NSG Senate Chamber [NSG Senate]

[Geilinor]

3 months of holidays makes sense to me in the US. For me, the school year is 9 months, with 2 months of summer vacation and 1 month spread out in between.

Why do you think that 3 months of holidays is right (and "the US does it" is not a reason)? Also, the original bill says that there are three months of holidays in the summer, with the rest spread out during the rest of the year. Great Nepal suggested that the 22 weeks be spread during the whole year as the governors see fit- I think this is better because it spreads out the holidays. What I'm suggesting is shorter school days and shorter holidays, so that the children won't be tired by the end of the day. So, why do we need such long holidays?

I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying it seemed like an acceptable amount to me. Also, it isn't just a US-centric thing. I suggest you read the school holiday article and notice that Canada, Chile, Brazil, Mexico, Austria, Estonia, Germany, the Netherlands, etc. have almost 3 months of holidays. I could accuse you of being UK-centric, considering you were so quick to accuse me of American exceptionalism. Shorter school days could work, as long as the students are in school for at least six hours a day. The way the bill was written, it had 8 hour school days. It said 7 hours of instruction time, not including lunch and recess. With 8 hour days, we do need that much vacation. I will support the suggestion to make school days shorter.

[Great Nepal]

We could put you in prison for life.

Then just execute us....

No, because:-
1. That is a easy way out.
2. Its illegal.

[Ainin]

We could put you in prison for life.

Then just execute us....

Haven't you read the Restricting Capital Punishment Act? And plus, life imprisonment is way cheaper than capital punishment.

[CTALNH]

Then just execute us....

Haven't you read the Restricting Capital Punishment Act? And plus, life imprisonment is way cheaper than capital punishment.

Well I see we are gonna have a lot of escape attempts.

[Ainin]

Your version isn't democracy, it isn't even tyranny by majority, it's just tyranny.

Lenin would be so proud!

Definition of democracy (n)

Bing Dictionary
de·moc·ra·cy
 [ di mókrəssee ]   

    free and equal representation of people: the free and equal right of every person to participate in a system of government, often practiced by electing representatives of the people by the majority of the people
    democratic nation: a country with a government that has been elected freely and equally by all its citizens
    democratic system of government: a system of government based on the principle of majority decision-making

What you advocate isn't democracy AT ALL.

[CTALNH]

Lenin would be so proud!

Definition of democracy (n)

Bing Dictionary
de·moc·ra·cy
 [ di mókrəssee ]   

    free and equal representation of people: the free and equal right of every person to participate in a system of government, often practiced by electing representatives of the people by the majority of the people
    democratic nation: a country with a government that has been elected freely and equally by all its citizens
    democratic system of government: a system of government based on the principle of majority decision-making

What you advocate isn't democracy AT ALL.

What other citizens?

[Great Nepal]

I think the filibuster started by senator CTALNH has gone on long enough. Lets return to debating governmental services bill omnibus which includes Universal Healthcare Act, Small Business Assistance Act, Public Education Act, Universal Credit and Educational Framework Establishment Act.

[CTALNH]

I think the filibuster started by senator CTALNH has gone on long enough. Lets return to debating governmental services bill omnibus which includes Universal Healthcare Act, Small Business Assistance Act, Public Education Act, Universal Credit and Educational Framework Establishment Act.

Yes indeed lets debate.

[Pesda]

What time would you prefer the school to start, and why would changing the time that the school starts change how tired the child is at the end of the day?

I remember when I was in school I would start to wake up around 9ish so 9:30 seems acceptable. And it's not about the fact that their tired as with anything work or school you will be tired after a 7 hour day. But it's to improve their focuse while in school And to have them better understand the material as they have had time to wake themselves up.

As for school days here are two articles one on Japan the other on Niger.

Japan
http://web-japan.org/kidsweb/explore/schools/q9.html

Niger
http://www.wes.org/ewenr/11aug/practical.htm

The article about Nigeria doesn't say anything about the length school days, so we can't get any relevant information from that (plus Nigeria is a less economically developed country, so we can't really compare it to Japan).
The article about Japan says that the older children have classes of 50 minutes, and have 5 or 6 lessons a day, therefore, a school day in Japan for older children, not including breaks, lunch, and extracurricular activities etc, is 4 hours 10 minutes or 5 hours.
So, to be like Japan, we would have shorter days for younger children (good idea), and allow people to stay in school for longer to do extracurricular activities (also a good idea).

[Republik auf Texas]

I say to Agriculture Rights Acts NO.

Needs to be better written and more to it. A land owner sound not be Taxed for the property of which he owns. But I do agree that farmers are one of the most important aspect of a economy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBsWYcWwpr4

[Geilinor]

I remember when I was in school I would start to wake up around 9ish so 9:30 seems acceptable. And it's not about the fact that their tired as with anything work or school you will be tired after a 7 hour day. But it's to improve their focuse while in school And to have them better understand the material as they have had time to wake themselves up.

As for school days here are two articles one on Japan the other on Niger.

I agree that students should start at about 9. I have to start school at 7:10, which is insanity(it's summer vacation now though).

[Geilinor]

I remember when I was in school I would start to wake up around 9ish so 9:30 seems acceptable. And it's not about the fact that their tired as with anything work or school you will be tired after a 7 hour day. But it's to improve their focuse while in school And to have them better understand the material as they have had time to wake themselves up.

As for school days here are two articles one on Japan the other on Niger.

Japan
http://web-japan.org/kidsweb/explore/schools/q9.html

Niger
http://www.wes.org/ewenr/11aug/practical.htm

The article about Nigeria doesn't say anything about the length school days, so we can't get any relevant information from that (plus Nigeria is a less economically developed country, so we can't really compare it to Japan).
The article about Japan says that the older children have classes of 50 minutes, and have 5 or 6 lessons a day, therefore, a school day in Japan for older children, not including breaks, lunch, and extracurricular activities etc, is 4 hours 10 minutes or 5 hours.
So, to be like Japan, we would have shorter days for younger children (good idea), and allow people to stay in school for longer to do extracurricular activities (also a good idea).

That's Niger, like 1/5th as developed as Nigeria. Niger is the least developed country on the planet, so let's please not take advice from Niger. EDIT: The link goes to Nigeria, but Niger is typed over the link.

[Oneracon]

Oh no, the right-wing elites will be force to mix with the regulars.

The horror, Senator! The sheer horror!

> Implying only the elite attends private schools

If you're a working class family, it's a lot harder to be paying all that tuition on top of all your other expenses.

[Geilinor]

> Implying only the elite attends private schools

If you're a working class family, it's a lot harder to be paying all that tuition on top of all your other expenses.

It isn't just the "super elite" that attends private schools though. $150,000-$200,000 is high-income, but not elite.

[Oneracon]

If you're a working class family, it's a lot harder to be paying all that tuition on top of all your other expenses.

It isn't just the "super elite" that attends private schools though. $150,000-$200,000 is high-income, but not elite.

I never said anything about super elite, I'm referring to elite in the sense of "A group or class of persons or a member of such a group or class, enjoying superior intellectual, social, or economic status" (American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, 2000)

[Pesda]

Why do you think that 3 months of holidays is right (and "the US does it" is not a reason)? Also, the original bill says that there are three months of holidays in the summer, with the rest spread out during the rest of the year. Great Nepal suggested that the 22 weeks be spread during the whole year as the governors see fit- I think this is better because it spreads out the holidays. What I'm suggesting is shorter school days and shorter holidays, so that the children won't be tired by the end of the day. So, why do we need such long holidays?

I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying it seemed like an acceptable amount to me. Also, it isn't just a US-centric thing. I suggest you read the school holiday article and notice that Canada, Chile, Brazil, Mexico, Austria, Estonia, Germany, the Netherlands, etc. have almost 3 months of holidays.

Noted. Three months holiday is okay if spread throughout the year, but what I object to is three months (lets call that 13 weeks) in one summer, plus the other 9 weeks throught the rest of the year (the original bill allows 22 weeks in total). If we had 17 weeks of holiday throughout the year (more than three months), we could cut the school day from 7 to six hours.

I could accuse you of being UK-centric, considering you were so quick to accuse me of American exceptionalism.

I wasn't accusing you of American exceptionalism, sorry it sounded like that. Your post said "3 months of holidays makes sense to me in the US." which I thought implied you wanted three months just because America does it that way. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Shorter school days could work, as long as the students are in school for at least six hours a day. The way the bill was written, it had 8 hour school days. It said 7 hours of instruction time, not including lunch and recess. With 8 hour days, we do need that much vacation. I will support the suggestion to make school days shorter.

Okay. How about the school day is 6 hours of lessons, plus however long luch and breaks etc are, and there are 17 weeks of holidays? That sounds like a good compramise allowing long holidays and a slightly shorter day.

[Pesda]

The article about Nigeria doesn't say anything about the length school days, so we can't get any relevant information from that (plus Nigeria is a less economically developed country, so we can't really compare it to Japan).
The article about Japan says that the older children have classes of 50 minutes, and have 5 or 6 lessons a day, therefore, a school day in Japan for older children, not including breaks, lunch, and extracurricular activities etc, is 4 hours 10 minutes or 5 hours.
So, to be like Japan, we would have shorter days for younger children (good idea), and allow people to stay in school for longer to do extracurricular activities (also a good idea).

That's Niger, like 1/5th as developed as Nigeria. Niger is the least developed country on the planet, so let's please not take advice from Niger. EDIT: The link goes to Nigeria, but Niger is typed over the link.

Agreed.

[Geilinor]

I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying it seemed like an acceptable amount to me. Also, it isn't just a US-centric thing. I suggest you read the school holiday article and notice that Canada, Chile, Brazil, Mexico, Austria, Estonia, Germany, the Netherlands, etc. have almost 3 months of holidays.

Noted. Three months holiday is okay if spread throughout the year, but what I object to is three months (lets call that 13 weeks) in one summer, plus the other 9 weeks throught the rest of the year (the original bill allows 22 weeks in total). If we had 17 weeks of holiday throughout the year (more than three months), we could cut the school day from 7 to six hours.

I could accuse you of being UK-centric, considering you were so quick to accuse me of American exceptionalism.

I wasn't accusing you of American exceptionalism, sorry it sounded like that. Your post said "3 months of holidays makes sense to me in the US." which I thought implied you wanted three months just because America does it that way. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Shorter school days could work, as long as the students are in school for at least six hours a day. The way the bill was written, it had 8 hour school days. It said 7 hours of instruction time, not including lunch and recess. With 8 hour days, we do need that much vacation. I will support the suggestion to make school days shorter.

Okay. How about the school day is 6 hours of lessons, plus however long luch and breaks etc are, and there are 17 weeks of holidays? That sounds like a good compramise allowing long holidays and a slightly shorter day.

I wasn't saying 13 weeks in one summer plus the other 9 weeks throughout the rest of the year. I was saying about 9 weeks(two months)in summer, with another 4 weeks in between. That's actually less than 17 weeks of holiday.

[Pesda]

Noted. Three months holiday is okay if spread throughout the year, but what I object to is three months (lets call that 13 weeks) in one summer, plus the other 9 weeks throught the rest of the year (the original bill allows 22 weeks in total). If we had 17 weeks of holiday throughout the year (more than three months), we could cut the school day from 7 to six hours.
I wasn't accusing you of American exceptionalism, sorry it sounded like that. Your post said "3 months of holidays makes sense to me in the US." which I thought implied you wanted three months just because America does it that way. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Okay. How about the school day is 6 hours of lessons, plus however long luch and breaks etc are, and there are 17 weeks of holidays? That sounds like a good compramise allowing long holidays and a slightly shorter day.

I wasn't saying 13 weeks in one summer plus the other 9 weeks throughout the rest of the year. I was saying about 9 weeks(two months)in summer, with another 4 weeks in between. That's actually less than 17 weeks of holiday.

No, the original bill says 13 weeks in one summer plus the other 9 weeks throughout the rest of the year (it says 30 weeks of school, so 52 in a year minus 30 is 22. It says three months in the summer, which is 13, and I presume that the other 9 weeks is spread out during the rest of the year).
The original bill also says there must be 1050 hours of school in a year, which means 7 hours of school gives 22 weeks of holiday, 6 hours gives 17 weeks, and 5 hours give 10 weeks of holiday. To keep with round numbers, I suggest keeping to one of those three options.
As to how the weeks are spread out during the year, I suggest allowing the school governors decide that (like Great Nepal), but we can decide it if we want.

[Geilinor]

I wasn't saying 13 weeks in one summer plus the other 9 weeks throughout the rest of the year. I was saying about 9 weeks(two months)in summer, with another 4 weeks in between. That's actually less than 17 weeks of holiday.

No, the original bill says 13 weeks in one summer plus the other 9 weeks throughout the rest of the year (it says 30 weeks of school, so 52 in a year minus 30 is 22. It says three months in the summer, which is 13, and I presume that the other 9 weeks is spread out during the rest of the year).
The original bill also says there must be 1050 hours of school in a year, which means 7 hours of school gives 22 weeks of holiday, 6 hours gives 17 weeks, and 5 hours give 10 weeks of holiday.

I see. Then I will support 6 hours of instruction a day and 17 weeks of holidays.

[Free South Califas]

I take issue with the Public Education Act, part of the Act being debated.
- If every child pass to pass a GAT before moving on in thier education, that means that 5 year olds will have to pass an exam. I consider it inappropriate for children this young to be subject to a test of this importence. Also, if this test is given annually, then children will be focusing on learning how to pass exams, instead of learning skills they can use after leaving education. Wouldn't it be better to either start these tests at a higher age, and have them less often, or have teachers decide if the children are ready to move on to the next grade by considering the child's work throughout the year?

This, so very much this. Standardized testing must come from someone's imagined, oversimplified model of the world. Its popularity is one of the many enduring tragedies of education law.

This prevents me from supporting the bill but I'm also concerned about protections for people with disabilities and those with different sensory/environmental needs and learning styles, like autistics. It sounds like the routine torture of the latter, or from a policy perspective at least their inability to stop it, would be the order of the day.

Yep:

2. It will mandatory for children to attend at least 10,500 instructional hours of school, be it at either public, private, or home school. Parents who knowingly prevent their children from meeting this requirement may be subject to fines of up to $10,000 for each 1,500 hours of school missed and 3 months of jail for each 1,500 hours of school missed.

There should be an option for (at least) students with disabilities and different sensory needs to, instead, give a 'thesis defense' of their education. A rigid hours requirement (and throwing the parents in jail?) is terrible policy, and would cause a massive amount of needless suffering. A simple committee of pediatricians, child psychiatrists/psychologists, and autism and disability experts would do wonders.

Why we're throwing any non-murdering/raping parent in jail is beyond me anyhow, unless their obligations to their children are complete. Garnish their wages and make them do community service.

Also, wthis is potentially troubling as it could presumably create a loophole through which those above 20 could be prevented from attending public tertiary education:

9. Nobody above the age of 20 may attend a public school.

Adding something making it specifically refer to these schools would be comforting.

-I think a 7 hour day is long for children of school age, because by the end of the school day, the child will be tired, and may not be able to concentrate well enough. I propose either a school day of 6 hours, and 35 school weeks a year, or a school day of 5 hours, and 42 school weeks a year, not including breaks. This would still add to the 1050 hours a year.

Most of the better educated places in the world have 7 hour school days or more.

And how is the children's health doing? Considering Japan's enduring teen suicide rate, I'm guessing not always well?

[Royalsoldiers]

I move to add the Commercial Usage of Railways Act to the queue.

I also move to add the Commercial Usage of Railways Act to the Economic Oversight Act omnibus.

[Free South Califas]

And yes point one is a a logical assumption but I don't see the issue with 7 hour school days I think it's more on what time school starts not the time you are in school. And I do support a year round school system.

What time would you prefer the school to start, and why would changing the time that the school starts change how tired the child is at the end of the day?

Well, children in general I dunno, but teenagers are now known to have a healthy sleep cycle that involves waking up and going to sleep later than younger and older people. Hence why teens are so groggy and irritable in school all day. This is exactly why the time of start and end should not be legislated - it must be flexible to growing scientific knowledge.

[Ainin]

CURRENT QUEUE FOR LEGISLATION

1. Governmental Services Act
2. Ministry of Research and Astronomy Reform Act
3. National Culture Act
4. National Financing and Accounting Act
5. Legality and Restrictions Act
6. Senatorial Procedures Act
7. Anti-Corruption Act
8. International Treaties Ratification Act
9. Economic Oversight Act
10. Death with Dignity Act
11. Universal Credit
12. Internet Registration Act
13. Voting out business management without holding shares is stupid idea and illegal
14. Standards of Daily Measurement Act
15. Condemnation of United States National Security Agency project: US-984XN
16. Educational Framework Establishment Act
17. Animal Protection Act
18. Amend Transportation Ministry Provision Act 2013
19. Amend National Census Bureau Establishment Act
20. Repeal Commerce Ministry Act
21. Military Discipline and Structure Act
21. Military Discipline and Structure Act
22. Corps Creation Charter
23. Commercial Usage of Railways Act

[Royalsoldiers]

What time would you prefer the school to start, and why would changing the time that the school starts change how tired the child is at the end of the day?

Well, children in general I dunno, but teenagers are now known to have a healthy sleep cycle that involves waking up and going to sleep later than younger and older people. Hence why teens are so groggy and irritable in school all day. This is exactly why the time of start and end should not be legislated - it must be flexible to growing scientific knowledge.

What about we give the local school board the ability to determine when the school day starts and ends?