Argument Thread OOC Future Tech Only

[Saurisisia]

Shut up. It looks cool.

The ultimate justification for when you are unable to come up with a bullshit explanation of how your stuff works.

[Thrashia]

Thrashian Imperial Fleet Organization
- Consists of five levels of command and organization.

1st) Squadron: the smallest independent operating unit in the Imperial Navy. Composed of several lines, a squadron is commanded by a rear admiral or higher and ranges from 14 to 60 ships, depending upon the composition of the lines in the squadron. A squadron is [usually] the largest concentration of ships normally assigned to a single system.

2nd) Systems Force: combining several squadrons under the command of an vice admiral or admiral, referred to as a commodore while leading a systems force. These combined forces are responsible for Imperial Fleet actions across multiple star systems. Rather than outline specific formations of system forces, the Imperial Starfleet Order of Battle lends flexibility to commodores to pool the whole of their naval resources and shape them as necessary missions require.

3rd) Fleet: Where all previous units were generally bound to specific system or set of systems, the Imperial Navy designates a fleet as a "sector resource", allowing it to operate on a sector-wide scale. A fleet is the smallest unit transferred between sectors. With such a large number of units, there are thousands of potential types of fleet alignments. Common fleet deployment types included superiority fleets, assault fleets, and bombard fleets. Other examples of alignments that a fleet might take include a deepdock fleet, support fleet, or ordinance fleet.

4th) Sector Group: A sector group is the sum total of naval strength which the Empire expects to commit to a normal sector. A fleet admiral commands a sector group, a title usually granted to the Moff who governed the sector until Grand Admiral Thrawn officially removed all military powers from system and sector governors. A sector group could be expected to contain at least 2,400 ships, 24 of which are Star Destroyers, and another 1,600 combat starships.

5th) Regional, Oversector and Strategic Military Commands: Roving fleets aimed at specific tasks, the composition and command of which is based at the discretion of the Supreme Commander of the Imperial Military. Usually consisting of a higher than average number of capitol ships and super dreadnoughts than normal.

[Socialist States Owen]

question time:

with your defences do you have your ships split up between planets, with each planet having its own defence. Or do you try to keep your fleet together as much as possible and have it on rapid response to a number of planets?

I personally use the "mass effect" approach, keeping a few ships/defences in orbit around planet, with a larger fleet watching over the sector ready to respond to any distress call.

Every system has its own fleet (and most systems also have extensive missile pod fields and fortifications), with the exception of a cluster of resource colonies that have roving patrols operating out of a fleet base nearby. Patrols, expeditions, etc. are drawn from these garrison fleets and organized under specifically created combatant commands.

I'm not a big fan of rapid response fleets, as the people who use them tend to ignore things like maintenance schedules, supplies, crew leave, etc. For me, getting the entirety of Capital Fleet sortied, for example, could take days IC as crews have to be recalled from leave, operations plans laid out, maintenance on any docked warships finished up or at least gotten to a point of combat readiness, and so on. I roleplay it that way out of partly respect for realism and partly out of balance. The Imperial Navy has a lot of capital ships, and so it has the logistical and organizational baggage that come with them.

EDIT: The other reason I'm not a fan of rapid response fleets is they seem somewhat 'cheap' as a roleplaying tactic. "Oh crap, I underestimated the situation, better call in reinforcements!" seems uncomfortably close to 'RPing to win'. I prefer to go with the RP position that any forces that weren't mentioned earlier as being available won't suddenly become available if some captain gets in over his head. As such, the assets available to a character at the start of a situation are all he/she will have for quite some time, if not the entirety of the RP.

But it dosen't have to work like that. I've only had one situation where I've had to rapidly deploy, but I don't deploy an entire fleet at once - usually any major reinforcement comes in stages. It would be unfair to just drop half the navy in.

And anyway, my fleets which are on duty for that sort of thing are not paticularly huge or can't be deployed instantly anyway - after all, every planet has to have at least some protection and patrolling territory takes up a lot of escort assets.

[Risen Britannia]

you could have multi layered defence fleets (this does not include attack fleets) EG:

(note that the numbers and ship types are just made up. I haven't put any thought into them)

so for a small incursion you have the planetary defences attack, But if its a bigger incursion you attack with the system defences, however it takes longer for them to get there.


Also i am adding some of the "Angels fall first planetstorm" (AFF) ships to my fleet as im lacking good looking smaller ships

Im currently using a mixture of:
eve caldari ships- http://img804.imageshack.us/img804/4042/shipsm.png
I-War - http://iwar.free.fr/IMG/jpg/iwar26.jpg
AFF- http://www.affuniverse.com/artdepot/pub ... r3000x.jpg

[Auman]

The Aumanii Fleet operates 1,360 combat vessels in four systems. While many task forces are formed on an as needed basis, two types see regular deployment, so much so as to be routine in their use. Nominal task forces are generally deployed through out the Co-Prosperity Sphere's stellar holdings, to serve as the mainstay of a solar system's defensive capability... The doctrinal sword to the previous task force's shield is the Battle Space Domination Task Force, commanded by a single 2.095km warship known as the Gorgon, of which there are twelve in existence. The Gorgon is quite possibly the most powerful warship in the Milky Way Galaxy, backed by an array of some of the most advanced combat vessels created in the history of mankind. The Gorgon's duty is to remain on rapid response duties and active sovereignty patrols for tours of at least six months. The BSDs are deployed on a rotational basis... Five task forces are on roving patrols through out the galaxy, making foreign ports of call where welcome and raising the visible profile of the Aumanii military abroad. Five more fleets are deployed for six months for regional domination task force duties in the Aumanii stellar territories and one of those fleets also being stationed in the allied military ports of Bavin Prime. Two fleets are typically in Ambrosia for refit, resupply, re-training and rejuvenation after their one year tours have ended. The nominal task forces follow a similar profile to that of the BSDs at the galactic regional scale.

[Unified Sith]

Every system has its own fleet (and most systems also have extensive missile pod fields and fortifications), with the exception of a cluster of resource colonies that have roving patrols operating out of a fleet base nearby. Patrols, expeditions, etc. are drawn from these garrison fleets and organized under specifically created combatant commands.

I'm not a big fan of rapid response fleets, as the people who use them tend to ignore things like maintenance schedules, supplies, crew leave, etc. For me, getting the entirety of Capital Fleet sortied, for example, could take days IC as crews have to be recalled from leave, operations plans laid out, maintenance on any docked warships finished up or at least gotten to a point of combat readiness, and so on. I roleplay it that way out of partly respect for realism and partly out of balance. The Imperial Navy has a lot of capital ships, and so it has the logistical and organizational baggage that come with them.

EDIT: The other reason I'm not a fan of rapid response fleets is they seem somewhat 'cheap' as a roleplaying tactic. "Oh crap, I underestimated the situation, better call in reinforcements!" seems uncomfortably close to 'RPing to win'. I prefer to go with the RP position that any forces that weren't mentioned earlier as being available won't suddenly become available if some captain gets in over his head. As such, the assets available to a character at the start of a situation are all he/she will have for quite some time, if not the entirety of the RP.

that is one of the issues i find. Say after my two/three ships around the planet have been taken out, if i then go "after a few hours my backup fleet arrives". No matter how cannon with my tech it is or if its technically possible. it can be considered foul play. ]

enemy arrive - distress call sent - battle starts - local fleet destroyed - planet enters "siege mode" - backup fleet arrives - full battle happens

with the logistical part. The fleet doesnt have to be just floating in space. It could be docked to a station or in orbit around a nearby planet. ships can also be cycled within the fleet, so the fleet can stay at full power but with the crew being able to have time off and the ships repaired/restocked

One of the main reasons why I have never really liked the rapid response tactic is because of players like myself. One hour of orbital supremacy is all that is required to decimate a planets population, or take it entirely. The usual Imperial tactic is to slam a shielded Galaxy Gun projectile into the planets mantle. Thusly holding it hostage for an eternity. For the Empire, it goes like this. Surrender and give us your planet or we will decimate its core and magnetic fields, leaving it open to the crippling murders of the galaxies solar winds and radiation.

Now you may launch a counter attack, but then you will be faced with a lone Imperial ship and the unthinkable decision. . . .

As for myself, my preferred tactic in facing a superior enemy is to hold them in system with an encompassing FTLi. Rather than overpowering defences, an overpowering FTLi can trap an enemy fleet in system for months while Imperial forces mount a sensible counter attack on our enemies. Naturally we would lose our planet, but, our enemy would most likely be running low on supplies and may, rather likely, find their undefended home ports in ruins from an unparalleled Imperial counter attack.

- Sith.

[Golomun]

I have a question, what would be the best practical type of sub light speed engine to be used on any ship?

[Otagia]

I have a question, what would be the best practical type of sub light speed engine to be used on any ship?

Orion drive.

[The Soviet Technocracy]

I think I have just over 400 ships.

Like 406 or 407.

All named, too.

[Xenohumanity]

I think I have just over 400 ships. Like 406 or 407. All named, too.

I've put listing all my ships and naming them somewhere on my factbook work-order. I don't know where, but it's there to be done one day.

[Golomun]

I have a question, what would be the best practical type of sub light speed engine to be used on any ship?

Orion drive.

ok, so what is the best to use in space And in atmosphere?

[Thrashia]

Orion drive.

ok, so what is the best to use in space And in atmosphere?

It doesn't really matter what type of engine it is, more than what kind of speed output it can give. I use Star Wars tech engines for Zues' sake.

[Orthodox Gnosticism]

ok, so what is the best to use in space And in atmosphere?

It doesn't really matter what type of engine it is, more than what kind of speed output it can give. I use Star Wars tech engines for Zues' sake.

It's Zeus you heathen.

[Auman]

Orion drive.

ok, so what is the best to use in space And in atmosphere?

The answer I will give you is pretty simple... No such thing exists. You're better off using a space ship that is good at space and an airship that's good at air.

[Strykla]

I have a question, what would be the best practical type of sub light speed engine to be used on any ship?

I use the Variable Specific Impulse Magnetoplasma Rocket for all my sublight engines. For more information, google 'VASIMR'.

Orion drive.

ok, so what is the best to use in space And in atmosphere?

First of all, Orion drives were the product of Cold War nonsense. In a sentence, what they do is explode nukes behind a craft to putt-putt it along, using the nuke to vaporize a part of a pusher plate, which would push the ship. It can actually achieve high speeds, but there's also the problem of ionizing radiation and having the replace the pusher plate every few hours.
Second of all, if you have a ship that weighs more than the Saturn V rocket it's probably a good idea not to bring it into the atmosphere - The Saturn V rocket barely got off the ground, and a lot of my ships are the size of a small mountain. Better to use a space elevator.

[Useful Daveia]

First of all, Orion drives were the product of Cold War nonsense. In a sentence, what they do is explode nukes behind a craft to putt-putt it along, using the nuke to vaporize a part of a pusher plate, which would push the ship. It can actually achieve high speeds, but there's also the problem of ionizing radiation and having the replace the pusher plate every few hours.
Second of all, if you have a ship that weighs more than the Saturn V rocket it's probably a good idea not to bring it into the atmosphere - The Saturn V rocket barely got off the ground, and a lot of my ships are the size of a small mountain. Better to use a space elevator.

Shows how little you looked at Orion really. The pusher-plate ablation problem was solved by spraying a layer of oil onto it between pulses, and with regards to ionising radiation, the drive tends to be situated at the rear of the vessel with not only the heavy mechanisms of the pusher plate and pulse unit mechanisms between it and the crew compartments, but also the standard shadow shielding seen on any nuclear powered craft.

[Ularn]

Of course, larger Russian systems also have their own defenses, my lovely "space forts", which I blatantly stole from Legend of the Galactic Heroes, are generally spheres on the order of 10-20km in diameter, mostly hollow, featuring a large transverse railcannon as their primary armament. In most cases, three or four of these will be placed in equidistant positions around the primary planet of the system, although a really important system (such as New Ukraine) may have 20 or so around a few planets. They feature totally sexy liquid armor that I have yet to come up with a bullshit explanation as to how it works. Shut up. It looks cool.

If I can make a suggestion? Space Custard.

I don't know if you've seen that episode of Brainiac where the guy walks on custard but the effect of it was that if you strike a liquid (like custard) hard enough then it turns solid for an instant. Thus, you can walk on custard as long as you don't stand in the same place long enough for the custard to start behaving like a liquid again.

Don't look at me like that - I am going somewhere with this!

If you want some sci-fi bullshitty excuse for why your ships have liquid armour, say that they're covered in space custard. When struck by an object (like a bullet or missile) the liquid at that point becomes solid for an instant, absorbing a portion of the impact, before returning to its liquid state. Of course, I'm probably ignoring most of the laws of physics that say this is a terrible idea and there are easier, cheaper and more effective ways to create the same level of protection but hey, I've justified your nonsense!

[Ularn]

First of all, Orion drives were the product of Cold War nonsense. In a sentence, what they do is explode nukes behind a craft to putt-putt it along, using the nuke to vaporize a part of a pusher plate, which would push the ship. It can actually achieve high speeds, but there's also the problem of ionizing radiation and having the replace the pusher plate every few hours.
Second of all, if you have a ship that weighs more than the Saturn V rocket it's probably a good idea not to bring it into the atmosphere - The Saturn V rocket barely got off the ground, and a lot of my ships are the size of a small mountain. Better to use a space elevator.

Shows how little you looked at Orion really. The pusher-plate ablation problem was solved by spraying a layer of oil onto it between pulses, and with regards to ionising radiation, the drive tends to be situated at the rear of the vessel with not only the heavy mechanisms of the pusher plate and pulse unit mechanisms between it and the crew compartments, but also the standard shadow shielding seen on any nuclear powered craft.

I think he was actually talking about radiation being a problem for the people on the planet this thing is being used in orbit of. Start it up close enough and your best case scenario is a bunch of unlucky sods get hit with an EMP. Worst case scenario is you turn the whole planet into the Capital Wasteland.

[Axis Nova]

.facepalm

You obviously don't know much about how radiation of any kind works.

[Ularn]

.facepalm

You obviously don't know much about how radiation of any kind works.

Not really. My physics lessons literally finished at explaining the difference between alpha, beta and gamma. But how about, instead of insulting my intelligence, you actually expand on your post with a bit of explanation as to what I got wrong?

[Auman]

.facepalm

You obviously don't know much about how radiation of any kind works.

Not really. My physics lessons literally finished at explaining the difference between alpha, beta and gamma. But how about, instead of insulting my intelligence, you actually expand on your post with a bit of explanation as to what I got wrong?

Second.

[Golomun]

I have a question, what would be the best practical type of sub light speed engine to be used on any ship?

I use the Variable Specific Impulse Magnetoplasma Rocket for all my sublight engines. For more information, google 'VASIMR'.

ok, so what is the best to use in space And in atmosphere?

First of all, Orion drives were the product of Cold War nonsense. In a sentence, what they do is explode nukes behind a craft to putt-putt it along, using the nuke to vaporize a part of a pusher plate, which would push the ship. It can actually achieve high speeds, but there's also the problem of ionizing radiation and having the replace the pusher plate every few hours.
Second of all, if you have a ship that weighs more than the Saturn V rocket it's probably a good idea not to bring it into the atmosphere - The Saturn V rocket barely got off the ground, and a lot of my ships are the size of a small mountain. Better to use a space elevator.

the thing is, I forgot to mention the part about me trying to come up with a shuttle of some sorts to deploy black-ops on a hostile world; and of course space elevators are the way to go if you want a good space dock.
so what would the engine mechanics look like for a shuttle to go from a vessel that is near, lets say the moon were the awaiting battle-cruiser is, to Roswell on earth and back?
would you have two separate sets of engines or is there a hybrid that can be made? like a thermo-nuclear turbojet/VASIMR? (thermo-nuclear in me terms = heating the heat exchanger via nuclear reactor)

Not really. My physics lessons literally finished at explaining the difference between alpha, beta and gamma. But how about, instead of insulting my intelligence, you actually expand on your post with a bit of explanation as to what I got wrong?

Second.

Third.

[Axis Nova]

Okay, first off, an Orion drive operating in Earth orbit will not cause any problems whatsoever to the surface as far as radiation goes. You want to know why? Breathe in, then out. Then look at the sky.

What you are breathing and looking at is called the atmosphere, and it's pretty good at keeping much more powerful sources of radiation (like the sun) from scouring all life from the face of the planet. A piddly little Orion drive isn't going to do anything, even if you parked it right over an ozone hole.

Second, EMPs require an atmosphere to propagate. Above a certain altitude, no EMP is produced from a nuclear weapon at all, not that Orion's bombs are super powerful in any case. Don't launch from the ground and it won't be a major issue.

[Durmatagno]

Whats the best form of Ground vehicle?

[Axis Nova]

For what purpose? There is no 'all around' vehicle that's good at everything.