Constantinople or Istanbul what do you call it?

[Rethymnon]

hmm...seems I will have to revise my knowledge on Russian history. Well I guess it is somewhat important that Russians still have Moscow.

[Farnhamia]

hmm...seems I will have to revise my knowledge on Russian history. Well I guess it is somewhat important that Russians still have Moscow.

Oh, sure, I mean, what would Russia be without Moscow?

[Khyrta]

Yeeeeeaaaahhhhh........I still call it Constantinople. For whatever reason.....I have no clue. Everyone else in my family says Istanbul, but eh.. I still call it Constantinople

[Farnhamia]

Yeeeeeaaaahhhhh........I still call it Constantinople. For whatever reason.....I have no clue. Everyone else in my family says Istanbul, but eh.. I still call it Constantinople

I'm not worried, you'll grow out of that rebelliousness, find a nice girl and settle down, join the family business.

[Brauzillia]

Constantinople was Christian
Istanbul is easier to say and it's Muslim

[Coccygia]

I dunno. Why does (the former Soviet republic of) Georgia insist on being called Georgia when they call themselves Sakartvelo? It would be a lot less confusing.

So your argument is that countries have one name in one language and another name in another? I'm pretty sure that the country in question decded to be known officially as Georgia in the English-speaking world.

Just like Turkey decided that its city name is Istanbul.

First off: I do not have an argument because I am not arguing. I woulda thought prefacing my remarks witn "I dunno" might have been a hint in that direction.
Georgia insists on having everybody call it the Republic of Georgia. But that's not what they call themselves, as I point out, nor does the name "Georgia" have anything to do with anybody named "George" (unlike the US state, named after King George of England - somebody with a better knowledge of history can tell me which one); it's a phonetic accident, coming from the Turkish (I think) name, Jurja. WHAT I'M SAYIN' IS IT DON'T MAKE NO SENSE! So why does anybody think what any country calls itself or is called by others should make any freakin' sense??

[Unilisia]

I was born in Istanbul and I've been living here since then. AND I've never been able to understand this thing at all. Resisting on using a former name looks nothing more than being childish.

No, the infindels named it Istanbul

That was a rather ignorant comment towards a Turkish citizen.

[Coccygia]

No, the infindels named it Istanbul

That was a rather ignorant comment towards a Turkish citizen.

Are infindels anything like Zinfandels?

[Unilisia]

That was a rather ignorant comment towards a Turkish citizen.

Are infindels anything like Zinfandels?

Err, I don't think so. Being called an infidel is an insult.

[Farnhamia]

Are infindels anything like Zinfandels?

Err, I don't think so. Being called an infidel is an insult.

Some zinfandels are an insult, too, to the palate.

[NERVUN]

So your argument is that countries have one name in one language and another name in another? I'm pretty sure that the country in question decded to be known officially as Georgia in the English-speaking world.

Just like Turkey decided that its city name is Istanbul.

First off: I do not have an argument because I am not arguing. I woulda thought prefacing my remarks witn "I dunno" might have been a hint in that direction.
Georgia insists on having everybody call it the Republic of Georgia. But that's not what they call themselves, as I point out, nor does the name "Georgia" have anything to do with anybody named "George" (unlike the US state, named after King George of England - somebody with a better knowledge of history can tell me which one); it's a phonetic accident, coming from the Turkish (I think) name, Jurja. WHAT I'M SAYIN' IS IT DON'T MAKE NO SENSE! So why does anybody think what any country calls itself or is called by others should make any freakin' sense??

Of course place names don't make any sense. And I say this living in a country that has one of its names being an English bastardization of a Portuguese name that was corupted from a Chinese word used by Malay traders and has nothing at all to do with how it is actually said in Japanese.

[Farnhamia]

First off: I do not have an argument because I am not arguing. I woulda thought prefacing my remarks witn "I dunno" might have been a hint in that direction.
Georgia insists on having everybody call it the Republic of Georgia. But that's not what they call themselves, as I point out, nor does the name "Georgia" have anything to do with anybody named "George" (unlike the US state, named after King George of England - somebody with a better knowledge of history can tell me which one); it's a phonetic accident, coming from the Turkish (I think) name, Jurja. WHAT I'M SAYIN' IS IT DON'T MAKE NO SENSE! So why does anybody think what any country calls itself or is called by others should make any freakin' sense??

Of course place names don't make any sense. And I say this living in a country that has one of its names being an English bastardization of a Portuguese name that was corupted from a Chinese word used by Malay traders and has nothing at all to do with how it is actually said in Japanese.

I did not know that.

The Armenians call themselves Hay (prounced "high") their country Hayk' or Hayastan. And my Sumerians called themselves ùĝ saĝ gíg-ga, "the black-headed people," and their land Ki-en-gir, "the land of the civilized lords." *sighs nostalgically* "Sumer" is the Akkadian word, may their asses never foal.

[Valanora]

I use all three depending upon the context of the conversation, though I do favor Constantinople in just general conversation as it sounds better to me.

[Geniasis]

Of course place names don't make any sense. And I say this living in a country that has one of its names being an English bastardization of a Portuguese name that was corupted from a Chinese word used by Malay traders and has nothing at all to do with how it is actually said in Japanese.

I did not know that.

The Armenians call themselves Hay (prounced "high") their country Hayk' or Hayastan. And my Sumerians called themselves ùĝ saĝ gíg-ga, "the black-headed people," and their land Ki-en-gir, "the land of the civilized lords." *sighs nostalgically* "Sumer" is the Akkadian word, may their asses never foal.

Hey, my ass foals plenty! Especially when I eat at Taco Bell.

[The Archregimancy]

Funny how everyone seems to want to be the Heir of Rome, isn't it?

Sultanate of Rûm tried it a few centuries before, too. And who wouldn't want to be Rome, what with all their fancy robes and circuses and stuff.

There's even a technical term for the phenomenon: the translatio imperii, the concept that the universal sovereignty of the Roman Empire transferred itself naturally upon a successor. This was particularly important among those states (notably the Byzantine, Russian, and Holy Roman Empires) that - at least in theory - projected the ideal of a single universal state in symposium with a single universal church; an extension, if you will, of the original Constantinian foundation of Christianity as the Imperial church that didn't fully die until the Russian Revolution and the abdication of Charles Hapsburg removed the last two emperors drawing their title on any vestige of the translatio imperii.

But it helps to explain why Byzantine Emperors were insisting on the theoretical universality of their state and church when the state comprised little more than a city, why Holy Roman Emperors were claiming that they ruled a revived Roman Empire as late as 1806, why the title of 'Third Rome' was so important to the Muscovites, and why so many in Europe were shocked when Napoleon crowned himself 'Emperor' in the presence of the Pope when there was still in theory a Christian Roman Emperor in the West.

The First World War didn't just destroy the basis for European imperial monarchies, it also killed off a concept of 'Christendom' that had been the hypothetical basis for church-state relations across much of Europe - even in Bismarck's majority Protestant German Reich - since Constantine I.

[NERVUN]

Sultanate of Rûm tried it a few centuries before, too. And who wouldn't want to be Rome, what with all their fancy robes and circuses and stuff.

There's even a technical term for the phenomenon: the translatio imperii, the concept that the universal sovereignty of the Roman Empire transferred itself naturally upon a successor. This was particularly important among those states (notably the Byzantine, Russian, and Holy Roman Empires) that - at least in theory - projected the ideal of a single universal state in symposium with a single universal church; an extension, if you will, of the original Constantinian foundation of Christianity as the Imperial church that didn't fully die until the Russian Revolution and the abdication of Charles Hapsburg removed the last two emperors drawing their title on any vestige of the translatio imperii.

But it helps to explain why Byzantine Emperors were insisting on the theoretical universality of their state and church when the state comprised little more than a city, why Holy Roman Emperors were claiming that they ruled a revived Roman Empire as late as 1806, why the title of 'Third Rome' was so important to the Muscovites, and why so many in Europe were shocked when Napoleon crowned himself 'Emperor' in the presence of the Pope when there was still in theory a Christian Roman Emperor in the West.

The First World War didn't just destroy the basis for European imperial monarchies, it also killed off a concept of 'Christendom' that had been the hypothetical basis for church-state relations across much of Europe - even in Bismarck's majority Protestant German Reich - since Constantine I.

And oddly enough, it still lives, though not directly of course, in the only remaining emperor. When the Japanese were deciding on the English equivalent of what reads 天皇 (Heavenly sovereign), they sure as heck were not going to let the Russian Empire claim that the Czar (Caesar) was higher on the totem pole.

[Coccygia]

First off: I do not have an argument because I am not arguing. I woulda thought prefacing my remarks witn "I dunno" might have been a hint in that direction.
Georgia insists on having everybody call it the Republic of Georgia. But that's not what they call themselves, as I point out, nor does the name "Georgia" have anything to do with anybody named "George" (unlike the US state, named after King George of England - somebody with a better knowledge of history can tell me which one); it's a phonetic accident, coming from the Turkish (I think) name, Jurja. WHAT I'M SAYIN' IS IT DON'T MAKE NO SENSE! So why does anybody think what any country calls itself or is called by others should make any freakin' sense??

Of course place names don't make any sense. And I say this living in a country that has one of its names being an English bastardization of a Portuguese name that was corupted from a Chinese word used by Malay traders and has nothing at all to do with how it is actually said in Japanese.

Would that be Japan?

I might also have mentioned China itself, which has not called itself anything like that since the fall of the Qin dynasty (Qin>China) ca. 200 BC, if it ever even did. As no doubt you know, it calls itself Jongguo, the Middle Kingdom (in the middle between Heaven and us barbarians, that is, not the middle of the Earth) and the people (and anything else Chinese) are Han, after the dynasty that succeeded the Qin. The term Qin was used for China because, I guess, that's when Greek traders first encountered China (or else the Qin emperor insisted on the term).

[NERVUN]

Of course place names don't make any sense. And I say this living in a country that has one of its names being an English bastardization of a Portuguese name that was corupted from a Chinese word used by Malay traders and has nothing at all to do with how it is actually said in Japanese.

Would that be Japan?

I might also have mentioned China itself, which has not called itself anything like that since the fall of the Qin dynasty (Qin>China) ca. 200 BC, if it ever even did. As no doubt you know, it calls itself Jongguo, the Middle Kingdom (in the middle between Heaven and us barbarians, that is, not the middle of the Earth) and the people (and anything else Chinese) are Han, after the dynasty that succeeded the Qin. The term Qin was used for China because, I guess, that's when Greek traders first encountered China (or else the Qin emperor insisted on the term).

It would be Japan indeed. The Japanese use Nihon or Nippon. And yes, China is also a country where the English/International name is nowhere close to what it is in its own language(s) (Given that Chinese only exists in the fevered imaginations of the CCP).

[SD_Film Artists]

Constantinople, but only because I've played too much Medieval 2 and seen The Muppets.

[Kalaspia-Shimarata]

Would that be Japan?

I might also have mentioned China itself, which has not called itself anything like that since the fall of the Qin dynasty (Qin>China) ca. 200 BC, if it ever even did. As no doubt you know, it calls itself Jongguo, the Middle Kingdom (in the middle between Heaven and us barbarians, that is, not the middle of the Earth) and the people (and anything else Chinese) are Han, after the dynasty that succeeded the Qin. The term Qin was used for China because, I guess, that's when Greek traders first encountered China (or else the Qin emperor insisted on the term).

It would be Japan indeed. The Japanese use Nihon or Nippon. And yes, China is also a country where the English/International name is nowhere close to what it is in its own language(s) (Given that Chinese only exists in the fevered imaginations of the CCP).

Same with Greece. The Greek name for Greece is Ellada

[Kalaspia-Shimarata]

You can see what I call it from my flag!

[Rolamec]

You can see what I call it from my flag!

Istanbul?

[Kalaspia-Shimarata]

You can see what I call it from my flag!

Istanbul?

No, Constantinople!

[Rolamec]

Istanbul?

No, Constantinople!

So not Istanbul?

[Kalaspia-Shimarata]

No, Constantinople!

So not Istanbul?

No!