NS Infantry discussion thread

[Doppio Giudici]

This from the guy who routinely uses micro rounds...

b/c I'm pretty sure you're hte only mod on right now

Picture of a gun to make this post look on topic:

What gun is this?

[Puzikas]

Only thing I can think of is the corner in the trigger guard looks rather sharp.
Other than that, superb weapon and art, arch.

If you cut yourself on a plastic trigger guard, you shouldn't have a rifle.

In my experience, plastics that are sharp are as sharp as the sharpest of metals.

What makes these guns so special? Wikipedia can only tell me so much.

FN FAL is the right arm of the free world. Renowned for its ruggedness, accuracy, the fact it punches above its weight, and its general utility. Its been going strong since its introduction more than 60 years ago, and its gained a reputation as one of (And, to be honest, IMO THE) best western rifles of all times.

The AKM is the ubiquitous rifle. There is one gun on the planet for every 10th person. One in every one of these 10 is an AKM clone. They dont break or jam in any manner of simplicity, they're simple to make, and they're simply recognized as the best combat rifle ever.

People still use M14s, I don't know that many places using FALs.

M21, DMR, and the rest are fantastic short range marksmen rifles, comparable to the Dragon

IIRC 6 countries use the M14 family still vs. The 62 at last count that still used the FAL to some capacity.

They adopted a German/British grenade launcher, and actually contacted a German/British company to exclusively design their next service rifle, so...

well i was saying right after world war II, when the US refused to adopt .280 British and the FAL, and instead threw 7.62x51mm NATO down everyone's troath and adopted the M-14 instead.

unfortunately, now the US armed forces weapon choices are being decided by corporations rather than weapon quality (not saying HK is not of good quality). damn capitalism/corporativism.

You know, for as much hate as it gets the M14 was renounced as being one of the best battle rifles of the era, and today has more than a large fan base of shooters. I almost bought one myself last year but opted instead to buy something different for its modularity. It really is a great rifle, they shoot very well and have an excellent grade of accuracy while being evey bit as reliable as you could ever want from an infantry rifle.

The entire era of .308/7.62x51 is said to be a mistake, but you'd be hardpressed to find a rifle caliber that has attained as much of a following in all three areas of shooting (Practical, Tactical, and Completion, or, if you prefer, Military, Law Enforcement, and Civilian) as .308/7.62x51mm has. Its a real workhorse round that does everything you need from it, and for a round that many armchair generals consider a mistake is sure as shit doesnt show any signs of slowing down.

And saying that weapon quality of the US military is being "decided by corporations" is nothing new. Its been like that since always. Corporations breed competition, and competition breeds innovation. Nations have never been the most forward of thinking entities if you haven't noticed, and with corporations building and innovating you get more modern things faster. Im not saying that we'd be stuck on bolt action rifles were it not for corperations but you can bet your sweet ass that a lot of things you see on the modern war fighter can be traced back to the commercialization and competition the existence of companies breed.

Except the M60 was extremely unreliable, and the M240 was reliable-er than the M60.

And what would you have them choose, hm? The MG3? Much too long, especially considering the M60E4 is being used because the M240 is too long.

The M60 is unreliable when it is caked in mud, just like every firearm ever.

Just so much this. The M60, from every person who I have talked to who used it in combat, was a perfectly acceptable GPMG, and if its good enough to have been used for 50 years odds are the notion of its unreliable nature are either fabrications of peoples lacks of common sense or over exaggerations as to its unreliable nature.

Is there anything inherently bad in developing and using a side loaded, hopper fed, automatic only, black powder and lead ball rifle?
As in, would it be something that could be made and developed into a design of some reliability using modern technology?

And yes, I do imagine two hoppers. one on each side of the weapon for powder and balls.

Besides everything?

Ok, so I'm going to try and put out some less common infantry weapons. This one is based on the M4 CQBR, the SA4, but without the top handle sights. It's supposed to be used by tank crews members(middle version), soldiers expected to engage in urban warfare(top &bottom version), and is an option to spec ops soldiers(they use less). Fires the 5.56x45mm NATO round. So, any improvement?

(Image)

I dont do this alot but for you, ill do this.

I went into the deep crevesses of my computers firearm files and dug out the most oddball guns I have for you, went through them for find this.

This is an ACTUALLY weapon for EXACTLY what the middle ones purpose was, sort of.

The Colt M231 Port Firing Weapon is a derivative of the M16/AR family rifles. It is fully-automatic only, has a special buffer tube to reduce recoil, fired at 1050-1225 rounds per minute, has a threaded hand guard and was made in such small numbers unless you know what you're looking for you'd almost certainly never find it. I happened upon it while reading a source book on the AR-15/M16 I have (had?), found the photos and forgot about it all together until 20 minutes ago.

[Absurrania]

A big round of applause to Puzikas for his help. I've adopted the SA402 as the rifle for tanks crewmen, APC drivers, transport plane crew, etc. Basically any infantryman who is stuck inside a vehicle for extended periods of time will be using this weapon. With a fully automatic mode, an RPM of 1000+, and recoil reducing buffer, its compact size is perfect for it's role.

Link
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... M231_1.svg

[Istevia]

So, would it be reasonable to have most GPMG's in my army be M60E4's, with some M240B's in use as well?

[Lemanrussland]

If you cut yourself on a plastic trigger guard, you shouldn't have a rifle.

In my experience, plastics that are sharp are as sharp as the sharpest of metals.

What makes these guns so special? Wikipedia can only tell me so much.

FN FAL is the right arm of the free world. Renowned for its ruggedness, accuracy, the fact it punches above its weight, and its general utility. Its been going strong since its introduction more than 60 years ago, and its gained a reputation as one of (And, to be honest, IMO THE) best western rifles of all times.

The AKM is the ubiquitous rifle. There is one gun on the planet for every 10th person. One in every one of these 10 is an AKM clone. They dont break or jam in any manner of simplicity, they're simple to make, and they're simply recognized as the best combat rifle ever.

People still use M14s, I don't know that many places using FALs.

M21, DMR, and the rest are fantastic short range marksmen rifles, comparable to the Dragon

IIRC 6 countries use the M14 family still vs. The 62 at last count that still used the FAL to some capacity.

well i was saying right after world war II, when the US refused to adopt .280 British and the FAL, and instead threw 7.62x51mm NATO down everyone's troath and adopted the M-14 instead.

unfortunately, now the US armed forces weapon choices are being decided by corporations rather than weapon quality (not saying HK is not of good quality). damn capitalism/corporativism.

You know, for as much hate as it gets the M14 was renounced as being one of the best battle rifles of the era, and today has more than a large fan base of shooters. I almost bought one myself last year but opted instead to buy something different for its modularity. It really is a great rifle, they shoot very well and have an excellent grade of accuracy while being evey bit as reliable as you could ever want from an infantry rifle.

The entire era of .308/7.62x51 is said to be a mistake, but you'd be hardpressed to find a rifle caliber that has attained as much of a following in all three areas of shooting (Practical, Tactical, and Completion, or, if you prefer, Military, Law Enforcement, and Civilian) as .308/7.62x51mm has. Its a real workhorse round that does everything you need from it, and for a round that many armchair generals consider a mistake is sure as shit doesnt show any signs of slowing down.

And saying that weapon quality of the US military is being "decided by corporations" is nothing new. Its been like that since always. Corporations breed competition, and competition breeds innovation. Nations have never been the most forward of thinking entities if you haven't noticed, and with corporations building and innovating you get more modern things faster. Im not saying that we'd be stuck on bolt action rifles were it not for corperations but you can bet your sweet ass that a lot of things you see on the modern war fighter can be traced back to the commercialization and competition the existence of companies breed.

The M60 is unreliable when it is caked in mud, just like every firearm ever.

Just so much this. The M60, from every person who I have talked to who used it in combat, was a perfectly acceptable GPMG, and if its good enough to have been used for 50 years odds are the notion of its unreliable nature are either fabrications of peoples lacks of common sense or over exaggerations as to its unreliable nature.

Is there anything inherently bad in developing and using a side loaded, hopper fed, automatic only, black powder and lead ball rifle?
As in, would it be something that could be made and developed into a design of some reliability using modern technology?

And yes, I do imagine two hoppers. one on each side of the weapon for powder and balls.

Besides everything?

Ok, so I'm going to try and put out some less common infantry weapons. This one is based on the M4 CQBR, the SA4, but without the top handle sights. It's supposed to be used by tank crews members(middle version), soldiers expected to engage in urban warfare(top &bottom version), and is an option to spec ops soldiers(they use less). Fires the 5.56x45mm NATO round. So, any improvement?

(Image)

I dont do this alot but for you, ill do this.

I went into the deep crevesses of my computers firearm files and dug out the most oddball guns I have for you, went through them for find this.

This is an ACTUALLY weapon for EXACTLY what the middle ones purpose was, sort of.

The Colt M231 Port Firing Weapon is a derivative of the M16/AR family rifles. It is fully-automatic only, has a special buffer tube to reduce recoil, fired at 1050-1225 rounds per minute, has a threaded hand guard and was made in such small numbers unless you know what you're looking for you'd almost certainly never find it. I happened upon it while reading a source book on the AR-15/M16 I have (had?), found the photos and forgot about it all together until 20 minutes ago.

The M14 is a good rifle, but I think the mistake they made was trying to shoehorn into the automatic rifle role. It was not really suited as an automatic rifle, far too light and still constrained by relatively small 20 round magazines. There were lots of bad ideas from that time, the Davy Crockett, the Pentomic division, and so on. It was a strange period for the US Army, honestly. They should have built squads around the M60 from the start, which they quickly did once the M14A1 was proven not to be a good idea (though the USMC clung to the idea for a bit longer).

I feel like the attempt by the army to introduce the 7.62x51 as a general purpose cartridge was also wrong, a lighter cartridge is needed, the Soviet approach (using 7.62x39 + 7.62x54R) was better. The British .280 could have also worked. The M14 itself was fine, the doctrine behind it wasn't, in my opinion.

[Triplebaconation]

The Colt M231 Port Firing Weapon is a derivative of the M16/AR family rifles. It is fully-automatic only, has a special buffer tube to reduce recoil, fired at 1050-1225 rounds per minute, has a threaded hand guard and was made in such small numbers unless you know what you're looking for you'd almost certainly never find it. I happened upon it while reading a source book on the AR-15/M16 I have (had?), found the photos and forgot about it all together until 20 minutes ago.

I thought this was a hipster thread. The M231 is the 3 Doors Down of port-firing weapons.

[Lemanrussland]

So, would it be reasonable to have most GPMG's in my army be M60E4's, with some M240B's in use as well?

Sure, that would be completely fine. I would move to replace the M60 with the M240 though. The M60 gets a lot of undeserved shit slung at it (some people basically think it was a terrible machine gun), but it is frankly not the best/most logical design. The ubiquitous FN MAG and PK machine guns are better designs.

[Black Hand]

Speaking of MG's I have a some questions for my HMG its in 30X120 which has some pretty powerful loads, now I'm building it off of the PKM. Now my question is would I be better with a PKP forced cooling system and sacrifice barrel change time? And how does the KORD reduce recoil and how effective would it be for my HMG and AMR?

[The Ashkenazi]

Speaking of MG's I have a some questions for my HMG its in 30X120 which has some pretty powerful loads, now I'm building it off of the PKM. Now my question is would I be better with a PKP forced cooling system and sacrifice barrel change time? And how does the KORD reduce recoil and how effective would it be for my HMG and AMR?

Why 30x120mm? Isn't that a bit of overkill for a HMG?

[Spreewerke]

Picture of a gun to make this post look on topic:
(Image)

You don't see those handguards every day.

b/c I'm pretty sure you're hte only mod on right now

Picture of a gun to make this post look on topic:
(Image)

What gun is this?

Converted Saiga .308 Winchesthair with a custom-made extended magazine.

I "designed" a suppressor idea a few months ago that would be an infantryman's suppressor: Simple, easy to clean, cheap to make. Ideally you would want the suppressor in the range of $75-125 in manufacturing cost to be a viable thing to issue on large scale, and you want to make it simple to clean: Thats what my idea was, which was a simple "slip baffle" design that consisted of three component sets that were simple to take apart, clean and maintain, and reassemble. The problem with this is that it might seem "cheap" and have a low life of use. Then you run into the issues of subsonics vs supersonics, which effects the effectiveness of suppressors and sound dispersal pattern....Blah blah blah.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=texEzvXnmdk

'Murricah! beat you to it. These suppressors are ~$500.00 pre-tax, if I remember correctly. I'm assuming they'd be in your price range at actual cost plus government contract price. Real simple.

Ok, so I'm going to try and put out some less common infantry weapons.

This one is based on the M4

I "lol"ed.

I'd suggest going with an RPK-pattern receiver. Look up the VEPR and Saigas in .308 Winchesthair: they use an RPK-pattern receiver.

are there any differences other than overall tickness and the reinforcement near the bolt?

sorry, i'm not very keen of eye.

These are airsoft, but are fairly decent representations. The top receiver is the RPK receiver and the taker of this photo went ahead and circled the main difference (reinforced barrel trunnion and different rivet pattern). The RPK receiver is also made out of a 1.5mm thick piece of steel opposed to the standard AK's stamped receiver of 1mm thickness.

FN FAL. End of story.

P.S: +1 ACOG Scope

My experience with ACOGs has left me greatly unimpressed with them. Their eye relief sucks, and they're way too fucking overpriced for what they are. I'd take a red dot or PSO-pattern optic over them any day. I will admit that the ACOG's range finder is a little more practical than the PSO's (shoulder width vs. target height), but that's about it. The ACOG's nice, but that's it... nice. It didn't give me operatorgasms or anything. Just a nice scope is all.

(Image)

AK!

Airsoft Kalashnikov.

You can tell by the complete lack of space in the apparently solid charging handle cut-out.

Considering the fact that the barrel is a vital part in the whole recoil operation thing I'd say not. At least not unless you want to fire at a gazillion bullets per nanosecond. Or you know, just not work.

Especially considering some forms of the MG42 fired at almost two thousand RPM...
yeah...

1,500RPM is close to 2,000RPM? Is there a variant I am unaware of?



Also, Puzikas: since you're reading this, you can assume I didn't kill myself. Mostly because I don't know where my PM is, but also because I took many deep breaths and sadsturbated.

[Black Hand]

Speaking of MG's I have a some questions for my HMG its in 30X120 which has some pretty powerful loads, now I'm building it off of the PKM. Now my question is would I be better with a PKP forced cooling system and sacrifice barrel change time? And how does the KORD reduce recoil and how effective would it be for my HMG and AMR?

Why 30x120mm? Isn't that a bit of overkill for a HMG?

Because power armor. And its the same as my AMR, HMG/GLMG, and shotgun/light grenade launcher


Is something wrong with spree? Not my business but I can guess. My condolences whatever it may be.

[Spreewerke]

Why 30x120mm? Isn't that a bit of overkill for a HMG?

Because power armor. And its the same as my AMR, HMG/GLMG, and shotgun/light grenade launcher


Is something wrong with spree? Not my business but I can guess. My condolences whatever it may be.

Inside joke, comrade.

[Pan Asian Amercian Coalition]

The M60 was an unholy child of the MG42 and the Lewis Gun. Two of the most glorious MGs ever made.

And it sucked. I was disappoint.

Anyways: What do you guys think of a toggle lock action rifle in the 6mm for WW2 era stuff?

[Aqizithiuda]

The M60 was an unholy child of the MG42 and the Lewis Gun. Two of the most glorious MGs ever made.

And it sucked. I was disappoint.

Anyways: What do you guys think of a toggle lock action rifle in the 6mm for WW2 era stuff?

It's possible, but it's unlikely to have a reputation for reliability, unless it's Swiss made/only being used in Switzerland.

[Black Hand]

Because power armor. And its the same as my AMR, HMG/GLMG, and shotgun/light grenade launcher


Is something wrong with spree? Not my business but I can guess. My condolences whatever it may be.

Inside joke, comrade.

Sorry suicide statements always get me concerned..... I've had experience with both the living and the dead and I much prefer a live person to corpse

[Austroatia]

The Austroatian Infantry is one of the mightiest of it's time, well trained soldiers fight for their country and their Fuhrer with the utmost loyalty and dedication. The wool uniform is usually outfitted with a stahlhelm, and multiple combat gear types such a packs, sleeping bags, ammo boxes, grenades, etc.

As for our weapons, typical infantrymen use the Zigsauzer P-45 pistol

And the MP-95, based off the German MP-40 but with a more modern design

The Common Infantry along with any special forces of the Wehrmacht Heer, use the Staufen AR-762

It uses a 7.62x51mm round, and comes equipped with a detachable bayonet for close combat. It is one of the most deadliest weapons in Austroatia.

The Waffen SS SSG Units are the best of the best. Otherwise known as "Shadow Squads" these men are hand selected from Naval Marines Ranks.

SS Kommando Squads a.k.a. "Punishment Squads" work alongside the SSG in combat, and also look after P.O.W. camps. They are the most feared and elite units, selected ONLY from the General SS Divisions.

The Typical Waffen SS troops can enlist for the Waffen SS once they have performed 3 years of service, but they require another 4 week training program. Typical SS Soldiers wear the same wool uniform as the Wehrmacht, but with different insignia

The Waffen SS and some Naval Marines units use the Zigsauzer TBR-754 Tactical Rifle.

It uses a 7.62x54mm round and has an optional grenade launcher that fires M433 HEDP Grenade rounds. The only time a Wehrmacht soldier may use this weapon is when his rifle is out of ammo and he picks it up to defend himself.

In The Luftwaffe Airforce, the Fallshirmjager or Paratroops drop from planes onto the battlefield, they use the Staufen AR-762 and are specially trained in open military owned fields during a 5 week program.

The Kriegsmarine Naval Marines are elite units specialized for land, sea, and air warfare. They use both the AR-762 and the TBR-754 Rifles as well as the MP-95. They are trained in a 6 week program on navy ships and at training bases across Austroatia.

[Gallia-]

What makes these guns so special? Wikipedia can only tell me so much.

Nothing whatsoever.

They all shoot bullets and all the bullets kill people. The differences are mostly aesthetics, personal preference, and fashion.

[Rich and Corporations]

What makes these guns so special? Wikipedia can only tell me so much.

Nothing whatsoever.

They all shoot bullets and all the bullets kill people. The differences are mostly aesthetics, personal preference, and fashion.

Yes, but bigger bullets traveling faster are more likely to kill for numerous reasons.

[New Visegrad]

Once more
Smoothbore BR for EVA work, y/n?

> 2200 or thereabouts (I honestly have no idea what year it is in your nation)
> Not using 4mm hypervelocity flechettes for EVA troops
> Not firing said flechettes out of a superior autorail rifle

Plebs

Our infantry railguns are heavier, bulkier affairs that are generally classified as anti-vehicle weapons. Also, they're not available for civilian use, so while a CAT might in fact use a railgun in EVA, your average starship crew is only allowed lightweight lasers or propellant/projectile weapons.

(For the record, it's 4405 DCT, or 39-something standard calendar.)

[Triplebaconation]

Since I doubt you're taking full advantage of 39-something technology, how do you expect an oxymoronic "smoothbore BR" to be very accurate?

[Rich and Corporations]

Since I doubt you're taking full advantage of 39-something technology, how do you expect an oxymoronic "smoothbore BR" to be very accurate?

maybe he uses flechettes?

[Triplebaconation]

how do fletchettes work in space

[Bezombia]

b/c I'm pretty sure you're hte only mod on right now

Picture of a gun to make this post look on topic:
(Image)

What gun is this?

Seems to be an AK-74M something something RPK modified to feed from Galil 7.62x51 magazines.

Speaking of MG's I have a some questions for my HMG its in 30X120 which has some pretty powerful loads, now I'm building it off of the PKM. Now my question is would I be better with a PKP forced cooling system and sacrifice barrel change time? And how does the KORD reduce recoil and how effective would it be for my HMG and AMR?

From what I understand it, the PKP takes longer to heat up, but the PKM is easier to manage once it does.
From what I've read, for this reasons the PKP is better suited for the squad machinegunenr role, where the PKM is better suited for the mounted machine gun role.

So if you're going for an HMG issued like an HMG (on turrets, vehicles, aircraft, etc...not in soldiers' hands) I'd go with the PKM.

All right, I'm going to experiment with multiple platforms. For my LMG, should I go with the MK46, the M249, or the XM8 light machine gun version? My AK LMG has too small a magazine. The only reason I chose it was for it's lightweight, but I've pretty much abandoned that.

Just use the 75 round drums used with the RPK-74 adapted to use 5.56x45.

[DnalweN acilbupeR]

dumb question ahead: can you use a scope through NVGs?

[Rich and Corporations]

how do fletchettes work in space

there is air in space
depending how deep you are