Your Nations Warships, MKII

[Tsuyoi Tekikoku]

Could i talk to someone in TG? I need some help improving a carrier i made.

[Roski]

I kept my LSTs around ICly because once a beachhead was secured using amphibious infantry, heavy armored units would be brought in almost immediately in order to reinforce the light infantry that landed.

Which means you're still restricted to the same beaches, correct?

[The Ukrainian Navy and Sea Guard]

I'm personally considering using my Ropucha class LSM as sea base. The ship would carry two 11m or 7m patrol\landing boats on davits, and a helicopter. Not sure how many helos I can land on just a regular deck rather than a flight deck.

[Husseinarti]

I kept my LSTs around ICly because once a beachhead was secured using amphibious infantry, heavy armored units would be brought in almost immediately in order to reinforce the light infantry that landed.

LCACs can do heavy armour

it's why they exist

Wouldn't it take longer for LCACs to ferry ashore a company worth of tanks, when an LST and land on a secured beachhead and land them?

[Gallia-]

LCACs can do heavy armour

it's why they exist

Wouldn't it take longer for LCACs to ferry ashore a company worth of tanks, when an LST and land on a secured beachhead and land them?

no not really

it would just take more of them

[The Ukrainian Navy and Sea Guard]

Wouldn't it take longer for LCACs to ferry ashore a company worth of tanks, when an LST and land on a secured beachhead and land them?

no not really

it would just take more of them

Out of interest, what would the best landing craft\ship for Ukraine be, given their current situation? A Chinese LCAC?

[Rupudska]

What's a good modern corvette class to use? I was thinking of using two types, one for escort duty/ASW, and one for coast patrol.

[Spirit of Hope]

no not really

it would just take more of them

Out of interest, what would the best landing craft\ship for Ukraine be, given their current situation? A Chinese LCAC?

Given their current situation? None. They have no need for them and much bigger worries on the home front.

For a nation designed after them? Saying the Russians left you some when they pulled out and the fleets got split.

[Gallia-]

no not really

it would just take more of them

Out of interest, what would the best landing craft\ship for Ukraine be, given their current situation? A Chinese LCAC?

Nothing. Ukraine has no major naval ports, and its Navy is basically confined to the Dnieper.

[The Ukrainian Navy and Sea Guard]

Out of interest, what would the best landing craft\ship for Ukraine be, given their current situation? A Chinese LCAC?

Nothing. Ukraine has no major naval ports, and its Navy is basically confined to the Dnieper.

No. Just... no.

Ukraine's main naval base\port is in Odessa, albeit a minor one and a bit cramped, which escaped the Russian Capture, there are plans to develope Ochaiv, which currently is homeport to everal auxilleries, and Mariupol is a Coast Gaurd base. The Ukrainian Navy retains very limited Blue Water capability with a single frigate, but in reality it acts as an OPV. The Navy\Coast Gaurd operates on both the Black Sea and Sea of Azov. They also have a brigade of Marines and a a single Polochny class LSm which I'd like to replace with an LCAC. Considering a Zubr from China.

[L3 Communications]

Nothing. Ukraine has no major naval ports, and its Navy is basically confined to the Dnieper.

No. Just... no.

Ukraine's main naval base\port is in Odessa, albeit a minor one and a bit cramped, which escaped the Russian Capture, there are plans to develope Ochaiv, which currently is homeport to everal auxilleries, and Mariupol is a Coast Gaurd base. The Ukrainian Navy retains very limited Blue Water capability with a single frigate, but in reality it acts as an OPV. The Navy\Coast Gaurd operates on both the Black Sea and Sea of Azov. They also have a brigade of Marines and a a single Polochny class LSm which I'd like to replace with an LCAC. Considering a Zubr from China.

No, really, without Sevastopol it's basically nothing, and it's not going to get Crimea back any time soon.

One ship isn't going to be enough for a credible landing force, and one landing craft isn't going to be useful. There's no real reason Ukraine needs naval infantry, afaict it's just a holdover from the pre-Soviet era kept around for ~reasons~. Everything it does can be accomplished by Army troops.

Buy a bunch of little boats for landing single sections, and shrink the Naval Infantry down to a battalion of commandos like the Kustjagarna. Train them for riverine/littoral raids or something and commando/ranger duties like the KJ. That'll be more useful than a ridiculous white elephant LCAC and some ersatz mechanized infantry.

Ukraine in its current situation should focus on acquiring OPVs, bulking up its littoral warfare capability with small craft like CB90 and commandos, and generally pursuing a strong coastal navy. Some modern SSKs wouldn't go amiss either but that's probably more long term. Kill all frigates, FACs, ASW ships, and landing ships. Those are huge money sinks and tbh they're shit. Pr 58250 looks alright, and honestly is probably a lot better than having the Soviet-era rust buckets hulking around. It can do all their jobs.

So alongside that thing, throw in three or four modern SSKs and a boatload (ha) of CB90s.

Done.

You don't need an LCAC, you couldn't make use of it anyway. Ukraine's interests are right off shore (Crimea, for a start), so start there.

[Padnak]

I'll take that LCAC off your hands for a good price...

being such a fan of white elephants as I am

[North Arkana]

I worked out the organization of ships and vessels within my navy. Now to just work the specifics of each ship class.

Each ANDF Fleet has: 1 fleet carrier (CVF) with 60 fighters and 12 other aircraft of varying types, 2 light carriers (CVL) with 24 aircraft each and 6 other aircraft of varying types, 2 nuclear "battleships" (BBGN) with heavy rail-guns, advanced AA weapons, and missiles, 4 medium rail-gun equipped missile cruisers (CGN), 8 light rail-gun equipped missile destroyers (DDGN), 12 light rail-gun equipped missile frigates (FFGN), and 2 multi-role nuclear submarines (SSMN), with 12 combat cargo support ships (CCS) to accompany the fleet.

Overall Commander: Admiral Jacob Hood

---

1st Fleet: Home Defense - Admiral Marcos - (Flagship) CVF-32 ANS Stratos, CVL-118, CVL-119, BBGN-5, BBGN-6, CGN-101 to 104, DDGN-451 to 458, FFGN-626 to 638, SSMN-132, SSMN-133, CCS-763 to 784

---

2nd Fleet: South Atlantic - Admiral Dreslin - (Flagship) CVF-33 ANS Sentinel, CVL-120, CVL-121, BBGN-7, BBGN-8, CGN-105 to 108, DDGN-458 to 466, FFGN-639 to 650, SSMN-134, SSMN-135, CCS-785 to 796

---

3rd Fleet: North Pacific - Admiral Kitchner - (Flagship) CVF-34 ANS Valiant, CVL-122, CVL-123, BBGN-9, BBGN-10, CGN-109 to 112, DDGN-467 to 474, FFGN-651 to 662, SSMN-136, SSMN-137, CCS-797 to 808

---

4th Fleet: South Pacific - Admiral Kincade - (Flagship) CVF-35 ANS Stalwart, CVL-124, CVL-125 BBGN-11, BBGN-12, CGN-113 to 116, DDGN-475 to 482, FFGN-663 to 674, SSMN-138, SSMN-139, CCS-809 to 820

---

5th Fleet: Indian Ocean/South Pacific - Admiral Farrow - (Flagship) CVF-36 ANS Endurance, CVL-126, CVL-127, BBGN-13, BBGN-14, CGN-117 to 120, DDGN-482 to 490, FFGN-675 to 686, SSMN-140, SSMN-141, CCS-821 to 832

---

6th Fleet: Mobile Fleet - Admiral Cole - (Flagship) CVF-37 ANS Horizon, CVL-128, CVL-129, BBGN-1, BBGN-2, CGN-121 to 124, DDGN-491 to 498, FFGN-687 to 698, SSMN-142, SSMN-143, CCS-833 to 844

---

7th Fleet: Mobile Fleet - Admiral Kristov - (Flagship) CVF-38 ANS Everest, CVL-130, CVL-131, BBGN-3, BBGN-4, CGN-125 to 128, DDGN-499 to 506, FFGN-699 to 710, SSMN-144 ANS Abgrund, SSMN-145, CCS-845 to 856

---

8th Fleet: North Atlantic/North Sea/Mediterranean - Admiral Wells - (Flagship) CVF-39 ANS Midlothian, CVL-132, CVL-133, BBGN-15, BBGN-16, CGN-129 to 132, DDGN-507 to 514, FFGN-711 to 722, SSMN-146, SSMN-147, CCS-857 to 868

---

9th Fleet: Central Pacific - Admiral Sumner - (Flagship) CVF-40 ANS Guardian, CVL-134, CVL-135, BBGN-17, BBGN-18, CGN-133 to 136, DDGN-515 to 522, FFGN-723 to 734, SSMN-148, SSMN-149, CCS-869 to 880

---

Joint Mobile Fleet- Joint force of the 6th and 7th Mobile Fleets- Admiral Cole assumes position as senior flag officer with Admiral Kristov as second in command.

---

Office of Naval Surveillance (ONS)- Admiral Perez

---

The ANDF has fielded nuclear powered "battleships". Powered by nuclear reactors, the "battleships" no longer need to store massive amounts of fuel, saving weight and cutting down on size. Two molten salt reactors are used, one large reactor to provide propulsion power, while a smaller reactor powers weapons. Among these weapons are free-electron lasers and prototype railguns. These nuclear "battleships" have replaced the old modernized battleships formerly stationed with the fleets. The 6th and 7th Mobile Fleets were the first to receive the new ships, resulting the non-sequential ships numbers among the fleets.

---

With the development of laser weapon systems, all vessels assigned to the fleets have been retrofitted with the technology.

[Roski]

no not really

it would just take more of them

Out of interest, what would the best landing craft\ship for Ukraine be, given their current situation? A Chinese LCAC?

The current situation of Ukraine? Its only known enemy at this point shares a significant land border, and, they have no other hostile threats. Ukraine does not need any form of marine infantry, or anything in preparation for amphibious invasion.

[The Akasha Colony]

Nothing. Ukraine has no major naval ports, and its Navy is basically confined to the Dnieper.

No. Just... no.

Ukraine's main naval base\port is in Odessa, albeit a minor one and a bit cramped, which escaped the Russian Capture, there are plans to develope Ochaiv, which currently is homeport to everal auxilleries, and Mariupol is a Coast Gaurd base. The Ukrainian Navy retains very limited Blue Water capability with a single frigate, but in reality it acts as an OPV. The Navy\Coast Gaurd operates on both the Black Sea and Sea of Azov. They also have a brigade of Marines and a a single Polochny class LSm which I'd like to replace with an LCAC. Considering a Zubr from China.

What would you do with this Zubr?

Landing craft are only useful if you have the ability to support them.

Say you've got this Zubr. Where are you going to use it? You don't have a navy to seriously contest the Russians for control of the Black Sea, so trying to put your LCAC to sea will just result in it getting sunk by an actual warship. You don't have enough strength to land in force against an enemy as strong as Russia, or any of the other Black Sea powers, because you have a single landing ship. You don't have any follow-on capabilities either, which means that once you've disembarked your troops, they're going to be sorely lacking in support and obliterated rather quickly.

So again, what are you going to do with a landing ship?

LCACs can do heavy armour

it's why they exist

Wouldn't it take longer for LCACs to ferry ashore a company worth of tanks, when an LST and land on a secured beachhead and land them?

It still ultimately leaves you stuck using just a small handful of beaches, which makes the advantages of an LCAC moot.

[Padnak]

Be like Padnak and use your antiquated Tank Landing Ships and other landing craft to move supplies to outposts on small islands around your country

[The Ukrainian Navy and Sea Guard]

The Ukrainian Navy has two main missions: Coastal Defense and International Co-operation.

For the first mission, Ukraine has a well laid out plan, building one new corvette and 30 IPV's which are building right now. This will be more than enough to defend their littorals from foreign aggression. This is a non-issue anyhow as it would entail direct, undeniable Russian intervention, which Russia has thus far attempted to avoid in order to avoid international criticism. Of course, I model the current situation give or take a few years where the Crimea and Donbas form a frozen conflict situation, so I don't have access to that tech. And given the Ukraine has maneged to comission a total of three new ships over the last twenty years, I'm not holding my breath. In my three years of being on NS (On a different account), I have never had to actually defend my nations homeland, so I do not bother much with the first mission.

For the second mission, Ukraine has many different options. One of them is deploying for international exercises, which it does with Sea Breeze every year, in real life. Another option is Anti-Piracy patrols, which the RL Hetman Sahaidachny did in 2013 off the coast of Africa, and my NS Hetman Sahaidachny did in Yohannes' waters (the West Pacific, I think). Ukraine also has several asymmetric options available curtosey the 73rd Spec Ops, which I have used in my deployment of the Spy Ship Pereyaslav to keep the peace in the recent conflict against the CAJ. (She was later joined by the Hetman, returning home from her patrol). I have also used the LSM Kirvograd to raid and capture a small island (though admittedly that only worked because the other RP-er was a beginner. We all have to start somewhere). I found that I liked the fast paced nature of the raid rp, as it only took one evening's worth of commitment and I was better able to achieve my goals. A small force, with clear goals, commanded well is far better than a large, amorphous one. The problem I found though was that the LSM's speed was insufficent to make a good raiding craft, hence the intrest in LCAC (well, that and not derailing the thread). I have also suggested the use of Kirovograd as a Sea Basing ship, featuring two Willard Marine 11m Patrol Boats and a helicopter (probably either a KA-29 or Mi-2), landing on the unmodified foredeck. This would negate the speed issue by allowing the ship to sit in safety off shore and send amphibious raiders inland.

Currently, the Ukrainian Marines are serving several important purposes. Firstly, they are a second Army, better trained and equipped, as has happened in the American Military. In this capacity, they are currently deployed to protect the port of Mariupol. The second role for them is not invasion of Russia, as has been suggested, but rather counter landings to defend the coast. A supply role is conceivable as well, due to the amphibious capabilities. The third role of the marines is serving in detachments aboard ship, which I have used before in Anti-Piracy Ops with success. The final, and most interesting role to me is protecting Ukranians overseas and generally contributing to larger allied operations. This last occured in 2011, when Ukraine sent an LST to Libiya to evacuate civilians. It is precisely this role for which I am most intersted in expanding my capabillities. The Riverine role is an interesting role to me as well, but I feel that what is need there is not new material but new training with existing Willard Marine 11m Patrol Boats.

I only suggested the Zubr because of Ukranian Insitutional knowledge, and the slim possibility of buying a chinese copy. I would personally prefer somthing more along the lines of a Lebed or Aist. It would have to be capable of using it's speed for raids\counter landings to avoid enemy defeneses, and be able to carry 8 APCs as in the obsolete Kirovograd.

[Husseinarti]

The USMC's equipment typically is the second-hand equipment from the Army.

[New Oyashima]

Can someone give me a good run down on just how terrible Iranian swarm tactics are? Not Gayla levels either, he's lazy :c

[Gallia-]

I'm going to address this in stages because it's a huge post. Also, I'm going to work backwards.

Currently, the Ukrainian Marines are serving several important purposes. Firstly, they are a second Army, better trained and equipped, as has happened in the American Military.[2] In this capacity, they are currently deployed to protect the port of Mariupol.[3] The second role for them is not invasion of Russia, as has been suggested[4], but rather counter landings to defend the coast. A supply role is conceivable as well, due to the amphibious capabilities.[5] The third role of the marines is serving in detachments aboard ship, which I have used before in Anti-Piracy Ops with success.[6] The final, and most interesting role to me is protecting Ukranians overseas and generally contributing to larger allied operations.[7] This last occured in 2011, when Ukraine sent an LST to Libiya to evacuate civilians.[8] It is precisely this role for which I am most intersted in expanding my capabillities. The Riverine role is an interesting role to me as well, but I feel that what is need there is not new material but new training with existing Willard Marine 11m Patrol Boats.[9]

I only suggested the Zubr because of Ukranian Insitutional knowledge, and the slim possibility of buying a chinese copy.[10] I would personally prefer somthing more along the lines of a Lebed or Aist. It would have to be capable of using it's speed for raids\counter landings to avoid enemy defeneses, and be able to carry 8 APCs as in the obsolete Kirovograd.

2) A second army is actually useless, and one of the reasons it's super dumb is the American experiment. That's part of the Marine Myth, if you will. The USMC is no better than the US Army, and is actually worse in a lot of ways. The USMC is no worse or better equipped than the US Army, in fact it has a lot of ludicrous ideas. About the only thing it does better is integration of fixed-wing and rotary wing aircraft for close air support, which is no tremendous surprise given the US Army isn't allowed to have fixed-wing ground attack aircraft. The US Army has done bigger amphibious operations more successfully than the USMC, which prior to WW2 was a very traditional marine force.

3) Marine detachments do not necessitate armoured fighting vehicles. In fact, this is highly detrimental to their alleged role as shipboard police/commandos/boarding parties as you imply. The KJ or Royal Marines are better models than the Black Sea Fleet.

4) Where was "invasion of Russia" implied? Please find that, unless you mean where I mentioned, which I was doing so facetiously because the only reason you'd have mechanized Marines is if you're planning on landing in Rostov-on-Don or Istanbul or something. It's a giant anachronism from the Black Sea Fleet tbh, like if Ukraine had mechanized airborne troops or whatever. It's just a really stupid :Russian: thing that will probably change in the future (ideally) to reflect Ukraine's shifting geopolitical threats.

5) PROTIP: Sweden's Marines have the same jobs as all of this. They do it a lot better than Ukraine's marines because they aren't driving around in useless APCs or tanks or whatever. They have speedboats and carry their heavy weapons, being more like an elite light infantry raiding force than mechanized heavy troops. Ukraine isn't the United States. It can barely afford to pay its own army, it doesn't need a second one!

The Army should be the only counter-landing operations force, that's it's job! The Marines can be kept around for, as you said, shipboard security/boarding, assisting the coast guard, and international operations. None of this necessitates that you have a brigade of Marines, that these Marines be mechanized, or that these Marines have the ability to land a mechanized infantry brigade.

6) When you can land a BTR-80 on a merchant ship, I'll be a) surprised; b) realize the relevance of Ukraine's mechanization of its Marines.

7) This is a good point, counter-intuitively. Mechanization increases time for readiness and mobilization. There's a reason Western rapid reaction troops are light, non-mechanized paratroopers or amphibious raiders. It's not because they're pussies or whatever, it's because that means they can get their butts on a plane and combat ready in another country in a couple days instead of a couple weeks.

This could be done with frigates just as easily. Look at what China did in Yemen with some frigates and destroyers, not assault craft. A 1950s LST is not useful for anything besides an auxiliary transport role, where it's more expensive and less capable in that role than a modified commercial freighter. Keep it if you need a landing base or something, but it's not the only thing that can do international operations.

9) PT boats are a good idea for riverine troops for patrols and stuff (see: USN NECC), but actual assaults/raids would need something better I'd think. Look at CB90 for a start.

10) This isn't a bad idea, but again I don't see the point of being able to lift heavy armour, nor do I see the point of Ukraine having mechanized marine troops. Mechanized marine troops are generally considered offensive forces for breaching/forced entry, not counter landing. The latter is done by motor rifles or mechanized Army troops in-land.

tl;dr Train the Army to do counter-landing operations with motor rifle regiments, get the Marines more specialized to do expeditionary/littoral tasks like commando raiding operations and general light infantry roles. Once you switch the Marines from a second army to something actually relevant (a light commando force), they'll be useful again.

For the second mission, Ukraine has many different options. One of them is deploying for international exercises, which it does with Sea Breeze every year, in real life.[1] Another option is Anti-Piracy patrols, which the RL Hetman Sahaidachny did in 2013 off the coast of Africa, and my NS Hetman Sahaidachny did in Yohannes' waters (the West Pacific, I think). Ukraine also has several asymmetric options available curtosey the 73rd Spec Ops, which I have used in my deployment of the Spy Ship Pereyaslav to keep the peace in the recent conflict against the CAJ. (She was later joined by the Hetman, returning home from her patrol). I have also used the LSM Kirvograd to raid and capture a small island (though admittedly that only worked because the other RP-er was a beginner. We all have to start somewhere). I found that I liked the fast paced nature of the raid rp, as it only took one evening's worth of commitment and I was better able to achieve my goals.[2] A small force, with clear goals, commanded well is far better than a large, amorphous one. The problem I found though was that the LSM's speed was insufficent to make a good raiding craft, hence the intrest in LCAC (well, that and not derailing the thread).[3] I have also suggested the use of Kirovograd as a Sea Basing ship, featuring two Willard Marine 11m Patrol Boats and a helicopter (probably either a KA-29 or Mi-2), landing on the unmodified foredeck.[4] This would negate the speed issue by allowing the ship to sit in safety off shore and send amphibious raiders inland.

1) This is why Pr 58250 exists I think. It looks like a generally solid, multipurpose frigate, able to defend itself decently against all attacks and be useful for international and littoral operations. Sort of like a less shit/modular LCS ASW combatant. That's really all the surface combatant Ukraine wants.

2) I don't know what all these NS things are they're irrelevant in either case tbh. If you're literally RP'ing Ukraine c. 2014 or w/e you don't need Zubrs or anything that's a fact rly.

3) This is pretty solid basis, and generally why people want LCACs. The problem is that LSMs are used to deliver tanks and IFVs, which very few marine forces need unless they're expected to conduct opposed landing, forced entry operations against mechanized formations. This requires more than one LCAC, you need about 20-30. And a mechanized infantry brigade and tank battalion. And a fleet of 15-20 landing ships. You need more if they are actual competents like everyone and their dog is on NS. You see where it gets expensive.

To illustrate the problem: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... 91/ARL.htm

This is not what a fast raid force needs, although it could be helpful it rarely is. Hovercraft are loud and visible, which is counter productive for fast raiders. You want something quiet and fast, which is Strb/CB90 or Swift Boat/PCF, or whatever.

4) This is probably what would happen regardless IRL, it's not possible to bring an LST ashore anyway and live rly.

It's suboptimal, but cheaper than buying HMS Ocean or something, which would be the best option for you as it is.

The Ukrainian Navy has two main missions: Coastal Defense and International Co-operation.

For the first mission, Ukraine has a well laid out plan, building one new corvette[1] and 30 IPV's which are building right now.[2] This will be more than enough to defend their littorals from foreign aggression. This is a non-issue anyhow as it would entail direct, undeniable Russian intervention, which Russia has thus far attempted to avoid in order to avoid international criticism.[3] Of course, I model the current situation give or take a few years where the Crimea and Donbas form a frozen conflict situation, so I don't have access to that tech.[4] And given the Ukraine has maneged to comission a total of three new ships over the last twenty years, I'm not holding my breath. In my three years of being on NS (On a different account), I have never had to actually defend my nations homeland, so I do not bother much with the first mission.

1) I thought it had more than one Pr 58250 on order? At least replace all corvettes and frigates with them.

2) This is good, but it doesn't provide a lot of room for landing troops. CB90s are lighter and can navigate waterways, islets, and deltas far better than a mini-corvette, and you can operate them from an LST probably just fine.

3) I don't see how this precludes Marine raids into irregular-regular occupied territory. Ukraine's marines are very small and Ukraine is a very small country, so a Marine force that can hit hard and fast is probably going to be better than a mechanized troupe waltzing around the countryside being no different than the Army. The current mechanized force is a product of Russian experience in WW2, not an actual reflection on Ukraine's future or even needs.

You mentioned raiding and fast attacks, which seems to be preferential to a mechanized assault, especially in your use in RPs. Again, consider looking at fast raiders like the French, British, and Swedish marines instead of thinking you need to keep the BTRs or w/e.

Coastal defence doesn't need sole Marine intervention to do, in fact Sweden's marines have the very same mission, but they are focused on the littoral island holdings and immediate coastal areas along the Baltic coast. They're a fast raider force built for special operations missions as opposed to a mechanized infantry force built to counter land against the 3rd SS Panzer Division besieging Sevastopol or whatever.

You would probably prefer the Army take over the Marines' mission of counter-landing operations with mechanized forces, and switch the Marines' coastal defence mission to be more focused around the very immediate coastal area (a few km inland) and international operations, with a preference towards light infantry/raider role. The BTRs, AFAIK, have never been used by the Ukrainian Marines in combat and seem to be ultimately dead weight. Against a defended coastline, the LST would die with all hands; and you wouldn't be able to build up sufficient combat power to stop any unit equivalent in size regardless with just one landing ship.

Your two choices really are to either increase your amphibious landing capacity to handle a Marine brigade (less likely, very expensive) or reform the marines into a more mobile light infantry unit for raiding actions (more likely, less expensive).

[Gallia-]

Can someone give me a good run down on just how terrible Iranian swarm tactics are? Not Gayla levels either, he's lazy :c

:<<<<

The USMC's equipment typically is the second-hand equipment from the Army.

It isn't, it's second-hand USMC equipment.

Marine Abrams are probably going to end up better than US Army ones since they still have Hardhat and will eventually get the same spinny turret diddle as Protector with SCOWS, but everything else is kinda lol/ancient.

[The Ukrainian Navy and Sea Guard]

Currently, the Ukranian Marines are moving from motorized infantry vehicles, BTR-80s, to US supplied Humvees, and so I think right now that makes them more of light infantry than mechanized infantry. They are in transition, obviously, due to the war in Donbas, and things are a bit doctrinally mixed up.

I was interested in Zubr class LCAC's due to their giving me access to 70% of all beeches in the world, along with my previously stated purposes. However, it appears that these vehicles have too small a range for my purposes and along with the noise and cost issues previously stated, this makes them unsuitable.

My vision is to transform the corp into a long range raiding force. For this reason, as excellent a raiding craft as the CB-90 is I think it is not what I am looking for. I may test it in combat, anyhow, to see the results.

My new concept of sea basing is founded on the use of Ukraine's current landing ship, the Kirovograd, which can carry 8 BTR's. For a seas basing mission, however, I would probably reduce the number of BTR-80's in favor of more embarked supplies. The Kirvograd would carry two 11m patrol boats on her existing lifeboat davits, and also embark a helicopter on her bare fore deck (as she does not have a helipad). Idk if the latter would work, please advise. In my view, then, the Kirvograd would become a mother ship rather than taking part in direct assaults, hopefully with better results.

That said, I would like to have the capability to land a small number of troops from a long range naval platform with high speed and low cost. A derivitave of a civil high speed ferry may be in order. I've condsidered diverging from reality and employing a A-90 Orlyonok Erokanoplan but I suspect this would be dead meat in any warzone, even when it was brand new. And expensive as sin to boot.

[Velkanika]

Currently, the Ukranian Marines are moving from motorized infantry vehicles, BTR-80s, to US supplied Humvees, and so I think right now that makes them more of light infantry than mechanized infantry. They are in transition, obviously, due to the war in Donbas, and things are a bit doctrinally mixed up.

I was interested in Zubr class LCAC's due to their giving me access to 70% of all beeches in the world, along with my previously stated purposes. However, it appears that these vehicles have too small a range for my purposes and along with the noise and cost issues previously stated, this makes them unsuitable.

My vision is to transform the corp into a long range raiding force. For this reason, as excellent a raiding craft as the CB-90 is I think it is not what I am looking for. I may test it in combat, anyhow, to see the results.

My new concept of sea basing is founded on the use of Ukraine's current landing ship, the Kirovograd, which can carry 8 BTR's. For a seas basing mission, however, I would probably reduce the number of BTR-80's in favor of more embarked supplies. The Kirvograd would carry two 11m patrol boats on her existing lifeboat davits, and also embark a helicopter on her bare fore deck (as she does not have a helipad). Idk if the latter would work, please advise. In my view, then, the Kirvograd would become a mother ship rather than taking part in direct assaults, hopefully with better results.

That said, I would like to have the capability to land a small number of troops from a long range naval platform with high speed and low cost. A derivitave of a civil high speed ferry may be in order. I've condsidered diverging from reality and employing a A-90 Orlyonok Erokanoplan but I suspect this would be dead meat in any warzone, even when it was brand new. And expensive as sin to boot.

If you plan on getting into amphibious assaults, you should look into acquiring a helicopter carrier. Helicopter assaults are the best way to obtain initial control of a beach before the main landings with LCACs and traditional landing craft.

[Gallia-]

Currently, the Ukranian Marines are moving from motorized infantry vehicles, BTR-80s, to US supplied Humvees, and so I think right now that makes them more of light infantry than mechanized infantry. They are in transition, obviously, due to the war in Donbas, and things are a bit doctrinally mixed up.

I was interested in Zubr class LCAC's due to their giving me access to 70% of all beeches in the world, along with my previously stated purposes. However, it appears that these vehicles have too small a range for my purposes and along with the noise and cost issues previously stated, this makes them unsuitable.

My vision is to transform the corp into a long range raiding force. For this reason, as excellent a raiding craft as the CB-90 is I think it is not what I am looking for. I may test it in combat, anyhow, to see the results.

My new concept of sea basing is founded on the use of Ukraine's current landing ship, the Kirovograd, which can carry 8 BTR's. For a seas basing mission, however, I would probably reduce the number of BTR-80's in favor of more embarked supplies. The Kirvograd would carry two 11m patrol boats on her existing lifeboat davits, and also embark a helicopter on her bare fore deck (as she does not have a helipad). Idk if the latter would work, please advise. In my view, then, the Kirvograd would become a mother ship rather than taking part in direct assaults, hopefully with better results.

That said, I would like to have the capability to land a small number of troops from a long range naval platform with high speed and low cost. A derivitave of a civil high speed ferry may be in order. I've condsidered diverging from reality and employing a A-90 Orlyonok Erokanoplan but I suspect this would be dead meat in any warzone, even when it was brand new. And expensive as sin to boot.

CB90 can be operated from a mothership fine tbh.

I don't know how you'd operate a Zubr from an LST. You'd have to get close enough to open the bow doors I guess, since it doesn't have a well deck, and that's exceedingly dangerous. If you're using the Zubr alongside the LST, you are limited to low sea states of inland seas, or having some other means of transporting the hovercraft, but it keeps the LST out of harm's way.

This is a OK interim solution, but in the end you will need a purpose built amphibious helicopter dock on the order of Juan Carlos I or HMS Ocean. You will also want more than one helicopter ultimately. Like three or four.

[New Chilokver]

Currently, the Ukranian Marines are moving from motorized infantry vehicles, BTR-80s, to US supplied Humvees, and so I think right now that makes them more of light infantry than mechanized infantry. They are in transition, obviously, due to the war in Donbas, and things are a bit doctrinally mixed up.

I was interested in Zubr class LCAC's due to their giving me access to 70% of all beeches in the world, along with my previously stated purposes. However, it appears that these vehicles have too small a range for my purposes and along with the noise and cost issues previously stated, this makes them unsuitable.

My vision is to transform the corp into a long range raiding force. For this reason, as excellent a raiding craft as the CB-90 is I think it is not what I am looking for. I may test it in combat, anyhow, to see the results.

My new concept of sea basing is founded on the use of Ukraine's current landing ship, the Kirovograd, which can carry 8 BTR's. For a seas basing mission, however, I would probably reduce the number of BTR-80's in favor of more embarked supplies. The Kirvograd would carry two 11m patrol boats on her existing lifeboat davits, and also embark a helicopter on her bare fore deck (as she does not have a helipad). Idk if the latter would work, please advise. In my view, then, the Kirvograd would become a mother ship rather than taking part in direct assaults, hopefully with better results.

That said, I would like to have the capability to land a small number of troops from a long range naval platform with high speed and low cost. A derivitave of a civil high speed ferry may be in order. I've condsidered diverging from reality and employing a A-90 Orlyonok Erokanoplan but I suspect this would be dead meat in any warzone, even when it was brand new. And expensive as sin to boot.

CB90 can be operated from a mothership fine tbh.

I don't know how you'd operate a Zubr from an LST. You'd have to get close enough to open the bow doors I guess, since it doesn't have a well deck, and that's exceedingly dangerous. If you're using the Zubr alongside the LST, you are limited to low sea states of inland seas, or having some other means of transporting the hovercraft, but it keeps the LST out of harm's way.

This is a OK interim solution, but in the end you will need a purpose built amphibious helicopter dock on the order of Juan Carlos I or HMS Ocean. You will also want more than one helicopter ultimately. Like three or four.

If you were to reconfigure a Juan Carlos I to be more aviation orientated- a light carrier with amphibious assault capability, how many aircraft and what type could be carried?