NS Military Realism Mk. 7: NO

[The Corparation]

So, if you had to pick one ship to convert into an Aegis ship, would it be better to go with an Albany-class cruiser or a Spruance/Kidd-class destroyer?

The Albany might make a more powerful ship, but it's also much older than the Spruance and would require far more extensive modifications. It's also much larger, which is good for missile capacity, but also makes it a bigger target. It is also unusually tall, which is useful when it comes to radar range.

The Spruance on the other hand, is newer and would require less extensive modifications. The Ticonderoga-class was built on the same hull design as the Spruance as well. On the other hand, the superstructure of the Spruance is too short for the AN/SPY-1 radar arrays to be mounted on it directly (they'd practically be flush with the deck). So you'd have to build a platform on top of it to hold the radar.

Why not a Virginia Class Cruiser? Plenty of VLS space available with the removal of the mk26's, the USN did plan a Aegis subclass but cancelled the notion before CGN42 could eventuate. Shame, a nuclear powered Aegis ship of a displacement of of over 10,000t would be a suitable answer to the far larger Kirov

If I recall correctly, the Virgina Class Cruiser Aegis refit proposals didn't include the removal of the Mk 26s. It would have just been the installation of the electronics and radar. The Mk 26 launcher was compatible with Aegis as evidenced by the first 5 Ticonderogas. Installing. Installing VLS would have required much more work.

[Inyourfaceistan]

Pros and cons about thermobaric weapons. What are they?

Pros:
- Kill lots of infantry
- Can clear out caves/bunkers

Cons:
- Poor against well-armored vehicles
- Lack penetration

[Dubious]

I want to design a 1920s 1930s military can anyone help me? I dont know where to start.

My nation is a small landlocked country, with only about 20 million people. We have a thriving steel industry as everything need can be produced at home, the rest of our economy is focused on agriculture. My neighbors to the west are small nations similar to mine own, minus the steel industry and my neighbors to the east are two larger nations that hate each other.

[Korouse]

I want to design a 1920s 1930s military can anyone help me? I dont know where to start.

My nation is a small landlocked country, with only about 20 million people. We have a thriving steel industry as everything need can be produced at home, the rest of our economy is focused on agriculture. My neighbors to the west are small nations similar to mine own, minus the steel industry and my neighbors to the east are two larger nations that hate each other.

Make weapons...

lots of weapons.

[Yukonastan]

Jamming a fly by wire missile? why bother.
(Image)
Can't hit what you cant see. (that or just make erratic moments making it harder to stay on target or just get behind something as missiles relatively are slow )

They go pretty damn fast. Covering about 4K metres in less than eight seconds.

[Questers]

Jamming a fly by wire missile? why bother.
(Image)
Can't hit what you cant see. (that or just make erratic moments making it harder to stay on target or just get behind something as missiles relatively are slow )

They go pretty damn fast. Covering about 4K metres in less than eight seconds.

Er, like what? Which wire-guided missiles go 500mps?

Here's a truefact - it takes 20 seconds for a Milan to reach 4,000 metres, 12.5 for the fastest variant of TOW, 16.6 for HOT, 18 for Konkurs.

Even the fastest, non-wirespooled missiles like Khrizantema don't reach 500mps. Not even Hellfire which is helicopter launched can travel at 500mps. Stop talking bullshit please.

[Yukonastan]

They go pretty damn fast. Covering about 4K metres in less than eight seconds.

Er, like what? Which wire-guided missiles go 500m/s?

I was mistaken. Not 500. I roughly eyeballed a video for both distance and time. 300m/s is the centre of the TOW's operational speed tolerance.

Still 1000 feet per second. Not a lot slower than a 9x19mm cartridge, with as difference that this one keeps going and destroys tanks.

[Gallia-]

So, if you had to pick one ship to convert into an Aegis ship, would it be better to go with an Albany-class cruiser or a Spruance/Kidd-class destroyer?

The Albany might make a more powerful ship, but it's also much older than the Spruance and would require far more extensive modifications. It's also much larger, which is good for missile capacity, but also makes it a bigger target. It is also unusually tall, which is useful when it comes to radar range.

The Spruance on the other hand, is newer and would require less extensive modifications. The Ticonderoga-class was built on the same hull design as the Spruance as well. On the other hand, the superstructure of the Spruance is too short for the AN/SPY-1 radar arrays to be mounted on it directly (they'd practically be flush with the deck). So you'd have to build a platform on top of it to hold the radar.

They made a Spruance with Aegis, so there is your answer.

[Questers]

Er, like what? Which wire-guided missiles go 500m/s?

I was mistaken. Not 500. I roughly eyeballed a video for both distance and time. 300m/s is the centre of the TOW's operational speed tolerance.

Still 1000 feet per second. Not a lot slower than a 9x19mm cartridge, with as difference that this one keeps going and destroys tanks.

And TOW is the fastest wire guided missile. Most of them fly at half the speed which you "eyeballed." If you can't contribute to the thread without saying things that are just factually and empirically wrong then don't bother at all.

[Yukonastan]

I was mistaken. Not 500. I roughly eyeballed a video for both distance and time. 300m/s is the centre of the TOW's operational speed tolerance.

Still 1000 feet per second. Not a lot slower than a 9x19mm cartridge, with as difference that this one keeps going and destroys tanks.

And TOW is the fastest wire guided missile. Most of them fly at half the speed which you "eyeballed." If you can't contribute to the thread without saying things that are just factually and empirically wrong then don't bother at all.

Either way you're not going to be trundling out of the way in time unless you're VERY lucky.

[Questers]

Time for a RandC: a shell moving at 1650mps would travel 4000 metres in 2.4 seconds. A tank can rotate its turret 360 degrees in 9 seconds.

[Yukonastan]

Time for a RandC: a shell moving at 1650mps would travel 4000 metres in 2.4 seconds. A tank can rotate its turret 360 degrees in 9 seconds.

This is the Leo 2 you're talking about, or Western MBTs in general?

And are you taking 1650 m/s as average velocity or as a starting velocity? Remember that velocity drops with wind resistance.

[Gallia-]

And TOW is the fastest wire guided missile. Most of them fly at half the speed which you "eyeballed." If you can't contribute to the thread without saying things that are just factually and empirically wrong then don't bother at all.

Either way you're not going to be trundling out of the way in time unless you're VERY lucky.

Yom Kippur showed that CLOS missiles are vulnerable to rapid jinking and counter fire by tanks.

Not only are you going to be "trundling" (is 40 kmh over rough country really trundling?) out of the way, you're probably going to be fine as long as you spot the missile launch first.

[Yukonastan]

Either way you're not going to be trundling out of the way in time unless you're VERY lucky.

Yom Kippur showed that CLOS missiles are vulnerable to rapid jinking and counter fire by tanks.

Not only are you going to be "trundling" (is 40 kmh over rough country really trundling?) out of the way, you're probably going to be fine as long as you spot the missile launch first.

Assuming that the operator of the missile isn't total crap, he can still guide it to your last-known position if you smoke, or lead it so it hits your 40 km/h tank square in the side or on the roof.

Not everything is a guarantee.
Hence APS was developed, to screw with the missile guidance, making it uncontrollable.

[Questers]

Time for a RandC: a shell moving at 1650mps would travel 4000 metres in 2.4 seconds. A tank can rotate its turret 360 degrees in 9 seconds.

This is the Leo 2 you're talking about, or Western MBTs in general?

And are you taking 1650 m/s as average velocity or as a starting velocity? Remember that velocity drops with wind resistance.

Leopard, Leclerc and Challenger traverse 40 degrees per second. Abrams is faster.

It's an irrelevant number - a modern LRP loses 40mps per kilometre or so. It makes no appreciable difference to the outcome.

[Gallia-]

Yom Kippur showed that CLOS missiles are vulnerable to rapid jinking and counter fire by tanks.

Not only are you going to be "trundling" (is 40 kmh over rough country really trundling?) out of the way, you're probably going to be fine as long as you spot the missile launch first.

Assuming that the operator of the missile isn't total crap, he can still guide it to your last-known position if you smoke, or lead it so it hits your 40 km/h tank square in the side or on the roof.

Not everything is a guarantee.
Hence APS was developed, to screw with the missile guidance, making it uncontrollable.

Actually no he misses entirely, because 40 km/h translates into the tank moving its length roughly every 0.8-0.5 seconds.

Jinking, smoke, and counter fire throws off his aim entirely.

Tanks are tough cookies. They're only scared when this appears:



Also "Questers", M1 can sling its turret full 'round in EIGHT seconds because America is superior at gyroscopic stabilisation and motion sickness management.

[Chebucto Provinces]

For what its worth to the recent discussion: SOP for TOW teams and TUA when I was in was to fire at 2km or less unless in support of armoured operations.

A tank can easily avoid TOW or any of the Soviet ATGMs at even 2km or a bit less. But a tank avoiding a missile is not a tank firing at your tank.

[Inyourfaceistan]

Assuming that the operator of the missile isn't total crap, he can still guide it to your last-known position if you smoke, or lead it so it hits your 40 km/h tank square in the side or on the roof.

Not everything is a guarantee.
Hence APS was developed, to screw with the missile guidance, making it uncontrollable.

Actually no he misses entirely, because 40 km/h translates into the tank moving its length roughly every 0.8-0.5 seconds.

Jinking, smoke, and counter fire throws off his aim entirely.

Tanks are tough cookies. They're only scared when this appears:



Also "Questers", M1 can sling its turret full 'round in EIGHT seconds because America is superior at gyroscopic stabilisation and motion sickness management.

Why not this?

[Gallia-]

same thing

[San-Silvacian]

Yom Kippur showed that CLOS missiles are vulnerable to rapid jinking and counter fire by tanks.

Not only are you going to be "trundling" (is 40 kmh over rough country really trundling?) out of the way, you're probably going to be fine as long as you spot the missile launch first.

Assuming that the operator of the missile isn't total crap, he can still guide it to your last-known position if you smoke, or lead it so it hits your 40 km/h tank square in the side or on the roof.

Not everything is a guarantee.
Hence APS was developed, to screw with the missile guidance, making it uncontrollable.

No its pretty amazing when you get fired at even if you don't get hit or if it doesn't go rly close by, you tend to flinch.

So counter-fire with say, an 120mm round flying a few feet away from me is going it most likely make me jump like a motherfucker and will most likely make my launcher guidance unit put my missile into the ground.

[Gallia-]

Assuming that the operator of the missile isn't total crap, he can still guide it to your last-known position if you smoke, or lead it so it hits your 40 km/h tank square in the side or on the roof.

Not everything is a guarantee.
Hence APS was developed, to screw with the missile guidance, making it uncontrollable.

No its pretty amazing when you get fired at even if you don't get hit or if it doesn't go rly close by, you tend to flinch.

So counter-fire with say, an 120mm round flying a few feet away from me is going it most likely make me jump like a motherfucker and will most likely make my launcher guidance unit put my missile into the ground.

wow but dont you work on howitzers of course you would turbopog alert i can count your chest hairs on one hand

[San-Silvacian]

No its pretty amazing when you get fired at even if you don't get hit or if it doesn't go rly close by, you tend to flinch.

So counter-fire with say, an 120mm round flying a few feet away from me is going it most likely make me jump like a motherfucker and will most likely make my launcher guidance unit put my missile into the ground.

wow but dont you work on howitzers of course you would turbopog alert i can count your chest hairs on one hand

If I am engaging any kind of armored vehicle something has gone wrong.

Or silly Ivan and his pesky VDV r coming to get me ;-;

[Gallia-]

wow but dont you work on howitzers of course you would turbopog alert i can count your chest hairs on one hand

If I am engaging any kind of armored vehicle something has gone wrong.

Or silly Ivan and his pesky VDV r coming to get me ;-;

load canister

elevate guns 85'

[San-Silvacian]

If I am engaging any kind of armored vehicle something has gone wrong.

Or silly Ivan and his pesky VDV r coming to get me ;-;

load canister

elevate guns 85'

Why not just get on the Mk-19 and have the other members of the crew grab their M16A2s and lay down a base of fire so the Mk-19 can engage anything that seems bad.

Unless like a BMP comes in.

Thats when you get the AT4.

[Gallia-]

load canister

elevate guns 85'

Why not just get on the Mk-19 and have the other members of the crew grab their M16A2s and lay down a base of fire so the Mk-19 can engage anything that seems bad.

Unless like a BMP comes in.

Thats when you get the AT4.

dont miss major

>whump

>short 50m