New Democratic Party [NSG Senate | HQ]

[New Zepuha]

I honestly can say I'd like a centrist coalition, but on the risk of losing the ability to get things done.

[Britanno]

So the CMP, Reform, and the libertarians would go for this platform in its entirety?

I'll take that as a "no".

If you'd actually been listening, I said that the libertarians and CMP would not be in the coalition.

[Britanno]

Yeah, honestly counting people who are no longer active and no longer listed as Senators is a bad idea

Are you going to be the one to go through that list and fine out who is active or not? It took hours to even get the list.

[Britanno]

I honestly can say I'd like a centrist coalition, but on the risk of losing the ability to get things done.

I fail to see how a centrist coalition would not get things done.

[New Zepuha]

I honestly can say I'd like a centrist coalition, but on the risk of losing the ability to get things done.

I fail to see how a centrist coalition would not get things done.

We'd spend too much time trying to find more centrists to gain back even a slim majority.

[Britanno]

We'd spend too much time trying to find more centrists to gain back even a slim majority.

Think about it this way. If a centrist coalition was formed, elections would have coalitions running like this:

SAP, CP, RG
NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP
CMP, LP
IP, ABP

Who would win?

The second round would be between the SAP, CP, RG coalition and the NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP coalition. The remaining right would either abstain or vote NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP.

[Next Washington]

We'd spend too much time trying to find more centrists to gain back even a slim majority.

Think about it this way. If a centrist coalition was formed, elections would have coalitions running like this:

SAP, CP, RG
NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP
CMP, LP
IP, ABP

Who would win?

The second round would be between the SAP, CP, RG coalition and the NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP coalition. The remaining right would either abstain or vote NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP.

Aye

[New Zepuha]

We'd spend too much time trying to find more centrists to gain back even a slim majority.

Think about it this way. If a centrist coalition was formed, elections would have coalitions running like this:

SAP, CP, RG
NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP
CMP, LP
IP, ABP

Who would win?

The second round would be between the SAP, CP, RG coalition and the NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP coalition. The remaining right would either abstain or vote NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP.

I don't like the chance that it'd fall through the floor. I just don't see the benefits of risking it.

[Next Washington]

I don't like the chance that it'd fall through the floor. I just don't see the benefits of risking it.

"no risk, no fun"

[Britanno]

I don't like the chance that it'd fall through the floor. I just don't see the benefits of risking it.

Politics has always been a risky game. The question is, how much of a risk is this?

[Neo Rome Republic]

I don't like the chance that it'd fall through the floor. I just don't see the benefits of risking it.

Politics has always been a risky game. The question is, how much of a risk is this?

One that isn't worth the cost.

[Bering]

We have a government now, that we dominate AND with the size of the coaltion we will not have to worry about losing that.

What is to stop a MSP-NDP-NCP-SLP-RefP coalition from winning an election?

Other than possible size issues,
What is stopping a SAP-COM-RG-MS-PMP-NDP Coalition from wining? Nothing because we are winning right now, so leaving makes no sense.

Still not sure how they hurt us seeing as they mostly toe the line and if they get too crazy we can put them down, they know they will not be able to get into the government without this coalition and understand that it is better than getting the Right-Wingers in charge.

You are missing the point, without a centrist coalition, extremists will get into government no matter what. If the right wings, fascists get in, if the left wins, communists get in. I want to stop either from getting into government, because I think keeping moderates in and extremists out is important.

AND? Without a majority they will not be able to do much, besides I fail to see how the Communists are doing any bad things right now, wouldn't putting them in government and forcing them to work with more center parties moderate them more? Leaving them out will only make them more extreme and possibly dangerous

As said before, the idea would be to have an economic platform where neither side would have to sacrifice or compromise their beliefs and would be solely based around the things they agree on.

So...less than we have now, right now all the parties in the ProgCo agree Economically and Socially (More or less)
and what about all the things we don't agree on?

Which as stated before fails to give us the majority and none of the jump out as too similar to us. On the other hand the Market Socialists and Red-Greens are fairly close allies ideologically speaking.

I could deal with the MSP, but some of the RGs are way took left wing.

So kick out another good ally of the NDP because you can't deal with them?
A majority of the party supports both of these parties and leaving them out will only hurt any possible coalition more

[Bering]

We'd spend too much time trying to find more centrists to gain back even a slim majority.

Think about it this way. If a centrist coalition was formed, elections would have coalitions running like this:

SAP, CP, RG
NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP
CMP, LP
IP, ABP

Who would win?

The second round would be between the SAP, CP, RG coalition and the NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP coalition. The remaining right would either abstain or vote NDP, MSP, NCP, SLP, RefP.

AND face a minortiy government in the senate
The Presidential election is not the end all be all of things
it's whoever can form a working majority in the Senate

[Next Washington]

why should his proposal be bad? if we are centrists, we'll win with a high majority

the rest is either left or right wing, and they won't be able to form a coalition anyways... so even if we'd lose the center would remain the most powerful part...

[Bering]

I don't like the chance that it'd fall through the floor. I just don't see the benefits of risking it.

Politics has always been a risky game. The question is, how much of a risk is this?

No, the question is how much will we gain from this risk?
Nothing, we will isolate the "Far-Left" which has done...how many crazy extremist things recently?

[Neo Rome Republic]

why should his proposal be bad? if we are centrists, we'll win with a high majority

the rest is either left or right wing, and they won't be able to form a coalition anyways... so even if we'd lose the center would remain the most powerful part...

We are a centre-left party, centre-left is left-wing, you do know this right?

[Next Washington]

why should his proposal be bad? if we are centrists, we'll win with a high majority

the rest is either left or right wing, and they won't be able to form a coalition anyways... so even if we'd lose the center would remain the most powerful part...

We are a centre-left party, centre-left is left-wing, you do know this right?

the party, but if we form a coalition with both sides it'll pretty much at the center...

[Neo Rome Republic]

We are a centre-left party, centre-left is left-wing, you do know this right?

the party, but if we form a coalition with both sides it'll pretty much at the center...

Thank you for telling me, now I have more incentive to oppose a centrist coalition.

[Divair]

I'll take that as a "no".

If you'd actually been listening, I said that the libertarians and CMP would not be in the coalition.

So a coalition that's not big enough to win anyway?

[Britanno]

What is stopping a SAP-COM-RG-MS-PMP-NDP Coalition from wining? Nothing because we are winning right now, so leaving makes no sense.

It makes sense if there are more advantages of a centrist coalition.

AND? Without a majority they will not be able to do much, besides I fail to see how the Communists are doing any bad things right now, wouldn't putting them in government and forcing them to work with more center parties moderate them more? Leaving them out will only make them more extreme and possibly dangerous.

I suppose if fascists agreed to our platform and didn't do anything too bad we could find space for them as well somehow.

So...less than we have now, right now all the parties in the ProgCo agree Economically and Socially (More or less) and what about all the things we don't agree on?

Did you just say that communists more or less agree with you on economics?

Other things? Considering that NDP will have the power to make or break the coalition, I'm sure the centre-right parties would happily compromise.

So kick out another good ally of the NDP because you can't deal with them?
A majority of the party supports both of these parties and leaving them out will only hurt any possible coalition more.

If you allowed the RGs in, it would scare away the rightists unless they were allowed to bring in another, slightly further right, party such as the CMP or LP. A majority of the party supports staying in the PC, I'm still arguing for it.

No, the question is how much will we gain from this risk?
Nothing, we will isolate the "Far-Left" which has done...how many crazy extremist things recently?

Considering you'd be running a coalition, you'd probably gain the coalition presidency candidate, along with another executive position. Hell, the rightists might even let you have PM and Pres.

What crazy things have the far right done recently? Why don't we let them in?

How risky is this risk?

[Britanno]

If you'd actually been listening, I said that the libertarians and CMP would not be in the coalition.

So a coalition that's not big enough to win anyway?

Well if you expect the far left to unite with the far right in a coalition, then yeah, it wouldn't win. In the second round, the far left would vote for their own candidate while the far right would either abstain or vote for us.

[Divair]

So a coalition that's not big enough to win anyway?

Well if you expect the far left to unite with the far right in a coalition, then yeah, it wouldn't win. In the second round, the far left would vote for their own candidate while the far right would either abstain or vote for us.

Why would the far right vote for us or abstain when we've just wrecked their coalition?

[Britanno]

Why would the far right vote for us or abstain when we've just wrecked their coalition?

Because they'd rather have us in government than the far left.

[Divair]

Why would the far right vote for us or abstain when we've just wrecked their coalition?

Because they'd rather have us in government than the far left.

You vastly underestimate the desire for revenge.

[Britanno]

You vastly underestimate the desire for revenge.

I've been in a coalition with them (with my last senator). I know them far better than you and while they always want revenge, the far right would never vote for communists.