Exactly how ****ed is Detroit?

[Selothey]

but I've been to Germany, and it's hard to mentally picture anyone in that country as threatening.

Awww... there went my World Domination Plans...

[Saiwania]

Detroit is in the poor house after decades of liberal policies. Ruinous wage increases beyond what the free market could reasonably provide, gradually forced the automobile factories to leave. The unions got too greedy and pushed business out of Detroit until there is nearly nothing left but government sector jobs. Detroit is a dying city with people leaving it for other states or cities.

[Brandenburg-Altmark]

Detroit is in the poor house after decades of liberal policies. Ruinous wage increases beyond what the free market could reasonably provide, gradually forced the automobile factories to leave. The unions got too greedy and pushed business out of Detroit until there is nearly nothing left but government sector jobs. Detroit is a dying city with people leaving it for other states or cities.

No, the auto factories left because they felt they could make more profit elsewhere. Last I checked in the 80s when they were all packing up and shipping out to Mexico and China GM and Ford were posting record profits. Simple case of greed and no government desire or capacity to stop them.

[Norstal]

Detroit is in the poor house after decades of liberal policies. Ruinous wage increases beyond what the free market could reasonably provide, gradually forced the automobile factories to leave. The unions got too greedy and pushed business out of Detroit until there is nearly nothing left but government sector jobs. Detroit is a dying city with people leaving it for other states or cities.

It's so easy to blame liberals and liberal policies isn't it?

[-The West Coast-]

I've heard stories about US cities where, if you go beyond a certain street in a city, you will "definitely get shot". I can't even mentally grasp how a govt can let any city sink so far. Here in Aus, cities just... aren't dangerous. At least, not any more than the suburbs.

Since you have not lived in cities like that, as I have, of course you would not be able to grasp the concept of gangland.

[Helertia]

Detroit is in the poor house after decades of liberal policies. Ruinous wage increases beyond what the free market could reasonably provide, gradually forced the automobile factories to leave. The unions got too greedy and pushed business out of Detroit until there is nearly nothing left but government sector jobs. Detroit is a dying city with people leaving it for other states or cities.

Lets just leave aside the whole fuele crisis thing, shall we?

[Havl]

Detroit is not as bad as it's made out to be. You should go there sometime. I love Detroit!

More like, everywhere that's mostly red is not all that bad:

What's the story behind that image?

Detroit is getting a bad rap for unfair reasons. It's one thing for residents to complain, but if you've never lived in Detroit, you don't know what you're talking about.

[Sibirsky]

More like, everywhere that's mostly red is not all that bad:

What's the story behind that image?

Detroit is getting a bad rap for unfair reasons. It's one thing for residents to complain, but if you've never lived in Detroit, you don't know what you're talking about.

Because information on any topic is not readily available?

[Brandenburg-Altmark]

More like, everywhere that's mostly red is not all that bad:

What's the story behind that image?

Detroit is getting a bad rap for unfair reasons. It's one thing for residents to complain, but if you've never lived in Detroit, you don't know what you're talking about.

I think I can safely say that, from the facts, Detroit is an absolute shithole. 47.3 murders per 100,000 people, the highest in the nation, is nothing to sneeze at, add in that it is also ranked #2 for overall violent crime and #4 for robbery, plus the low median income, the dirty, litter covered streets and the generally angry, violent uneducated population and it is just a terrible place. I don't have to go there and get shot at for being white to see it is a horrible place.

[Nazi Flower Power]

None of the big five Australian cities are like that, at all.

Then feel fortunate. Major cities in the US are quite violent. And I am sure there isn't just one cause for that.

American cities are not as violent as they are reputed to be.

I live in Boston, and I hear people from the suburbs say they are afraid to ride the bus or the T or to walk on the streets at night; and honestly, I have no fucking clue what they are so afraid of. Maybe I scared them away because I'm a Nazi. I dunno. It just seems like a large part of the American population, especially the white people, and a lot of the media have an irrational fear of cities. They have decided to focus only on the few idiots who shoot each other rather than the hundreds of thousands of people who live perfectly decent peaceful lives. Just because there are tall buildings and a lot of people around, doesn't mean your life is in danger every time you walk down the street. A lot of the reputation cities have for being dangerous is just fear of the unfamiliar because there are a lot of ethnic enclaves, unusual subcultures, etc. Crime rates do tend to go up with higher population density because the more people you interact with, the more people you have an opportunity to attack, rip off, etc. However, American cities are not all gang fights and ghettos like you hear about in the news. The news media likes fearmongering in general -- hence all the stories warning of terrorist threats, even when they have no actual terrorist attacks to report -- so they always exaggerate urban violence. American culture likes the image of cities crawling with ruthless black thugs. It sells newspapers, rap albums, etc. Nobody wants to hear about the white neighborhoods. Nobody wants to hear about middle class city-dwellers who work ordinary jobs and live in condos where the inside looks just like your house in the 'burbs. They want the horror stories about tenements crawling with roaches. They want to hear about the crack houses, the gang turf, and all the worst places in town because that is more exciting.

That said, I have heard that Detroit is fucked up in ways that other American cities are not. I read somewhere that the abandoned property in Detroit covers more land than the entire city of Boston. That is BAD! Even so, I've never been to Detroit except the airport and I don't know the city well enough to say if it is all bad. I just know the bad parts of the city get really bad, and that is what you hear about.

[Lacadaemon]

Then feel fortunate. Major cities in the US are quite violent. And I am sure there isn't just one cause for that.

American cities are not as violent as they are reputed to be.

I live in Boston, and I hear people from the suburbs say they are afraid to ride the bus or the T or to walk on the streets at night; and honestly, I have no fucking clue what they are so afraid of. Maybe I scared them away because I'm a Nazi. I dunno. It just seems like a large part of the American population, especially the white people, and a lot of the media have an irrational fear of cities. They have decided to focus only on the few idiots who shoot each other rather than the hundreds of thousands of people who live perfectly decent peaceful lives. Just because there are tall buildings and a lot of people around, doesn't mean your life is in danger every time you walk down the street. A lot of the reputation cities have for being dangerous is just fear of the unfamiliar because there are a lot of ethnic enclaves, unusual subcultures, etc. Crime rates do tend to go up with higher population density because the more people you interact with, the more people you have an opportunity to attack, rip off, etc. However, American cities are not all gang fights and ghettos like you hear about in the news. The news media likes fearmongering in general -- hence all the stories warning of terrorist threats, even when they have no actual terrorist attacks to report -- so they always exaggerate urban violence. American culture likes the image of cities crawling with ruthless black thugs. It sells newspapers, rap albums, etc. Nobody wants to hear about the white neighborhoods. Nobody wants to hear about middle class city-dwellers who work ordinary jobs and live in condos where the inside looks just like your house in the 'burbs. They want the horror stories about tenements crawling with roaches. They want to hear about the crack houses, the gang turf, and all the worst places in town because that is more exciting.

That said, I have heard that Detroit is fucked up in ways that other American cities are not. I read somewhere that the abandoned property in Detroit covers more land than the entire city of Boston. That is BAD! Even so, I've never been to Detroit except the airport and I don't know the city well enough to say if it is all bad. I just know the bad parts of the city get really bad, and that is what you hear about.

Boston and NYC aren't that bad though. In fact, I'd be hard pressed to think of a part of NYC that's really all that bad these days. So I don't think they are a good yard stick.

On the other hand, look at places like Richmond Va, or Charleston SC north of the touristy part. Quite epically awful if you are a stranger.

And I think part of the reason that places like NYC still have a bad reputation is because 20 years ago it was that bad.

[Wamitoria]

-snip-

Hint: They're afraid of black people.

[Nazi Flower Power]

Boston and NYC aren't that bad though. In fact, I'd be hard pressed to think of a part of NYC that's really all that bad these days. So I don't think they are a good yard stick.

On the other hand, look at places like Richmond Va, or Charleston SC north of the touristy part. Quite epically awful if you are a stranger.

And I think part of the reason that places like NYC still have a bad reputation is because 20 years ago it was that bad.

If we're talking about "major cities," I think Boston and NYC are better examples than Richmond.

[Xarithis]

Can any Americans (Detroitans in particular) shine some light on the subject for me?

Saddam Hussein got the key to the city of Detroit. 'Nuf said. (Granted, they didn't know he was going to be an "Evil Dictator" at the time, but it is still fun to think about.)

[Grand Berlin]

I live in the Detroit area, and yeah, most of us metro people say we hate it. But in truth, we visit it all the time; we have overwhelming support for our sports teams, and many of us have jobs at the car companies based in Detroit. Most, actually. Detroit is the center of Michigan, even if it's a hollowed-out ditch, and they're improving it. Mayor Bing is demolishing vacant buildings and they're actually going ahead with the urban farming idea, which seems like it'll work. Most of us are tired of this bad image of Detroit and we are willing to do anything to fix it.

[Unidox]

I read this article, and you know, before the article I knew that Detroit was economically troubled and had crime problems, but I didn't think it was at the "truly doomed" stage.

Can any Americans (Detroitans in particular) shine some light on the subject for me?

Moe sums it up nicely.

[Sun Aut Ex]

Since you have not lived in cities like that, as I have, of course you would not be able to grasp the concept of gangland.

It's not the concept I can't grasp, it's the idea that a govt lets it happen. Here, we alleged have a drunken violence epidemic (we don't, it's sensationalist crap to sell newspapers), and the police are out patrolling the city streets in numbers every night. If shit like happens in the US ever happened here, I can't imagine how heavy the police crackdown would be.

[Lacadaemon]

Boston and NYC aren't that bad though. In fact, I'd be hard pressed to think of a part of NYC that's really all that bad these days. So I don't think they are a good yard stick.

On the other hand, look at places like Richmond Va, or Charleston SC north of the touristy part. Quite epically awful if you are a stranger.

And I think part of the reason that places like NYC still have a bad reputation is because 20 years ago it was that bad.

If we're talking about "major cities," I think Boston and NYC are better examples than Richmond.

That sets the bar pretty high though. The Boston Metro is in the top 10.

Richmond is about the same size as New Orleans. People don't ever think about it because it's so fucking horrible.

[Nazi Flower Power]

That sets the bar pretty high though. The Boston Metro is in the top 10.

Richmond is about the same size as New Orleans. People don't ever think about it because it's so fucking horrible.

Well, I do try to avoid thinking about any place south of the Potomac, but my point was just that people should not make generalizations about cities being violent if it is easy to find examples of cities that are safe.

[Nazi Flower Power]

Since you have not lived in cities like that, as I have, of course you would not be able to grasp the concept of gangland.

It's not the concept I can't grasp, it's the idea that a govt lets it happen. Here, we alleged have a drunken violence epidemic (we don't, it's sensationalist crap to sell newspapers), and the police are out patrolling the city streets in numbers every night. If shit like happens in the US ever happened here, I can't imagine how heavy the police crackdown would be.

A lot of what you hear about the U.S. is also sensationalist crap to sell newspapers.

[Brandenburg-Altmark]

It's not the concept I can't grasp, it's the idea that a govt lets it happen. Here, we alleged have a drunken violence epidemic (we don't, it's sensationalist crap to sell newspapers), and the police are out patrolling the city streets in numbers every night. If shit like happens in the US ever happened here, I can't imagine how heavy the police crackdown would be.

A lot of what you hear about the U.S. is also sensationalist crap to sell newspapers.

Bingo. For the most part even our "dangerous" cities are safe. Detroit definitely not as safe as others, but you won't necessarily be killed for walking around. You're almost guaranteed to get mugged if you spend enough time walking around the streets, sure, but if everyone who walked around Detroit was shot they'd have run out of victims 30 years ago.

[Sun Aut Ex]

Bingo. For the most part even our "dangerous" cities are safe. Detroit definitely not as safe as others, but you won't necessarily be killed for walking around. You're almost guaranteed to get mugged if you spend enough time walking around the streets, sure, but if everyone who walked around Detroit was shot they'd have run out of victims 30 years ago.

That's still pretty bad. Plus, you know, how US cities have "no go zones" that are controlled by gangs.

[The Bleeding Roses]

I love all the self-righteous foreigners talking about how none of their cities are dangerous...

[Blouman Empire]

Of course, any major city, anywhere in the world, is probably quite violent.

None of the big five Australian cities are like that, at all.

Not true at all, there are some streets that ambos wont go unless they have a police escort. They may not be shot but they will be assaulted quite severely. I know that is just one city but I dare say the bigger ones in Australia have the same problem.

After all there are some suburbs in Sydney I wouldn't want to be in

[Blouman Empire]

I've never heard of such places...

Heh, I remember when i was like 10 me and my dad went to Detroit to watch a Tigers game. We drove by a McDonalds in an area where I did not see one white person, I asked if we could stop there, he replied "no, you don't go into a black McDonalds".

And some say segregation is a thing of the past