Argument Thread OOC Future Tech Only

[Biop]

Hello. Any Advice/CC Would be greatly appreciated.

http://the-last-dragon-kni.deviantart.com/art/APC-IFV-Second-try-286936297?q=gallery%3Athe-last-dragon-kni&qo=0

[Arthropoda Ingens]

The shield produces a signal mirroring low levels of incoming radiation to feed to the ship's sensors, or serves as a sensory field in the first place?

If your shields let a % of everything through that's going lower the effectiveness of your shields . It will also mean that as 90% (random %) is being blocked out, communication signals will have to be allot stronger.

I'll only cover the sensory field variant since well... It's the easier, and at the same time more efficient version. Actually, the two versions are near-identical anyway.

Regardless.

What do sensors do?

They receive incoming radiation, turn it into an electrical signal, which is fed into the computers. Or not, the first radar units functioned as analog units, I believe.

What do shields do? They receive incoming radiation... And I don't see why whatever pathway is used to build up a shield in the first place shouldn't be used to send signals back to the ship. In fact, in every single instance where a crewman on a given spaceboat goes 'Shields down to 90%', this is already happening - it's only through such feedback that the relevant information could be gained. And the shield doesn't have to be a computer to do this, no more so than a radar dish has to be. Simple analog mechanisms quite suffice. Analysis can then happen in the ship computers.

I suppose that there's some (Somewhat unnecessarily detailed) types of shields where the electric (Or photonic. Probably more practical in this instance) signal generation would cause issues, or where there's simply no raise/ lower/ gimme percentages shields pathways, but I'm really just concerned with bogstandard scifi shields here, not with the more exotic variants.

So, we've got a means to observe our surroundings. Throw in some decent software to discriminate between noise (Including weapons) and communications. and you're all set.

[Arthropoda Ingens]

QE doesn't work that way. A QE'd sensor drone cannot (as far as I am, aware) be jammed or intercepted. It'll transmit through shields just fine, just make sure it's outside the shields.

so what QE then...?

Think of it as the communications equivalent of discontinuous FTL or teleportation - it just goes point to point, rather than covering a distance as such. 2D shields (Covering a shell around a given something to protect) would thus not be a problem for it (Or for teleporters, barring silly I-transform-you-into-a-beam ones, of course).

I'm pretty sure there's issues with QE comms that make them impractical/ not doable IRL, but that kind of applies to said FTL and teleportation, too.

[Risen Britannia]

If your shields let a % of everything through that's going lower the effectiveness of your shields . It will also mean that as 90% (random %) is being blocked out, communication signals will have to be allot stronger.

I'll only cover the sensory field variant since well... It's the easier, and at the same time more efficient version. Actually, the two versions are near-identical anyway.

Regardless.

What do sensors do?

They receive incoming radiation, turn it into an electrical signal, which is fed into the computers. Or not, the first radar units functioned as analog units, I believe.

What do shields do? They receive incoming radiation... And I don't see why whatever pathway is used to build up a shield in the first place shouldn't be used to send signals back to the ship. In fact, in every single instance where a crewman on a given spaceboat goes 'Shields down to 90%', this is already happening - it's only through such feedback that the relevant information could be gained. And the shield doesn't have to be a computer to do this, no more so than a radar dish has to be. Simple analog mechanisms quite suffice. Analysis can then happen in the ship computers.

I suppose that there's some (Somewhat unnecessarily detailed) types of shields where the electric (Or photonic. Probably more practical in this instance) signal generation would cause issues, or where there's simply no raise/ lower/ gimme percentages shields pathways, but I'm really just concerned with bogstandard scifi shields here, not with the more exotic variants.

So, we've got a means to observe our surroundings. Throw in some decent software to discriminate between noise (Including weapons) and communications. and you're all set.

i can see that working for communication where it doesnt matter which direction the signal coming from. But when you have to be precise for things like targeting you cant really use that system as it probably wont be accurate enough.


I think my main issue with anything shield related is that shields probably wont ever exist. And even if they do they wont be like they are portrayed in FT RPs

[Azhuru]

Hello. Any Advice/CC Would be greatly appreciated.

http://the-last-dragon-kni.deviantart.com/art/APC-IFV-Second-try-286936297?q=gallery%3Athe-last-dragon-kni&qo=0

You're silly and lazy for using such metal machines. Real men walk up to their enemies and stab 'em in the face.

Naw, it looks fine. The machine gun on the pintel however, could use a bit more definition; it just looks like a box. Also, the chassis itself is too high. You have a design similar to a M113 but the track to chassis is much smaller. Bring down the height of the tracks and you'll be golden.

[Biop]

Hello. Any Advice/CC Would be greatly appreciated.

http://the-last-dragon-kni.deviantart.com/art/APC-IFV-Second-try-286936297?q=gallery%3Athe-last-dragon-kni&qo=0

You're silly and lazy for using such metal machines. Real men walk up to their enemies and stab 'em in the face.

Naw, it looks fine. The machine gun on the pintel however, could use a bit more definition; it just looks like a box. Also, the chassis itself is too high. You have a design similar to a M113 but the track to chassis is much smaller. Bring down the height of the tracks and you'll be golden.

Thanks a mill. But im not entirely sure what you mean XD

[Azhuru]

What do you mean? Like, which part? The one of it resembling a M113 and it needed where the track and chassis meet lowered or the part with the pintel machinegun?

[Biop]

What do you mean? Like, which part? The one of it resembling a M113 and it needed where the track and chassis meet lowered or the part with the pintel machinegun?

The threads, The .50 cal i get but im not sure how to draw it.

[Azhuru]

I"m not really sure how to put it other than, make the barrel, look more... barrelly. .. like, more cylinder-like. The actual action and receiver could use some more detail I suppose. The treads,



The way you've put it is where the treads tops are too high. It looks a little silly.

[Balrogga]

This is the FT Argument Thread.

There is a link in my sig for the FT Advice Thread.

[Ibis Galaxy Alliance]

Well, lets take my heavy cruiser as an example. Its got three spinals and 12 turrets that are the scale to be ship to ship. These would excel at rapid fire tactical strikes against enemy positions. Now, the smaller missile turrets would excel at providing air superiority. Then, the fifty odd point defence guns would be used to provide close air support strikes against enemy infantry or vehicles. I've just filled three combat roles with a single ship parked in the atmosphere. Now, if I were to park five or six across an area, they could provide covering fire for each other, as well as for troops and armour on the ground. I now don't need to use a small air-force or deploy artillery on the ground, and my ground forces have the added benefit of eyes in the sky to give them a heads up for things like enemy ambushes or even things like land-mines or the like.

The problem is that your ships could be shot down by long range artillery and other weapon that couldn't have shot down your ships it they were in orbit. Its a lot more practical to simply shoot swarms of small missiles from orbit. Or if you don't care about conquering the planet and its not one of yours, just Exterminatus it.

[Of The Arch ilands]

Well, lets take my heavy cruiser as an example. Its got three spinals and 12 turrets that are the scale to be ship to ship. These would excel at rapid fire tactical strikes against enemy positions. Now, the smaller missile turrets would excel at providing air superiority. Then, the fifty odd point defence guns would be used to provide close air support strikes against enemy infantry or vehicles. I've just filled three combat roles with a single ship parked in the atmosphere. Now, if I were to park five or six across an area, they could provide covering fire for each other, as well as for troops and armour on the ground. I now don't need to use a small air-force or deploy artillery on the ground, and my ground forces have the added benefit of eyes in the sky to give them a heads up for things like enemy ambushes or even things like land-mines or the like.

The problem is that your ships could be shot down by long range artillery and other weapon that couldn't have shot down your ships it they were in orbit. Its a lot more practical to simply shoot swarms of small missiles from orbit. Or if you don't care about conquering the planet and its not one of yours, just Exterminatus it.

sound theory but makes for crap reading learn into writing stories for fun and learn out of trying to win!

[Risen Britannia]

The problem is that your ships could be shot down by long range artillery and other weapon that couldn't have shot down your ships it they were in orbit. Its a lot more practical to simply shoot swarms of small missiles from orbit. Or if you don't care about conquering the planet and its not one of yours, just Exterminatus it.

sound theory but makes for crap reading learn into writing stories for fun and learn out of trying to win!

But then your commanders/government get "starship trooper syndrome". Where they are forced by the "plot" to make stupid, out of character decisions which put the entire operation at risk. Just so it sounds "cooler".

Examples:
Sir, should we nuke the alien infested planet? - "no lets send down thousands of useless marines who will start crying when they get shot at."
Sir, the enemy is trying to sneak past in a stolen shuttle, should i stop them? - "no let them pass its all part of my plan"
Sir, should we keep the fleet out of the enemies weapon range? - "NO! lets get all up in their face so that we can taunt at each other through the windows"
Sir, should i bring my kids and wife on this first hyperspace test? "Yes of course. Later on they can be save by an important character who will sacrifice himself to protect them"

[Caragonia]

sound theory but makes for crap reading learn into writing stories for fun and learn out of trying to win!

But then your commanders/government get "starship trooper syndrome". Where they are forced by the "plot" to make stupid, out of character decisions which put the entire operation at risk. Just so it sounds "cooler".

Examples:
Sir, should we nuke the alien infested planet? - "no lets send down thousands of useless marines who will start crying when they get shot at."
Sir, the enemy is trying to sneak past in a stolen shuttle, should i stop them? - "no let them pass its all part of my plan"
Sir, should we keep the fleet out of the enemies weapon range? - "NO! lets get all up in their face so that we can taunt at each other through the windows"
Sir, should i bring my kids and wife on this first hyperspace test? "Yes of course. Later on they can be save by an important character who will sacrifice himself to protect them"

If you're referring to Operation Bughouse, that was intended to wipe the Arachnids out on Klendathu. The MI just didn't account for the fact that their doctrines didn't work against the fact that the Bugs controlled the sub-ground environment, leading to the mass casualties in the participating platoons. If you're referring to Operation Royalty, that was a test of new doctrines as well as a chance to capture the Bug's 'royalty'.

'Starship Trooper Syndrome' is in actual fact a hefty dose of realism mixed with some idealistic and patriotic threads wrapped in it.

[OMGeverynameistaken]

But then your commanders/government get "starship trooper syndrome". Where they are forced by the "plot" to make stupid, out of character decisions which put the entire operation at risk. Just so it sounds "cooler".

Examples:
Sir, should we nuke the alien infested planet? - "no lets send down thousands of useless marines who will start crying when they get shot at."
Sir, the enemy is trying to sneak past in a stolen shuttle, should i stop them? - "no let them pass its all part of my plan"
Sir, should we keep the fleet out of the enemies weapon range? - "NO! lets get all up in their face so that we can taunt at each other through the windows"
Sir, should i bring my kids and wife on this first hyperspace test? "Yes of course. Later on they can be save by an important character who will sacrifice himself to protect them"

If you're referring to Operation Bughouse, that was intended to wipe the Arachnids out on Klendathu. The MI just didn't account for the fact that their doctrines didn't work against the fact that the Bugs controlled the sub-ground environment, leading to the mass casualties in the participating platoons. If you're referring to Operation Royalty, that was a test of new doctrines as well as a chance to capture the Bug's 'royalty'.

'Starship Trooper Syndrome' is in actual fact a hefty dose of realism mixed with some idealistic and patriotic threads wrapped in it.

The Federation in movie canon is actually using the 'Bug War' for political advantage. They're aware that the bugs pose little to no threat to humanity as a whole. I believe that in the third film (however terrible it may be) they actually admit that the asteroid attack on Buenos Aires was organized by the Federation itself.

[YellowApple]

If you're referring to Operation Bughouse, that was intended to wipe the Arachnids out on Klendathu. The MI just didn't account for the fact that their doctrines didn't work against the fact that the Bugs controlled the sub-ground environment, leading to the mass casualties in the participating platoons. If you're referring to Operation Royalty, that was a test of new doctrines as well as a chance to capture the Bug's 'royalty'.

'Starship Trooper Syndrome' is in actual fact a hefty dose of realism mixed with some idealistic and patriotic threads wrapped in it.

The Federation in movie canon is actually using the 'Bug War' for political advantage. They're aware that the bugs pose little to no threat to humanity as a whole. I believe that in the third film (however terrible it may be) they actually admit that the asteroid attack on Buenos Aires was organized by the Federation itself.

>Hive-minded insectoid aliens blow up Buenos Aires with a ballistic asteroid and completely slaughter Camp Joe Smith
>"They're aware that the bugs pose little to no threat to humanity as a whole"

Not sure where they mention the Buenos Aires attack to be orchestrated by the Federation. Unless you're satirizing the whole "9/11 wuz pland by the US guvermint!!!!!11one" conspiracy "theory" in the same way that the film version of Starship Troopers satirizes America in general.

[Senestrum]

our shipkiller missiles are the size of the burj khalifa and dont afraid of nothing

[OMGeverynameistaken]

So, fun idea.

Within the Etherway (Russia's version of hyperspace), standard physics do not apply in order to allow FTL travel. Light within the Etherway still travels at c, but exists in purely particle form. By rendering particles of light inertialess, they can be captured and stored. If transported to regular space and released from their inertialess state, they immediately accelerate back to the speed of light with, as they say, hilarious results. Unfortunately my ability to science things is not up to the task of saying exactly what those results might be, although it seems that large explosions would certainly be in the running.

What say you, NSFT?

[Galla-]

Light is already particles, tho.

[OMGeverynameistaken]

Light is already particles, tho.

But it's also a wave. This particular version of light would exist as a particle with mass.

[Arthropoda Ingens]

Light is already particles, tho.

But it's also a wave. This particular version of light would exist as a particle with mass.

Then the universe explodes. Infinite energy and all that.

Incidentally, wave/ particle duality isn't limited to Photons. It's been observed and verified for the standard subatomic particles (Protons, neutrons, electrons), and observed - but not yet verified - for C60 molecules.

Particles with mass have it, no problem there.

[Ibis Galaxy Alliance]

[/quote]
sound theory but makes for crap reading learn into writing stories for fun and learn out of trying to win![/quote]
Uh,thats not exactly true. I've read and watched plenty of good sf where space superiority is the dominant factor. And I like land battles, I just try and explain them.

[Ularn]

There's also a point where, I think, common sense has to trump rule of cool. Look at it this way:

While a ship is in space, it can:

• Fire at enemy starships
• Bombard the entire surface of the planet below with great accuracy

And is at risk from:

• Enemy starships
• Enemy orbital defences

While a ship is in a planet's atmosphere, it can:

• Bombard a limited area of the planet's surface

And is at risk from:

• Enemy starships
• Enemy orbital defences
• Enemy ground forces, including artillery and atmospheric fighter craft.

So by putting your starship in a planet's atmosphere, you're limiting its ability to provide fire support to your own ground forces and making it much harder, if not impossible, to fire on the enemy ships still in orbit. A ship in atmosphere can only hit what's in it's immediate area, whereas a ship in orbit can fire a kinetic weapon on one side of the planet to bombard a target on the other. Also, to prevent possible collateral damage to your own ship, there's a chance you'll have to avoid using your most powerful weapons.

At the same time, you're increasing the number of things able to shoot at your starship. Ship's in orbit can still bombard you like a ground target, while the enemy's ground forces will now have you in range of their more powerful weapons and air strikes.

[Ruthless Slaughter]

*snip*

This. Very much this. While my capital ships are too large to enter a planet's orbit let alone atmosphere, we don't go out of the way to put them in more danger than a very noticeable 60Km target should be. It may be powered by rule of cool but it is still used and handled like the warship that it is.

[Risen Britannia]

*snip*

This. Very much this. While my capital ships are too large to enter a planet's orbit let alone atmosphere, we don't go out of the way to put them in more danger than a very noticeable 60Km target should be. It may be powered by rule of cool but it is still used and handled like the warship that it is.

"capital ships are too large to enter a planet's orbit"
wait what?