Your Nations Warships, MKII

[Valdiu]

Would VLS work?

If you design it right. I believe some modern submarines use VLS cells in certain submarines.

My main concern is how compact torpedoes and VLS can be. Could, theoretically, a UAV be launched from a tube or VLS armed with some light ordnance (two 500-lbs or a few missiles)?

[Aznazia]

If you design it right. I believe some modern submarines use VLS cells in certain submarines.

My main concern is how compact torpedoes and VLS can be. Could, theoretically, a UAV be launched from a tube or VLS armed with some light ordnance (two 500-lbs or a few missiles)?

http://www.gizmag.com/submarine-uav-launch/30027/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_Cormorant

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNx28Xff5Yg

The Cormorant would be able to carry ordnance but it would mainly be used for scouting targets for cruise missiles from the Submarine.

[Spirit of Hope]

If you design it right. I believe some modern submarines use VLS cells in certain submarines.

My main concern is how compact torpedoes and VLS can be. Could, theoretically, a UAV be launched from a tube or VLS armed with some light ordnance (two 500-lbs or a few missiles)?

Maybe? I'm would not call myself an expert.

As an example the Trident II missiles are sub launched, they weigh 59,000 kg are 13 meters long and 2 meters wide. You could probably design a UAV that would fit inside of that container and carry some form of armaments, you would however be sacrificing multiple nuclear warheads.

Torpedo tubes on the other hand are only about 500-600 mm wide and ~6 meters long. While you could probably fit a UAV in that you probably can't include armaments.

[Valdiu]

My main concern is how compact torpedoes and VLS can be. Could, theoretically, a UAV be launched from a tube or VLS armed with some light ordnance (two 500-lbs or a few missiles)?

Maybe? I'm would not call myself an expert.

As an example the Trident II missiles are sub launched, they weigh 59,000 kg are 13 meters long and 2 meters wide. You could probably design a UAV that would fit inside of that container and carry some form of armaments, you would however be sacrificing multiple nuclear warheads.

Torpedo tubes on the other hand are only about 500-600 mm wide and ~6 meters long. While you could probably fit a UAV in that you probably can't include armaments.

Thanks.

onto the next issue: Midget sub or RHIB launch bay (some sort of Hughes Glomar Explorer Moon Pool type thing) - feasible?

[The Soodean Imperium]

If you design it right. I believe some modern submarines use VLS cells in certain submarines.

My main concern is how compact torpedoes and VLS can be. Could, theoretically, a UAV be launched from a tube or VLS armed with some light ordnance (two 500-lbs or a few missiles)?

If all you want to do is launch a land strike inland, then you're better off skipping the "middleman" step and launching a cruise missile directly from the submarine. Arguably the SSGN and SSBN categories are the real-life successors to I-400's strike role, and can carry dozens or hundreds of underwater-launched cruise missiles in place of three surface-launched dive-bombers.

Rich and Corporations has in the past claimed that carrier submarines are justifiable if the enemy has sufficient jamming systems to render cruise missiles inefficient, but in that case a remotely-controlled UAV would suffer even greater problems, and even a manned aircraft would have trouble navigating.

Maybe? I'm would not call myself an expert.

As an example the Trident II missiles are sub launched, they weigh 59,000 kg are 13 meters long and 2 meters wide. You could probably design a UAV that would fit inside of that container and carry some form of armaments, you would however be sacrificing multiple nuclear warheads.

Torpedo tubes on the other hand are only about 500-600 mm wide and ~6 meters long. While you could probably fit a UAV in that you probably can't include armaments.

Thanks.

onto the next issue: Midget sub or RHIB launch bay (some sort of Hughes Glomar Explorer Moon Pool type thing) - feasible?

Midget subs would "piggyback" on the outside of the submarine, and wouldn't need a launch bay. As for RHIBs, the US Navy or Royal Navy has a module of some sort allowing inflatable boats and special forces to be deployed underwater, but I can't seem to find the video right now.

[Rich and Corporations]

the merchant marine of the corporate confederacy has standardized a large tanker class which can be doubled for usage as a carrier conversion. A variant is used for dry-bulk shipping.

It is Chinamax in dimensions.

It's not a Valemax ship. Or related to Emma Maersk.

Tonnage: 330,000 metric
Length: 366 meters
Beam: 67 meters
Draft: 19 meters
Powerplant: 175 megawatt (thermal) RITM-200 nuclear reactor, 1x 25 MW diesel engine
Propulsion: Single frontal azipod, 5x shafts
Speed: 26 knots cruising, 27 knots maximum
Crew: 25 (including security personnel)

Design: It uses a double hull design, with the exterior hull using aluminum to limit corrosion and reduce overall weight. The exterior hull is painted with a substance that contains copper to prevent barnacle build-up.
Underneath the reactor is a pool of boric acid, in the event of a catastrophic nuclear accident.
The diesel engine is meant as a backup or to provide an additional knot of speed.

It is one of the faster cargo ships around.

carrier tanker conversion

Tonnage: 220,000 metric
Length: 363 meters
Beam: 65 meters
Draft: 15 meters
Powerplant: 175 megawatt (thermal) RITM-200 nuclear reactor, 2x 25 MW turbo-electric generators
Propulsion: Single frontal azipod, 5x shafts
Speed: 24 knots carrier operations, 27 knots cruising
Crew: 5,000

Armament: AA and SAM complement. Grenade launcher and machine gun mountings surround the original deck of the ship, for protection while docking in hostile waters.

Sensors: many, and a naval spyglass

Aircraft Carried: 130 aircraft and fixed wing


The ship suffers from multiple problems from being a carrier conversion. Among them is the relatively low power nuclear reactor, it is insufficient for carrier operations, many megawatts are consumed by radars, as well as flight deck operations. During a low readiness state with no airwings in flight, escort ships are supposed to provide radar coverage.
Another problem is the metacentric height is increased by the double hull construction and the added flight deck.

The double hull construction creates a spaced armor effect, improving protection against low velocity HE warheads or medium caliber cannon fire hitting the side of the ship. The outer aluminum shell is 8 centimeters thick, and the inner steel shell is 3.4 centimeters thick. The distance between the two hulls is 2.5 meters. Separate tanks for ballast or fuel are used near the bottom of the ship.

The ship uses EMALS to launch aircraft, allowing it to launch drones to large strike fighters with variable speeds.

The diesel engine is replaced by an electric motor, making it a hybrid powered warship. The purpose is to allow the backup turbines to provide shaft power or power ship systems as needed. Otherwise the electric motor is unused.

The steam generators are replaced with a different version to provide more electrical power and less steam power to the shafts (as less displacement reduces torque requirements).

The 2x turbine generators are meant for backup power in the event the reactor is knocked out.

References:
http://fas.org/man/dod-101/navy/docs/es ... darsys.htm

[New Oyashima]

the merchant marine of the corporate confederacy has standardized a large tanker class which can be doubled for usage as a carrier conversion. A variant is used for dry-bulk shipping.

It is Chinamax in dimensions.

It's not a Valemax ship. Or related to Emma Maersk.

Tonnage: 330,000 metric
Length: 366 meters
Beam: 67 meters
Draft: 19 meters
Powerplant: 175 megawatt (thermal) RITM-200 nuclear reactor, 1x 25 MW diesel engine
Propulsion: Single frontal azipod, 5x shafts
Speed: 26 knots cruising, 27 knots maximum
Crew: 25 (including security personnel)

Design: It uses a double hull design, with the exterior hull using aluminum to limit corrosion and reduce overall weight. The exterior hull is painted with a substance that contains copper to prevent barnacle build-up.
Underneath the reactor is a pool of boric acid, in the event of a catastrophic nuclear accident.
The diesel engine is meant as a backup or to provide an additional knot of speed.

It is one of the faster cargo ships around.

carrier tanker conversion

Tonnage: 220,000 metric
Length: 363 meters
Beam: 65 meters
Draft: 15 meters
Powerplant: 175 megawatt (thermal) RITM-200 nuclear reactor, 2x 25 MW turbo-electric generators
Propulsion: Single frontal azipod, 5x shafts
Speed: 24 knots carrier operations, 27 knots cruising
Crew: 5,000

Armament: AA and SAM complement. Grenade launcher and machine gun mountings surround the original deck of the ship, for protection while docking in hostile waters.

Sensors: many, and a naval spyglass

Aircraft Carried: 130 aircraft and fixed wing


The ship suffers from multiple problems from being a carrier conversion. Among them is the relatively low power nuclear reactor, it is insufficient for carrier operations, many megawatts are consumed by radars, as well as flight deck operations. During a low readiness state with no airwings in flight, escort ships are supposed to provide radar coverage.
Another problem is the metacentric height is increased by the double hull construction and the added flight deck.

The double hull construction creates a spaced armor effect, improving protection against low velocity HE warheads or medium caliber cannon fire hitting the side of the ship. The outer aluminum shell is 8 centimeters thick, and the inner steel shell is 3.4 centimeters thick. The distance between the two hulls is 2.5 meters. Separate tanks for ballast or fuel are used near the bottom of the ship.

The ship uses EMALS to launch aircraft, allowing it to launch drones to large strike fighters with variable speeds.

The diesel engine is replaced by an electric motor, making it a hybrid powered warship. The purpose is to allow the backup turbines to provide shaft power or power ship systems as needed. Otherwise the electric motor is unused.

The steam generators are replaced with a different version to provide more electrical power and less steam power to the shafts (as less displacement reduces torque requirements).

The 2x turbine generators are meant for backup power in the event the reactor is knocked out.

References:
http://fas.org/man/dod-101/navy/docs/es ... darsys.htm

Draw it.

[Grays Harbor]

the merchant marine of the corporate confederacy has standardized a large tanker class which can be doubled for usage as a carrier conversion. A variant is used for dry-bulk shipping.

It is Chinamax in dimensions.

It's not a Valemax ship. Or related to Emma Maersk.

Tonnage: 330,000 metric
Length: 366 meters
Beam: 67 meters
Draft: 19 meters
Powerplant: 175 megawatt (thermal) RITM-200 nuclear reactor, 1x 25 MW diesel engine
Propulsion: Single frontal azipod, 5x shafts
Speed: 26 knots cruising, 27 knots maximum
Crew: 25 (including security personnel)

Design: It uses a double hull design, with the exterior hull using aluminum to limit corrosion and reduce overall weight. The exterior hull is painted with a substance that contains copper to prevent barnacle build-up.
Underneath the reactor is a pool of boric acid, in the event of a catastrophic nuclear accident.
The diesel engine is meant as a backup or to provide an additional knot of speed.

It is one of the faster cargo ships around.

carrier tanker conversion

Tonnage: 220,000 metric
Length: 363 meters
Beam: 65 meters
Draft: 15 meters
Powerplant: 175 megawatt (thermal) RITM-200 nuclear reactor, 2x 25 MW turbo-electric generators
Propulsion: Single frontal azipod, 5x shafts
Speed: 24 knots carrier operations, 27 knots cruising
Crew: 5,000

Armament: AA and SAM complement. Grenade launcher and machine gun mountings surround the original deck of the ship, for protection while docking in hostile waters.

Sensors: many, and a naval spyglass

Aircraft Carried: 130 aircraft and fixed wing


The ship suffers from multiple problems from being a carrier conversion. Among them is the relatively low power nuclear reactor, it is insufficient for carrier operations, many megawatts are consumed by radars, as well as flight deck operations. During a low readiness state with no airwings in flight, escort ships are supposed to provide radar coverage.
Another problem is the metacentric height is increased by the double hull construction and the added flight deck.

The double hull construction creates a spaced armor effect, improving protection against low velocity HE warheads or medium caliber cannon fire hitting the side of the ship. The outer aluminum shell is 8 centimeters thick, and the inner steel shell is 3.4 centimeters thick. The distance between the two hulls is 2.5 meters. Separate tanks for ballast or fuel are used near the bottom of the ship.

The ship uses EMALS to launch aircraft, allowing it to launch drones to large strike fighters with variable speeds.

The diesel engine is replaced by an electric motor, making it a hybrid powered warship. The purpose is to allow the backup turbines to provide shaft power or power ship systems as needed. Otherwise the electric motor is unused.

The steam generators are replaced with a different version to provide more electrical power and less steam power to the shafts (as less displacement reduces torque requirements).

The 2x turbine generators are meant for backup power in the event the reactor is knocked out.

References:
http://fas.org/man/dod-101/navy/docs/es ... darsys.htm

I believe some of your reasoning is a bit, well, overly optimistic.
Firstly, i seriously doubt if a carrier conversion could carry roughly twice the air group as a purpose built CV of roughly the same size.
Second, a carrier conversion project of that scale would more than likely take as long and cost as much as a purpose built carrier from the keel up.
Thirdly, your projected speed for the tanker is probably a bit high. Merchant vessals are built for capacity, not for speed. The massive extra space required for engines capable of military speeds cuts back considerably on the carrying capacity, making them more expensive to operate and less economically viable compared to smaller vessals which have the same or similar capacity, but smaller engines.
Yes, during WW2 there were a number of escort carriers converted from tankers, and they did enjoy considerable success in their designed role as escorts. But, WW2 era aircraft hardly compare to modern aircraft as far as the space and facilities required for successful operations. I honestly don't see how this could be a viable option for a CV.

[Rich and Corporations]

Firstly, i seriously doubt if a carrier conversion could carry roughly twice the air group as a purpose built CV of roughly the same size.

it's twice the tonnage of Nimitz

Second, a carrier conversion project of that scale would more than likely take as long and cost as much as a purpose built carrier from the keel up.

Ships damaged at Pearl Harbor... some of them were repaired within two years.

Furthermore, this ship is meant as a jeep carrier (to protect convoys) or to provide support in massed landing operations. It's not meant to function alone.

Thirdly, your projected speed for the tanker is probably a bit high. Merchant vessals are built for capacity, not for speed. The massive extra space required for engines capable of military speeds cuts back considerably on the carrying capacity, making them more expensive to operate and less economically viable compared to smaller vessals which have the same or similar capacity, but smaller engines.

http://www.navweaps.com/index_tech/tech-029.htm
The horsepower difference between 26 and 30 knots is about double.
Safe to say that 27 knots is reasonably possible, and the entire ship's design is meant to be an awkward compromise between military requirements and civilian requirements. Besides, the additional cost of operating a slightly bigger nuclear reactor then needed is not very great.

Yes, during WW2 there were a number of escort carriers converted from tankers, and they did enjoy considerable success in their designed role as escorts. But, WW2 era aircraft hardly compare to modern aircraft as far as the space and facilities required for successful operations. I honestly don't see how this could be a viable option for a CV.

It isn't meant to be a viable option for a CV. It's meant to serve as a "fastest with the mostest" strategy in the surprise event of total war.

---

Just discovered something, I believe the ship design is capable of sailing through 10 cm of ice.

[New Oyashima]

For my next ridiculous stunt, I will modernize the Hiyou class as escort carriers. Any tips?

[Husseinarti]

For my next ridiculous stunt, I will modernize the Hiyou class as escort carriers. Any tips?

By modernize you mean to melt down and build it into a normal CVE?

[New Oyashima]

For my next ridiculous stunt, I will modernize the Hiyou class as escort carriers. Any tips?

By modernize you mean to melt down and build it into a normal CVE?

U, fine sir, are a fgt.

[The Soodean Imperium]

For my next ridiculous stunt, I will modernize the Hiyou class as escort carriers. Any tips?

Obviously every carrier is better with sesquiplane fighters embarked

[Husseinarti]

For my next ridiculous stunt, I will modernize the Hiyou class as escort carriers. Any tips?

Obviously every carrier is better with sesquiplane fighters embarked

What happens when I-15 of doom comes down with its 4 OP'd ass MGs?

[New Oyashima]

No srs, what are the obvious things that need fixing, assuming I have a Hiyo with a Ryujo double deck hanger layout?

[Axis Nova]

Not having terrible damage control would be a good start.

[Grays Harbor]

Not having terrible damage control would be a good start.

Or putting the avgas lines adjacent to the damage control water lines.

[New Oyashima]

Not having terrible damage control would be a good start.

Or putting the avgas lines adjacent to the damage control water lines.

Great design m8 8/8.

No srs, and no retarded rearming procedures and armament stores.

[Rich and Corporations]

Or putting the avgas lines adjacent to the damage control water lines.

Great design m8 8/8.

No srs, and no retarded rearming procedures and armament stores.

You really want to improve a WWII ship? You can't. The engines are the most integral part, as well as the hull design. You'll also have to gut a fair amount of internals. The ship has to be a blank slate for it to be worth coverting.

All you can really do is use STOL planes.

[New Oyashima]

Great design m8 8/8.

No srs, and no retarded rearming procedures and armament stores.

You really want to improve a WWII ship? You can't. The engines are the most integral part, as well as the hull design. You'll also have to gut a fair amount of internals. The ship has to be a blank slate for it to be worth coverting.

All you can really do is use STOL planes.

I'm doing it anyways.

[New Oyashima]

Why does Langley go sink in WW2? :V

[Tulacia]

Track so I can muse about my stuff later.

[Grays Harbor]

Why does Langley go sink in WW2? :V

The IJN was funny that way, insisting on sinking allied ships during the war.

[The Soodean Imperium]

Speaking of sinking Allied ships, I'm not sure I posted this here yet...

[Grays Harbor]

Speaking of sinking Allied ships, I'm not sure I posted this here yet...

([url=http://iiwiki.com/images/4/48/IMS_Ssinzun.png]Image)[/url]

Very nice. Reminds me a bit of my own Eugene Class DD
Displacement: 3,426 t standard; 3,994 t normal; 4,448 t full load
Length: 439' OA/433' WL
Beam: 45'
Draught: 17'
Propulsion: Geared Steam Turbines, 6 boilers, 2 shafts, 60,363 shp
Speed: 33 knots
Range: 5500 NM @ 18 knots
Complement: 304
Armament:
8 x 4.5"/45 (4 x 2)
8 x 40mm/56 (1 x 2; 6 x 1)
10 x 21" Torpedo (2 x 5)