NSG Senate Coffee Shop (OLD THREAD, DO NOT POST)

[Vietnam]

National Tax Act

Urgency: Very High

Drafted By: Geilinor

Co-Sponsors: Evraim, Wolfmanne, Gallup

---

The government of our yet to be named nation:

RECOGNIZING: the necessity of taxation if the state and government are to be sustained and preserved

ESTABLISHING: a national code of taxation applicable to all citizens and residents, without exception, unless otherwise authorized by the Senate

DEFINING: legal nonmedical drugs as substances, with the exception of foods and non-alcoholic beverages, employed for purposes other than those approved by medical professionals for the treatment of aches, smarts, and illnesses, and which are lawful to possess and use in the aforementioned capacities

MANDATING: that the Senate begin the process of determining which drugs should be legal and which drugs should not be legal with all due urgency

STIPULATING: that the tax code shall operate as follows:

Income Taxes shall be levied at:
0.00% of income earned between 0.00 and 15,999.99 NSC shall be levied
5.00% of income earned between 16,000.00 and 30,999.99 NSC shall be levied
10.00% of income earned between 31,000.00 and 50,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
15.00% of income earned between 51,000.00 and 100,999.99 NSC shall be levied
30.00% of income earned between 101,000.00 and 250,999.99 NSC shall be levied
35.00% of income earned between 251,000.00 and 500,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
40.00% of income earned between 501,000.00 and 1,000,999.99 NSC shall be levied
45.00% of income earned between 1,001,000.00 and 2,000,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
50.00% of income earned between 2,001,000.00 and 5,000,000.00 NSC shall be levied.
Any income above 5,000,000.00 NSC shall be levied at 60.00%

Sales Taxes shall be levied at:
For nonessential services: 0.00%
For gasoline: 2.50%
For publications, admission tickets to cultural events: 2.00%
For legal nonmedical drugs: 1.25%

Miscellaneous Taxes shall be levied at:
For corporate tax: 13.00%
For capital gains tax: 25.00%

Made a few changes. Perhaps we could make a progressive corporate tax? It'd help small businesses get ahead.

[Chestaan]

So basically, the rates I have proposed will likely become a reality anyway at a later point?

I said "can" not "will."

Most European countries don't find it excessive.

So?

What legislation do you hope to see brought in? With these tax rates, you will be severely limited.

So? Because European countries function very well. They also have a high standard of life. You are painting my proposal as completely unreasonable, while in many countries they are the norm.

[Othelos]

We aren't spending any money yet. So, not really. Besides, they can also be raised later.

Anyway, I find taxing the majority of people at 40% excessive, as well.

Eh, as far as know, we could be a starving developing nation with HDI lower than the DCR's.

And we will be, when people are excessively taxed and take their capital elsewhere.

[Aquitayne]

[box]Income Taxes shall be levied at:
0.00% of income earned between 0.00 and 15,999.99 NSC shall be levied
5.00% of income earned between 16,000.00 and 30,999.99 NSC shall be levied
10.00% of income earned between 31,000.00 and 50,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
15.00% of income earned between 51,000.00 and 100,999.99 NSC shall be levied
30.00% of income earned between 101,000.00 and 250,999.99 NSC shall be levied
35.00% of income earned between 251,000.00 and 500,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
40.00% of income earned between 501,000.00 and 1,000,999.99 NSC shall be levied
45.00% of income earned between 1,001,000.00 and 2,000,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
50.00% of income earned between 2,001,000.00 and 5,000,000.00 NSC shall be levied.
Any income above 5,000,000.00 NSC shall be levied at 60.00%

The re-designated colored levies are way too high. People should be able to use the money they've earned; we want higher taxes on the rich, not crippling ones.

[Imperiatom]

To get it through with liberal support, It needs to be at that level. I negotiated this with the liberal chairman. This is the best we can hope for, to protest is folly. I have the support of Wolfmanne,Subramani ,Radiatia, and New Sapienta so far for we all negotiated it with Geilinor . I recommend this as a three line whip issue.

I wasn't talking about your proposal. Most people don't make over 500K.

Sorry i misread the post beforehand.

[Othelos]

I said "can" not "will."


So?

What legislation do you hope to see brought in? With these tax rates, you will be severely limited.

So? Because European countries function very well. They also have a high standard of life. You are painting my proposal as completely unreasonable, while in many countries they are the norm.

Explain how we will be severely limited.

Their well-being is artificial. Their taxes aren't high enough to cover all their expenses.

[Othelos]

I wasn't talking about your proposal. Most people don't make over 500K.

Sorry i misread the post beforehand.

It's alright

[Vietnam]

[box]Income Taxes shall be levied at:
0.00% of income earned between 0.00 and 15,999.99 NSC shall be levied
5.00% of income earned between 16,000.00 and 30,999.99 NSC shall be levied
10.00% of income earned between 31,000.00 and 50,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
15.00% of income earned between 51,000.00 and 100,999.99 NSC shall be levied
30.00% of income earned between 101,000.00 and 250,999.99 NSC shall be levied
35.00% of income earned between 251,000.00 and 500,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
40.00% of income earned between 501,000.00 and 1,000,999.99 NSC shall be levied
45.00% of income earned between 1,001,000.00 and 2,000,999.99 NSC shall be levied.
50.00% of income earned between 2,001,000.00 and 5,000,000.00 NSC shall be levied.
Any income above 5,000,000.00 NSC shall be levied at 60.00%

The re-designated colored levies are way too high. People should be able to use the money they've earned; we want higher taxes on the rich, not crippling ones.

Someone making $5,000,000 a year would pay $2,092,750 in taxes, or less than 41.86%, due to the levies.

Someone making $10,000,000 a year would pay $5,092,750 in taxes, or less than 50.93%.

They'd still be able to live quite comfortably.

[Irredento]

As expected, the communists are already demanding much more, despite being offered generous concessions by the liberals and centrists. The idea of taking 30% in taxes from high earners is repulsive enough to me as a conservative and yet, despite the centrists offering even more than this, the communists are not content. Liberals and centrists need to learn that there can be no appeasement or compromise where dirty commies are concerned. This act will surely fail when it comes to vote, especially if the reds are allowed any input on it.

[Polvia]

The re-designated colored levies are way too high. People should be able to use the money they've earned; we want higher taxes on the rich, not crippling ones.

If you can point me to a wealthy person who made over one million dollars by themselves I will be amazed. Most CEOs pay themselves over four hundred times what their average worker makes, and I have yet to see an employer who works four hundred times more hours or produces four hundred times the sales. That being the case, they did not earn that income. They just took it from the workers who actually produced the revenue and gave it back to them at pennies on the dollar. That or they put it all in a stock market and rack in huge quantities in capital gains, and that isn't really earning income per se.

I would say that the blue tax brackets are too low, but that's just me.

[Vietnam]

The re-designated colored levies are way too high. People should be able to use the money they've earned; we want higher taxes on the rich, not crippling ones.

If you can point me to a wealthy person who made over one million dollars by themselves I will be amazed. Most CEOs pay themselves over four hundred times what their average worker makes, and I have yet to see an employer who works four hundred times more hours or produces four hundred times the sales. That being the case, they did not earn that income. They just took it from the workers who actually produced the revenue and gave it back to them at pennies on the dollar. That or they put it all in a stock market and rack in huge quantities in capital gains, and that isn't really earning income per se.

I would say that the blue tax brackets are too low, but that's just me.

Agreed, honestly, though it's better if we work with them to get something passed which will better suit our interests than something which doesn't.

[Vietnam]

As expected, the communists are already demanding much more, despite being offered generous concessions by the liberals and centrists. The idea of taking 30% in taxes from high earners is repulsive enough to me as a conservative and yet, despite the centrists offering even more than this, the communists are not content. Liberals and centrists need to learn that there can be no appeasement or compromise where dirty commies are concerned. This act will surely fail when it comes to vote, especially if the reds are allowed any input on it.

haha wut

isn't this place OOC?

[Chestaan]

What legislation do you hope to see brought in? With these tax rates, you will be severely limited.

So? Because European countries function very well. They also have a high standard of life. You are painting my proposal as completely unreasonable, while in many countries they are the norm.

Explain how we will be severely limited.

Their well-being is artificial. Their taxes aren't high enough to cover all their expenses.

Isn't it obvious? The vast majority of our citizens will be taxed at no more than 15%! How can that sustain any level of services?

Irrelevant. The current economic climate must be considered and you will find that much of the deficit in European nations, is structural not cyclical. Had tax rates been higher during boom times, then the nations of Europe would have adequate funds to stimulate the economy.

[Evraim]

As expected, the communists are already demanding much more, despite being offered generous concessions by the liberals and centrists. The idea of taking 30% in taxes from high earners is repulsive enough to me as a conservative and yet, despite the centrists offering even more than this, the communists are not content. Liberals and centrists need to learn that there can be no appeasement or compromise where dirty commies are concerned. This act will surely fail when it comes to vote, especially if the reds are allowed any input on it.

The decision of whether or not this resolution should go to the Senate floor is in the hands of the individual who wrote it, Geilinor. I am content with the current income tax rates. I believe that if the Progressive Conservatives, Liberal Democrats, the Monarchists, and a few centrists demonstrate support for this legislation and vocalize their opposition to the rates proposed by the Communists, then this resolution will pass with overwhelming support. It is already a compromise. That said, I am receptive to the proposals regarding a progressive corporate tax rate. Such a policy could bolster business.

Agreed, honestly, though it's better if we work with them to get something passed which will better suit our interests than something which doesn't.

The objective is not to satisfy everybody, but rather to create a framework to build upon in the future. At the moment, most of the Senate's expenditures are administrative. We aren't providing that many services to the population. We haven't even created a police force or military yet. If we're not spending funds, it doesn't matter how much we collect in taxes. If we don't have any taxes at all, it doesn't matter what we would spend those taxes accomplishing. If the Communists support this legislation, allowing for a progressive corporate tax, they will have gained something. This is a compromise. No one side has gotten exactly what it wants.

[Othelos]

The re-designated colored levies are way too high. People should be able to use the money they've earned; we want higher taxes on the rich, not crippling ones.

If you can point me to a wealthy person who made over one million dollars by themselves I will be amazed. Most CEOs pay themselves over four hundred times what their average worker makes, and I have yet to see an employer who works four hundred times more hours or produces four hundred times the sales. That being the case, they did not earn that income. They just took it from the workers who actually produced the revenue and gave it back to them at pennies on the dollar. That or they put it all in a stock market and rack in huge quantities in capital gains, and that isn't really earning income per se.

What about people who create their business from the ground up? Out of their own hard work they grew and expanded a business, which benefited the economy and all the workers they hired.

Successful CEO's do the same thing. They just happened to start later.

[Chestaan]

As expected, the communists are already demanding much more, despite being offered generous concessions by the liberals and centrists. The idea of taking 30% in taxes from high earners is repulsive enough to me as a conservative and yet, despite the centrists offering even more than this, the communists are not content. Liberals and centrists need to learn that there can be no appeasement or compromise where dirty commies are concerned. This act will surely fail when it comes to vote, especially if the reds are allowed any input on it.

As I have already pointed out, most European countries have much higher rates than 30%. Also, the highest that most people will ever be taxed at is 15%, which is obscenely low.

[Irredento]

As expected, the communists are already demanding much more, despite being offered generous concessions by the liberals and centrists. The idea of taking 30% in taxes from high earners is repulsive enough to me as a conservative and yet, despite the centrists offering even more than this, the communists are not content. Liberals and centrists need to learn that there can be no appeasement or compromise where dirty commies are concerned. This act will surely fail when it comes to vote, especially if the reds are allowed any input on it.

haha wut

isn't this place OOC?

I'm going with a bit of both I guess.

Also, here's my tax proposal:
0-25,000: 20%
25,000-50,000: 20%
50,000-80,000: 20%
80,000-150,000: 20%
150,000-200,000: 20%
200,000-1,000,000: 20%
1,000,000+: 20%

Where my libertarian dawgs at?

Anyway, I oppose the current proposal in a big way, but if it comes down to it and the alternative is the communist tax system, I'll probably end up supporting it in the end. We'll see how it goes.

[Othelos]

Explain how we will be severely limited.

Their well-being is artificial. Their taxes aren't high enough to cover all their expenses.

Isn't it obvious? The vast majority of our citizens will be taxed at no more than 15%! How can that sustain any level of services?

We don't have any services right now, so I don't think that arguing for imaginary expenses cuts it.

Irrelevant. The current economic climate must be considered and you will find that much of the deficit in European nations, is structural not cyclical. Had tax rates been higher during boom times, then the nations of Europe would have adequate funds to stimulate the economy.

Taking money and feeding it into the government does not help as much as leaving money in the market.

[Imperiatom]

I said "can" not "will."


So?

What legislation do you hope to see brought in? With these tax rates, you will be severely limited.

So? Because European countries function very well. They also have a high standard of life. You are painting my proposal as completely unreasonable, while in many countries they are the norm.

We don't want to spend much government money so that s not really an issue.

[Othelos]

As expected, the communists are already demanding much more, despite being offered generous concessions by the liberals and centrists. The idea of taking 30% in taxes from high earners is repulsive enough to me as a conservative and yet, despite the centrists offering even more than this, the communists are not content. Liberals and centrists need to learn that there can be no appeasement or compromise where dirty commies are concerned. This act will surely fail when it comes to vote, especially if the reds are allowed any input on it.

As I have already pointed out, most European countries have much higher rates than 30%. Also, the highest that most people will ever be taxed at is 15%, which is obscenely low.

Until we have services to spend money on, why would we tax higher than 15%?

[Imperiatom]

haha wut

isn't this place OOC?

I'm going with a bit of both I guess.

Also, here's my tax proposal:
0-25,000: 20%
25,000-50,000: 20%
50,000-80,000: 20%
80,000-150,000: 20%
150,000-200,000: 20%
200,000-1,000,000: 20%
1,000,000+: 20%

Where my libertarian dawgs at?

Anyway, I oppose the current proposal in a big way, but if it comes down to it and the alternative is the communist tax system, I'll probably end up supporting it in the end. We'll see how it goes.

You know what i am offering you. I will not break my word, that i can promise.

[Vietnam]

Agreed, honestly, though it's better if we work with them to get something passed which will better suit our interests than something which doesn't.

The objective is not to satisfy everybody, but rather to create a framework to build upon in the future. At the moment, most of the Senate's expenditures are administrative. We aren't providing that many services to the population. We haven't even created a police force or military yet. If we're not spending funds, it doesn't matter how much we collect in taxes. If we don't have any taxes at all, it doesn't matter what we would spend those taxes accomplishing. If the Communists support this legislation, allowing for a progressive corporate tax, they will have gained something. This is a compromise. No one side has gotten exactly what it wants.

Yeah, we know.

[Imperiatom]

As I have already pointed out, most European countries have much higher rates than 30%. Also, the highest that most people will ever be taxed at is 15%, which is obscenely low.

Until we have services to spend money on, why would we tax higher than 15%?

Exactly. Murder is not even illegal yet! we have no police no civil service no hospitals or schools. we have nothing to spend money on yet. It will just suck money out of the economy.

[Ziegenhain]

haha wut

isn't this place OOC?

I'm going with a bit of both I guess.

Also, here's my tax proposal:
0-25,000: 20%
25,000-50,000: 20%
50,000-80,000: 20%
80,000-150,000: 20%
150,000-200,000: 20%
200,000-1,000,000: 20%
1,000,000+: 20%

Where my libertarian dawgs at?

Anyway, I oppose the current proposal in a big way, but if it comes down to it and the alternative is the communist tax system, I'll probably end up supporting it in the end. We'll see how it goes.

I might be willing to support this if that is what it takes. Though I would still prefer a flat tax.

[Othelos]

Until we have services to spend money on, why would we tax higher than 15%?

Exactly. Murder is not even illegal yet! we have no police no civil service no hospitals or schools. we have nothing.

Did you TG Denecaep to put the proposal up for vote? We don't need to compromise with the Communists or even the Red-Greens to get the proposal through. Most people don't agree with insane taxes.