Your Nations Warships, MKII

[Rich and Corporations]

the most money

because inflation means absolute dollar amounts are relevant i guess

israel is the last bastion of the new world order i guess

Given that the R&D costs and tooling costs for new weapon systems are fixed, it doesn't quite count. Halve Israel's population, and I'm pretty sure per capita military spending will increase quite a bit.

I don't know what Spirit of Hope is going on about.

[New Chilokver]

Is it still possible for naval forces to surrender in the modern day? If so, by what means would they express this to the enemy?

[Velkanika]

Is it still possible for naval forces to surrender in the modern day? If so, by what means would they express this to the enemy?

Radio. All modern naval forces monitor the Guard frequencies, and will hear a request for a cease fire and terms immediately.

[United Earthlings]

Redirecting back to the more important topic of 3-D printing since objectively discussing defense spending and priorities is an impossibility {at this current time} as the policy wonks who live for this stuff can't even agree anymore.

The latest article on 3-D printing, granted not Carrier based, but from reading the article and others like it, it sounds like the US Navy is heading in that direction, eventually.

[Triplebaconation]

Is it still possible for naval forces to surrender in the modern day? If so, by what means would they express this to the enemy?

Striking colors and hoisting a white flag, stopping their engines and responding to signals, taking to lifeboats, etc.

Recent history shows surrendering at sea is quite a risky proposition full of ambiguity!

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

Redirecting back to the more important topic of 3-D printing since objectively discussing defense spending and priorities is an impossibility {at this current time} as the policy wonks who live for this stuff can't even agree anymore.

The latest article on 3-D printing, granted not Carrier based, but from reading the article and others like it, it sounds like the US Navy is heading in that direction, eventually.

It's faster, cheaper and less wasteful than traditional casting and machining. For large parts like fuselage panels it would be impractical but for all the small metal components found in an aircraft like gears, fuel nozzles, fasteners, etc it will become more and more popular.

[Laritaia]

Redirecting back to the more important topic of 3-D printing since objectively discussing defense spending and priorities is an impossibility {at this current time} as the policy wonks who live for this stuff can't even agree anymore.

The latest article on 3-D printing, granted not Carrier based, but from reading the article and others like it, it sounds like the US Navy is heading in that direction, eventually.

It's faster, cheaper and less wasteful than traditional casting and machining. For large parts like fuselage panels it would be impractical but for all the small metal components found in an aircraft like gears, fuel nozzles, fasteners, etc it will become more and more popular.

it's only cheaper if you're making a limited number of said item, one you get into the realm of parts that are produced in large quantities traditional manufacturing far outstrips "3d printing" in cost effectiveness.

[Roskian Federation]

Redirecting back to the more important topic of 3-D printing since objectively discussing defense spending and priorities is an impossibility {at this current time} as the policy wonks who live for this stuff can't even agree anymore.

The latest article on 3-D printing, granted not Carrier based, but from reading the article and others like it, it sounds like the US Navy is heading in that direction, eventually.

It's faster, cheaper and less wasteful than traditional casting and machining. For large parts like fuselage panels it would be impractical but for all the small metal components found in an aircraft like gears, fuel nozzles, fasteners, etc it will become more and more popular.

because that metal isn't fucking expensive at all

[New Chilokver]

Is it still possible for naval forces to surrender in the modern day? If so, by what means would they express this to the enemy?

Striking colors and hoisting a white flag, stopping their engines and responding to signals, taking to lifeboats, etc.

Recent history shows surrendering at sea is quite a risky proposition full of ambiguity!

I meant in the modern day- presumably when you're conducting missile strikes from 500 km away the enemy won't be able to see your flags. What I'm really trying to ask is, will naval combat ever again feature ships surrendering themselves to the opposition before the ship itself is sunk? So the ship surrendering, not its former crew in lifeboats. I don't mean like if the ship is in port at the onset of hostilities either.

[Triplebaconation]

It's unlikely anyone would accept a surrender that couldn't be visually verified.

[The Soodean Imperium]

The discussion about "multipurpose" frigates a few weeks ago got me to go back and make a factbook entry for some old lineart I had sitting around:



TL;DR: The above frigate is designed to patrol the outer fringe of a CVBG or other escorted unit for submarines, and occasionally take part in massed AShM strikes against hostile CVBGs. For this purpose, it has VLS space for cruise missiles, ASROCs, and AShMs, as well as a towed array sonar and two helicopters (the landing pad can fit my ASW tiltrotor design for refueling and basic maintenance, but the hangars are too small to support long-term basing). It is not, however, capable of taking on the full roles of a DDG: while it has ample short-range SAMs for self-defense, it lacks the long-range SAMs necessary for area air defense, as well as the powerful radars needed to support them. This allows it to keep displacement below 3500 tonnes and cost below $300 million, resulting in a reasonably compact frigate that does its given role well rather than one of the multirole destroyer-size frigates appearing in Europe.

The latest article on 3-D printing, granted not Carrier based, but from reading the article and others like it, it sounds like the US Navy is heading in that direction, eventually.

Bearing in mind, of course, that "it sounds like the US Navy is heading in that direction, eventually" should be taken with about as many grains of salt as "this concept art represents the next generation of warship that will be in service by 2035"

[The Kievan People]

http://breakingdefense.com/2014/04/navy ... evolution/

But, I asked them, what about the military logistician’s dream of putting a 3D printer on every ship and at every forward base so troops can print out spare parts as needed instead of relying on long lines of supply?

“Come back in 20 years,” Epstein replied.

"Gayla" was right etc etc

The real "revolution" of military 3D printing isn't 3D printing though. It's the re-establishment of the services ability to design and procure certain items without having to go through the crooked defense conglomerates, incompetent procurement bureaucracy or Congresses budget shenanigans. Return of the arsenal system by stealth.

[Gallia-]

Bureau of Bespoke Components and Steam Engineering

gayla being a Pure Society still has arsenals ofc~

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

The real "revolution" of military 3D printing isn't 3D printing though. It's the re-establishment of the services ability to design and procure certain items without having to go through the crooked defense conglomerates, incompetent procurement bureaucracy or Congresses budget shenanigans. Return of the arsenal system by stealth.

The advantage is instead of having to ship a part you just have to email an .stl or .sti file.

http://www.gereports.com/post/116402870 ... rt-to-fly/

GE also made a prototype micro turbojet engine about the size of an american football entirely using DMLS, something which could potentially see application in a cruise missile or drone.

Clearly the future of naval warfare is supercarriers deploying swarms of hundreds of expendable autonomous drones created onboard using 3-D printers and DMLS machines.

[The Kievan People]

No that's mostly noise. For any significant volume of parts making them on shore and shipping them will be more efficient.

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

No that's mostly noise. For any significant volume of parts making them on shore and shipping them will be more efficient.

I know. In all likelihood in "teh futur" you'll just have a smallish DMLS machine in the ship's machine shop which can print/repair minor components like valves or drill bits

[Gallia-]

the same parts in a box the same size could last a war

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

the same parts in a box the same size could last a war

Not really. The machine shop in a ship is pretty small, I've worked in a large machine shops in a robotics lab at my school and finding say a specific drill bit for creating a thread can be a pain even when we have a dedicated room with boxes full of tooling. And drill bits, especially small ones, can get lost and are fairly fragile so it can be pretty annoying when you break or lose your only #7 drill bit you need to create a 1/4-20 thread.

And that's just one minor example. i'm sure if you sat down you could think of dozens of scenarios where the ability to manufacture small metal parts in situ could be useful.

[Laritaia]

The real "revolution" of military 3D printing isn't 3D printing though. It's the re-establishment of the services ability to design and procure certain items without having to go through the crooked defense conglomerates, incompetent procurement bureaucracy or Congresses budget shenanigans. Return of the arsenal system by stealth.

The advantage is instead of having to ship a part you just have to email an .stl or .sti file.

http://www.gereports.com/post/116402870 ... rt-to-fly/

GE also made a prototype micro turbojet engine about the size of an american football entirely using DMLS, something which could potentially see application in a cruise missile or drone.

Clearly the future of naval warfare is supercarriers deploying swarms of hundreds of expendable autonomous drones created onboard using 3-D printers and DMLS machines.

said drones would be astronomically more expensive then ones made using more conventional manufacturing processes.

also manufacturing them would probably take far longer then it would to have new ones delivered through the supply chain.

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

said drones would be astronomically more expensive then ones made using more conventional manufacturing processes.

The direct comparison would be CNC machining

The only expensive part of DMLS is the machine, which depending on the size can run from a few hundred thousand to over a million. Once you have the machine the costs are just the powder the parts are made from, the power costs, and the labor costs of operating the machine. The cost of the material is significantly less compared to CNC machining where up to 90% of the metal stock is wasted as opposed to almost zero waste for DMLS (altrhough the powder is more expensive than metal stock).As for power costs the largest DMLS machine I could find could print a part 0.4 meters on each side and had a peak power consumption of 20.2kW. A similarly sized Haas 3-axis tool-changing CNC milling machine was rated at 30 hp (22.4 kw), thus power consumption is comparable. Labor costs are also likely comparable because like a CNC a single person can easily operate a DMLS machine. Unlike CNC machining however with DMLS the complexity of a part has no impact on the cost, it's purely a function of part volume. And for materials like inconel or hastelloy which are notoriously difficult to machine DMLS is likely to be more cost effective than CNC machining. Something like Inconel 718 will eat carbide endmills for breakfast (tool life is measured in passes) but can be readily fabricated into complex parts using DMLS.

[Gallia-]

the same parts in a box the same size could last a war

Not really. The machine shop in a ship is pretty small, I've worked in a large machine shops in a robotics lab at my school and finding say a specific drill bit for creating a thread can be a pain even when we have a dedicated room with boxes full of tooling. And drill bits, especially small ones, can get lost and are fairly fragile so it can be pretty annoying when you break or lose your only #7 drill bit you need to create a 1/4-20 thread.

another reason why factories on land are better than cramped rooms on a warship!

can you think of more?

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

another reason why factories on land are better than cramped rooms on a warship!

can you think of more?

So you're saying ships shouldn't have machine shops? So you'll have to carry spares of every small component on a ship (or the aircraft/helicopters it carriers) that could potentially break or need fixing?

"Darn! There's a stripped bolt in the Seahawk's rotor head! I guess we'll have to call command and order a new bolt! If only we had a machine onboard which could make a new one...."

[Laritaia]

they would infact do exactly that, as while ships may posses machine shops they don't have the right tools or materials to manufacture high stress bearing parts such as those that make up the rotorhead of a helicopter.

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

they would infact do exactly that, as while ships may posses machine shops they don't have the right tools or materials to manufacture high stress bearing parts such as those that make up the rotorhead of a helicopter.

You take a piece of hexagonal metal stock of the correct material (For a bolt in a T-700 engine it would be heat treated 630 alloy stainless steel), turn the stock to the major diameter, and then use a die to cut the thread.

Lathe 101

[Gallia-]

you need smelting and strip mining ships that assist in gathering the ore needed

these are the untold stories of the USMC

the united states mining corps