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Ainin
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13979
Founded: Mar 05, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Ainin » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:02 pm

"Up next is the Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015, proposed by the Right Honourable Mr. Bustamante of the LDP."
"And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned round on you — where would you hide, Roper, the laws all being flat?"

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Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
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Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:11 am

Campos stood to speak. "Whilst I am open to accommodation of minority languages, I do actually wonder about the capacity for, and the need for, the government to be spending taxpayer money on translators and other materials such as textbooks for individuals and tribal groups that, more or less, are already bilingual and are at the very least proficient in the use of Spanish or such other primary language."
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Davincia
Envoy
 
Posts: 326
Founded: Apr 13, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Davincia » Sat Jul 11, 2015 7:03 am

"While I support the teaching of multiple languages in schools, among other centers of education, I will admit that we are pushing into an extreme. The establishment of cultural centers seems both expensive and unnecessary, and private broadcasters of television or radio should be permitted to broadcast in any language they wish."
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The Liberated Territories
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Founded: Dec 03, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby The Liberated Territories » Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:36 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:Campos stood to speak. "Whilst I am open to accommodation of minority languages, I do actually wonder about the capacity for, and the need for, the government to be spending taxpayer money on translators and other materials such as textbooks for individuals and tribal groups that, more or less, are already bilingual and are at the very least proficient in the use of Spanish or such other primary language."


"I second the good senator's concerns."
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Maklohi Vai
Minister
 
Posts: 2959
Founded: Jan 07, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Maklohi Vai » Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:22 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:Campos stood to speak. "Whilst I am open to accommodation of minority languages, I do actually wonder about the capacity for, and the need for, the government to be spending taxpayer money on translators and other materials such as textbooks for individuals and tribal groups that, more or less, are already bilingual and are at the very least proficient in the use of Spanish or such other primary language."

"Thank you for raising your concerns. The cost wouldn't be a great burden for a couple reasons. First, these families will likely choose to educate their children in Spanish or another national language because of the benefits for the child's integration into Calaverdean society. We can see this in other countries which have enshrined provisions for education in the minority language, like Romania. We need this provision because those families need that option, and some will feel it is necessary for their children to not only have that linguistic knowledge, but all the culture that comes along with knowing the language.

Second, translating costs at a base level aren't even that high. All combined translating services of the European Union cost the EU taxpayer about €2 per year. Now remember two major differences between Calaverde and the EU. One, they are dealing with 23 languages for every document. We are dealing with four for every document. Two, the EU requires translation of many more materials than would be required by the bill I have proposed. Together, the cost to the Calaverdean taxpayer would be very reasonable considering the enormous benefits that would be gained.

I hope this addresses your concern."

Source on EU figure: http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/translation/faq/index_en.htm

Davincia wrote:"While I support the teaching of multiple languages in schools, among other centers of education, I will admit that we are pushing into an extreme. The establishment of cultural centers seems both expensive and unnecessary, and private broadcasters of television or radio should be permitted to broadcast in any language they wish."

"Private broadcasters are not affected by this bill. May I ask you to elaborate on why you dislike cultural centers which help all of our populations and peoples grow their culture?"
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Costa Fierro
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Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:35 pm

Maklohi Vai wrote:"Thank you for raising your concerns. The cost wouldn't be a great burden for a couple reasons. First, these families will likely choose to educate their children in Spanish or another national language because of the benefits for the child's integration into Calaverdean society. We can see this in other countries which have enshrined provisions for education in the minority language, like Romania. We need this provision because those families need that option, and some will feel it is necessary for their children to not only have that linguistic knowledge, but all the culture that comes along with knowing the language.

Second, translating costs at a base level aren't even that high. All combined translating services of the European Union cost the EU taxpayer about €2 per year. Now remember two major differences between Calaverde and the EU. One, they are dealing with 23 languages for every document. We are dealing with four for every document. Two, the EU requires translation of many more materials than would be required by the bill I have proposed. Together, the cost to the Calaverdean taxpayer would be very reasonable considering the enormous benefits that would be gained.

I hope this addresses your concern."

Source on EU figure: http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/translation/faq/index_en.htm


"I remain unconvinced. Firstly, if they're already bilingual, they don't need to learn another language in order to fully immerse themselves in their culture. Secondly, there isn't that much of a need anyway. The families that "need" this as an option are few and far between and most would be happy not wasting money, even small amounts of it, on a worthless enterprise."
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Maklohi Vai
Minister
 
Posts: 2959
Founded: Jan 07, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Maklohi Vai » Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:50 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:
Maklohi Vai wrote:"Thank you for raising your concerns. The cost wouldn't be a great burden for a couple reasons. First, these families will likely choose to educate their children in Spanish or another national language because of the benefits for the child's integration into Calaverdean society. We can see this in other countries which have enshrined provisions for education in the minority language, like Romania. We need this provision because those families need that option, and some will feel it is necessary for their children to not only have that linguistic knowledge, but all the culture that comes along with knowing the language.

Second, translating costs at a base level aren't even that high. All combined translating services of the European Union cost the EU taxpayer about €2 per year. Now remember two major differences between Calaverde and the EU. One, they are dealing with 23 languages for every document. We are dealing with four for every document. Two, the EU requires translation of many more materials than would be required by the bill I have proposed. Together, the cost to the Calaverdean taxpayer would be very reasonable considering the enormous benefits that would be gained.

I hope this addresses your concern."

Source on EU figure: http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/translation/faq/index_en.htm


"I remain unconvinced. Firstly, if they're already bilingual, they don't need to learn another language in order to fully immerse themselves in their culture. Secondly, there isn't that much of a need anyway. The families that "need" this as an option are few and far between and most would be happy not wasting money, even small amounts of it, on a worthless enterprise."

"On your first point, there are a few issues. Some of these students are not bilingual and would require this service. More pertinent, however, is that education in a language gives a child a much greater sense of that language's history and culture. In the home they may learn household terms and folk tales, but in the classroom they will learn everything.

On your second point, this seems to come down to a difference in how we view spending and the government's role in promoting culture. I believe the preservation of a language, and hence a culture, is priceless. You cannot buy back hundreds or thousands of years of knowledge. The families who wish to have their child educated in their native language (that which meets the 10% threshold, which is quite high, may I remind you) certainly view this issue the same way. The cost for action is small, whereas the cost for inaction is enormous. I have elucidated the monetary cost and demonstrated it would be very manageable. I have provided measures within the bill and through my explanations that show this service could not be abused and could not be doled out wildly. I have set forward modest, progressive protections and provisions for the preservation of languages, cultures, and peoples at a low cost to the average taxpayer. I ask, then, what can I further do to help you?"
"For the glory of our people, we govern our nation freely. For the glory of Polynesia, we help and strengthen our friends. For the glory of the earth, we do not destroy what it has bestowed upon us."
Demonym: Vaian
-Kamanakai Oa'a Pani, first president of Maklohi Vai
-6.13/-8.51 - as of 7/18
Hosted: MVBT 1; WBC 27; Friendly Cups 7, 9; (co-) NSCAA 5
Former President, WBC; WBC Councillor
Senator Giandomenico Abruzzi, Workers Party of Galatea
Administrator
Former:
Head Administrator
Beto Goncalves, Chair, CTA
Abraham Kamassi, Chair, Labour Party of Elizia
President of Calaverde Eduardo Bustamante; Leader, LDP
President of Baltonia Dovydas Kanarigis; Leader, LDP
President of Aurentina Wulukuno Porunalakai; Leader, Progress Coa.

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Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19884
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Sat Jul 11, 2015 6:19 pm

"Señor Bustamante, if these children are not bilingual, perhaps it would be more prudent to teach them the majority language or a language that is actually useful to them instead of keeping them linguistically isolated from the rest of Calaverdean society? You say "in the home, they may learn folk tales and household terms". Surely they would, essentially, learn the same aspects of their language and culture in cultural groups? Why waste time and money on bilingual education when the society they will enter is not bilingual and where their culture and their values is largely irrelevant? We have an education system that prepares children for when they enter adulthood and when they enter society as productive members. Not children who will grow up expecting people to speak languages that others may not speak and have cultural values that others may not share.

As for your second point, I must address that yes, this is indeed a difference of how we view the government's role in culture. I want our education system to be just that: a system for the education of our nation's children. I don't want a government wasting time and money, irrespective of how "cost effective" you claim it is. If people want to learn about their tribal or ethnic culture, fine. But the school is no place for that."
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Ainin
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13979
Founded: Mar 05, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Ainin » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:03 am

"And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned round on you — where would you hide, Roper, the laws all being flat?"

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Lykens
Diplomat
 
Posts: 958
Founded: Apr 13, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Lykens » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:05 am

Aye
Aye
Nay
Aye
Aye

Respectively.
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Skeckoa
Minister
 
Posts: 2123
Founded: Jan 06, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Skeckoa » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:09 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act: NAY
Child Protection Act: ABSTAIN
Public Broadcaster Act: NAY
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannibus: AYE
Calaverde Homeless Act: AYE
Last edited by Skeckoa on Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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New Werpland
Senator
 
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Founded: Dec 11, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby New Werpland » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:13 am

Aye
Aye
Nay
Aye
Aye

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Beta Test
Minister
 
Posts: 2639
Founded: Jan 06, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Beta Test » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:21 am

Aye, Abstain, Abstain, Aye, Aye
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Argentarino
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1918
Founded: Oct 05, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Argentarino » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:28 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - AYE
Child Protection Act - AYE
Public Broadcaster Act - NAY
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - AYE
Calaverde Homelessness Act - AYE
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Maklohi Vai
Minister
 
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Founded: Jan 07, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Maklohi Vai » Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:33 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - AYE
Child Protection Act - AYE
Public Broadcaster Act - ABSTAIN
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - AYE
Calaverde Homelessness Act - AYE
"For the glory of our people, we govern our nation freely. For the glory of Polynesia, we help and strengthen our friends. For the glory of the earth, we do not destroy what it has bestowed upon us."
Demonym: Vaian
-Kamanakai Oa'a Pani, first president of Maklohi Vai
-6.13/-8.51 - as of 7/18
Hosted: MVBT 1; WBC 27; Friendly Cups 7, 9; (co-) NSCAA 5
Former President, WBC; WBC Councillor
Senator Giandomenico Abruzzi, Workers Party of Galatea
Administrator
Former:
Head Administrator
Beto Goncalves, Chair, CTA
Abraham Kamassi, Chair, Labour Party of Elizia
President of Calaverde Eduardo Bustamante; Leader, LDP
President of Baltonia Dovydas Kanarigis; Leader, LDP
President of Aurentina Wulukuno Porunalakai; Leader, Progress Coa.

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The Sarian
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1455
Founded: Jun 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby The Sarian » Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:00 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - NAY
Child Protection Act - AYE
Public Broadcaster Act - AYE
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - NAY
Calaverde Homelessness Act - NAY
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Electrum
Issues Editor
 
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Founded: Jan 20, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Electrum » Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:41 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - AYE
Child Protection Act - NAY
Public Broadcaster Act - NAY
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - NAY
Calaverde Homelessness Act - NAY
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Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
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Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Costa Fierro » Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:45 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - NAY
Child Protection Act - NAY
Public Broadcaster Act - AYE
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - NAY
Calaverde Homelessness Act - ABSTAIN
Last edited by Costa Fierro on Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Malgrave
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Malgrave » Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:51 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - Aye
Child Protection Act - Aye
Public Broadcaster Act - Aye
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - Abstain
Calaverde Homelessness Act - Abstain
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Atlanticatia
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Founded: Mar 01, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Atlanticatia » Sun Jul 12, 2015 4:19 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - Aye
Child Protection Act - Aye
Public Broadcaster Act - Aye
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - Aye
Calaverde Homelessness Act - Nay
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Britanno 2
Diplomat
 
Posts: 611
Founded: Apr 08, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Britanno 2 » Sun Jul 12, 2015 4:19 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - AYE
Child Protection Act - AYE
Public Broadcaster Act - ABSTAIN
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - AYE
Calaverde Homelessness Act - AYE
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Tutukerala
Diplomat
 
Posts: 563
Founded: Sep 26, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Tutukerala » Sun Jul 12, 2015 4:34 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - NAY
Child Protection Act - AYE
Public Broadcaster Act - AYE
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - NAY
Calaverde Homelessness Act - AYE

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Red Blackiland
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1581
Founded: Apr 30, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Red Blackiland » Sun Jul 12, 2015 5:22 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - NAY
Child Protection Act - AYE
Public Broadcaster Act - AYE
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - NAY
Calaverde Homelessness Act - NAY
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Minister
 
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Ex-Nation

Postby The New World Oceania » Sun Jul 12, 2015 5:47 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act of 2015 - AYE
Child Protection Act - AYE
Public Broadcaster Act - ABSTAIN
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis - AYE
Calaverde Homelessness Act - NAY
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Davincia
Envoy
 
Posts: 326
Founded: Apr 13, 2014
Ex-Nation

Update

Postby Davincia » Sun Jul 12, 2015 6:01 am

Calaverde Language Rights Act: Aye
Child Protection Act: Nay
Public Broadcaster Act: Aye
Act to Legalize and Regulate Cannabis: Aye
Calaverde Homeless Act: Nay
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