NSG Senate Chamber [NSG Senate]

[The Nihilistic view]

1) Are you really that stupid? climates don't work like that, we will not suddenly have summers 8 degrees colder than the nations around us when we are right in the middle of the med and 30-40 miles from their shores, same applies for the winter.
2) its about 100 miles away so not going to create such a large variation of temp changes when they are both in the same climate.
3)That is the average monthly low and monthly high. which is not the same as the monthly average temp. see my link above.

1. You seriously need to look up links provided.
2. Obviously it does as shown by the data which can be seen if you click on the links provided.
3. We are not looking at monthly average temperature because we haven't set that data out here.

See above, They have an average temp in winter months of 27 and in the summer months 28. Tell me you mathematical genius, what is the difference between the two?

[Great Nepal]

1. You seriously need to look up links provided.
2. Obviously it does as shown by the data which can be seen if you click on the links provided.
3. We are not looking at monthly average temperature because we haven't set that data out here.

See above, They have an average temp in winter months of 27 and in the summer months 28. Tell me you mathematical genius, what is the difference between the two?

Yea, I will need source for summer/winter temperature of Kuala Lumper otherwise, its best to take away average high from average low.
Either way, diffrence of 8 degrees isn't high.

[The Nihilistic view]

See above, They have an average temp in winter months of 27 and in the summer months 28. Tell me you mathematical genius, what is the difference between the two?

Yea, I will need source for summer/winter temperature of Kuala Lumper otherwise, its best to take away average high from average low.
Either way, diffrence of 8 degrees isn't high.

You do know that's not how and average temperature for a season such as the whole of summer is calculated right?

So its not best, its piss poor practice and worse than that piss poor maths and intellectually dishonest, I am sure you can sign up for a year 5 maths class at a local primary school in my constituency. Just admit you cocked up with your reading of the tables and subsequent calculations.

[Great Nepal]

Yea, I will need source for summer/winter temperature of Kuala Lumper otherwise, its best to take away average high from average low.
Either way, diffrence of 8 degrees isn't high.

You do know that's not how and average temperature for a season such as the whole of summer is calculated right?

Yes, however I seriously cant be bothered to calculate average for seasons since seasonal variance of 8 degrees (as it is case here) is insignificant, so taking annual average for Kuala Lumper should be reasonable reflection of variance there.

[The Nihilistic view]

You do know that's not how and average temperature for a season such as the whole of summer is calculated right?

Yes, however I seriously cant be bothered to calculate average for seasons since seasonal variance of 8 degrees (as it is case here) is insignificant, so taking annual average for Kuala Lumper should be reasonable reflection of variance there.

The point of your last post makes no sense, clear it up.

Ours should be something like this. Madrid has

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 6 7 10 11 15 21 25 25 22 15 10 7
°F 42 45 50 52 59 70 76 76 71 59 49 44

Thus an average high temp of 25 and average low of 6 for a variance of 19 degrees Celsius. We should be something similar to this.

[Great Nepal]

Yes, however I seriously cant be bothered to calculate average for seasons since seasonal variance of 8 degrees (as it is case here) is insignificant, so taking annual average for Kuala Lumper should be reasonable reflection of variance there.

Ours should be something like this. Madrid has

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 6 7 10 11 15 21 25 25 22 15 10 7
°F 42 45 50 52 59 70 76 76 71 59 49 44

Thus an average high temp of 25 and average low of 6 for a variance of 19 degrees Celsius. We should be something similar to this.

Madrid falls in Hot-summer Mediterranean climate. We fall in Cool-summer Mediterranean climate.

[The Nihilistic view]

Ours should be something like this. Madrid has

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 6 7 10 11 15 21 25 25 22 15 10 7
°F 42 45 50 52 59 70 76 76 71 59 49 44

Thus an average high temp of 25 and average low of 6 for a variance of 19 degrees Celsius. We should be something similar to this.

Madrid falls in Hot-summer Mediterranean climate. We fall in Cool-summer Mediterranean climate.

So we have a hot-summer med climates in the geographical areas north, south, east and west of us and so we are somehow cool-summer now? I ask again do you know how climates work? we are where Menorca is, They have a hot summer med climate and their average temps are below. There is a difference of 14 Celsius between low and high.

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 11 11 12 14 17 21 25 25 23 20 15 12
°F 52 52 54 56 63 70 76 77 73 67 59 54

[Great Nepal]

Madrid falls in Hot-summer Mediterranean climate. We fall in Cool-summer Mediterranean climate.

So we have a hot-summer med climates in the geographical areas north, south, east and west of us and so we are somehow cool-summer now? I ask again do you know how climates work? we are where Menorca is, They have a hot summer med climate and their average temps are below. There is a difference of 14 Celsius between low and high.

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 11 11 12 14 17 21 25 25 23 20 15 12
°F 52 52 54 56 63 70 76 77 73 67 59 54

LINK FOR LOCATION OF COLD MEDITERRANEAN CLIMATE, since you obviously have problem with seeing the links because I posted this link like billion times.

Edit: we are much more north than Menorca and we admins have already decided on the climate, so that is decided.

[The Nihilistic view]

So we have a hot-summer med climates in the geographical areas north, south, east and west of us and so we are somehow cool-summer now? I ask again do you know how climates work? we are where Menorca is, They have a hot summer med climate and their average temps are below. There is a difference of 14 Celsius between low and high.

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 11 11 12 14 17 21 25 25 23 20 15 12
°F 52 52 54 56 63 70 76 77 73 67 59 54

LINK FOR LOCATION OF COLD MEDITERRANEAN CLIMATE, since you obviously have problem with seeing the links because I posted this link like billion times.

So one little area to the NE of us has that climate, yet even there they have a summer temp that is around 25 Celsius.

How about Corsica temp? another island we are right next to on the same latitude.
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 8 8 9 12 16 20 22 22 19 17 12 9
°F 46 46 48 54 61 68 72 72 66 63 54 48
for a difference of 15 again.

or Monaco that is actually in the very small "cold climate"

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 10 10 12 14 18 21 24 24 21 17 13 10
°F 49 50 54 56 64 70 74 75 70 63 55 50
Difference of 14.

Do you need any more examples of how our climate does not fit in to our geographical location? I can keep going all day.

[The Nihilistic view]

Marseille
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 7 8 11 14 18 21 24 24 21 17 11 8
°F 45 46 51 56 64 70 75 74 70 62 52 46

Difference of 17.

[The Realm of God]

How about you gents take this arguement out of the chamber?

[Great Nepal]

So one little area to the NE of us has that climate, yet even there they have a summer temp that is around 25 Celsius.
How about Corsica temp? another island we are right next to on the same latitude.
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 8 8 9 12 16 20 22 22 19 17 12 9
°F 46 46 48 54 61 68 72 72 66 63 54 48
for a difference of 15 again.
or Monaco that is actually in the very small "cold climate"

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 10 10 12 14 18 21 24 24 21 17 13 10
°F 49 50 54 56 64 70 74 75 70 63 55 50
Difference of 14.
Do you need any more examples of how our climate does not fit in to our geographical location? I can keep going all day.

San Francisco also has cold med climate, and its difference is 7.4 degrees. Either way the debate has already been settled, atleast until 4 other admins say otherwise since 1/3rd of admins (Maklohi, Regnum, me) have already agreed on climate.

[The Nihilistic view]

How about Genoa
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 9 9 12 14 17 21 24 25 22 18 13 10
°F 47 47 53 56 63 70 75 76 72 64 55 49
Difference of 16

or Tunis

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 12 13 14 16 19 23 27 27 25 21 16 13
°F 53 55 56 60 66 73 80 81 76 70 60 55

Difference of 15

[The Nihilistic view]

So one little area to the NE of us has that climate, yet even there they have a summer temp that is around 25 Celsius.
How about Corsica temp? another island we are right next to on the same latitude.
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 8 8 9 12 16 20 22 22 19 17 12 9
°F 46 46 48 54 61 68 72 72 66 63 54 48
for a difference of 15 again.
or Monaco that is actually in the very small "cold climate"

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 10 10 12 14 18 21 24 24 21 17 13 10
°F 49 50 54 56 64 70 74 75 70 63 55 50
Difference of 14.
Do you need any more examples of how our climate does not fit in to our geographical location? I can keep going all day.

San Francisco also has cold med climate, and its difference is 7.4 degrees. Either way the debate has already been settled, atleast until 4 other admins say otherwise since 1/3rd of admins (Maklohi, Regnum, me) have already agreed on climate.

To stubborn to admit you have fucked up. San Francisco is not in Europe where all these other places and their average temps are! You were trying to criticize my geog skill earlier.

[Great Nepal]

How about Genoa
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 9 9 12 14 17 21 24 25 22 18 13 10
°F 47 47 53 56 63 70 75 76 72 64 55 49
Difference of 16

or Tunis

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 12 13 14 16 19 23 27 27 25 21 16 13
°F 53 55 56 60 66 73 80 81 76 70 60 55

Difference of 15

You keep going all day, still wont change the fact that climate has been decided for the time or the fact that this is out of place in chambers and this will be my last post regarding the climate non-debate.

[Fulflood]

How about Genoa
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 9 9 12 14 17 21 24 25 22 18 13 10
°F 47 47 53 56 63 70 75 76 72 64 55 49
Difference of 16

or Tunis

Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
°C 12 13 14 16 19 23 27 27 25 21 16 13
°F 53 55 56 60 66 73 80 81 76 70 60 55

Difference of 15

You keep going all day, still wont change the fact that climate has been decided for the time or the fact that this is out of place in chambers and this will be my last post regarding the climate non-debate.

Where can we discuss the climate you decided upon then? It seems is completely contrary to the climates of the areas around us.

Coincidentally, I noticed its last edit was 13:28 today, well into this discussion. If you're attempting to steamroll through your inaccurate views on climate like this (not confirming or denying you have done so) to further a debate of which you are part - see Genoa, Tunis, Rome - all of which have 15°C+ variations while we mysteriously have 8.4°, I have serious reservations about your trustworthiness as admin.

[Great Nepal]

Where can we discuss the climate you decided then?

1. I suggested it and three admins including myself, Maklohi and Regnum decided on it. I think it was Maklohi who posted it on factbook.
2. Lobby, where original suggestion went.

Coincidentally, I noticed its last edit was 1:28 today, well into this discussion. If you're attempting to steamroll through your inaccurate views on climate like this (not confirming or denying you have done so) to further a debate of which you are part - see Genoa, Tunis, Rome - all of which have 15°C+ variations while we mysteriously have 8.4°, I have serious reservations about your trustworthiness as admin.

The last edit was was made on 12:28 pm (GMT +1) by Maklohi. I stated our variation in 1:19 pm..
And if you have reservations about me being admin, feel free to TG others, there's link to their home page on first post. Try checking facts before hand though.

[The Nihilistic view]

You keep going all day, still wont change the fact that climate has been decided for the time or the fact that this is out of place in chambers and this will be my last post regarding the climate non-debate.

Where can we discuss the climate you decided upon then? It seems is completely contrary to the climates of the areas around us.

Coincidentally, I noticed its last edit was 13:28 today, well into this discussion. If you're attempting to steamroll through your inaccurate views on climate like this (not confirming or denying you have done so) to further a debate of which you are part - see Genoa, Tunis, Rome - all of which have 15°C+ variations while we mysteriously have 8.4°, I have serious reservations about your trustworthiness as admin.

Well noticed Fulflood, he has basically just decided on something and written it in by himself. I second these reservations.

A discussion was not finished and with only a few senators have been part of it, that is not right.

[Great Nepal]

Where can we discuss the climate you decided upon then? It seems is completely contrary to the climates of the areas around us.

Coincidentally, I noticed its last edit was 13:28 today, well into this discussion. If you're attempting to steamroll through your inaccurate views on climate like this (not confirming or denying you have done so) to further a debate of which you are part - see Genoa, Tunis, Rome - all of which have 15°C+ variations while we mysteriously have 8.4°, I have serious reservations about your trustworthiness as admin.

Well noticed Fulflood, he has basically just decided on something and written it in by himself. I second these reservations.

Try checking the posts before hand and other threads and links provided. K?

[Fulflood]

Where can we discuss the climate you decided then?

1. I suggested it and three admins including myself, Maklohi and Regnum decided on it. I think it was Maklohi who posted it on factbook.
2. Lobby, where original suggestion went.

Coincidentally, I noticed its last edit was 1:28 today, well into this discussion. If you're attempting to steamroll through your inaccurate views on climate like this (not confirming or denying you have done so) to further a debate of which you are part - see Genoa, Tunis, Rome - all of which have 15°C+ variations while we mysteriously have 8.4°, I have serious reservations about your trustworthiness as admin.

The last edit was was made on 12:28 pm (GMT +1) by Maklohi. I stated our variation in 1:19 pm..
And if you have reservations about me being admin, feel free to TG others, there's link to their home page on first post. Try checking facts before hand though.

Maklohi posted them based on the inaccurate assumption which you fed him that we're likely to have a warm-summer Mediterranean climate and not a hot-Summer one like the majority of rest of the Mediterranean coast.

I've posted this in the lobby so we can continue from there.

[The Nihilistic view]

1. I suggested it and three admins including myself, Maklohi and Regnum decided on it. I think it was Maklohi who posted it on factbook.
2. Lobby, where original suggestion went.


The last edit was was made on 12:28 pm (GMT +1) by Maklohi. I stated our variation in 1:19 pm..
And if you have reservations about me being admin, feel free to TG others, there's link to their home page on first post. Try checking facts before hand though.

Maklohi posted them based on the inaccurate assumption which you fed him that we're likely to have a warm-summer Mediterranean climate and not a hot-Summer one like the majority of rest of the Mediterranean coast.

I've posted this in the lobby so we can continue from there.

Ok be right over.

[Free South Califas]

Private schools are not always charities. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/For-profit_education OOC: As a disabled student in a public school, I feel adequetely supported. It highly depends on the school, which we can easily avoid by providing enough funding.

I have yet to come across one in the UK that is not a charity, my own school was as was all the schools in our leagues or in the Rugby group. I Even think you have to be a charity to be part of the independent schools council. Yes in the public sector depends it depends on the school but my experience of private school from a friend who was epileptic to someone in my year who was autistic to my own dyslexia is that there provision was five star and they cared an awful lot. Same at all my schools for that matter.

I'm not an expert on the UK system, but in the US and some other countries it tends to be the reverse; other than a few specialty schools and those with their own distinct philosophies in this direction, private and charter schools are notorious for grafting state legitimacy and/or money while denying entry to students with disabilities through a subtly manipulated 'wait list' (might lower the college admissions rate you know), denying them needed services or lumping them into regular classes at any and every level of dysfunction with no support (more cash for other projects; this happened at my school), sometimes outright humiliating and torturing them (see Judge Rotenberg Center which is supported by the Massachusetts court system). Meanwhile, public schools are more generally awful for all students, a problem we can prevent or ameliorate with legislative and ministerial efforts; while providing generally adequate resources for students with disabilities because they're government employees accountable to parents at the state's gunpoint.

Now, if the state fails to use its power adequately to protect students with different needs/abilities, to provide students with equal opportunities regardless; then the state needs fixing. I've got half a mind to run for Minister of Education, frankly. If a private company (charity or not) fails its obligation, it's harder to whip them into shape than public schools. I would wither the state away if I thought it would lead to freedom and equality; yet, at the moment, we need the state to ensure there is equal opportunity for all students at every school, or else the whole legitimacy of the social order is questionable. Privacy is fantastic for individuals, but for school administrations, I think open government and public accountability are more appropriate.

[Free South Califas]

.

I have serious reservations about your trustworthiness as admin.

Quoted post is thirded to the letter, with an emphasis on 'steamroll' and 'trustworthiness'. These are major issues with GN as an admin for me. Gothmogs already did the work on our biological database which needs to now be the first and last criterion. If a climate zone we 'choose', or variation thereof (jeez this is stretching the IC concept of the chamber), does not work for the assumptions of that database, it needs to be corrected as such IMO.

I understand this has been moved to the Lobby but it has been noted that a Senator expresses a certain lack of confidence in an administrator, and the fact that at least two others agree, seems to be a discussion that is relevant for the Chamber.

[Free South Califas]

Friendly Amendments to Public Education Act for Students with Disabilities and Different Needs
I. Declaring solidarity with the general purpose and most specific goals of Public Education Act (PEA),
II. I move for the following friendly amendments to be made:
a. Change article "2." as such:

• after "school missed" and before "3 months of jail", add ", and either 3,000 hours of community service to begin as soon as feasible or"
• after "3 months of jail", add "to begin as soon as the parent's obligation to directly care for, support the care of, or raise funds for the child has ended or as soon as it becomes impossible for the parent to reasonably provide same".

b. Between article "2." and "3.", add the following in (a) new line(s): "2a. The minimum number of hours required for each particular student may be reduced by consensus of at least two professionals, currently licensed in fields relevant to evaluating that student's individual medical or ability-related needs, who have a substantial history of working directly with the student, as necessary to prevent the student's needless suffering. To the greatest legally and medically possible extent, the same minimum standards of academic achievement must be retained in any case."
c. At the end of article "9.", add "described as such in this Act"
d. Between article "15." and "16.", add the following in (a) new line(s): "15a. The following exceptions shall be provided on an individual basis as necessary to prevent that student's needless suffering, by consensus of at least two professionals currently licensed in fields relevant to evaluating that student's individual medical- or ability-related needs who have a significant history of working directly with the student. To the greatest legally and medically possible extent, the same minimum standards of academic achievement must be retained in any case.
15a1. The minimum number of days attended in each week may be reduced to no fewer than three (3).
15a2. The minimum number of instruction hours attended in each week may be reduced as little as required to achieve this goal.
15a3. More frequent breaks may be allowed which might not be subtracted from the number of instruction hours reported, although it is recommended that this only be used in cases of autism, developmental disorders, attentional or post-traumatic stress conditions being treated, chronic pain conditions, emotional dysfunctions which could otherwise disrupt the learning environment, etc."

Could you put those amendments into a new draft of the bill, in the same format that Nepal did earlier? I could use that to put my amendments in too.

Sure, but as the author agrees with me, I'm a little confused as to why my amendments suggesting basic dignity for people with disabilities should be treated as entries to a contest anymore. However, I'm a bit new to the Senate so I'll stick those changes in a fresh draft at some point and we'll see what happens from there.

[The Nihilistic view]

I have yet to come across one in the UK that is not a charity, my own school was as was all the schools in our leagues or in the Rugby group. I Even think you have to be a charity to be part of the independent schools council. Yes in the public sector depends it depends on the school but my experience of private school from a friend who was epileptic to someone in my year who was autistic to my own dyslexia is that there provision was five star and they cared an awful lot. Same at all my schools for that matter.

I'm not an expert on the UK system, but in the US and some other countries it tends to be the reverse; other than a few specialty schools and those with their own distinct philosophies in this direction, private and charter schools are notorious for grafting state legitimacy and/or money while denying entry to students with disabilities through a subtly manipulated 'wait list' (might lower the college admissions rate you know), denying them needed services or lumping them into regular classes at any and every level of dysfunction with no support (more cash for other projects; this happened at my school), sometimes outright humiliating and torturing them (see Judge Rotenberg Center which is supported by the Massachusetts court system). Meanwhile, public schools are more generally awful for all students, a problem we can prevent or ameliorate with legislative and ministerial efforts; while providing generally adequate resources for students with disabilities because they're government employees accountable to parents at the state's gunpoint.

Now, if the state fails to use its power adequately to protect students with different needs/abilities, to provide students with equal opportunities regardless; then the state needs fixing. I've got half a mind to run for Minister of Education, frankly. If a private company (charity or not) fails its obligation, it's harder to whip them into shape than public schools. I would wither the state away if I thought it would lead to freedom and equality; yet, at the moment, we need the state to ensure there is equal opportunity for all students at every school, or else the whole legitimacy of the social order is questionable. Privacy is fantastic for individuals, but for school administrations, I think open government and public accountability are more appropriate.

My overall point is straight forward and simple, we have just got independence from the UK so our private schools will be set up like theirs. They will have been inspected by ofsted as well as the independent schools council, I know for a fact that the independent schools council set tougher standards to meet than ofsted. They will all be educational charities that provide services to local state schools, mine for example allowed the local primary schools to use our gym and swimming pool as well as providing them with older but perfectly usable equipment such as computers for free. We also went down to the school to help out as teaching assistants to help with reading, writing and maths. These things among others. As well as providing bursary's to poor pupils, My grandfathers school helps out financially 25% of their pupils my own school around 10%.

Thus if we make similar legislation to the UK about private schools then we don't have to worry about what happens in the US. Even I don't agree with how private schools in the US are run!

EDIT: UK private schools don't get any money from the state education budget.