NSG Senate Coffee Shop: 50% off Americanos [NSG Senate]

[Brissia]

I think that was semi-sarcasm. Anyway, now that you have spoke up....why the HELL were you so rude in the Presidential Elections thread?

Because Nihil behaves as a child and doesn't know when to be an asshole and when not to be.

You do realize that that doesn't excuse you from being an asshole yourself?

Also, your argument kind of falls under the section of "But Mommy, Jimmy was mean to me!" excuses that are used by little kids.

[NSG Senate Administrators]

Nihil and Kam, you two are getting out of hand. Another inappropriate remark and you'll be warned.

-MV

[The National Bocialist Party]

What I am trying to work out is how discovering the vote end times were wrong and telling the admins so they can fix it is an arsehole move?

[Maklohi Vai]

What I am trying to work out is how discovering the vote end times were wrong and telling the admins so they can fix it is an arsehole move?

No, that's greatly appreciated. What's not appreciated is this: viewtopic.php?p=16625783#p16625783

[Brissia]

What I am trying to work out is how discovering the vote end times were wrong and telling the admins so they can fix it is an arsehole move?

Beats me.

[The National Bocialist Party]

What I am trying to work out is how discovering the vote end times were wrong and telling the admins so they can fix it is an arsehole move?

No, that's greatly appreciated. What's not appreciated is this: viewtopic.php?p=16625783#p16625783

Sorry, I have just had enough of his stupid, rude and unhelpful baitey posts.

[Unicario]

I for one, support the idea of a space agency with goals. Sponsored.

[Mediciano]

So you'll sponsor this, right?

First Amendment to the Protection of Religious Freedom for Minors Act

First Amendment to the Protection of Religious Freedom for Minors Act

Category: Domestic Development | Urgency: Low
Author: Britanno (MCP) | Co-Sponsors: The Licentian Isles (LD), New Zepuha (Ind),

UNDERSTANDING that the Protection of Religious Freedom for Minors Act had good intentions.

HOWEVER REALISING that Clause Twelve prevented parents from taking their children to a religious ritual, even if they didn't force the minor to participate in the ritual.

HEREBY changes the twelfth clause to:

"No parent shall force a minor to participate in a religious ritual against the minor's will."

Do it, or else.

Sure, I'll sponsor. I'm still going to make my children pray before bed, laws be damned, though.

[New Bierstaat]

Sponsors needed.

Aurentine Partisan Politics Act

Category: Senatorial Procedures| Urgency: Medium
Author: New Bierstaat (LC) | Co-Sponsors: Brissia (NL), Mediciano (Iron), Placenza (ATBP), Euskirribakondara (RG), Yanalia (RG)

The Senate of the Aurentine Commonwealth,

NOTICING the sheer number of parties in our commonwealth compared to the number of Senators,

SEEING that a significant number of these parties are merely jokes with no real political intent,

REALIZING the predicament brought upon the constituency mapmaker by people being in two or more parties as well as the horrible calamity that would result from banning hippos and banning banning,

ENACTS a long-needed rule, with apologies to Ainin, Divair, and Soviet Canuckistan:

A political party is defined as an organization with active Senators involved and which includes the word "party" or the phrase "Coalition for Freedom and Enterprise" in its name, or which wishes to be defined as a political party.

No Senator shall have membership in more than one political party.

A Senator who is found to be a member of more than one party must leave one or the other, and his votes will not count until he does so.

[Yanalia]

Sponsors needed.

Aurentine Partisan Politics Act

Category: Senatorial Procedures| Urgency: Medium
Author: New Bierstaat (LCP) | Co-Sponsors:

The Senate of the Aurentine Commonwealth,

NOTICING the sheer number of parties in our commonwealth compared to the number of Senators,

SEEING that a significant number of these parties are merely jokes with no real political intent,

REALIZING the predicament brought upon the constituency mapmaker by people being in two or more parties as well as the horrible calamity that would result from banning hippos and banning banning,

ENACTS a long-needed rule, with apologies to Ainin, Divair, and Soviet Canuckistan:

A political party is defined as an organization with active Senators involved and which includes the word "party" or the phrase "Coalition for Freedom and Enterprise" in its name.

No Senator shall have membership in more than one political party.

A Senator who is found to be a member of more than one party must leave one or the other, and his votes will not count until he does so.

You should add to the definition of party "or otherwise chooses to identify as a political party." I'd also remove the part about active Senators; parties who can't get elected should still be parties.

[HumanSanity]

Sponsors needed.

Aurentine Partisan Politics Act

Category: Senatorial Procedures| Urgency: Medium
Author: New Bierstaat (LCP) | Co-Sponsors:

The Senate of the Aurentine Commonwealth,

NOTICING the sheer number of parties in our commonwealth compared to the number of Senators,

SEEING that a significant number of these parties are merely jokes with no real political intent,

REALIZING the predicament brought upon the constituency mapmaker by people being in two or more parties as well as the horrible calamity that would result from banning hippos and banning banning,

ENACTS a long-needed rule, with apologies to Ainin, Divair, and Soviet Canuckistan:

A political party is defined as an organization with active Senators involved and which includes the word "party" or the phrase "Coalition for Freedom and Enterprise" in its name.

No Senator shall have membership in more than one political party.

A Senator who is found to be a member of more than one party must leave one or the other, and his votes will not count until he does so.

You should add to the definition of party "or otherwise chooses to identify as a political party." I'd also remove the part about active Senators; parties who can't get elected should still be parties.

I would like to create the "Coalition of Socialist Senators"

[Brissia]

Sponsors needed.

Aurentine Partisan Politics Act

Category: Senatorial Procedures| Urgency: Medium
Author: New Bierstaat (LCP) | Co-Sponsors:

The Senate of the Aurentine Commonwealth,

NOTICING the sheer number of parties in our commonwealth compared to the number of Senators,

SEEING that a significant number of these parties are merely jokes with no real political intent,

REALIZING the predicament brought upon the constituency mapmaker by people being in two or more parties as well as the horrible calamity that would result from banning hippos and banning banning,

ENACTS a long-needed rule, with apologies to Ainin, Divair, and Soviet Canuckistan:

A political party is defined as an organization with active Senators involved and which includes the word "party" or the phrase "Coalition for Freedom and Enterprise" in its name.

No Senator shall have membership in more than one political party.

A Senator who is found to be a member of more than one party must leave one or the other, and his votes will not count until he does so.

I will sponsor.

[Mediciano]

Sponsors needed.

Aurentine Partisan Politics Act

Category: Senatorial Procedures| Urgency: Medium
Author: New Bierstaat (LCP) | Co-Sponsors:

The Senate of the Aurentine Commonwealth,

NOTICING the sheer number of parties in our commonwealth compared to the number of Senators,

SEEING that a significant number of these parties are merely jokes with no real political intent,

REALIZING the predicament brought upon the constituency mapmaker by people being in two or more parties as well as the horrible calamity that would result from banning hippos and banning banning,

ENACTS a long-needed rule, with apologies to Ainin, Divair, and Soviet Canuckistan:

A political party is defined as an organization with active Senators involved and which includes the word "party" or the phrase "Coalition for Freedom and Enterprise" in its name.

No Senator shall have membership in more than one political party.

A Senator who is found to be a member of more than one party must leave one or the other, and his votes will not count until he does so.

I'll sponsor.

[Maklohi Vai]

Sponsors needed.

Aurentine Partisan Politics Act

Category: Senatorial Procedures| Urgency: Medium
Author: New Bierstaat (LCP) | Co-Sponsors:

The Senate of the Aurentine Commonwealth,

NOTICING the sheer number of parties in our commonwealth compared to the number of Senators,

SEEING that a significant number of these parties are merely jokes with no real political intent,

REALIZING the predicament brought upon the constituency mapmaker by people being in two or more parties as well as the horrible calamity that would result from banning hippos and banning banning,

ENACTS a long-needed rule, with apologies to Ainin, Divair, and Soviet Canuckistan:

A political party is defined as an organization with active Senators involved and which includes the word "party" or the phrase "Coalition for Freedom and Enterprise" in its name.

No Senator shall have membership in more than one political party.

A Senator who is found to be a member of more than one party must leave one or the other, and his votes will not count until he does so.

I suggest you read my admin comments on this phenomenon in the Lobby.

[New Bierstaat]

Sponsors needed.

Aurentine Partisan Politics Act

Category: Senatorial Procedures| Urgency: Medium
Author: New Bierstaat (LCP) | Co-Sponsors:

The Senate of the Aurentine Commonwealth,

NOTICING the sheer number of parties in our commonwealth compared to the number of Senators,

SEEING that a significant number of these parties are merely jokes with no real political intent,

REALIZING the predicament brought upon the constituency mapmaker by people being in two or more parties as well as the horrible calamity that would result from banning hippos and banning banning,

ENACTS a long-needed rule, with apologies to Ainin, Divair, and Soviet Canuckistan:

A political party is defined as an organization with active Senators involved and which includes the word "party" or the phrase "Coalition for Freedom and Enterprise" in its name.

No Senator shall have membership in more than one political party.

A Senator who is found to be a member of more than one party must leave all parties but one or leave all parties, and his votes will not count until he does so.

I suggest you read my admin comments on this phenomenon in the Lobby.

I just did. It is my opinion that this bill is compatible with your comments. It doesn't ban joke parties; it merely stops people from being part of more than one party. We don't need people being in more than one party no matter whether the positions of the parties are serious or jokes.

[Yanalia]

I suggest you read my admin comments on this phenomenon in the Lobby.

I just did. It is my opinion that this bill is compatible with your comments. It doesn't ban joke parties; it merely stops people from being part of more than one party. We don't need people being in more than one party no matter whether the positions of the parties are serious or jokes.

I'd recommend you allow organisations to define themselves as parties as well.

[Maklohi Vai]

I suggest you read my admin comments on this phenomenon in the Lobby.

I just did. It is my opinion that this bill is compatible with your comments. It doesn't ban joke parties; it merely stops people from being part of more than one party. We don't need people being in more than one party no matter whether the positions of the parties are serious or jokes.

Fair enough, I understand. What do you think of the point about developing an unofficial party while still maintaing membership in an official one?

[New Bierstaat]

I just did. It is my opinion that this bill is compatible with your comments. It doesn't ban joke parties; it merely stops people from being part of more than one party. We don't need people being in more than one party no matter whether the positions of the parties are serious or jokes.

I'd recommend you allow organisations to define themselves as parties as well.

But then Senators couldn't be part of them without renouncing their membership in their actual parties.

[Yanalia]

I'd recommend you allow organisations to define themselves as parties as well.

But then Senators couldn't be part of them without renouncing their membership in their actual parties.

Isn't that the point of your bill? I'm just saying that organisations should also be able to legally define themselves as parties, thus placing their membership under the bill's restrictions, even if they don't contain "party" in their name.

[Huda]

One Cappuchino Please?

[New Bierstaat]

I just did. It is my opinion that this bill is compatible with your comments. It doesn't ban joke parties; it merely stops people from being part of more than one party. We don't need people being in more than one party no matter whether the positions of the parties are serious or jokes.

Fair enough, I understand. What do you think of the point about developing an unofficial party while still maintaining membership in an official one?

Oh, I agree with you on that. Guess I forgot to address that one. That unofficial party could just be called an "organization" or "foundation" or something similar and not be counted as an official party. There have been many organizations like that here in the Senate like the Locke and Hobbes institutes, for instance, as well as the Aurentine Civil Liberties Union, and in RL politics there are hundreds of such organizations within the US Congress alone. My Congressman, Aaron Schock, is in a bunch of these caucuses. But they shouldn't be counted as parties. Like you said, it isn't realistic. Nobody wins a seat in Congress as a member of the Community Pharmacy Caucus; they win as Democrats or Republicans or, in some cases, as Independents. We should maintain this level of realism in the Senate as well.

I hope this is what you mean and I'm not totally missing your point. I live east of the Mississippi and it's late here...

[New Bierstaat]

But then Senators couldn't be part of them without renouncing their membership in their actual parties.

Isn't that the point of your bill? I'm just saying that organisations should also be able to legally define themselves as parties, thus placing their membership under the bill's restrictions, even if they don't contain "party" in their name.

Yeah, I just don't know why they would want to, that's all. I don't have a problem with it.

[Yanalia]

Isn't that the point of your bill? I'm just saying that organisations should also be able to legally define themselves as parties, thus placing their membership under the bill's restrictions, even if they don't contain "party" in their name.

Yeah, I just don't know why they would want to, that's all. I don't have a problem with it.

Say you've got something like the CFE, but a Coalition for "Something Else." They might want to be called an official party.

Oh, and you should add to the definition of party "recognised official parties."

As for the point you made about unofficial parties, I think you misunderstood. MV was referring to parties with fewer than ten members (thus unofficial), not organisations.

[New Bierstaat]

Yeah, I just don't know why they would want to, that's all. I don't have a problem with it.

Say you've got something like the CFE, but a Coalition for "Something Else." They might want to be called an official party.

Oh, and you should add to the definition of party "recognised official parties."

As for the point you made about unofficial parties, I think you misunderstood. MV was referring to parties with fewer than ten members (thus unofficial), not organisations.

1. True, maybe we could just add in "recognized official parties" and an option for an organization to be recognized as a party, but then again, being covered under this bill doesn't really determine whether you are or are not an official party. The party may, though, not want its members to be able to join other parties. My policy for my map is that I won't add a party to the map until it has 3 members. It is my experience that most parties with 3 members end up making it to 10. But that's irrelevant to this discussion...

2. See 1.

3. I don't think that someone who's in one party should also be allowed to be in another, whether that party is official or not. Would it make any sense for you as a Red-Green to all of a sudden join the Market Socialists? No, because they don't agree with you ideologically. Parties live and die based on their ability to recruit members who agree ideologically with them. It helps keep the number of parties down. If we allow people to be in more than one party, we could have four or five people start parties with the same ideology, and people could be in all of them, because they all agree, and all 4-5 parties would want to be on the map. It would not turn out well. Should I be able to be in the LCP and the CFE both even though I do agree with both ideologically? Again, realism. Can a British MP be both a Tory and a Lib Dem? Unofficial parties should be no different. What if they reach 10 members - do they then have to kick out their members who are in another party and go back to unofficial status? Can they then rejoin and start the cycle again? Most unofficial parties exist because they want to be official parties, and for those that don't, I don't really see why they need to be parties at all.

[Maklohi Vai]

Say you've got something like the CFE, but a Coalition for "Something Else." They might want to be called an official party.

Oh, and you should add to the definition of party "recognised official parties."

As for the point you made about unofficial parties, I think you misunderstood. MV was referring to parties with fewer than ten members (thus unofficial), not organisations.

1. True, maybe we could just add in "recognized official parties" and an option for an organization to be recognized as a party, but then again, being covered under this bill doesn't really determine whether you are or are not an official party. The party may, though, not want its members to be able to join other parties. My policy for my map is that I won't add a party to the map until it has 3 members. It is my experience that most parties with 3 members end up making it to 10. But that's irrelevant to this discussion...

2. See 1.

3. I don't think that someone who's in one party should also be allowed to be in another, whether that party is official or not. Would it make any sense for you as a Red-Green to all of a sudden join the Market Socialists? No, because they don't agree with you ideologically. Parties live and die based on their ability to recruit members who agree ideologically with them. It helps keep the number of parties down. If we allow people to be in more than one party, we could have four or five people start parties with the same ideology, and people could be in all of them, because they all agree, and all 4-5 parties would want to be on the map. It would not turn out well. Should I be able to be in the LCP and the CFE both even though I do agree with both ideologically? Again, realism. Can a British MP be both a Tory and a Lib Dem? Unofficial parties should be no different. What if they reach 10 members - do they then have to kick out their members who are in another party and go back to unofficial status? Can they then rejoin and start the cycle again? Most unofficial parties exist because they want to be official parties, and for those that don't, I don't really see why they need to be parties at all.

(Addressing #3 only)
I understand what you're saying, and I think at this point putting up to a vote will determine what side of this argument the senate comes down on.