Your Nation's Warships, Batch 3

[New Chilokver]

What's the difference between a barbette and a turret, and why are all modern "turrets" based off barbettes instead of turrets?

[Connori Pilgrims]

What's the difference between a barbette and a turret, and why are all modern "turrets" based off barbettes instead of turrets?

Barbettes in ye olde 1860s were basically fixed armoured enclosures protecting crew and the weapon mount. The protective wall of the barbette didn't move, rather it was the gun mount that rotated when you needed to train it on a target. A turret would have the whole thing (protective plates, gun, crew) rotate on its mount.

1860s turrets were bulky for their time; barbettes were an alternative mainly for being lighter. Turrets as we know them today basically evolved from lighter (relative to old 1860s turrets) armoured gunhouses/hoods placed over the barbette (as early barbettes were open-topped). Modern gun turrets though are fully turrets; they don't have barbettes anymore since armor generally don't exist on modern combatants (or if they do, its not for the weapons per se).

[The Akasha Colony]

What's the difference between a barbette and a turret, and why are all modern "turrets" based off barbettes instead of turrets?

Barbettes are fixed enclosures and were originally open-topped to allow their guns to fire over them. Turrets were enclosed and the entire housing rotated. Early ones, like those on US monitors during the Civil War, were extremely heavy which is why turrets didn't become as widespread on ocean-going ships during that time. The heavy turrets negatively affected stability and freeboard and a number of ships were lost in rough weather due to these factors, including the famous Monitor herself.

Gun mountings of the pre-dreadnought and dreadnought era combined both a barbette and a turret. A rotating armored gunhouse was placed on top of an armored barbette which protected the ammunition handling systems and crew and provided a raised pedestal from which to have a more commanding field of fire. This later allowed the introduction of superfiring turrets to maximize firing arcs. The gunhouse was originally a bit less armored than the barbette but by the emergence of the dreadnought era this distinction had disappeared and the gunhouse became extremely heavily armored, often the most heavily armored part of the ship. Because the gunhouse rotated and the barbette merely served as the pedestal, the entire arrangement was simply called a turret.

Modern turrets are lineal descendants of this design, just with both the barbette and gunhouse generally having little if any real armor and now often being totally automated. They're still mounted on short stationary pedestals inside which the ammunition handling equipment is placed.

[Kommeria]

A new warship to replace an aged class of frigates for anti-air and anti-sub purposes. I'll format this like I would in my factbook, but this wouldn't be entering service for a little while in roleplay.

Does anyone have any ideas for improvements? I'd love to hear them.
I'm thinking I may need at least one chain gun turret.

[Class Name] FFGX21 (Project title)

[Cost] ~$250 million
[In Commission] 2017(?)
[Ships in Class] -20 Planned

[Engines] Gas turbine x2, diesel x2
[Propulsion] Five-bladed variable pitch prop x2
[Top Speed] ~30 knots

[Length] 425 feet
[Displacement] ~6,500 short tons

[Complement] 240 sailors
[Helicopters] Two hangers for Seahawk-sized ASW helicopters
[Landing Craft] x1 RHIBs

[Countermeasures]
--x4 Triple-tube Chaff launchers
--x1 Torpedo decoy system

[Sensors]
--x1 Air and surface search, tracking and guidance radar
--x2 Air and Surface search radar
--x2 Navigation Radar
--x1 Bow mounted sonar

--x1 Helicopter-towed sonar

[Armament]
--x1 Three-Inch Naval Gun
--x1 Missile CIWS
--x4 M2HB heavy machine guns
--x6 Torpedo Tubes
------x3 Anti-Submarine Torpedo
--x2 eight-cell Mk.41 missile launchers
--------Mk.66M Standard multi-purpose missile
--------Mk.162 Evolved Kingfisher Missile (Four per cell)
--------Mk.139 Anti-Submarine missile
--x8 Mk.141 Trident anti-ship missiles

[New Oyashima]

ns warfare has caused more brain cancer than smoking, masturbation, and nsd put together

Honestly it should always be thought out, and the ending determined/

[New Korongo]

To elaborate on my previous post:

The Ahntan-class was a group of four Korongolese pre-dreadnought battleships (Ahntan, Gamenaiaa, Mendam, and Aurani) built for the Royal Naval Service between 1906 and 1911. They were the last pre-dreadnoughts to be commissioned by the Royal Naval Service. As constructed, members of the Ahntan-class were armed with four 12.19 in (309.6 mm) guns in two turrets, eight 9.62 in (244.3 mm) guns in four turrets, eight 6.41 in (192.9 mm) guns in single mounts on the main deck, fifteen 3.21 in (81.53 mm) on the deck above, four 1.85 in (47 mm) guns, and five 17.72 in (450 mm) torpedo tubes. Though the introduction of HMS Dreanought and similar ships abroad quickly made the Ahntan-class obsolescent, it was a significant improvement over past Korongolese pre-dreadnought designs. In comparison to older Korongolese designs the Ahntan-class had a heavier armament, completely lacked any guns mounted in hull casemates, and had watertight bulkheads.

In 1913, during the initial stages of the First Korongolese Civil War, the four ships of the Ahntan-class went to war in the white scheme depicted above. As the rebel forces lacked any significant naval capability, the class was primarily involved in shore bombardment operations along the Korongolese coast. The ships occasionally faced hostile fire from land-based artillery but suffered little damage. One member of the class, the Gamenaiaa, was removed from operational service for a month after she was bombed in port by rebel saboteurs. After the outbreak of the First World War in 1914, the Royal Naval Service transitioned to a grey scheme in response to the potential threat posed by German merchant raiders. This did not stop the sinking of the Ahntan in August 1915 after it struck a mine. In the end, only one merchant raider was sunk by battleships of the Ahntan-class. After the First Korongolese Civil War ended in 1916 the Royal Naval Service dispatched the Aurani to Europe to participate in the blockade of Germany. Few significant modifications were made to the Ahntan-class during the First World War due in part to the fact that enemy naval opposition was virtually non-existent. The image below depicts how an Ahntan-class vessel would look in 1918. The most notable differences include the replacement of the 1.85 in anti-torpedo boat guns with 3.21 in anti-aircraft guns and the removal of the deck which covered ten of the original fifteen 3.21 in guns.

After the First World War the Mendam was decommissioned and scrapped so that the Royal Naval Service could retain newer warships under the Washington Naval Treaty. The Aurani faced a similar fate after the hiatus on battleship construction came to an end in the mid-1930s. The Gamenaiaa, however, was retained as the Korongolese shipbuilding industry was slow to meet the Royal Naval Service’s requirement for a fleet of seven modern battleships. Though relegated to a training role due to her age and obsolescence, Gamenaiaa received extensive modifications in the years that followed. The changes included the addition of a crane and catapult near the stern for scout plane operation, the refitting of the old with modern 8 in (203.2 mm) guns, the truncation of the two forward funnels into a single funnel, the replacement of the fifteen 3.21 in guns with eight dual-purpose 3 in (76 mm) guns, and the installation of four anti-aircraft mounts equipped with four 0.98 in (25 mm) guns each. In 1940, even radar was fitted. Not all modifications necessarily improved her ability to fight. Anti-torpedo bulges fitted in 1936 reduced her top speed from an already slow 18 knots and the eight 6.41 in guns were only replaced by two modern 5 in (127 mm) guns. The five torpedo tubes were also removed. As a training vessel, the Gamenaiaa did not need to be effective in combat and most of the modifications were aimed at improving her training facilities and survivability against limited hostile activity, such as an air attack launched by a small number of enemy aircraft.

If war had not broken out in Europe in 1939, the Gamenaiaa would have been decommissioned in late 1940 to make way for a new battleship. However, global tensions led to her retention and sealed her eventual fate. In January 1942 the Gamenaiaa was sunk by Japanese dive bombers while fleeing New Korongo for naval bases in New Holtland.The image below depicts Gamenaiaa in her final form.

[The Selkie]

Is it worth retraining a landing craft for use as a buoy tender\supply ship for my coast guard? I was thinking of scrounging a Vydra class ship for that purpose.

While I doubt, that it would be the most effective in either roles, it should be both possible. It's makeshift, though, and you should aim to get a replacement as soon as possible.
Old landing ships, I've read somewhere, can be adapted to a multitude of auxillary roles as makeshifts, but they can not replace dedicated vessels.

[Velkanika]

(Image)

A new warship to replace an aged class of frigates for anti-air and anti-sub purposes. I'll format this like I would in my factbook, but this wouldn't be entering service for a little while in roleplay.

Does anyone have any ideas for improvements? I'd love to hear them.
I'm thinking I may need at least one chain gun turret.

[Class Name] FFGX21 (Project title)

[Cost] ~$250 million
[In Commission] 2017(?)
[Ships in Class] -20 Planned

[Engines] Gas turbine x2, diesel x2
[Propulsion] Five-bladed variable pitch prop x2
[Top Speed] ~30 knots

[Length] 425 feet
[Displacement] ~6,500 short tons

[Complement] 240 sailors
[Helicopters] Two hangers for Seahawk-sized ASW helicopters
[Landing Craft] x1 RHIBs

[Countermeasures]
--x4 Triple-tube Chaff launchers
--x1 Torpedo decoy system

[Sensors]
--x1 Air and surface search, tracking and guidance radar
--x2 Air and Surface search radar
--x2 Navigation Radar
--x1 Bow mounted sonar

--x1 Helicopter-towed sonar

[Armament]
--x1 Three-Inch Naval Gun
--x1 Missile CIWS
--x4 M2HB heavy machine guns
--x6 Torpedo Tubes
------x3 Anti-Submarine Torpedo
--x2 eight-cell Mk.41 missile launchers
--------Mk.66M Standard multi-purpose missile
--------Mk.162 Evolved Kingfisher Missile (Four per cell)
--------Mk.139 Anti-Submarine missile
--x8 Mk.141 Trident anti-ship missiles

Where are the roll stabilizers? Does it have any bubble generators to muffle internal sound?

[Prosorusiya]

Is it worth retraining a landing craft for use as a buoy tender\supply ship for my coast guard? I was thinking of scrounging a Vydra class ship for that purpose.

While I doubt, that it would be the most effective in either roles, it should be both possible. It's makeshift, though, and you should aim to get a replacement as soon as possible.
Old landing ships, I've read somewhere, can be adapted to a multitude of auxillary roles as makeshifts, but they can not replace dedicated vessels.

Thanks for answering my question, I really appreciate it. Right now I am thinking over wether or not to retain my claim on Dagestan, so the fate of my Coast Guard is in question.

[Palmyrion]

Angeli Tanalgo-class DDGN

Give me your opinion, NS.

[The Selkie]

Angeli Tanalgo-class DDGN

Give me your opinion, NS.

Well... what do you want it to do, where do you want to operate it, how large is it?

[Palmyrion]

Angeli Tanalgo-class DDGN

Give me your opinion, NS.

Well... what do you want it to do, where do you want to operate it, how large is it?

It's a general purpose DDGN, improving on every aspect of my older DDG.

[Lamoni]

What he's saying, is that there is only so much that we can tell from a picture. There needs to be at least some essential words to go with the pretty picture.

[Palmyrion]

What he's saying, is that there is only so much that we can tell from a picture. There needs to be at least some essential words to go with the pretty picture.

But is the shape good?

Statblock:

Preceded by: Antonio Valzado-class DDG
Length: 180m
Beam: 25m
Draft: 8m
Displacement: 14,500 tonnes
Hull type: monohull

Primary power source: 500MW Pressurized Water Reactor
Secondary power source: Multi-fuel diesel backup generators
Propulsion: 2x electrically-driven five-blade controllable-pitch propellers

Armament:

• 1x 152mm AGS
• 128x VLS cells

Defensive Measures:

• 4x Gauntlet - II CIWS (1x 32mm revolver cannon, 500 32mm CT cartridges; 8 125mm Naval Rolling Airframe Missiles)
• Acoustic Anti-Torpedo Decoys
• 4 remote-controlled/manned hardpoints for machine guns of up to 14.7mm (.587"), built flush into the superstructure
• IR and CHAFF decoy dispensers
• 2 Towed Active Sonar Decoys

Sensory System:

• AN/SPY-120 Multifunction Dual-Band (S & X-band) AESA 3D radar
• AN/SQY-104 Active/Passive Medium Frequency Array (MFA) Sonar
• AN/SQY-105 Active/Passive Fiber-Optic Towed Array Sonar
• AN/SQQ-28 LAMPS III Shipboard System

Aviation facilities:

• Flight deck
• Enclosed hangar for two medium-lift helicopters

[The Selkie]

What he's saying, is that there is only so much that we can tell from a picture. There needs to be at least some essential words to go with the pretty picture.

But is the shape good?

Statblock:

Preceded by: Antonio Valzado-class DDG
Length: 180m
Beam: 25m
Draft: 8m
Displacement: 14,500 tonnes
Hull type: monohull

Primary power source: 500MW Pressurized Water Reactor
Secondary power source: Multi-fuel diesel backup generators
Propulsion: 2x electrically-driven five-blade controllable-pitch propellers

Armament:

• 1x 152mm AGS
• 128x VLS cells

Defensive Measures:

• 4x Gauntlet - II CIWS (1x 32mm revolver cannon, 500 32mm CT cartridges; 8 125mm Naval Rolling Airframe Missiles)
• Acoustic Anti-Torpedo Decoys
• 4 remote-controlled/manned hardpoints for machine guns of up to 14.7mm (.587"), built flush into the superstructure
• IR and CHAFF decoy dispensers
• 2 Towed Active Sonar Decoys

Sensory System:

• AN/SPY-120 Multifunction Dual-Band (S & X-band) AESA 3D radar
• AN/SQY-104 Active/Passive Medium Frequency Array (MFA) Sonar
• AN/SQY-105 Active/Passive Fiber-Optic Towed Array Sonar
• AN/SQQ-28 LAMPS III Shipboard System

Aviation facilities:
[*]Flight deck
[*]Enclosed hangar for two medium-lift helicopters

That's what I am talking about, thank you very much.
That being said, the vessel seems a bit light to me, judging by displacement, but other then that, I would only slap a few more radars onto that thing, but I believe, that this is a personal preference.
All statements without guarantee, though.

[Palmyrion]

At least I am not using an axe bow now.

I'm gonna use just one radar to do everything

[The Akasha Colony]

Angeli Tanalgo-class DDGN

Give me your opinion, NS.

Looks fine.

[The Selkie]

At least I am not using an axe bow now.

I'm gonna use just one radar to do everything

As said, more then one radar is a personal preference of mine.
I like a bit of redundancy in that sort of thing as it allows me to operate with secondary systems when the main radars are taken out. Then again, more radars mean more maintenance and acquisition costs, so I guess it evens out a bit.

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

Angeli Tanalgo-class DDGN

Give me your opinion, NS.

Thales I-mast 500?

CIWS armament appears excessive. RIM-116 (aka the rolling airframe missile) is a bit redundant when you already have VLS cells which can launch ESSM.

[Palmyrion]

Angeli Tanalgo-class DDGN

Give me your opinion, NS.

Thales I-mast 500?

CIWS armament appears excessive. RIM-116 (aka the rolling airframe missile) is a bit redundant when you already have VLS cells which can launch ESSM.

Why redundant?

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

Why redundant?

They achieve the same thing. RAM/SeaRAM launchers are usually only placed on ships like LCS or carriers which lack VLS cells.

[Palmyrion]

Why redundant?

They achieve the same thing. RAM/SeaRAM launchers are usually only placed on ships like LCS or carriers which lack VLS cells.

So, my CIWS won't have any SeaRAM then??
#Sad

I have Arleigh Burke
I have Zumwalt
Uhhh
I have Angeli Tanalgo

[Lamoni]

Both ESSM and RAM are designed to hit missiles inbound on the targeted ship (though ESSM can also hit aircraft and other targets more generally). In other words, they are both a type of CIWS, just that one is larger, more expensive, and more capable than the other.

Think of missile defense at sea as being a layered system, like so:

1.) Long range SAMs (Standard, Aster, etc)
2.) Medium range SAMs (ESSM, etc)
3.) ECM
4.) Decoys (RF, Corner Reflector, IR, Chaff, etc)
5.) CIWS (both gun and missile)

Each layer works with the others in order to keep attacking missiles from hitting the ship. Gun/Missile combinations can also offer advantages that neither one has alone.

[Palmyrion]

Both ESSM and RAM are designed to hit missiles inbound on the targeted ship (though ESSM can also hit aircraft and other targets more generally). In other words, they are both a type of CIWS, just that one is larger, more expensive, and more capable than the other.

Think of missile defense at sea as being a layered system, like so:

1.) Long range SAMs (Standard, Aster, etc)
2.) Medium range SAMs (ESSM, etc)
3.) ECM
4.) Decoys (RF, Corner Reflector, IR, Chaff, etc)
5.) CIWS (both gun and missile)

Each layer works with the others in order to keep attacking missiles from hitting the ship. Gun/Missile combinations can also offer advantages that neither one has alone.

Can I get away with my current CIWS?

[Lamoni]

I would cut it down to 1-2 CIWS mounts. Take a look at RL destroyers, most of them only have 1 CIWS mount.