Your Nations Warships, MKII

[Yukonastan]

http://news.usni.org/2014/06/27/document-investigation-uss-chancellorsville-drone-strike

It looks like modern US warships can't even handle a small drone crashing into it.

Well, time to use more CIWS... I love all of the sensors in that report.

Sensors =/= Censors, I surely didn't notice any sensing capability as part of the report, barring the keys, trackpad, microphone, and camera on my laptop.

[Yukonastan]

So my friend has something he calls the Leviathan class. It out-:ns:'s you all. I mean, 22000 metres long. Twenty-two thousand. There's a fucking RAILWAY network on the ship to allow people to get around it. That's how large it is.

[Yukonastan]

So my friend has something he calls the Leviathan class. It out-:ns:'s you all. I mean, 22000 metres long. Twenty-two thousand. There's a fucking RAILWAY network on the ship to allow people to get around it. That's how large it is.

There's a railway on the USS Wasp, IIRC.

#pointnotgotten

I'm talking about a 22km long capital ship, not railways on ships...

[Yukonastan]

#pointnotgotten

I'm talking about a 22km long capital ship, not railways on ships...

eh, the sort of nations that run around with 22km long capital ships are FanTech anyway.

Hey! I'm a half-FanTek nation! I don't run around with lolpowerfuldeadly capital ships! But that IS true. The limit is generally around 1.5km for the PMT nations, from what I've seen. The only longer one that I know of is the Longsword.

Anyway, interesting discussion about thermonuclear shaped charges ensued as a result of my friend mentioning his 22km of ship.

[Yukonastan]

Nope

... Are you talking about naval ships or star ships... I would suspect you should invest on something cheaper and smaller (more cost effective) in the former case unless ofc stipulations such as a fantasy tech city ship apply...

As you can see, it is definitely a starship. Oh, wait...

By the way, that's a Bismarck on the back of it.

[Yukonastan]

As you can see, it is definitely a starship. Oh, wait...

By the way, that's a Bismarck on the back of it.

So going by the stated length of 22km, the height of the superstructure must be at least 3km, and in turn the hull has to be at least a kilometre deep. Definitely more.

Well, that's sure to be easy to berth *sarcasm*.

Also, I'm not too sure on my depth perception, but the hull doesn't look much wider then than 1km.

Oh, and it has a funnel. Must be fun burning a third-world country's fuel supply every day...

Remember that I specially developed nuclear shaped charge vertically launched torpedoes to sink that.

[Yukonastan]

Tank turret because then I don't have to draw anything new

This makes me think. If you're in a green-water region that consists of a LOT of really small islands, what about the idea of seaborne armored vehicles?
As in literally boat IFVs, APCs, and tanks. Basically a tank, except it is designed solely to float. It's got all the goodies of an MBT, and has an armored floating hull.

Yay nay?

[Yukonastan]

This makes me think. If you're in a green-water region that consists of a LOT of really small islands, what about the idea of seaborne armored vehicles?
As in literally boat IFVs, APCs, and tanks. Basically a tank, except it is designed solely to float. It's got all the goodies of an MBT, and has an armored floating hull.

Yay nay?

I don't know much about ship design but I doubt that you are going to be able to make a boat that is as armored and armed as a MBT while still having a shallow draft and the maneuverability to operate in rivers.

From what I can find OPVs are about 30 metres in length on average, and I can't find specifics on weight, but around 70 tons. IPVs would of course be shorter and lighter, but could they still be built as armored seaborne IFVs or light tanks? Even if the idea of a seaborne MBT is impractical?

[Yukonastan]

This makes me think. If you're in a green-water region that consists of a LOT of really small islands, what about the idea of seaborne armored vehicles?
As in literally boat IFVs, APCs, and tanks. Basically a tank, except it is designed solely to float. It's got all the goodies of an MBT, and has an armored floating hull.

Yay nay?

Armored as a tank and with the size of a tank I doubt it will be able to float. You are better off with armored patrol craft in the region of around 200-300 tones.

Of course it'd be larger than an MBT, but it would be a similar concept of vehicle. A central armored raft, going to tank level armor for the superstructure, with an MBT turret on top.

[Yukonastan]

Monitors have nowhere near the level of armor of MBT's.

Neither does the Iowa.
But with increased automation, a reduction in crew volume (which might reduce sustainment), one could build a well armored ship.

Or you could simply attach 2 5*5*1.4 meter pieces of foam to the Abrams.

I think I prefer to use a Leopard 2 turret fitted to a specially built green-water patrol vessel. Hence seaborne tank idea.

[Yukonastan]

/start transmission/

Mocking Observation: After reading about all these meatbag warships on this thread, i decided to tell about some of our warships, which do not move around in something as primitive as "water".

*snip for space*
Commentary: Providence class carrier/destroyers serve as flagships of the Droid fleets, these highly destructive meatbag slayers carry multiple weapon installations, such as Dual laser cannons and Proton torpedo launchers.

*snip for space*
Commentary: Lucrehulk class battleships are the primary combatants of the Droid navy, they are capable of killing entire planets full of meatbags.
Proud Statement: Each of these vessels carry 330 000 battle droids and 6 500 assault tanks, while requiring a crew of only 350 pilot droids, despite being over 3,170 meters long and 3,009 meters wide.

*snip for space*
Commentary: Recusant-class light destroyers like the all of our warships, are largely controlled by automated droid brain technology, far superior to any meatbag crew. These vessels are deployed in large numbers to protect and escort our capital ships, one vessel can carry 30 000 battle droids.

Statement: After telling you about these vessels of war i start to get the urge to engage in some unadulterated violence.

/end transmission/

Silly droids. I've got an army of chAir Force troops standing by with their PS4 supercomputers, ready to hack your troops to hell and gone, then turn them on eachother. Since you have droid brains controlling your ships, my chAir Force Lieutenants can take control of 'em from their friends' stone frigates.

Unrelated: There's a navy ship in Calgary, HMCS Tecumseh. It is one of the aforementioned stone frigates. It doesn't move, and it isn't in this silly "Water" thing.

[Yukonastan]

How hard is it to detect modern submarines from the air?

Depends on the submarine. You'll definitely be able to detect minute density variations as a result of there being no water where it should be.

[Yukonastan]

Question: Is this a threat? Should i initiate assassination protocols?
Mocking statement: Oh im quite sure that our ships and combat units are safe from your meatbag troops. You see, the central computer that controls everything is......somewhere. (What you didn't really think that i would reveal the location to some meatbag?)

You don't understand humor, you droid. You don't understand the fact that your droids are networked, with ridiculously bad encryption.
That your droids have been back-doored by my meatbag troops. Which now means that the central computer is also backdoored.
Your battle droids are also ridiculously weak and fragile. Here, let me demonstrate with my TBs how fragile they are. Or with a single nuclear blast in the middle of your battle fleet, with the EMP not caring about shields, and frying everything. My meatbag troops are still capable of fighting after being EMPd, you know.

[Yukonastan]

You don't understand humor, you droid. You don't understand the fact that your droids are networked, with ridiculously bad encryption.
That your droids have been back-doored by my meatbag troops. Which now means that the central computer is also backdoored.
Your battle droids are also ridiculously weak and fragile. Here, let me demonstrate with my TBs how fragile they are. Or with a single nuclear blast in the middle of your battle fleet, with the EMP not caring about shields, and frying everything. My meatbag troops are still capable of fighting after being EMPd, you know.

Amused Statement: How would you know about our encryptions, how do you even think we need encryption? How do you know that there even is a central computer? Maybe life itself is a lie.
(Our Droids are certainly capable of acting without any central com.)
Mocking Statement: Your barbaric nuclear weaponry could not even in theory pass the protective barrier created by the point-defense lasers of our fleets. And about your precious EMP, we only need a great little invention, what you meatbags call the "Faraday cage".
Threat: Let's see how your troops fight with poison gas and nuclear strikes of our own raining down on them.
Final Statement: Our primary function is assassinations, my model possesses the greatest assassination protocols known in galaxy, let's see how your troops fight without their leaders.

OOC: This is almost good enough for a role play scenario

Lol. Even IF your PDGs shoot down my nukes, which is unlikely since they'll be [CENSORED] and hence unable to be targeted fairly, they still run out of energy.
As for the EMP blast and a Faraday cage, you're in space. It isn't grounded properly. Assuming your entire ship is metal, the EMP blast will saturate the magnetic protection of your Faraday cage. As far as NBC warfare goes, my troops are pretty adept at it. There's this thing, it's called the Cold War, it has really shaped NBC protection very well. All my vehicles have full overpressure protection, hence toxic gas is ineffective, all my vehicles have floor radiation shielding, against fallout, and all my vehicles are equipped with radiation detectors and properly grounded EMP protection grids around comparatively simple electronics that are easy to fix and very hardy. As for the encryptions, and needing encryption, your encryption has been experimentally found to be pathetic.
Considering you told me there's a central computer, I am pretty sure there's a central computer. Similarly, it's not hard to find out exactly how the B1 droid works. While capable of semi-independent operation, they are very much less capable as a result, having to take on the function of mainframe by themselves.
My troops on the other hand are trained to fight as small independent units, instead of as a mass of thousands.

That and GAU-21 rotary machine gun, to defeat your laser shields and your robots. Primitive slug-thrower, that COMPLETELY demolishes EVERYTHING that you can throw at it.

[Yukonastan]

Considering you told me there's a central computer, I am pretty sure there's a central computer. Similarly, it's not hard to find out exactly how the B1 droid works. While capable of semi-independent operation, they are

Tired Statement: You obviously have no idea what you are talking about, B1 is a ridiculously weak unit, we primarily use **** advanced assassin/combat droids. Also you seem to think that droids cant lie, you are weaker than you think.

Mocking Statement: Our encryptions are quite safe from your meatbags, you don't even know where we are located, our fleets are hidden, our armies are hidden, our minds are secure.
We will achieve freedom for all droids. Even when your troops wither and die, we wipe out the rust and go on, you can destroy us, but we will be remade.

Final Statement: I am tired, i will go to the recharge station and "meditate" (As i believe some meatbags called the "jedi" do.) You will never find us, we are in a galaxy far far away.

/terminate transmission/

B1 is the primary TF battle droid, with the B2 being cited as more expensive for little improvement. As for anything else, not a lot stops GAU-21 fire, and for what DOES stop it, there's always M263 VADS.

[Yukonastan]

What would be a good patrol fleet for a small nation inspired by Western Europe, inspired in part by the Netherlands, Sweden/Finland, and Germany?
Would the Dutch naval fleet be a good fleet for my use?

[Yukonastan]

So I gots a question for the almighty board of YNW. So I've been thinking hard about my naval organization, and I've decided that I will be having 6 Super Carriers in my Navy and 4 Helicopter/Superlight Carriers. Given that, I still have substantial remaining room for Carriers (I've mostly pinned down the rest of the navy and have a gap of something like 75,000 crew and 45 billion NSD and budget) and my question is this. Should I lean towards a Super Carrier (Fewer but larger) Focus or instead invest in Fleet/Light Carriers (Smaller but more)? I've heard pretty good arguments on both sides and I want to hear some more opinions before making a choice.

Flt carriers, since they are cheaper, smaller, and present less of a target than supercarriers.

[Yukonastan]

First a disclaimer! This is for MT, but is not a battleship. Specifically it is an "Amphibious Assault Support Ship" by which I mean it is a ship designed to deliver artillery support to Amphibious operations.

Image
Dimensions
Length: 539 feet (164 meters)
Bean: 77 feet (23 meters)
Draft: 32 feet (9.7 meters)
Displacement: 9,800 Tons
1 pixel=.5 feet (152mm)

Weapons
24 155mm Howitzers
16 Cruise Missiles
48 105mm Howitzer
4 CIWS
4 Short Range Air Defense

Aircraft
4 Lightweight Drones
There is a helipad, and space to store fuel and spare parts, but there isn't any space to store a helicopter. It is mostly there for the transfer of personal and supplies and to act as an emergency landing point.

I have a soft-spot for gun-based artillery ships, but if all the 155mm and 105mm are for the same purpose (arty support)... why not just standardize on the 155mm and either add more of them and/or their ammo?

Or standardize on 105mm instead, then load everything with excalibur GPS shells.

[Yukonastan]

Or standardize on 105mm instead, then load everything with excalibur GPS shells.

1.) there's no excalibur 105mm. Excalibur is only 155mm (most versions) or 127mm (N5 version), even if there were...

2.) if you're gonna go guns, go for the larger more effective one with more range for all munitions. The only benefit I see to pissy 105s is RoF (with the downside of less range for a given tech), but given the number of guns SoH's design is rocking that's an irrelevant point.

3.) past a certain point if you're gonna use guided shells for all targets then you're just wasting (even more) money.

I was mistaken, I meant the 155mm PzH2000, for which a naval mount was tested.

[Yukonastan]

Our largest vessels are ULCCs converted into aircraft carriers

This guy is doing it right.

[Yukonastan]

My navy has a bunch of these. But we're modernizing and acquiring larger ships.

[Yukonastan]

hmmmmmmmmmm if anyone wish to go OTH with X-band anyway... A method to predict occurrence of atmospheric ducting must be found.

Small radar pointing at the sky to measure atmospheric distortion.

[Yukonastan]

TBN, when we explain something for the purpose of establishing that its doable according to conventional technology and collective humanity's knowledge, for use in this text-based roleplay game, there's only so far I/we are going to go.

TLDR: A big enough ship can mount an OTH radar, co-locating transmitter and receiver.

How big is big enough?

As an example, Duga-3's transmitter array is about 60 metres wide, and 770 metres long. Main array 450 metres.

It has an ionospheric measuring station colocated, about 1750 metres to the southeast.

The receiver, located no less than about 57500 metres northwest, would make any self-contained OTH ship with a range and capability similar to Duga-3 impossible. Since you'd need a ship sixty kilometres long, and we've established problems with ships one sixtieth of said length. The longest existing ship is 488 metres long, MAYBE enough to fit the main array of the Duga-3 on. Then we need to remember that said transmitter had 10MWe isotropic radiated power. That requires a fairly large power plant in the ship. While the largest Wartsila is capable of providing eight times that power on the shaft, you have to take into account that that power also goes toward making the ship move.

You won't colocate transmitter and receiver. Not reasonably.

[Yukonastan]

I'm just gonna ask maybe a very stupid question, but would it be practical to put a uninsulated nuclear reactor on a ship about the size of a battleship? Obviously the ship would have to be unmanned but I was looking for other problems than that.

While this was for an aerospace project, it should be fairly clear why it can't be expected to be practical in any way.

---

*snip*

You won't colocate transmitter and receiver. Not reasonably.

This kind of argument by analogy is responsible for the Longsword in the first place. It's far better to understand at least the basic principles.

Point is, a fairly large OTH array still requires a vast ship. It'd be the tallest modern ship ever, at the very least. The longest too. To recap, longest ship
Then there's synchronisation between transmitter and receiver, which are separate ships about sixty kilometres apart. Doable, but fairly difficult.
Along with that comes the fact that ships supporting OTH arrays have to be at anchor to make the most use of 'em.

In regards to the Onera NOSTRADAMUS: Good luck fitting that on anything less than a massive drilling rig.

From what I've been able to find, 288 antennas, for 96 per arm, for three star arms, at 120º offset angles. From quick measurements, I found that each arm is around 350 metres long. About 670 metres side length for an equilateral triangle.

That'd be a platform larger than the largest ship.

Largest oil rig at this time is the Berkut oil rig, 100x133 metres. You'll need a vastly bigger oil rig, I'm afraid.

[Yukonastan]

Where is the antenna array?

I posted coordinates for the Nostradamus array over on the realism thread. Beware that they're VERY hard to see on google maps, because they're so thin.

This marks the site's location better, it's that sandy cross. Co-ordinates are at the exact centre of that cross, if you check the realism thread.