SD wants to endrun Roe v Wade by legalizing murder of docs

[Geniasis]

When did I say it was murder?

Dude, I'm an atheist.

Also who says the fetus would be female?
No one. English, imperfect language as it is, lacks a neuter personal pronoun for the third person singular.

Roeder was only tangentially related to the pro-life movement (through a post on an open forum), and every pro-life organization I know of decried his actions. Though I'm not likely to do much outdoor activism; I'm more of a behind-the-scenes guy.

It's homicide. Murder, by definition, is illegal.

Somebody trying to deny they said something. Troll.

You should also start supporting women's rights.

Seriously? The word is "it".

Many pro-lifers also support such actions.

To be fair, he was explaining why he considered homicide and not murder, which I had erroneously assumed a few posts earlier. He did not, in fact, call it murder.

[Nulono]

When did I say it was murder?

Dude, I'm an atheist.

Also who says the fetus would be female?
No one. English, imperfect language as it is, lacks a neuter personal pronoun for the third person singular.

Roeder was only tangentially related to the pro-life movement (through a post on an open forum), and every pro-life organization I know of decried his actions. Though I'm not likely to do much outdoor activism; I'm more of a behind-the-scenes guy.

It's homicide. Murder, by definition, is illegal.

Somebody trying to deny they said something. Troll.

You should also start supporting women's rights.

Seriously? The word is "it".

Many pro-lifers also support such actions.

1. I explicitly said it wasn't murder.
2. I support the rights of all women, born or unborn.
3. "It" is for objects and items, not human beings.
4. Not mainstream ones. Every group has its crazies.

[Wiztopia]

Somebody trying to deny they said something. Troll.

You should also start supporting women's rights.

Seriously? The word is "it".

Many pro-lifers also support such actions.

1. I explicitly said it wasn't murder.
2. I support the rights of all women, born or unborn.
3. "It" is for objects and items, not human beings.
4. Not mainstream ones. Every group has its crazies.

Lets break it down for you so you can stop your bullshit likes. "It's homicide. Murder, by definition, is illegal.

No you don't. If you did then you would support abortion.

It has always been allowed to be used for humans.

Bullshit again. You're forgetting what happened in North Carolina with Eric Robert Rudolph.

[Geniasis]

Lets break it down for you so you can stop your bullshit likes. "It's homicide. Murder, by definition, is illegal.

Context is vital here. I asked him if it was murder and he said no, I asked him what he thought it was. You quoted his response. Let's parse the sentence.

Statement: It's homicide.

^This is an answer to my question. He considers it homicide.

Statement: Murder, by definition, is illegal.

^The reason he considers it homicide, and not murder, is because murder is illegal.

Abortion is not illegal. Therefore abortion is not murder. Therefore, he considers it to be homicide.

There are legitimate counters to his view. This is not one of them.

[Nulono]

1. I explicitly said it wasn't murder.
2. I support the rights of all women, born or unborn.
3. "It" is for objects and items, not human beings.
4. Not mainstream ones. Every group has its crazies.

Lets break it down for you so you can stop your bullshit likes. "It's homicide. Murder, by definition, is illegal.

No you don't. If you did then you would support abortion.

It has always been allowed to be used for humans.

Bullshit again. You're forgetting what happened in North Carolina with Eric Robert Rudolph.

1. Gee, way to fail at reading punctuation. Those are two separate sentences, hence the period.
2. I support the right to live. There is no right to kill.
3. I was under the impression that "it" was considered dehumanizing.
4. I'm not familiar with that. Could you fill me in? The pro-lifers I know are against violence.

[Wiztopia]

Lets break it down for you so you can stop your bullshit likes. "It's homicide. Murder, by definition, is illegal.

No you don't. If you did then you would support abortion.

It has always been allowed to be used for humans.

Bullshit again. You're forgetting what happened in North Carolina with Eric Robert Rudolph.

1. Gee, way to fail at reading punctuation. Those are two separate sentences, hence the period.
2. I support the right to live. There is no right to kill.
3. I was under the impression that "it" was considered dehumanizing.
4. I'm not familiar with that. Could you fill me in? The pro-lifers I know are against violence.

Tell that to soldiers killing other soldiers. Also abortion is a right.

Since when is it dehumanizing?

The people who hid him away after he bombed an abortion clinic.

[Caninope]

No.

Damn. I was expecting you to give the other answer. I had a wall-of-text ready to go and everything.

So what is it then? According to you, it's killing a person.

But it's still not murder, regardless. Murder is a legal term, as is person.

[Caninope]

It's homicide. Murder, by definition, is illegal.

Somebody trying to deny they said something. Troll.

Something can be homicide without being murder. lrn2law

[Caninope]

Since when is it dehumanizing?

"It" is dehumanizing when it is applied to human beings. If I called all Chinese people "its," that would be dehumanizing, no?

[Wiztopia]

Since when is it dehumanizing?

"It" is dehumanizing when it is applied to human beings. If I called all Chinese people "its," that would be dehumanizing, no?

Calling something you don't know what gender "it" is not dehumanizing at all.

[There is no cow level]

You know in the 1800's the catholic church supported early term abortions, and defined life as being able to survive outside the womb.

[Dyakovo]

You don't need to be "autonomous" to have rights.

If it doesn't kill women then it doesn't kill people, because men aren't going to be taking it.

False dichotomy.

What about it is false?

[The Nuclear Fist]

The world wouldn't be nearly so amusing without America.

Indeed. Honestly, its like watching a bigger, democratic, prosperous North Korea run around.

[Nulono]

1. Gee, way to fail at reading punctuation. Those are two separate sentences, hence the period.
2. I support the right to live. There is no right to kill.
3. I was under the impression that "it" was considered dehumanizing.
4. I'm not familiar with that. Could you fill me in? The pro-lifers I know are against violence.

Tell that to soldiers killing other soldiers. Also abortion is a right.

Since when is it dehumanizing?

The people who hid him away after he bombed an abortion clinic.

1a. Wrong thing to say to an extremist pacifist.
1b. Is not.
2. That's what I've always heard. So you wouldn't object to being called "it"?
3. Then those people were pricks.

Damn. I was expecting you to give the other answer. I had a wall-of-text ready to go and everything.

So what is it then? According to you, it's killing a person.

But it's still not murder, regardless. Murder is a legal term, as is person.

"Person" can also be a philosophical or ethical term.

"It" is dehumanizing when it is applied to human beings. If I called all Chinese people "its," that would be dehumanizing, no?

Calling something you don't know what gender "it" is not dehumanizing at all.

Calling someone "it", however, is.

You know in the 1800's the catholic church supported early term abortions, and defined life as being able to survive outside the womb.

So?

You don't need to be "autonomous" to have rights.


False dichotomy.

What about it is false?

Not all people are men or women. There are boys and girls.

[Wiztopia]

1a. Wrong thing to say to an extremist pacifist.
1b. Is not.
2. That's what I've always heard. So you wouldn't object to being called "it"?
3. Then those people were pricks.

Then you must be one of those people who think soldiers are murderers. It quite is.

You don't get it. Calling something "it" when you don't know what gender they are is not dehumanizing at all.

[Nulono]

1a. Wrong thing to say to an extremist pacifist.
1b. Is not.
2. That's what I've always heard. So you wouldn't object to being called "it"?
3. Then those people were pricks.

Then you must be one of those people who think soldiers are murderers. It quite is.

You don't get it. Calling something "it" when you don't know what gender they are is not dehumanizing at all.

1a. See my comment on murder versus homicide. But yes, I detest soldiers.
1b. Is not!
2. Calling someONE "it", however, IS dehumanizing. But that's off-topic.

[Dyakovo]

What about it is false?

Not all people are men or women. There are boys and girls.

Boy and girls (like men) won't be taking it either. So, your pedantry is pointless.

[Dyakovo]

You don't get it. Calling something "it" when you don't know what gender they are is not dehumanizing at all.

2. Calling someONE "it", however, IS dehumanizing. But that's off-topic.

You should try reading.

[Nulono]

Not all people are men or women. There are boys and girls.

Boy and girls (like men) won't be taking it either. So, your pedantry is pointless.

They WILL be killed by it, however. That's the point.

2. Calling someONE "it", however, IS dehumanizing. But that's off-topic.

You should try reading.

Someone versus something.

[Dyakovo]

Boy and girls (like men) won't be taking it either. So, your pedantry is pointless.

They WILL be killed by it, however. That's the point.

No, they won't.

male child

female child

a young person of either sex
a human offspring (son or daughter) of any age

To be a child and thus a boy or a girl you have to have been born.
RU-486 terminates a pregnancy, preventing a birth. No child is killed.

[Nulono]

a young person of either sex
a human offspring (son or daughter) of any age

Right before that is this:

a. An unborn infant; a fetus.
b. An infant; a baby.

And while I'm at it:

(fē'təs) Pronunciation Key
The unborn offspring of a mammal at the later stages of its development, especially a human from eight weeks after fertilization to its birth. In a fetus, all major body organs are present.

fetal adjective

[Bottle]

I honestly can't bear to read through the recent pages to see how far this thread has wandered from the actual subject (hint: threats against the lives of women and doctors), but I wanted to post to share this:

http://thehairpin.com/2011/03/ask-an-abortion-provider/

It's a piece written by an abortion provider. Maybe it will help put a human face on the people who are the target of anti-choice terrorism.

[Nulono]

I honestly can't bear to read through the recent pages to see how far this thread has wandered from the actual subject (hint: threats against the lives of women and doctors), but I wanted to post to share this:

http://thehairpin.com/2011/03/ask-an-abortion-provider/

It's a piece written by an abortion provider. Maybe it will help put a human face on the people who are the target of anti-choice terrorism.

Dude, I don't know anyone who supports violence against abortionists.

[Geniasis]

Dude, I don't know anyone who supports violence against abortionists.

It would only be people who truly believe the rhetoric being spouted.

[Nulono]

Dude, I don't know anyone who supports violence against abortionists.

It would only be people who truly believe the rhetoric being spouted.

Right, never heard that one before. "You're wrong because you don't believe what you say because you don't fit my stereotypes."

I just love how if we support violence we're dangerous nutbags who shouldn't be taken seriously, and if we don't we're hypocrites who don't believe what we say and shouldn't be taken seriously. Anything to avoid actually considering our points, 'eh?