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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:35 pm

Xeng He wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
And besides, I object to the implication this couldn't happen.

It has happened already, fer Crissakes. CM's sample, while done to death, is very realistic: they keep it bottled up, and that's what causes the problem of integrity and the horror in writers.

Speaking of metafiction... How often do you guys relate fictional events to your real ones?

My favorite example is Fun Home by Alison Bechdel. She plays around with perspective and agency in terms of literature. It isn't just her story; it's her father's story, her mother's story, her brothers' story.



I generally try to avoid writing myself. That said, I think there are certainly times "I" stood out in a character or someone a character knew.

...actually, what I sort of noticed some time ago is that many characters I create for RPs and things will often have formerly known someone that...doesn't necessarily resemble me, but I always think "myself" when I think of that person they formerly knew.

None of my characters are Mary Sues, but there's often a Sue hidden in their backstory. :p


To be fair, just because you associate with your character doesn't make it a Mary Sue automatically. If that were the case, there's plenty of authors throughout the many centuries that have been guilty of that, and it either can't be the case and the Mary Sue label is too broad, or it doesn't matter because the character isn't automatically a Sue for other reasons.

Are we going to accuse Ishmael for being a Gary Stu for being a self-insert of Herman Melville, now? Of course not. That would be silly.

I don't understand myself well enough to write myself, so I either write fiction based on actual events that happened in my life or emotions I felt or things I think and so on. And... Like Alison Bechdel once said, "I best understand my parents in fictional terms."

It's sublimely tragicomic when she does it. Like, wow.

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Bezombia
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Postby Bezombia » Thu Nov 13, 2014 4:15 am

I'll almost always give my characters some facet or trait that coincides with one of my own.
The reason for that is simply so I have a better understanding of what the character would do and why.
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Postby Laerod » Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:29 am

Bezombia wrote:I'll almost always give my characters some facet or trait that coincides with one of my own.
The reason for that is simply so I have a better understanding of what the character would do and why.

This is precisely why all of my DnD based characters hate bards u_u

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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:24 am

Has anyone actually tried writing autobiographical accounts?

Difficult as it is for me, it's also very enlightening, not only about myself, but about other people.

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Vancon
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Postby Vancon » Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:47 am

The Rich Port wrote:Has anyone actually tried writing autobiographical accounts?

Difficult as it is for me, it's also very enlightening, not only about myself, but about other people.

I've always had a hard time writing about myself at length.
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Well what the fuck do you use for lube?

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Which just so happens to be within the next half-hour

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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:49 am

Vancon wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:Has anyone actually tried writing autobiographical accounts?

Difficult as it is for me, it's also very enlightening, not only about myself, but about other people.

I've always had a hard time writing about myself at length.


How come?

It's difficult for me because... Well, my life is difficult to write. Painful.

Is it for the same reason?

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Vancon
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Postby Vancon » Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:50 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Vancon wrote:I've always had a hard time writing about myself at length.


How come?

It's difficult for me because... Well, my life is difficult to write. Painful.

Is it for the same reason?

Kinda.

It just feels, off, in a way.
Mike the Progressive wrote:You know I don't say this often, but this guy... he gets it. Like everything. As in he gets life.

Imperializt Russia wrote:
The balkens wrote:Please tell me that condoms and Hazelnut spread are NOT on the same table.

Well what the fuck do you use for lube?

Krazakistan wrote:How have you not died after being exposed to that much shit on a monthly basis?
Rupudska wrote:I avoid NSG like one would avoid ISIS-occupied Syria.
Alimeria- wrote:I'll go to sleep when I want to, not when some cheese-eating surrender monkey tells me to.

Which just so happens to be within the next half-hour

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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:56 am

Vancon wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
How come?

It's difficult for me because... Well, my life is difficult to write. Painful.

Is it for the same reason?

Kinda.

It just feels, off, in a way.


If it isn't painful, I hope you don't mind my prodding.

I'm curious. :?

But you don't have to tell us/me if you don't want to... I guess.
Last edited by The Rich Port on Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Occupied Deutschland
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Postby Occupied Deutschland » Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:59 am

The Rich Port wrote:Has anyone actually tried writing autobiographical accounts?

Difficult as it is for me, it's also very enlightening, not only about myself, but about other people.

I've tried it on a couple of occasions, once or twice even on here. Name changes involved to protect the innocent of course. *nod*

I actually found it more enlightening about other people than about me, and liked it for that. While I knew roughly why I did something, it made me stop and think about why somebody else did what they did, why they said something particular to me, and why things happened the way they did.

I actually don't find it too difficult. I'm reasonably sure my guesses about other people's motivations or purposes could be wrong, but they make sense to me and that's all that really matters.
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Vancon
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Postby Vancon » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:01 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Vancon wrote:Kinda.

It just feels, off, in a way.


If it isn't painful, I hope you don't mind my prodding.

I'm curious. :?

But you don't have to tell us/me if you don't want to... I guess.

I just don't see what others would find interesting in my life. Sure, I've done some badass things in the past, but I doubt others would care. Everyone was their own tastes and opinions.

My life has been pretty good so far, and I don't have anything to really whine about.

It's been far from painful.

It's more of a why question.

That, and I don't fully understand myself yet in many regards.
Mike the Progressive wrote:You know I don't say this often, but this guy... he gets it. Like everything. As in he gets life.

Imperializt Russia wrote:
The balkens wrote:Please tell me that condoms and Hazelnut spread are NOT on the same table.

Well what the fuck do you use for lube?

Krazakistan wrote:How have you not died after being exposed to that much shit on a monthly basis?
Rupudska wrote:I avoid NSG like one would avoid ISIS-occupied Syria.
Alimeria- wrote:I'll go to sleep when I want to, not when some cheese-eating surrender monkey tells me to.

Which just so happens to be within the next half-hour

Shyluz wrote:Van, Sci-fi Generallisimo


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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:03 am

Vancon wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
If it isn't painful, I hope you don't mind my prodding.

I'm curious. :?

But you don't have to tell us/me if you don't want to... I guess.

I just don't see what others would find interesting in my life. Sure, I've done some badass things in the past, but I doubt others would care. Everyone was their own tastes and opinions.

My life has been pretty good so far, and I don't have anything to really whine about.

It's been far from painful.

It's more of a why question.

That, and I don't fully understand myself yet in many regards.


Shit, man, that's a whole book right there.

Why I'm Not Really A Badass. It's like a Woody Allen type thing if Woody Allen actually did awesome things instead of being sad. :lol:

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Vancon
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Postby Vancon » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:07 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Vancon wrote:I just don't see what others would find interesting in my life. Sure, I've done some badass things in the past, but I doubt others would care. Everyone was their own tastes and opinions.

My life has been pretty good so far, and I don't have anything to really whine about.

It's been far from painful.

It's more of a why question.

That, and I don't fully understand myself yet in many regards.


Shit, man, that's a whole book right there.

Why I'm Not Really A Badass. It's like a Woody Allen type thing if Woody Allen actually did awesome things instead of being sad. :lol:

Maybe another short story down the road.

Now if someone were to do a Biography on my, or if I did a biography on someone else, that I would get. It's a lot easier to see others and how they act rather then one's self.
Mike the Progressive wrote:You know I don't say this often, but this guy... he gets it. Like everything. As in he gets life.

Imperializt Russia wrote:
The balkens wrote:Please tell me that condoms and Hazelnut spread are NOT on the same table.

Well what the fuck do you use for lube?

Krazakistan wrote:How have you not died after being exposed to that much shit on a monthly basis?
Rupudska wrote:I avoid NSG like one would avoid ISIS-occupied Syria.
Alimeria- wrote:I'll go to sleep when I want to, not when some cheese-eating surrender monkey tells me to.

Which just so happens to be within the next half-hour

Shyluz wrote:Van, Sci-fi Generallisimo


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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:12 am

Vancon wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
Shit, man, that's a whole book right there.

Why I'm Not Really A Badass. It's like a Woody Allen type thing if Woody Allen actually did awesome things instead of being sad. :lol:

Maybe another short story down the road.

Now if someone were to do a Biography on my, or if I did a biography on someone else, that I would get. It's a lot easier to see others and how they act rather then one's self.


Methinks therein lies the problem.

Other people baffle me.

Or maybe I'm just really good at talking about myself? :unsure:

Another hit at the ego there, whydontcha, universe?

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Vancon
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Postby Vancon » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:28 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Vancon wrote:Maybe another short story down the road.

Now if someone were to do a Biography on my, or if I did a biography on someone else, that I would get. It's a lot easier to see others and how they act rather then one's self.


Methinks therein lies the problem.

Other people baffle me.

Or maybe I'm just really good at talking about myself? :unsure:

Another hit at the ego there, whydontcha, universe?

*crickets*

:p
Mike the Progressive wrote:You know I don't say this often, but this guy... he gets it. Like everything. As in he gets life.

Imperializt Russia wrote:
The balkens wrote:Please tell me that condoms and Hazelnut spread are NOT on the same table.

Well what the fuck do you use for lube?

Krazakistan wrote:How have you not died after being exposed to that much shit on a monthly basis?
Rupudska wrote:I avoid NSG like one would avoid ISIS-occupied Syria.
Alimeria- wrote:I'll go to sleep when I want to, not when some cheese-eating surrender monkey tells me to.

Which just so happens to be within the next half-hour

Shyluz wrote:Van, Sci-fi Generallisimo


U18 2nd Cutest NS'er 2015
Best Role Play - Science Fiction 2015: Athena Program

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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:31 am

Vancon wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
Methinks therein lies the problem.

Other people baffle me.

Or maybe I'm just really good at talking about myself? :unsure:

Another hit at the ego there, whydontcha, universe?

*crickets*

:p


Well, there you go. :?

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Vancon
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Postby Vancon » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:32 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Vancon wrote:*crickets*

:p


Well, there you go. :?

*hueing intensifies*
Mike the Progressive wrote:You know I don't say this often, but this guy... he gets it. Like everything. As in he gets life.

Imperializt Russia wrote:
The balkens wrote:Please tell me that condoms and Hazelnut spread are NOT on the same table.

Well what the fuck do you use for lube?

Krazakistan wrote:How have you not died after being exposed to that much shit on a monthly basis?
Rupudska wrote:I avoid NSG like one would avoid ISIS-occupied Syria.
Alimeria- wrote:I'll go to sleep when I want to, not when some cheese-eating surrender monkey tells me to.

Which just so happens to be within the next half-hour

Shyluz wrote:Van, Sci-fi Generallisimo


U18 2nd Cutest NS'er 2015
Best Role Play - Science Fiction 2015: Athena Program

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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:39 am

Vancon wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
Well, there you go. :?

*hueing intensifies*


*Metafictional irony intensifies*

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Vancon
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Postby Vancon » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:41 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Vancon wrote:*hueing intensifies*


*Metafictional irony intensifies*

*silence puny mortaling intensifies*
Mike the Progressive wrote:You know I don't say this often, but this guy... he gets it. Like everything. As in he gets life.

Imperializt Russia wrote:
The balkens wrote:Please tell me that condoms and Hazelnut spread are NOT on the same table.

Well what the fuck do you use for lube?

Krazakistan wrote:How have you not died after being exposed to that much shit on a monthly basis?
Rupudska wrote:I avoid NSG like one would avoid ISIS-occupied Syria.
Alimeria- wrote:I'll go to sleep when I want to, not when some cheese-eating surrender monkey tells me to.

Which just so happens to be within the next half-hour

Shyluz wrote:Van, Sci-fi Generallisimo


U18 2nd Cutest NS'er 2015
Best Role Play - Science Fiction 2015: Athena Program

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Conserative Morality
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Postby Conserative Morality » Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:59 am

The Rich Port wrote:Has anyone actually tried writing autobiographical accounts?

Difficult as it is for me, it's also very enlightening, not only about myself, but about other people.

I've done so before. Didn't care for it.
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Zeinbrad
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Postby Zeinbrad » Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:00 am

Well, I have to educate someone about "the Artist original vision being the only one with artistic integrity". Mind helping people who are genius compared to me?
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Conserative Morality
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Postby Conserative Morality » Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:05 am

Zeinbrad wrote:Well, I have to educate someone about "the Artist original vision being the only one with artistic integrity". Mind helping people who are genius compared to me?

Why would the artist's original vision be the only one with artistic integrity?
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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:05 am

Vancon wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
*Metafictional irony intensifies*

*silence puny mortaling intensifies*


*Dr. Insano intensifies*

Conserative Morality wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:Has anyone actually tried writing autobiographical accounts?

Difficult as it is for me, it's also very enlightening, not only about myself, but about other people.

I've done so before. Didn't care for it.


I dunno, sometimes I feel like I have to.

Zeinbrad wrote:Well, I have to educate someone about "the Artist original vision being the only one with artistic integrity". Mind helping people who are genius compared to me?


Tell them that if we're actually taking their shit, we'll have to throw out centuries of literary criticism too, and nobody sane will do that because a bunch of hacks think we should.

But... With nicer words.

Well, explain, maybe I misunderstand their position?

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Zeinbrad
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Postby Zeinbrad » Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:09 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Vancon wrote:*silence puny mortaling intensifies*


*Dr. Insano intensifies*

Conserative Morality wrote:I've done so before. Didn't care for it.


I dunno, sometimes I feel like I have to.

Zeinbrad wrote:Well, I have to educate someone about "the Artist original vision being the only one with artistic integrity". Mind helping people who are genius compared to me?


Tell them that if we're actually taking their shit, we'll have to throw out centuries of literary criticism too, and nobody sane will do that because a bunch of hacks think we should.

But... With nicer words.

Well, explain, maybe I misunderstand their position?

viewtopic.php?p=22420270#p22420270
“There are three ways to ultimate success:
The first way is to be kind.
The second way is to be kind.
The third way is to be kind.”
― Fred Rogers
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The New World Oceania
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Postby The New World Oceania » Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:13 am

The Rich Port wrote:Has anyone actually tried writing autobiographical accounts?

Difficult as it is for me, it's also very enlightening, not only about myself, but about other people.


Are you referring to personal essays?
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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:14 am

Zeinbrad wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
*Dr. Insano intensifies*



I dunno, sometimes I feel like I have to.



Tell them that if we're actually taking their shit, we'll have to throw out centuries of literary criticism too, and nobody sane will do that because a bunch of hacks think we should.

But... With nicer words.

Well, explain, maybe I misunderstand their position?

viewtopic.php?p=22420270#p22420270


Yeah, debating with Czechanada is a loosing battle already because you might as well be talking to a brick wall, but...

A valid counter-argument is that works of art are by their very nature up to interpretation; the higher quality they are, the more this is the case.

There is a point when someone just writes a shitty poem about flowers or some shit.

But if, say Shakespeare, when asked about his sonnets, he's like, "Meh, it's just some shitty poems I wrote in like five minutes", then it doesn't really matter, does it?

There is meaning in meaningful works, even when the artists themselves can't see it.

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