NS Military Realism Consultancy Thread Mark IX Spitfire

[Spirit of Hope]

I'm curious how you calculated your needed stores for wartime operations. Overall it looks good.

US Army FMs, (FM 4-90, 93, and 95 for example), ODS logistical analysis, and others. Also lots of google.
I have a running tally on a notepad file which is a "close but not the same", based on my own decisions and assumptions. Which means I'm just finding sources with some information, and using that information to adjust my numbers, then move on. Not keeping anything hard because army logistics is too big to take too seriously here.

Oh, and reading lots and lots of TO&Es.

Oh I understand that we can't get to into it here, I was just curious about your methodology. I need to do my own units logistics, probably about to the same level, and was curious where you got your numbers from so I could poke my head in that direction some time in the future.

[Dostanuot Loj]

US Army FMs, (FM 4-90, 93, and 95 for example), ODS logistical analysis, and others. Also lots of google.
I have a running tally on a notepad file which is a "close but not the same", based on my own decisions and assumptions. Which means I'm just finding sources with some information, and using that information to adjust my numbers, then move on. Not keeping anything hard because army logistics is too big to take too seriously here.

Oh, and reading lots and lots of TO&Es.

Oh I understand that we can't get to into it here, I was just curious about your methodology. I need to do my own units logistics, probably about to the same level, and was curious where you got your numbers from so I could poke my head in that direction some time in the future.

It's a PITA, so have fun!
I'm essentially "roughing it", with very generic numbers. And then I figure out what I can add and go from there.

For example, I'm looking at water right now. Just water. And I have unique situational requirements for that, so I am very over-doing my water needs.

Edit:

Looking exclusively at water needs.
Each Supply Company within the brigades will have to supply about 150,000L per day to their respective brigades. Now this will be supplemented by the divisional supply battalion, but I also expect it to provide this alone if needed.

So, I have a Water Platoon within the supply company provided with the following:
- 4x Light trucks
- 4x 6x6 Purifier trucks capable of 5000 liters per hour
- 12x 6x6 tanker trucks with 11,000 liter capacity
- 12x 2500 liter insulated and cooled drinking water trailers
- 2x Purifier trailers capable of 2000 liters per hour
- 3x Light Utility Trailers

This will be split into an HQ, with two light trucks, and a utility trailer. And two sections each with:
- 1x Light truck with utility trailer
- 2x 6x6 5000 LPH Purifier Truck
- 6x 6x6 11,000L Tanker truck
- 6x 2500L Insulated/Cooled water trailers
- 1x 2000 LPH purifier trailer

Total capacity without temporary water bladders (included but not listed) is greater then 160,000 liters.
Combined purifier capability is 14,000 liters per hour, or greater then 160,000 liters per day.

And this is just organic capability for the maneuver brigades.

I have not solidified my idea on the supply battalion, but I am thinking a dedicated Water Company of four platoons. Each water platoon would consist of:
- 4x Light trucks, 2x light utility trailers.
- 4x 8x8 Purifier trucks capable of 15,000 liters per hour
- 12x 8x8 15,000 liter tanker trucks
- 8x Large Tanker Trailers with 10,000 liter capacity
- 2x Medium/Large utility trailers
- 2x Purifier trailers capable of 10,000 liters per hour

Therefore each of the four water platoons can move 260,000 liters of water. And it can purify 80,000 liters of water per hour, or nearly a million liters of water per day.

Four of these water platoons, plus the supply company's provisions, gives me...
1.7 million liters of water capacity.
Purify nearly 5 million liters of water per day.

[Purpelia]

That is... a lot of water.

[Western Weyard]

That is... a lot of water.

[Purpelia]

I do not get it.

[Western Weyard]

I do not get it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIgbPTBINhk

[Spirit of Hope]

Oh I understand that we can't get to into it here, I was just curious about your methodology. I need to do my own units logistics, probably about to the same level, and was curious where you got your numbers from so I could poke my head in that direction some time in the future.

It's a PITA, so have fun!
I'm essentially "roughing it", with very generic numbers. And then I figure out what I can add and go from there.

For example, I'm looking at water right now. Just water. And I have unique situational requirements for that, so I am very over-doing my water needs.

Edit:

Looking exclusively at water needs.
Each Supply Company within the brigades will have to supply about 150,000L per day to their respective brigades. Now this will be supplemented by the divisional supply battalion, but I also expect it to provide this alone if needed.

So, I have a Water Platoon within the supply company provided with the following:
- 4x Light trucks
- 4x 6x6 Purifier trucks capable of 5000 liters per hour
- 12x 6x6 tanker trucks with 11,000 liter capacity
- 12x 2500 liter insulated and cooled drinking water trailers
- 2x Purifier trailers capable of 2000 liters per hour
- 3x Light Utility Trailers

This will be split into an HQ, with two light trucks, and a utility trailer. And two sections each with:
- 1x Light truck with utility trailer
- 2x 6x6 5000 LPH Purifier Truck
- 6x 6x6 11,000L Tanker truck
- 6x 2500L Insulated/Cooled water trailers
- 1x 2000 LPH purifier trailer

Total capacity without temporary water bladders (included but not listed) is greater then 160,000 liters.
Combined purifier capability is 14,000 liters per hour, or greater then 160,000 liters per day.

And this is just organic capability for the maneuver brigades.

I have not solidified my idea on the supply battalion, but I am thinking a dedicated Water Company of four platoons. Each water platoon would consist of:
- 4x Light trucks, 2x light utility trailers.
- 4x 8x8 Purifier trucks capable of 15,000 liters per hour
- 12x 8x8 15,000 liter tanker trucks
- 8x Large Tanker Trailers with 10,000 liter capacity
- 2x Medium/Large utility trailers
- 2x Purifier trailers capable of 10,000 liters per hour

Therefore each of the four water platoons can move 260,000 liters of water. And it can purify 80,000 liters of water per hour, or nearly a million liters of water per day.

Four of these water platoons, plus the supply company's provisions, gives me...
1.7 million liters of water capacity.
Purify nearly 5 million liters of water per day.

That seams like overkill for water. An active person only needs 2 or so liters of water per day, for 17,000 soldiers that's about 34,000 liters a day. Now obviously you are going to have other uses for water, cooking comes to mind, and you want extra in case of battlefield losses, plus dealing with movement means not being able to purify water at all times. However that still leaves you with almost 150 times as much capability as you need for drinking water, that seams a bit much.

[Dostanuot Loj]

That is... a lot of water.

You seriously do not know how important water is until you look at military logistics.

[Takhshiyt]

Every soldier needs to bathe before afternoon battle.

[Rich and Corporations]

That is... a lot of water.

You seriously do not know how important water is until you look at military logistics.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fbn2j2ag2jir5 ... I.pdf?dl=0

The Future Combat System would be able to generate 3-5 gallons of water per engine operating hour.

(hurrah for compressors?)

[Purpelia]

That is... a lot of water.

You seriously do not know how important water is until you look at military logistics.

But like what do you do with all that stuff? A brigade is what, ~2-10 kilosoldiers? Say we take the high number and say we further multiply that by 5 times as that once you add up every single supporting thing you could imaginably add. That's still 100 liters of water per person.

[Rich and Corporations]

100 KG of water per person?

[Dostanuot Loj]

You seriously do not know how important water is until you look at military logistics.

But like what do you do with all that stuff? A brigade is what, ~2-10 kilosoldiers? Say we take the high number and say we further multiply that by 5 times as that once you add up every single supporting thing you could imaginably add. That's still 100 liters of water per person.

Requirements for arid operations, including drinking, cleaning, food preparation, cooling, decontamination, and other things you use water for, is about 45L per person per day. I round up to 50L per person per day because water is important and I'm all hot dusty grasslands. This doesn't mean everybody gets 50L of water, that's just how it works out.
Temperate regions like Europe work out to about 25-30L per person per day.

Since my divisions are 15,000-17,000 troops, and the component brigades are close to 3,000 each, that gives us some nice numbers. A brigade should get 150,000L of water a day, and the entire division should get 850,000L at the high end.

Of course these are minimums, and ideally we want to exceed them greatly to cover equipment loss due to damage or wear, and to provide greater margin of error for such an important resource.

[Husseinarti]

for a tracked mechanized infantry regiment, I was considering 3 infantry battalions, an artillery battalion, and a support battalion with the H&H company, a tank company, materiel support company, medical company, etc.

Was considering having two batteries of 4 SPGs each and then an ada battery of 8 ADATS and 6 Wiesel stinger vehicles.

The infantry battalions have like 6 120mm mortars, a bunch of stingers, wiesels with TOWs, an assault platoon with some FSVs and a bunch of guys with M202s, and finally a sniper platoon.

Should I expand on the arty?

[Purpelia]

That is quite fascinating. Thanks for the explanation. Any idea what the daily requirement would be for a more European climate like say generic east Germany through West Russia region?

[Rich and Corporations]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helepolis

If there is evidence that an NSer was sent into the past, this would be it.

[Dostanuot Loj]

That is quite fascinating. Thanks for the explanation. Any idea what the daily requirement would be for a more European climate like say generic east Germany through West Russia region?

25-30L per man per day average.
Arctic climates will actually raise this. I can't remember what the military says for it because I didn't pay too much attention to that part, but I would say ~40L per man per day is fine.

for a tracked mechanized infantry regiment, I was considering 3 infantry battalions, an artillery battalion, and a support battalion with the H&H company, a tank company, materiel support company, medical company, etc.

Was considering having two batteries of 4 SPGs each and then an ada battery of 8 ADATS and 6 Wiesel stinger vehicles.

The infantry battalions have like 6 120mm mortars, a bunch of stingers, wiesels with TOWs, an assault platoon with some FSVs and a bunch of guys with M202s, and finally a sniper platoon.

Should I expand on the arty?

So you are looking at a total of eight SPGs and eighteen 12cm mortars?
I would say you might be short a bit on the SPGs. Perhaps add another battery of four guns in there. That would bring you to four batteries in the artillery battalion including ADA.

Are you looking at armoured SPG like M109 or GCT? Or something more akin to Caesar?

Edit: Purp, try thinking of it like this: An Olympic sized swimming pool will sustain my entire division for almost three days. Or a US Army Armoured division in West Germany for five days.

Or if you really want fun, the water displaced by the USS Ford will supply one of my divisions for four months.

[Imperializt Russia]

You seriously do not know how important water is until you look at military logistics.

But like what do you do with all that stuff? A brigade is what, ~2-10 kilosoldiers? Say we take the high number and say we further multiply that by 5 times as that once you add up every single supporting thing you could imaginably add. That's still 100 liters of water per person.

Think how much water is in the system of your car. Think how much you use to wash, To clean. To cook with, that's probably one of the biggest.

[Rich and Corporations]

http://www.quartermaster.army.mil/pwd/p ... v_08_(5-09).pdf

[Husseinarti]

That is quite fascinating. Thanks for the explanation. Any idea what the daily requirement would be for a more European climate like say generic east Germany through West Russia region?

25-30L per man per day average.
Arctic climates will actually raise this. I can't remember what the military says for it because I didn't pay too much attention to that part, but I would say ~40L per man per day is fine.

for a tracked mechanized infantry regiment, I was considering 3 infantry battalions, an artillery battalion, and a support battalion with the H&H company, a tank company, materiel support company, medical company, etc.

Was considering having two batteries of 4 SPGs each and then an ada battery of 8 ADATS and 6 Wiesel stinger vehicles.

The infantry battalions have like 6 120mm mortars, a bunch of stingers, wiesels with TOWs, an assault platoon with some FSVs and a bunch of guys with M202s, and finally a sniper platoon.

Should I expand on the arty?

So you are looking at a total of eight SPGs and eighteen 12cm mortars?
I would say you might be short a bit on the SPGs. Perhaps add another battery of four guns in there. That would bring you to four batteries in the artillery battalion including ADA.

Are you looking at armoured SPG like M109 or GCT? Or something more akin to Caesar?

Edit: Purp, try thinking of it like this: An Olympic sized swimming pool will sustain my entire division for almost three days. Or a US Army Armoured division in West Germany for five days.

Or if you really want fun, the water displaced by the USS Ford will supply one of my divisions for four months.

The mechanized infantry have M109L52s with all kinds of "Hey keep the fossil alive" upgrades

the light infantry get trucks with 105s because fuck them.

the motorized infantry get m777s on the back of LAVs.

[Gallan Systems]

for a tracked mechanized infantry regiment, I was considering 3 infantry battalions, an artillery battalion, and a support battalion with the H&H company, a tank company, materiel support company, medical company, etc.

Was considering having two batteries of 4 SPGs each and then an ada battery of 8 ADATS and 6 Wiesel stinger vehicles.

The infantry battalions have like 6 120mm mortars, a bunch of stingers, wiesels with TOWs, an assault platoon with some FSVs and a bunch of guys with M202s, and finally a sniper platoon.

Should I expand on the arty?

a tank company is this ww2?

this is the closest to "optimum" dumbla ever gets

[Husseinarti]

yes

ww2 forever

[Western Weyard]

So you are looking at a total of eight SPGs and eighteen 12cm mortars?
I would say you might be short a bit on the SPGs. Perhaps add another battery of four guns in there. That would bring you to four batteries in the artillery battalion including ADA.

While we're on the subject of artillery:
24 not-PzH2000 SPGs and 36 120mm mortar carriers per Armored (Infantry) Brigade - Overkill Y/N?

[Gallan Systems]

yes

ww2 forever

unfortunately even the condensed stupidity that is the us army realized it was a dumb idea and adopted 1:1 ratios of armoured infantry and tanks in divisons by the end of it

[The Kievan People]

While we're on the subject of artillery:
24 not-PzH2000 SPGs and 36 120mm mortar carriers per Armored (Infantry) Brigade - Overkill Y/N?

That would place you somewhere between an American HBT and a Russian Motor Rifle Brigade.

So, fine.