Is School Slavery With Benifits?

[Dakini]

You shouldn't start a sentence with a conjunction (e.g. and, but, or).

In the words of Ira Gershwin, it ain't necessarily so.

I don't think it works so much in this case.

[Dakini]

Riiight.

Wikipedia is a good source, but see those [citation needed]? They're synonyms for "bullshit."

And as I've said before, it's a status offense. Meaning, only people who are minors (or look like minors, humans are not Omnipotent) gets the fine. Even then, parents don't have to enroll their kids in the school. Its up to the parents.

Besides, what are kids going to do during the day, if not being educated?

Probably obtain educations for far lower costs, gain knowledge in area's that are important to them, begin working earlier and avoid all of the debts and and everything associated with the modern education system.

An apostrophe followed by an s denotes possession or contraction, not a plural word. Apparently you've managed to avoid the grammatical portion of "everything associated with the modern education system".

If you're going to rally against the modern educational system, you should at least appear literate while you do so. Unless of course, you think that's "the man" telling you what to do or whatever.

Also, I'm a graduate student, I carry no debt at present and I've been saving up a lot of money since I've started grad school. If I began working earlier, I'd be working at the sort of crappy, dead end job people work when they have nothing more than a high school education. If I hadn't even completed high school, I'd probably be working the same sorts of crappy, soul-destroying jobs. I'm not sure why starting to work earlier is better if you're going to be stuck working at a terrible job for the rest of your life instead of possibly finding something you enjoy later.

Of course, you're advocating the removal of primary education, which means you basically want people to be illiterate morons because they'd rather not learn to read.

[Daistallia 2104]

In the words of Ira Gershwin, it ain't necessarily so.

I don't think it works so much in this case.

Twas aimed at your "You shouldn't start a sentence with a conjunction (e.g. and, but, or)." post, not the poster you were replying to.

[Dakini]

I don't think it works so much in this case.

Twas aimed at your "You shouldn't start a sentence with a conjunction (e.g. and, but, or)." post, not the poster you were replying to.

This is true. There are some situations where it does work.

[Myrmekion (Ancient)]

In short, no.

In long, I think that while mandatory schooling may be a little silly, it can hardly be called oppressive. Though if one were to argue that shoe-horning politically-motivated faux-education (read: no-sex only education, enforced religious ideology, etc...) into the school place could easily be called oppression, I don't think it happens enough or is strict enough to be called slavery. Plus, if you really hate going to school that much, you can pretty easily avoid the repercussions of doing so. I broke truancy laws several times through middle/high school without ever getting so much as a slap on the wrist. Of course, maybe I was just lucky.

Plus, higher education is still entirely voluntary.

(Yay! First post!)

[Bendira]

Maybe you should spend more time paying attention in school instead of bitching about how you're imprisoned.

It's funny, because when I was in school I always passionately wished that kids like Bendira would just drop out already, so the rest of us could get shit done...but now that I'm out of school I recognize that usually the kids who are most resistant to learning are the ones who need school the most.

Lol, you assume I was a poor student based on what?

[Sdaeriji]

It's funny, because when I was in school I always passionately wished that kids like Bendira would just drop out already, so the rest of us could get shit done...but now that I'm out of school I recognize that usually the kids who are most resistant to learning are the ones who need school the most.

Lol, you assume I was a poor student based on what?

Source?

search.php?keywords=&terms=all&author=bendira&sc=1&sf=all&sr=posts&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

[Bendira]

Um. Bendira, weren't recently or aren't you currently a college student of some sort?

If so, (1) doesn't that prove education has value to you and (2) didn't you need earlier education to get into college?

I am a college student right now yes.

1. Education has a value to me, I like to learn. I would attend school voluntarily, even if I had the choice to opt out. Although I would take time off for independent study.

2. Yes, but I don't think saying that since I am in college, I should accept my imprisonment in the public education system. The whole notion of high school being mandatory for college is part of the system that I do not believe in.

[Bendira]

An apostrophe followed by an s denotes possession or contraction, not a plural word. Apparently you've managed to avoid the grammatical portion of "everything associated with the modern education system".

If you're going to rally against the modern educational system, you should at least appear literate while you do so. Unless of course, you think that's "the man" telling you what to do or whatever.

Lol, looks like your public education failed a poor illiterate soul like me.

Also, I'm a graduate student, I carry no debt at present and I've been saving up a lot of money since I've started grad school. If I began working earlier, I'd be working at the sort of crappy, dead end job people work when they have nothing more than a high school education. If I hadn't even completed high school, I'd probably be working the same sorts of crappy, soul-destroying jobs. I'm not sure why starting to work earlier is better if you're going to be stuck working at a terrible job for the rest of your life instead of possibly finding something you enjoy later.

Of course, you're advocating the removal of primary education, which means you basically want people to be illiterate morons because they'd rather not learn to read.

Lol, because its impossible to learn to read outside of a school.

[NERVUN]

An apostrophe followed by an s denotes possession or contraction, not a plural word. Apparently you've managed to avoid the grammatical portion of "everything associated with the modern education system".

If you're going to rally against the modern educational system, you should at least appear literate while you do so. Unless of course, you think that's "the man" telling you what to do or whatever.

Lol, looks like your public education failed a poor illiterate soul like me.

Also, I'm a graduate student, I carry no debt at present and I've been saving up a lot of money since I've started grad school. If I began working earlier, I'd be working at the sort of crappy, dead end job people work when they have nothing more than a high school education. If I hadn't even completed high school, I'd probably be working the same sorts of crappy, soul-destroying jobs. I'm not sure why starting to work earlier is better if you're going to be stuck working at a terrible job for the rest of your life instead of possibly finding something you enjoy later.

Of course, you're advocating the removal of primary education, which means you basically want people to be illiterate morons because they'd rather not learn to read.

Lol, because its impossible to learn to read outside of a school.

And you learned to read and write where? You learned how to evaluate texts where? You learned how to conduct literary research where?

[Panzerjaeger]

Lol, looks like your public education failed a poor illiterate soul like me.



Lol, because its impossible to learn to read outside of a school.

And you learned to read and write where? You learned how to evaluate texts where? You learned how to conduct literary research where?

The local commune or my ass...one of the two.

[Bendira]

Lol, looks like your public education failed a poor illiterate soul like me.



Lol, because its impossible to learn to read outside of a school.

And you learned to read and write where? You learned how to evaluate texts where? You learned how to conduct literary research where?

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

[Panzerjaeger]

And you learned to read and write where? You learned how to evaluate texts where? You learned how to conduct literary research where?

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

WTF? How is a private school different from a public school? Wouldn't both by your logic be prisons?

[Dazchan]

Lol, because its impossible to learn to read outside of a school.

Oh I
Could tell you why
The ocean meets the shore.
I could think of things I've never thunk before
And then I'd sit
And think some more

Nobody except you is saying that. However, the removal of compulsory education removes the guarantee. Not only do most parents simply not have the skills to effectively teach reading, some of them simply don't value their children's education.

I'll give you an example of a kid in my class, who for privacy's sake, I'll name N. N is a nice kid. I have a lot of time for N when he's at school, which at the moment is an average of 3 days per week, and he's late on all three. If he takes two consecutive days off from school, I have to notify the principal, who drives around to his house to collect him. Hell, he wasn't enrolled in school at all until Term 4 of Year 2, when an anonymous report was made.

So let's put Bendira's policy of "education shouldn't be mandatory" into effect. Now my principal can't go around and collect N, because he no longer has the law on his side. N's attendance will probably drop back to the zero it was two years ago. His parents wouldn't have taught him to read. I know this because they didn't. His parents wouldn't have taught him mathematics. I know this because they didn't.

Three separate teachers have been playing the catch up game with him since he was finally enrolled in school. None of us have ever seen homework from him, so it's clear that his education still isn't valued at home. When he's at school, he's happy to learn and participate, and is making small steps. He'll probably never catch up to the others, but at least he won't be an illiterate, innumerate drain on society, like he would have been had the school not been able to force the issue.

My question to you, Benny, is why you want to punish N for his parents' values?

[NERVUN]

And you learned to read and write where? You learned how to evaluate texts where? You learned how to conduct literary research where?

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

Actually it's a very good argument because it supports the fact that you really have no clue what the hell you are speaking of.

[Bendira]

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

WTF? How is a private school different from a public school? Wouldn't both by your logic be prisons?

Uh, no? Nobody is forcing you to go to a private school, except maybe your parents.

[Dazchan]

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

Actually it's a very good argument because it supports the fact that you really have no clue what the hell you are speaking of.

The fact that his lists "on the internet [sic]" and "at the library" as places where a hapless child could learn to read and write demonstrate how little he knows.

I wonder what he'll say about N and his parents... if he chooses to respond.

[Dazchan]

WTF? How is a private school different from a public school? Wouldn't both by your logic be prisons?

Uh, no? Nobody is forcing you to go to a private school, except maybe your parents.

There is as much compulsion about going to a private school as there is about a public school.

The law says you must receive an education; it doesn't mandate a specific institution.

[Bendira]

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

Actually it's a very good argument because it supports the fact that you really have no clue what the hell you are speaking of.

Your argument dosn't make any sense. You are trying to say since the prison of public education taught me how to write it is justified for them to lock me up. You are ignoring the majority of the negative aspects of public education, namely the vast inefficiencies and unethical treatment of students. You can find a silver lining in virtually anything.

[Bendira]

Uh, no? Nobody is forcing you to go to a private school, except maybe your parents.

There is as much compulsion about going to a private school as there is about a public school.

The law says you must receive an education; it doesn't mandate a specific institution.

Yeah, if you followed this shit at all you would know im against the law that would make it compulsory to attend private school. However the option to attend would be there.

[Bendira]

Actually it's a very good argument because it supports the fact that you really have no clue what the hell you are speaking of.

The fact that his lists "on the internet [sic]" and "at the library" as places where a hapless child could learn to read and write demonstrate how little he knows.

I wonder what he'll say about N and his parents... if he chooses to respond.

The internet and library were examples of where you could learn the other skills he mentioned beyond reading and writing.

[Avenio]

Yeah, if you followed this shit at all you would know im against the law that would make it compulsory to attend private school. However the option to attend would be there.

Even without that law, I really rather doubt it would mean an appreciable increase in the amount of 'freedom'. If your parents are spending $4000+ a year to send you to a private, potentially high-end school, why would they let you piddle away their money by skipping, or worse, throw away your future by dropping out completely? If you think about it, even in an an-cap society, there would still be truancy patrols and kids being hoisted into paddy-wagons and hauled back to school, it would just be done by a private company rather than the police. Probably a profitable business, even.

[Dazchan]

The fact that his lists "on the internet [sic]" and "at the library" as places where a hapless child could learn to read and write demonstrate how little he knows.

I wonder what he'll say about N and his parents... if he chooses to respond.

The internet and library were examples of where you could learn the other skills he mentioned beyond reading and writing.

Oh really?

And you learned to read and write where? You learned how to evaluate texts where? You learned how to conduct literary research where?

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

Now, about N and his family...

[Bendira]

The internet and library were examples of where you could learn the other skills he mentioned beyond reading and writing.

Oh really?

Thats not a good argument and you know it. Obviously I learned it in school, however that isn't an argument that somehow supports imprisonment of youths. I could have learned it outside of school from parents, on the internet, at the library, or a private school.

Now, about N and his family...

You cannot learn how to conduct literary research on the internet or the library?

[Bendira]

Yeah, if you followed this shit at all you would know im against the law that would make it compulsory to attend private school. However the option to attend would be there.

Even without that law, I really rather doubt it would mean an appreciable increase in the amount of 'freedom'. If your parents are spending $4000+ a year to send you to a private, potentially high-end school, why would they let you piddle away their money by skipping, or worse, throw away your future by dropping out completely? If you think about it, even in an an-cap society, there would still be truancy patrols and kids being hoisted into paddy-wagons and hauled back to school, it would just be done by a private company rather than the police. Probably a profitable business, even.

Its true that hypothetically parents could force children to attend school. However it is unclear in an AnCap society how this would work. Children's rights in an AnCap society would most likely depend completely upon the community in which they lived, and what their policy was on it. It would depend on the parents policies as well.