Evolution or Creationism

[Sociobiology]

Rude? You're the one that presented a falsifiable evidence when I clearly requested a testable one. Testable means that I can reproduce the results on my own. Looking up in the sky is the same as looking into a microscope: it doesn't do crap.

I mean really, if I were to make a scientific achievement in Biology and I ask people to "just look into the microscope!" I'll look like a fucking idiot.

There is no point in trying to show those who were raised in a non-observant environment that the Lord exists. To each her own.

in other words god only exists if he/she/it has been pounded into your head since birth. That would be the very definition of opinion and not a fact. facts are true for everyone regardless of their background and are proven through evidence. Gravity is a great example, you still fall even if you don't believe. and you still evolve even if you don't understand it. to be proven something usually can be measured evolution can be measured as can gravity.
Scientists demand proof EVERYTHING exists that is what science is.

[Sociobiology]

You failed the poe test, my friend

As in Poe's Law?

Oh, I'm quite serious about what I've said...

I think he is talking about himself being a parody of a fundamentalist and not a real one. Although as per Poe's "law" asking someone else to distinguish whether you are one or the other is equally fallacious.

[Amorgas]

Yet no one can prove that God exists or doesn't exist. So really this thread is for people to come here and make fun of each other. Or in other words, hey let's go make fun of Christians because that's the only religion I know how to criticize.

So, by not immediately embracing your suggestion that both creationism and evolution might be valid and that "God" might have created science, we're Christianity-bashing, are we? Gosh, I'm sure no one wanted to do that.

You didn't read all of the responses to me not picking a religion? So, when I was talking about this thread in general, did you just immediately think I was talking to just you?

[Tokos]

WRT God - extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Hence the demands to prove it.

[Sociobiology]

Yet no one can prove that God exists or doesn't exist. So really this thread is for people to come here and make fun of each other. Or in other words, hey let's go make fun of Christians because that's the only religion I know how to criticize.

I can offer evidence against 99% of the gods I have ever been presented with, the rest are unfalsifiable. I have to this date only been presented with the gods of 6 different religions, don't blame us if you guys never come up with new arguments.

[Farnhamia]

So, by not immediately embracing your suggestion that both creationism and evolution might be valid and that "God" might have created science, we're Christianity-bashing, are we? Gosh, I'm sure no one wanted to do that.

You didn't read all of the responses to me not picking a religion? So, when I was talking about this thread in general, did you just immediately think I was talking to just you?

I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion, considering that I said "we" and not "I." You came in, asked, "Why cant it be both?" I answered that by saying that only one is science, you asked why couldn't God have created science, I asked which god, you said you weren't going to pick one, other folks picked up on that ... Nope, I'm pretty sure I'm not under any illusion that you and I are having a private conversation, or that I have badly misunderstood you.

[Avenio]

uh no, that is only true of Bilateria. Echinoderms, Mollusks, Cnidaria, and archeobacteria all use different genetic coding for their eyes.
but that eyes are painfully simple to evolve is true. All you need is one light sensitive protein (which there are dozens in your average human, several in the liver) even a light sensitive spot, no good for anything except being able to detect night vs day, is a huge advantage.

I was under the impression that the basic proteins involved in photoreception (The opsins) were common to all life with eyes; I was referring to the basic genetic machinery that operates that particular set of functions.

similarities alone is not evidence, the fact that those similarities follow a predictable and organized pattern IS evidence for interrelationship (evolution).

Which is what I was getting at; I was trying to put it into more colloquial terms for him/her.

yea the miller is only taught by inept teachers, the experiment has been refuted ny dozens of experiments using more accurate data that yeilded BETTER RESULTS. most recently the Gerland/ Sutherland experiment which created RNA from naturally occuring material. the problem it turns out was that other experiments were not starting with simple enough precursors, in other words you have to start with simpler molecules to make make the experiment work.

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/ ... cleotides/
Synthesis of activated pyrimidine ribonucleotides in prebiotically plausible conditions Matthew W. Powner, Beatrice Gerland & John D. Sutherland. Nature, Vol. 460, May 13, 2009.

I'll repeat that because it is important
To create the complex molecules of life, previous experiments were starting with goo that was too complex, and that is why they failed

To clarify my point (In case it wasn't clear) I was saying that the Miller-Urey experiment has its place being taught as part of the history of the theories surrounding abiogenesis (It marks a step in our understanding of the processes involved) and as a stepping stone to explain the other, more modern experiments (Like the Bohr model).

At least, that's how it was taught to me in highschool, and my teacher was hardly 'inept'.

stop helping you don't know enough, the peppered moth experiment was crap, the experimenter never really did any experiments, not that it matters because the peppered moth was never used as proof for evolution by the scientific community just the textbook publishers.

try this for reading material, its a very useful site.
http://evolution.berkeley.edu/

Huh. Didn't know that, thanks. Though I don't think the 'stop helping' bit was really necessary.

[Amorgas]

Yet no one can prove that God exists or doesn't exist. So really this thread is for people to come here and make fun of each other. Or in other words, hey let's go make fun of Christians because that's the only religion I know how to criticize.

I can offer evidence against 99% of the gods I have ever been presented with, the rest are unfalsifiable. I have to this date only been presented with the gods of 6 different religions, don't blame us if you guys never come up with new arguments.

Wait, you have proof that god doesn't exist? Like, real hard facts proving God doesn't exist? Oh, please share. Because I don't think the rest of the world has heard it.

As far as your "evidence" goes, I'd just call them opinions.

[Amorgas]

You didn't read all of the responses to me not picking a religion? So, when I was talking about this thread in general, did you just immediately think I was talking to just you?

I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion, considering that I said "we" and not "I." You came in, asked, "Why cant it be both?" I answered that by saying that only one is science, you asked why couldn't God have created science, I asked which god, you said you weren't going to pick one, other folks picked up on that ... Nope, I'm pretty sure I'm not under any illusion that you and I are having a private conversation, or that I have badly misunderstood you.

I didn't have to specify on what religion I was thinking of. Yet, people still assumed I was talking about Christianity and that I believed in it.

[Farnhamia]

I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion, considering that I said "we" and not "I." You came in, asked, "Why cant it be both?" I answered that by saying that only one is science, you asked why couldn't God have created science, I asked which god, you said you weren't going to pick one, other folks picked up on that ... Nope, I'm pretty sure I'm not under any illusion that you and I are having a private conversation, or that I have badly misunderstood you.

I didn't have to specify on what religion I was thinking of. Yet, people still assumed I was talking about Christianity and that I believed in it.

Christianity is sort of the default value for religion in a Western setting.

[Sociobiology]

I can offer evidence against 99% of the gods I have ever been presented with, the rest are unfalsifiable. I have to this date only been presented with the gods of 6 different religions, don't blame us if you guys never come up with new arguments.

Wait, you have proof that god doesn't exist? Like, real hard facts proving God doesn't exist? Oh, please share. Because I don't think the rest of the world has heard it.

As far as your "evidence" goes, I'd just call them opinions.

present me with a god, with a definition, including their influence, if he/she/it has/had any, on the universe, life, humanity, ect.
like I have said before "god" is such an amorphous term that it requires a definition for logical discussion.
This also cuts down on the "thats not the kind of god I'm talking about" game.

[FREEaquaticdancelesson]

I present you an alternative to both evolution AND creationism!

MATRIXISM. No, not Marxism MATRIXISM. Yes, you see, we were never "created" in the sense you're all thinking, we're really just in a computer simulation run by robots who feed off of our body energy to power themselves because we blocked out the sun hundreds of years ago.

Look around you neo, you are the one.

THERE IS NO SPOON!

[Sociobiology]

I present you an alternative to both evolution AND creationism!

MATRIXISM. No, not Marxism MATRIXISM. Yes, you see, we were never "created" in the sense you're all thinking, we're really just in a computer simulation run by robots who feed off of our body energy to power themselves because we blocked out the sun hundreds of years ago.

Look around you neo, you are the one.

THERE IS NO SPOON!

sorry to burst you bubble but you are not special.

[FREEaquaticdancelesson]

I present you an alternative to both evolution AND creationism!

MATRIXISM. No, not Marxism MATRIXISM. Yes, you see, we were never "created" in the sense you're all thinking, we're really just in a computer simulation run by robots who feed off of our body energy to power themselves because we blocked out the sun hundreds of years ago.

Look around you neo, you are the one.

THERE IS NO SPOON!

sorry to burst you bubble but you are not special.

Lol, BUT THE MOVIE, uh, I mean.... my ANCIENT BOOK said I was!

What evidence do you have that we're NOT in the matrix? HUH? HUH?!!

That's RIGHT.

[Norstal]

I can offer evidence against 99% of the gods I have ever been presented with, the rest are unfalsifiable. I have to this date only been presented with the gods of 6 different religions, don't blame us if you guys never come up with new arguments.

Wait, you have proof that god doesn't exist? Like, real hard facts proving God doesn't exist? Oh, please share. Because I don't think the rest of the world has heard it.

As far as your "evidence" goes, I'd just call them opinions.

How do I prove Frodo is real? Or Mordor? Or Hogwarts? Or Edward the Shiny Vampire?

[Amorgas]

sorry to burst you bubble but you are not special.

Lol, BUT THE MOVIE, uh, I mean.... my ANCIENT BOOK said I was!

What evidence do you have that we're NOT in the matrix? HUH? HUH?!!

That's RIGHT.

Your sarcasm has the right idea. It sounds stupid but you just can't prove it wrong or right, whether you believe it or not.

[Norstal]

sorry to burst you bubble but you are not special.

Lol, BUT THE MOVIE, uh, I mean.... my ANCIENT BOOK said I was!

What evidence do you have that we're NOT in the matrix? HUH? HUH?!!

That's RIGHT.

Shut up or I'll delete you. >:)

[Norstal]

Lol, BUT THE MOVIE, uh, I mean.... my ANCIENT BOOK said I was!

What evidence do you have that we're NOT in the matrix? HUH? HUH?!!

That's RIGHT.

Your sarcasm has the right idea. It sounds stupid but you just can't prove it wrong.

Oh excellent.

I'm starting the Church of the Fonz. Who wants to come with me? Fonzie was a real person I tell you what.

[DaWoad]

Your sarcasm has the right idea. It sounds stupid but you just can't prove it wrong.

Oh excellent.

I'm starting the Church of the Fonz. Who wants to come with me? Fonzie was a real person I tell you what.

ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Amorgas]

Your sarcasm has the right idea. It sounds stupid but you just can't prove it wrong.

Oh excellent.

I'm starting the Church of the Fonz. Who wants to come with me? Fonzie was a real person I tell you what.

YOUR RELIGION'S STUPID!!! .....................................................but I can't prove it wrong. BUT YOU CAN'T PROVE IT RIGHT! HA!

See how dumb this sounds guys.... (Being a hypocrite, yes)

[Norstal]

Oh excellent.

I'm starting the Church of the Fonz. Who wants to come with me? Fonzie was a real person I tell you what.

YOUR RELIGION'S STUPID!!! .....................................................but I can't prove it wrong. BUT YOU CAN'T PROVE IT RIGHT! HA!

See how dumb this sounds guys.... (Being a hypocrite, yes)

See how you used a hypocritical argument to attack mine? Your irrationality is showing, once again.

[DaWoad]

Oh excellent.

I'm starting the Church of the Fonz. Who wants to come with me? Fonzie was a real person I tell you what.

YOUR RELIGION'S STUPID!!! .....................................................but I can't prove it wrong. BUT YOU CAN'T PROVE IT RIGHT! HA!

See how dumb this sounds guys.... (Being a hypocrite, yes)

that's just ... silly. Aside from the caps, all you've managed to do is regurgitate a very simplistic version of what it is to be a skeptic. As in, "I don't believe in things that have no proof, you have no proof to support your religion, therefore I don't believe in your religion". It doesn't sound dumb, you've tried to make it sound dumb, but that's about it.

[Abdju]

You failed the poe test, my friend

As in Poe's Law?

Oh, I'm quite serious about what I've said...

Sorry, I do apologise for that. It was so far out there I thought it was satire... My bad.

[Amorgas]

YOUR RELIGION'S STUPID!!! .....................................................but I can't prove it wrong. BUT YOU CAN'T PROVE IT RIGHT! HA!

See how dumb this sounds guys.... (Being a hypocrite, yes)

See how you used a hypocritical argument to attack mine? Your irrationality is showing, once again.

I wasn't attacking you. I was simply calling my earlier argument stupid and this general argument dumb. There's no point in trying to prove to someone that something either exists or doesn't exists, whether that person thinks it's stupid or not. Because you're not going to get anywhere.

I'm willing to call myself a hypocrite, are you?

[Abdju]

Yet no one can prove that God exists or doesn't exist. So really this thread is for people to come here and make fun of each other. Or in other words, hey let's go make fun of Christians because that's the only religion I know how to criticize.

I can offer evidence against 99% of the gods I have ever been presented with, the rest are unfalsifiable. I have to this date only been presented with the gods of 6 different religions, don't blame us if you guys never come up with new arguments.

Meh. I could give you some interesting stuff to debate, but TBQH watching Christians get kicked around is more fun