a

[Ravea]

Muhammad of islam was far worse. So were the christian conquistadores. And the islamic warlords who attempted genocide in India against the hindus.

Perhaps, but those are entirely off topic.

I'm sure they are, but I can't take them up by telegram since Phenia cowardly blocked me because he/she couldn't refute the islamic scripture I quoted to back up my claims.

Phenia thinks religion is special and should be given special rights and all sorts of exceptions.

You really think any religion is worse than another? Why not pick on Christianity, or the blood sacrifices of the Aztecs?

Just concentrating on Islam so much makes you seem somewhat bigoted.

[Mad hatters in jeans]

My Grandmother lived there during his rule and she supported Mussolini. She said he made the trains run on time.

ah that would be the special train service mussolini created yes?
also known as the failtrain.
who knew?

[Civil Arabia]

Muhammad of islam was far worse. So were the christian conquistadores. And the islamic warlords who attempted genocide in India against the hindus.

Perhaps, but those are entirely off topic.

I'm sure they are, but I can't take them up by telegram since Phenia cowardly blocked me because he/she couldn't refute the islamic scripture I quoted to back up my claims.

Phenia thinks religion is special and should be given special rights and all sorts of exceptions.

La ilaha illa Allah, Muhammadun rasulullah!

[Intestinal fluids]

My Grandmother lived there during his rule and she supported Mussolini. She said he made the trains run on time.

ah that would be the special train service mussolini created yes?
also known as the failtrain.
who knew?

She was alive and lived there and was a first person witness, you going to argue with her?

[Phenia]

I'm sure they are, but I can't take them up by telegram since Phenia cowardly blocked me because he/she couldn't refute the islamic scripture I quoted to back up my claims.

I blocked you because you were harassing me. I never once asked for you to start sending me telegrams. In fact, I asked you twice to stop.

Phenia thinks religion is special and should be given special rights and all sorts of exceptions.

You are not in any position to tell me what I do or do not think.

[Maurepas]

He's a hero to Fascists...But, considering I abhor fascism and most other authoritarian forms of government, he's scum to me...

[Mad hatters in jeans]

My Grandmother lived there during his rule and she supported Mussolini. She said he made the trains run on time.

ah that would be the special train service mussolini created yes?
also known as the failtrain.
who knew?

She was alive and lived there and was a first person witness, you going to argue with her?

*shuffles feet and mumbles*
....
....
....
no

[Milks Empire]

La ilaha illa Allah, Muhammadun rasulullah!

Let me take a crack at translating that.

There is no god but Allah; Mohammed is his messenger.

He's a hero to Fascists...But, considering I abhor fascism and most other authoritarian forms of government, he's scum to me...

Yeah, I'm not a fan either. But I can think of worse leaders.
Maximilien Robespierre comes to mind.

[Maurepas]

He's a hero to Fascists...But, considering I abhor fascism and most other authoritarian forms of government, he's scum to me...

Yeah, I'm not a fan either. But I can think of worse leaders.
Maximilien Robespierre comes to mind.

Agreed, he's also scum worthy,

[Carbandia]

Mussolini was a third rate dictator with delusions of grandeour and with zero military expirience, or capability.

Take a look at the campaigns in 1940, the invasion of France (done at a very short notice), the invasion of Egypt (done over the stringent objections of his in theater commander and with totally in effective troops) and last but not the least the invasion of Greece (done with no preparation what so ever)

edit: that's a hell no vote in case you hadn't guessed.

[Grave_n_idle]

Mussolini was a third rate dictator with delusions of grandeour and with zero military expirience, or capability.

Take a look at the campaigns in 1940, the invasion of France (done at a very short notice), the invasion of Egypt (done over the stringent objections of his in theater commander and with totally in effective troops) and last but not the least the invasion of Greece (done with no preparation what so ever)

Promoted to corporal for 'merit in war'? Commended for exemplary conduct, fighting quality, mental calmness, etc'?

That sort of 'zero military experience'?

[Civil Arabia]

La ilaha illa Allah, Muhammadun rasulullah!

Let me take a crack at translating that.

There is no god but Allah; Mohammed is his messenger.

You've obviously ... read a book or something. I was merely proclaiming my faith to the anti-Muslim or ... critic of Muhammed, at least..

[Milks Empire]

La ilaha illa Allah, Muhammadun rasulullah!

Let me take a crack at translating that.

There is no god but Allah; Mohammed is his messenger.

You've obviously ... read a book or something. I was merely proclaiming my faith to the anti-Muslim or ... critic of Muhammed, at least..

Aye, I have read.

[Bdellovibrio]

Intestinal fluids wrote:
Mad hatters in jeans wrote:
Intestinal fluids wrote:
My Grandmother lived there during his rule and she supported Mussolini. She said he made the trains run on time.
ah that would be the special train service mussolini created yes?
also known as the failtrain.
who knew?

She was alive and lived there and was a first person witness, you going to argue with her?

I've met some first person witnesses when living in Germany. So of them have different opinions on Hitler, which should we argue with.

So so far the main reason that Mussolini is a hero is because he got the trains to run on time. If this is the definition of the greatest achievement of a nation then the Island of Sodor is a standout. Italy might have won the war if the Fat Controller was in charge. Perhaps he was? When you think the Fat Controller never wears clothes that were fashionable after 1910.

Can we draw up a list of five items that Mussolini did that were heroic that do not involve train timetables.

Pro
1) he did unify a realtively new nation that could have fallen apart and descended in to civil war.

Con
1) Poor strategic vision - is there any involvement with other nations that he and Italy come out looking heroic?

[Mad hatters in jeans]

Intestinal fluids wrote:
Mad hatters in jeans wrote:
Intestinal fluids wrote:
My Grandmother lived there during his rule and she supported Mussolini. She said he made the trains run on time.
ah that would be the special train service mussolini created yes?
also known as the failtrain.
who knew?

She was alive and lived there and was a first person witness, you going to argue with her?

I've met some first person witnesses when living in Germany. So of them have different opinions on Hitler, which should we argue with.

So so far the main reason that Mussolini is a hero is because he got the trains to run on time. If this is the definition of the greatest achievement of a nation then the Island of Sodor is a standout. Italy might have won the war if the Fat Controller was in charge. Perhaps he was? When you think the Fat Controller never wears clothes that were fashionable after 1910.

Can we draw up a list of five items that Mussolini did that were heroic that do not involve train timetables.

Pro
1) he did unify a realtively new nation that could have fallen apart and descended in to civil war.

Con
1) Poor strategic vision - is there any involvement with other nations that he and Italy come out looking heroic?

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=9932&start=100
that's a link to my more ahem serious thoughts on Mussolini, just scroll down the page a bit i'm confident you will find my post there.
*just making sure no one thinks i'm a joker all the time*

[Carbandia]

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=9932&start=100
that's a link to my more ahem serious thoughts on Mussolini, just scroll down the page a bit i'm confident you will find my post there.
*just making sure no one thinks i'm a joker all the time*

Damn and here I thought I knew everything about him..How highly would you rate the chance that he faked his war record, in particular his commendations?

[Mad hatters in jeans]

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=9932&start=100
that's a link to my more ahem serious thoughts on Mussolini, just scroll down the page a bit i'm confident you will find my post there.
*just making sure no one thinks i'm a joker all the time*

Damn and here I thought I knew everything about him..How highly would you rate the chance that he faked his war record, in particular his commendations?

It's quite possible, quite the strutting peacock ol Mussolini.

[Bdellovibrio]

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=9932&start=100
that's a link to my more ahem serious thoughts on Mussolini, just scroll down the page a bit i'm confident you will find my post there.
*just making sure no one thinks i'm a joker all the time*

Damn and here I thought I knew everything about him..How highly would you rate the chance that he faked his war record, in particular his commendations?

When you can get the trains to run on time I'm sure that a faked war record is a fairly simple thing. Hitler covered up the fact that his granny claimed that she was carrying a half Jewish child.

Think about it. The lat Controller like uniforms and gets trains to run on time - it all makes sense. So If the Island of Sodor represents Italy, who is Thomas the Tank Engine?

[The Romulan Republic]

Whatever good things he did, I rather believe they were outweighed by the bad things. Rather heavily.

So, no.

[Risottia]

How about Gaius Julius Caesar, he was a Fascist.

You really can't even open a book, do you?

1.You. Can't. Use. 20th. Century. Categories. To. Describe. The. Politics. Of. The. Roman. Republic.

Gaius Iulius Caesar (there's no "j" in latin!) hailed from the populares political faction - he was seen as the successor to the two Gracchi (Tiberius Gracchus and Gaius Gracchus) and and to his own uncle Gaius Marius. The Gracchi and Marius were reformers and innovators, opposed to the conservative faction; they pushed for the elimination of the privileges of the senatores, giving more rights and equality for the equites (the middle class) and the plebs (the lower class).
So, if any kind of analogy with current political categories can be done, the would be more or less left-leaning liberal bourgoises.

[Risottia]

My Grandmother lived there during his rule and she supported Mussolini. She said he made the trains run on time.

All of my four grandparents lived here in Italy under fascism. And no, trains didn't run on time - expecially through 5 years of bombings.

She was alive and lived there and was a first person witness, you going to argue with her?

Yes.

Can we draw up a list of five items that Mussolini did that were heroic that do not involve train timetables.

Pro
1) he did unify a realtively new nation that could have fallen apart and descended in to civil war.

Actually in 1943 Italy split into two States - the Kingdom of Italy (siding with the Allies) and the RSI (siding with the Nazis). So, in Italy there was a civil war from September 8, 1943 to April 25, 1945 . And (not all, but at the very least some of) the blame falls on Mussolini.

Con
1) Poor strategic vision - is there any involvement with other nations that he and Italy come out looking heroic?

Battle of Nikolajevka (part of the Russian advance in Winter 1942-1943). The Italian expeditionary force in the Soviet Union being the first, and last ever, to manage fighting their way out of the Soviet encirclement (even the Soviet war bullettin acknowledged that the Alpini corps was unbeaten in Russia).
Second Battle of El Alamein. The Italian divisions Ariete and Folgore fighting until the last man to give time to the rest of the Axis divisions to retreat.
Or also the Massacre of Cefalonia, the SM-79 torpedo aircrafts against the British H-Force, the Maiali (scuba-carrying minisubs) raid against British ships... yes, plenty of examples of heroic actions in WW2 carried out by Italian soldiers.

These, though, make look heroic the italian soldiers ONLY - expecially if you think the poor equipment and the almost inexistant supplies (food and ammo) they had. Mussolini, instead, was happily playing tennis in Rome in his nice villa, as the Alpini died in the Russian snow, or as the tinfoil tank of the Ariete were minced by the British guns.
The fucker even had the guts to say, when, in late 1940, he was informed that the Italian troops attacking Greece were freezing in the snow for lack of winter equipment: "Nevica? Bene! Così se ne vanno le mezze calzette e si migliora questa mediocre razza italiana."
("It snows? Good! So the weaklings die off and we'll better this mediocre Italian race.")

Rot in hell if there's one, Mussolini dei miei coglioni, te e tutti i fascisti di merda!

[Farnhamia]

How about Gaius Julius Caesar, he was a Fascist.

You really can't even open a book, do you?

1.You. Can't. Use. 20th. Century. Categories. To. Describe. The. Politics. Of. The. Roman. Republic.

Gaius Iulius Caesar (there's no "j" in latin!) hailed from the populares political faction - he was seen as the successor to the two Gracchi (Tiberius Gracchus and Gaius Gracchus) and and to his own uncle Gaius Marius. The Gracchi and Marius were reformers and innovators, opposed to the conservative faction; they pushed for the elimination of the privileges of the senatores, giving more rights and equality for the equites (the middle class) and the plebs (the lower class).
So, if any kind of analogy with current political categories can be done, the would be more or less left-leaning liberal bourgoises.

And Caesar was always, always a Roman patrician. Remember, Risottia, he said that his family was so old and venerale that if Rome still had a king, it would be him. But, yeah.

"Mussolini dei miei coglioni, te e tutti i fascisti di merda!" come on, tell us how you really feel.

[Risottia]

And Caesar was always, always a Roman patrician. Remember, Risottia, he said that his family was so old and venerale that if Rome still had a king, it would be him. But, yeah.

That's correct, but in the late Republic, in politics your birth meant less than the faction you chose . Of course, most officials hailed from patrician families (the gens Iulia being one of the most prominent), but that's because you were supposed to practically buy your votes.

Nothing new on the Western Front, ain't it?

Anyway, compare with the Kennedys: clearly from a rich family, yet not aligned with most of the rich families.

"Mussolini dei miei coglioni, te e tutti i fascisti di merda!" come on, tell us how you really feel.

Want a translation?

[Farnhamia]

And Caesar was always, always a Roman patrician. Remember, Risottia, he said that his family was so old and venerale that if Rome still had a king, it would be him. But, yeah.

That's correct, but in the late Republic, in politics your birth meant less than the faction you chose . Of course, most officials hailed from patrician families (the gens Iulia being one of the most prominent), but that's because you were supposed to practically buy your votes.

Nothing new on the Western Front, ain't it?

Anyway, compare with the Kennedys: clearly from a rich family, yet not aligned with most of the rich families.

"Mussolini dei miei coglioni, te e tutti i fascisti di merda!" come on, tell us how you really feel.

Want a translation?

Only if "coglioni" isn't part of the digestive tract. Babelfish couldn't translate it.

[BrightonBurg]

I should disclose that I am not found of facism but will post this opnion,I voted no, He should have did what Franco did,stay neutral,but send volunteers to fight like Spain's Blue Division, but in the end, all he did was get tens of thousands of Italians killed,and himself, hung upside down,at a gas station..

My 2 cents..