Your Nations Warships, MKII

[The Akasha Colony]

Made it longer to accommodate more fuel to help it reach its stated range, although it's still a bit shorter than the other torpedoes (which are ~8.9 meters). Increased the size of the steerable cavitator to try to match the proportions of the longer torpedo a bit more, and added the cavity sensors. Not sure if there's anything else missing, or where the gas generator would go (I'm guessing it could be placed inside the rear end of the cavitator, or otherwise in that area).

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

My latest project: The Tempest-Class Ballistic Missile Defense Cruiser. I modeled it off an enlarged zumwalt hull, keeping the tumblehomme hull with a 10 degree slope

Basic Information:

• Type: Ballistic Missile Defense Cruiser
• Displacement: 30,000 tons full load
• Length: 260 m
• Beam: 28 m
• Draft: 10 m

Propulsion:

• 1x 300 MWe Lead-bismuth cooled fast reactor
• 2x steam turbines
• 2x backup diesel generators
• 2x superconducting homopolar (SCH) generators
• 2x skewback propellors driven by superconducting homopolar (SCH) motors, 70,000 shp each

Performance:

• Top Speed: 30+ knots
• Range: crew endurance

Sensors:

• SPY-3 MFR/SPY-4 VSR Dual Band Radar (DBR)
• AAQ-37 Electro Optical DAS
• UPX-36 CIFF-SD IFF Interrogator
• SQS-60 Hull-mounted mid-frequency sonar
• SQS-61 Hull-mounted high-frequency sonar
• SQR-20 Multi-function towed array sonar

Countermeasures:

• SLY-2 (V) Advanced Integrated Electronic Warfare System (AIEWS)
• MK36 SRBOC with Nulka
• SLQ-25 Nixie Torpedo decoy system
• Surface Ship Torpedo Defense (SSTD) Torpedo hardkill system

Armament:

• 512x mk 57 VLS cells
• 8x KEI cells
• 3x 30mm mk 46 mod 2 GWS
• 2x MK32 Surface Vessel Torpedo Tubes (SVTT)
• 1x 155mm L-AGS or 1x 36 MJ 150mm electromagnetic railgun

Aircraft Carried:

• 2x SV-22 LAMPS III tiltrotor
• 2x MQ-8C VT-UAV

[New Chilokver]

(Image)

Made it longer to accommodate more fuel to help it reach its stated range, although it's still a bit shorter than the other torpedoes (which are ~8.9 meters). Increased the size of the steerable cavitator to try to match the proportions of the longer torpedo a bit more, and added the cavity sensors. Not sure if there's anything else missing, or where the gas generator would go (I'm guessing it could be placed inside the rear end of the cavitator, or otherwise in that area).

Just out of curiosity, what do the Chinese characters say?

[The Akasha Colony]

(Image)

Made it longer to accommodate more fuel to help it reach its stated range, although it's still a bit shorter than the other torpedoes (which are ~8.9 meters). Increased the size of the steerable cavitator to try to match the proportions of the longer torpedo a bit more, and added the cavity sensors. Not sure if there's anything else missing, or where the gas generator would go (I'm guessing it could be placed inside the rear end of the cavitator, or otherwise in that area).

Just out of curiosity, what do the Chinese characters say?

More or less what the English says (it's Japanese, not Chinese). The transliteration is "Hayami kaiyō gijutsu kaisha," which means "Hayami Marine Technology Company," the name of the IC development and production company and a reference to Blue Submarine No. 6.

[Eclixia]

I'd like to discuss my central strategy to my defense of my nation should we be under attack directly from a foreign power. First of all, Eclixia is a collection of five islands and a surrounding archipelago, quite small, with many economic partners but few military agreements between our allies.

http://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=534513

[This dispatch shows the map of our regional rp. I am the collection of islands to the far left.]

Currently, my armed forces are geared towards solely defending the country from an impending invasion. For this, I have decided to have a small infantry fighting force, the Eclixian Marines, for land operations, but I expect most fighting will occur at sea. The Marines are highly armoured having armoured vehicles and heavy weapons from a force four times their size. However, in return, my navy is enlarged and my air force is too to a degree, as I plan to engage an enemy fleet at sea and from the air. If they reach the islands and come ashore, we will have no choice but to surrender. However, this is all in theory. My populace enjoys extremely relaxed gun laws and any law-abiding 18+ male can buy one, in fact, it's compulsory, and so even if the country is conquered, resistance movements will continue with an armed populace fighting back against their invaders.

Strategically, as I am not very large, I will not be able to maintain a large navy. I plan to have one Midway-class aircraft carrier (remember that the rp is set in 1953) and two Des Moines-class heavy cruisers, as well as a fleet of auxiliary carriers from converted civilian ships and corvettes. Building these vessels is a very expensive project and I have scheduled so that it will take a long time for the carrier to be completed. The burden of the navy's construction is warranting loans and subsequent debt, and it cannot last. However, my small size and small influence as opposed to my allies will make me less than a vital target if a World War is declared in the roleplay. Nobody is nuclear-capable yet, and I am out of range of most socialist strategic bomber airfields. My enemies however, are quite large and have greater industrial bases than me, but are quite far away for supplies to reach them. This brings me on to my next theoretical situation - a Battle of the Atlantic like submarine war.

In the case of an outbreak of war, we anticipate that due to our distance from their bases and our reliance on foreign food to feed ourselves, we will may have to deal with hunter submarines preying on shipping to starve us to defeat. This means we need to invest heavily in ASW technology - bombers carrying depth charges, torpedo bombers, rocket aircraft, depth charges on specialized hunter corvettes - I even have plans in place for ASW blimps to help in the war effort. If you were a socialist nation attacking Eclixia, what would you do?

[The Akasha Colony]

Okay, here it is in one image:



Still debating on whether to make the supercavitating torpedo longer to match the others. It would add more weight and drag but also more space for fuel to better meet the stated range requirements.

[The Kievan People]

You might also consider a stubby 660mm torpedo with an overall weight comparable to a 530mm torp.

The ideal L/D ratio for an underwater vehicle, to produce the lowest total drag, is about 7 to 7.5. A 4.6 meter long, 660mm wide torpedo would have about the same volume as a longish 533mm torpedo but significantly lower drag and more space to accommodate a larger propulsor. Which suggests it would be better in pretty much every important way.

[The Akasha Colony]

You might also consider a stubby 660mm torpedo with an overall weight comparable to a 530mm torp.

The ideal L/D ratio for an underwater vehicle, to produce the lowest total drag, is about 7 to 7.5. A 4.6 meter long, 660mm wide torpedo would have about the same volume as a longish 533mm torpedo but significantly lower drag and more space to accommodate a larger propulsor. Which suggests it would be better in pretty much every important way.

Now that's an interesting concept.

Would there be much space left for fuel at that point? I imagine it would be accompanied by a reduction to a warhead commensurate with a 533 mm torpedo rather than a large 660 mm torpedo, with the balance of the volume going to fuel/battery storage.

I suppose it answers the question of finding potential uses for both torpedo designs, I could shorten the gas turbine torpedo for higher speed, shorter-range work using the lower drag to partially compensate for the lost fuel volume and possibly allow higher speeds, while retaining the battery torpedo for very long range attacks where its stealth and total endurance would be more useful. It would be better than a 533 mm torpedo and more compact than a 660 mm torpedo.

It would also solve any problems with weapons capacity if the torpedo handling systems were made to accommodate two stubby torpedoes per rack in place of one "full-length" torpedo. And it wouldn't require the use of any torpedo tube adapters to use 533 mm weapons (which have all been retired from Carthaginian service by the present day).





It looks kind of cute.

It would also sort of fit the nomenclature better if two "Double Spark" torpedoes could be carried in place of one "Master Spark" torpedo (not like this was a serious consideration). This one's 4.85 m, or roughly 7.3:1 L:D. Two could fit on a 10 m torpedo rack (barely). Might make the taper to the propulsor a bit stubbier to maximize volume.

With some very basic computations:

Using NV's submarine speed equation spreadsheet, a 1,350 kW propulsor would provide a maximum underwater speed of 93 knots. But NV's calculator does not seem to take into account the changing effects of different sources of drag, and is designed for large submarines, so I do not know how far off it would be, either overestimating or underestimating the maximum speed. The 1,350 kW figure is taken from claims that this is the output of UGST's turbine, as I couldn't come across any other figures.

Volume would be equivalent to a ~7.45 meter 533 mm-diameter torpedo, so larger than Spearfish and DM2A4. Thus, with a 300 kg warhead like Spearfish it would presumably provide a longer range due to greater fuel volume (although some nose volume would be taken up by the larger seeker).

[Gallia-]

"kind of cute"

understatement game is strong

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

Here's an internal layout of the Tempest class CGN I drew up in paint. A larger version can be viewed here. For reference here are some exterior 3D views of the model.

I realized I forgot to add in space for the Mk. 32 SVTT, It'll probably replace on of the storage units forward of the gun. The middle machinery room is inted to house the steam turbines and SCH generaotrs. Forward and aft machinery rooms are for the auxiliary diesels, generators, and other equipment.

[The Kievan People]

A profile more like the MK50 scaled up should be fine.

So a more compact afterbody should be possible, though a proportionately shorter tubular section is favourable from a drag perspective you should be able to keep the fraction of the torpedo which is tube basically the same as other torpedoes. Right now its just a longer torpedo cut down AFAICT.

A seahake like nose is also worth considering, at least for the high speed torpedo, since it is closer to any other homing torpedo to the hydrodynamic ideal. It has less drag and produces less flow noise at high speeds.

[The Akasha Colony]

A profile more like the MK50 scaled up should be fine.

So a more compact afterbody should be possible, though a proportionately shorter tubular section is favourable from a drag perspective you should be able to keep the fraction of the torpedo which is tube basically the same as other torpedoes. Right now its just a longer torpedo cut down AFAICT.

A seahake like nose is also worth considering, at least for the high speed torpedo, since it is closer to any other homing torpedo to the hydrodynamic ideal. It has less drag and produces less flow noise at high speeds.

Yeah, I just cut sections and shortened the original gas turbine design with no other changes except to telescope the length.



Not sure if I'll keep it, honestly the original proportions do look better. IMO.

I overlaid an image of Seahake's nose over this torpedo and it's pretty much a perfect match in terms of contour. Maybe just a tad more sloped toward the forward end of the nose. And maybe slightly more rounded at the very front to avoid any perfectly flat face.

Comparison:


The drawn torpedo's nose outline has been changed to red to make it more visible. The Seahake nose outline can be hard to make out but it's a very close, nearly identical match (leaving out part of the white background that was not cropped out). The white background on the drawing was brought back to de-emphasize the white background on the Seahake image that wasn't cropped out.

EDIT: Here it is with a more sloped nose which is a near identical trace of Seahake's nose:

[Triplebaconation]

Top to bottom:
A notional design from the first serious report on the application to nuclear propulsion to submarines. Mercury-cooled reactor in a detachable forward section.

Argosy, the first nuclear submarine.

The Banshee-class was a smaller and cheaper version better suited to mass production.

Alarm was a half-sister of Argosy that carried nuclear cruise missiles in hangars faired into the forward deck.

[Gallia-]

super skipjack when

[Triplebaconation]

Skipjack is for suckers. Real pros use 500-ton nuclear gas turbine fighter subs.



A highly simplified internal schematic of the Project MINNOW hunter-killer showing the location of the main sonar, rocket tubes, and pressure hull.

[Minroz]

This is an article regarding Attack Submarines. Did y'all agree or disagree with it?

[Allanea]

I don't think listicles contribute very much to the military knowledge of this thread.

[Zepplin Manufacturers]

Stopped?

Oh .. I didn't stop.

*commence cackling*

[Gallia-]

Stopped?

Oh .. I didn't stop.

*commence cackling*

ne post when

or spiz posting his giant battleship

[Pharthan]

Here's an internal layout of the Tempest class CGN I drew up in paint. A larger version can be viewed here. For reference here are some exterior 3D views of the model.

I realized I forgot to add in space for the Mk. 32 SVTT, It'll probably replace on of the storage units forward of the gun. The middle machinery room is inted to house the steam turbines and SCH generaotrs. Forward and aft machinery rooms are for the auxiliary diesels, generators, and other equipment.

(Image)

Rec facilities is a bit large. Could split it into also housing the Primary DCC(/Secondary Conn)/Reactor Control Room quite easily, freeing you up space where one of your DCCs is.

(Image)

Top to bottom:
A notional design from the first serious report on the application to nuclear propulsion to submarines. Mercury-cooled reactor in a detachable forward section.

Argosy, the first nuclear submarine.

The Banshee-class was a smaller and cheaper version better suited to mass production.

Alarm was a half-sister of Argosy that carried nuclear cruise missiles in hangars faired into the forward deck.

I know it's notional, but I'd think designers wiser than to suggest having a forward mounted nuclear reactor.
*goes about googling to see if this was actually a thing*

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

Rec facilities is a bit large. Could split it into also housing the Primary DCC(/Secondary Conn)/Reactor Control Room quite easily, freeing you up space where one of your DCCs is.

Yeah I could split the rec facilities and crew mess sections into two half's fore and aft. Maybe add an extra crew berthing section aft of the rec facilities level and put the reactor control room forward of the crew mess. Or maybe put it under the medical room. The "LMFR" section is sort of a placeholder, I'll have to calculate how large its dimensions based on the specified output I want (300MWe) and then size the reactor compartment accordingly.

[The Akasha Colony]

This is an article regarding Attack Submarines. Did y'all agree or disagree with it?

The problem with this list and all of those like it is that military hardware, especially things as complex as an entire submarine, rarely fall so neatly into "ranks." They're designed for different roles in different navies which results in different feature sets. Their brevity also means they almost inevitably just end up regurgitating the same Wikipedia facts in like 3-4 paragraphs, not saying anything really serious about their performance or capabilities.

The beginning alone is off to a bad start; Virginia is better than Seawolf at the things the US Navy cares about.

[Gallia-]

Virginia is only "better" in the sense that it's the only game in town. Seawolf is better in every meaningful way that matters for a submarine: It's faster, quieter, and dives deeper, carries more ammunition, and fires more weapons. SSN-774 is literally an evolution of the L.A. class.

The USN's first choice would always be SSN-21. Unfortunately, the USN never has a choice in such matters.

[Pharthan]

Rec facilities is a bit large. Could split it into also housing the Primary DCC(/Secondary Conn)/Reactor Control Room quite easily, freeing you up space where one of your DCCs is.

Yeah I could split the rec facilities and crew mess sections into two half's fore and aft. Maybe add an extra crew berthing section aft of the rec facilities level and put the reactor control room forward of the crew mess. Or maybe put it under the medical room. The "LMFR" section is sort of a placeholder, I'll have to calculate how large its dimensions based on the specified output I want (300MWe) and then size the reactor compartment accordingly.

keep in mind its not just the reactor compartment but also the reactor auxiliaries room and engine room you have to consider.

[The Technocratic Syndicalists]

Yeah I could split the rec facilities and crew mess sections into two half's fore and aft. Maybe add an extra crew berthing section aft of the rec facilities level and put the reactor control room forward of the crew mess. Or maybe put it under the medical room. The "LMFR" section is sort of a placeholder, I'll have to calculate how large its dimensions based on the specified output I want (300MWe) and then size the reactor compartment accordingly.

keep in mind its not just the reactor compartment but also the reactor auxiliaries room and engine room you have to consider.

The middle machinery room is supposed to hold the steam turbines and all the extra auxiliary machinery for the reactor. The motor rooms could also hold extra equipment.