NSG Senate Chamber [NSG Senate]

[Ainin]

I cast an aye vote in absentia for Sen. Rocketvill (TR).

Proof he allows me to do so: http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof1_zps3a990c1b.png

So more of the rigged proxy votes I predicted.

Computer problems prevented him from accessing the forums, and he informed me of his intention to vote aye. How is that rigged?

[Malgrave]

So more of the rigged proxy votes I predicted.

Computer problems prevented him from accessing the forums, and he informed me of his intention to vote aye. How is that rigged?

Well for one I can't see the picture clearly and secondly I don't think Senators should be able to vote without being present.

[Yanalia]

You support worker self-management?

Except that?

You realize by "communities taking control for themselves" FSC (I think, please correct me if I'm wrong) means a sort of anarcho-communism? Besides, worker self-management is a pretty big thing for socialists and communists; I don't know if you've noticed.

[New Waterford]

I vote in favour of the appointment of John Geil as Prime Minister.

[Jetan]

So more of the rigged proxy votes I predicted.

Computer problems prevented him from accessing the forums, and he informed me of his intention to vote aye. How is that rigged?

It opposes the leftist stance, and thus must be rigged. Duh.

[Chetssaland]

Yeah, proxy votes are an entirely different animal. I don't believe those should be counted, but I'm unaware of the current legality of them. If they really are legal, then fine. We should work on a bill to make them illegal though.

[Jetan]

Computer problems prevented him from accessing the forums, and he informed me of his intention to vote aye. How is that rigged?

Well for one I can't see the picture clearly and secondly I don't think Senators should be able to vote without being present.

Zoom in with Ctrl and + if you can't read it otherwise.

[Malgrave]

Computer problems prevented him from accessing the forums, and he informed me of his intention to vote aye. How is that rigged?

It opposes the leftist stance, and thus must be rigged. Duh.

I'm against proxy votes on all counts Senator so I ask you not to put words in my mouth.

[Free South Califas]

You know what, I was going to not vote in this but seeing as one side is clearly and unashamedly trying to win the vote through the exploitation of the rules I vote against the act currently at vote.

This one was another.

In addition to the three, or the third you mentioned?

We have a legitimate and stable government in the full confidence of the Senate without PM Geil. It's called the Progress Coalition. Without Geil, We'll still have the same FreeSoc and the same First Council of Ministers as before. This is not a bad outcome, especially if it leads to a better alignment of coalitions.

Yea, I still dont see how you can use second action without first action happening when two are connected by "if" in clause five of REA.

I've explained that where we've discussed it, and see no further need to give a platform for your propaganda tricks on the issue. If and when it comes to a head legally, I will present my argument with certainty of the relevant syntactical and semantic issues.

I have fixed the count to add GN's rules exploitation.

Rules has been used to do what it was designed to do, to extend the voting time.

Many things were designed to exploit. As a libertarian you should know this

And why should I accept the coalition which is motivated with the purpose of pushing the left out of the power we've earned democratically, and has done everything in its power to push my party out of government for no harm or violation? Am I just supposed to take it because your party is one of the major ones and you want it this way? That's a dangerous argument. Mind, if the PM is bad for my politics that means it's bad for worker self-management, for communities taking control for themselves, for a strong social safety net, for the rights of people with disabilities of which I am one and I can't help taking this purge a little personally. All of that being said, these are all perfectly sound reasons for me to vote no; yet you call them 'political' and claim that is bad and/or obstructive, when in fact it can just mean a reflection of the will of the people.

I think both TR and LD support those things you listed.

The left wing of the coalition? Yeah, I noticed they were rather similar to the government currently in power. If they want to make a coalition offer to CP and RG, we've seen that there's some room for maneuver there if they're willing to stop associating with rabid anticommunists and allow both of the libertarian socialist parties to ensure the people who voted for us have a say in government. So far LD have been unwilling to entertain such things. Frankly I dont' see why they insist on aligning with rabid anticommunists and rightists. It's their prerogative to seek agreements, but to then insist we must simply take it for the good of the people (who we are helping serve now), is rather offensive.

All that happens if the vote fails is the current government remains in power. The Progress Coalition moreso supports the things I listed than the Jumble Coalition does.

[Great Nepal]

Yeah, proxy votes are an entirely different animal. I don't believe those should be counted, but I'm unaware of the current legality of them. If they really are legal, then fine. We should work on a bill to make them illegal though.

They are perfectly legal, as per admin ruling and precedent and there is nothing wrong with it, especially with OOC situation where people have lives.

[Jozef van Oostvoorne]

I cast an aye vote in absentia for Sen. Rocketvill (TR).

Proof he allows me to do so: http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof1_zps3a990c1b.png

This is way too fraud-sensitive. I can make this by simply using MSPaint.

[Ainin]

Computer problems prevented him from accessing the forums, and he informed me of his intention to vote aye. How is that rigged?

Well for one I can't see the picture clearly and secondly I don't think Senators should be able to vote without being present.

http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof1_zps3a990c1b.png
The picture, blown up to 8000 x 3000. If you still can't see it well, your computer's drunk.

[Yanalia]

This one was another.

In addition to the three, or the third you mentioned?

No, that was the third one I mentioned. That was poor phrasing on my part.

[Jetan]

It opposes the leftist stance, and thus must be rigged. Duh.

I'm against proxy votes on all counts Senator so I ask you not to put words in my mouth.

Then you should have said so, instead of claiming that your opponents are rigging the vote Senator.

[Britanno]

This is quite amusing. The opposition to the PM complain when we use proxy votes, I bet hey wouldn't be complaining if it was them using proxy votes. They're not illegal, deal with it.

[Chetssaland]

Yeah, proxy votes are an entirely different animal. I don't believe those should be counted, but I'm unaware of the current legality of them. If they really are legal, then fine. We should work on a bill to make them illegal though.

They are perfectly legal, as per admin ruling and precedent and there is nothing wrong with it, especially with OOC situation where people have lives.

I realize people have lives, but if they aren't present they still shouldn't be able to vote. The "life getting in the way" excuse is precisely why I believe a vote extension is warranted in the case of a new PM.

[Yanalia]

This is quite amusing. The opposition to the PM complain when we use proxy votes, I bet hey wouldn't be complaining if it was them using proxy votes. They're not illegal, deal with it.

Have we once used proxy votes on this appointment? No, nor have I suggested to my party members that that was even an option in my TGs to them.

[Ainin]

I cast an aye vote in absentia for Sen. Rocketvill (TR).

Proof he allows me to do so: http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof1_zps3a990c1b.png

This is way too fraud-sensitive. I can make this by simply using MSPaint.

This good enough for you, senator?
http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof4_zpsc09008e7.png

[Welsh Cowboy]

Yeah, proxy votes are an entirely different animal. I don't believe those should be counted, but I'm unaware of the current legality of them. If they really are legal, then fine. We should work on a bill to make them illegal though.

They are perfectly legal, as per admin ruling and precedent and there is nothing wrong with it, especially with OOC situation where people have lives.

Now in the specific case being discussed, computer problems seem to have occurred. But I don't think "people having lives" explains that people can get on to send a TG, but not to spend 20 seconds posting "AYE". I'm sorry, but why can people get on to TG someone but not post?

[Jozef van Oostvoorne]

This is way too fraud-sensitive. I can make this by simply using MSPaint.

This good enough for you, senator?
http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof4_zpsc09008e7.png

Not really. I can do this in MSPaint as well.

[Gothmogs]

This good enough for you, senator?
http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof4_zpsc09008e7.png

Not really. I can do this in MSPaint as well.

Ainin must be really quick with MS Paint. He wants that one vote pretty bad to do all that.

[Jozef van Oostvoorne]

Not really. I can do this in MSPaint as well.

Ainin must be really quick with MS Paint. He wants that one vote pretty bad to do all that.

Not the point. It's possible, and therefore it's bad.

[Ainin]

This good enough for you, senator?
http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/proof4_zpsc09008e7.png

Not really. I can do this in MSPaint as well.

Fine. How about a physical picture?

http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd494/ainin-ns/WP_20130623_001_zps18b1f367.jpg

[Free South Califas]

In addition to the three, or the third you mentioned?

No, that was the third one I mentioned. That was poor phrasing on my part.

Oh, I think it was fine, I just tend to seek clarity.

They are perfectly legal, as per admin ruling and precedent and there is nothing wrong with it, especially with OOC situation where people have lives.

Now in the specific case being discussed, computer problems seem to have occurred. But I don't think "people having lives" explains that people can get on to send a TG, but not to spend 20 seconds posting "AYE". I'm sorry, but why can people get on to TG someone but not post?

That's what's most confusing and disturbing to me about this whole mess. It seems like authorizing the proxy vote takes longer for them to do than casting an actual vote.

[Great Nepal]

They are perfectly legal, as per admin ruling and precedent and there is nothing wrong with it, especially with OOC situation where people have lives.

Now in the specific case being discussed, computer problems seem to have occurred. But I don't think "people having lives" explains that people can get on to send a TG, but not to spend 20 seconds posting "AYE". I'm sorry, but why can people get on to TG someone but not post?

Clicking on NS icon opens NS page where person can copy and paste a sentence into their reply, which takes about 2 seconds. This may be doable than going on forums, finding chamber's thread, getting up to speed on whats being voted and then vote.

Ainin must be really quick with MS Paint. He wants that one vote pretty bad to do all that.

Not the point. It's possible, and therefore it's bad.

It is possible that someone hacks into another person's account and votes. Therefore voting must be banned.