Democracy vs Realpolitik: Where do you stand?

[Tahar Joblis]

OK, I can see that the democracy options have been gaining ground lately.

What's odd to me is the enormous gap between military autocrats and theocrats, both oppressive; was I incautious in wording the question, or do y'all really think that the two are fundamentally different in terms of their utility or morality?

[Mosasauria]

Shouldn't there be an all of the above option?

[New Manvir]

My country must be doing something really horrible to get the first two options so hostile towards us.

[Mosasauria]

My country must be doing something really horrible to get the first two options so hostile towards us.

Apparently so.

[Tahar Joblis]

Shouldn't there be an all of the above option?

Given that you can check six boxes, it's not that hard to vote for all of them.

[Rolamec]

Realpolitik is a type of foreign policy. Democracy is a political system.

I don't see why the two are mutually exclusive.

^This.

[Mollux]

Realpolitik is a type of foreign policy. Democracy is a political system.

I don't see why the two are mutually exclusive.

^This.

Situations arise, though, where one or the other must be chosen. The point is to force you to evaluate which is more important.

[Minotzia]

Obviously, this topic has connections to the news; less obviously, this topic ALWAYS has connections to the news, in case you weren't paying attention.

I'm guessing it's supposed to be a thinly veiled caricature of Mubarak..? It's definitely going to be bad if Egypt successfully ousts him and all of his influence from their government; the MB is going to have a field day.

[Genivar]

Still isn't really balance. Why is there no option, for example, for a fully functioning democracy which is totally apathetic and neutral towards your country? Y'know, considering this is the stance of a majority of countries in the world.

Because then the answer to 99% of this forum is obvious.

The question is basically asking which you prioritise: Freedom for people in other countries or security for your own nation.

It's meant to make you think.

Or heres a thought, those countries that don't abuse their peoples civil rights and keep their nose out of other other countries business have few enemies.
You don't need to install a dictatorship to have security, in fact I think revolution would be MORE likely in a autocratic state.

[Rolamec]

^This.

Situations arise, though, where one or the other must be chosen. The point is to force you to evaluate which is more important.

Then it should be idealism versus realpolitik, as democracy could be one form of idealism (it could be human rights, free elections, etc.).

[Rolamec]

Because then the answer to 99% of this forum is obvious.

The question is basically asking which you prioritise: Freedom for people in other countries or security for your own nation.

It's meant to make you think.

Or heres a thought, those countries that don't abuse their peoples civil rights and keep their nose out of other other countries business have few enemies.
You don't need to install a dictatorship to have security, in fact I think revolution would be MORE likely in a autocratic state.

But that's not how the world works, if it wasn't the US, it would be China and if it wasn't China, it would be Russia and so on. You'd be returning to the days of old where you had 5-6 empires, constantly struggling against one another, breaking our in wars frequently, sometimes small, sometimes larger...

[Norstal]

Nazi oppressive theocratic oligarchy practising the Mugabe school of economics.

Hey, I want 1 trillion Zimbabwean dollars on my bank account.

I just like large numbers actually.

[Rolamec]

Nazi oppressive theocratic oligarchy practising the Mugabe school of economics.

Hey, I want 1 trillion Zimbabwean dollars on my bank account.

I just like large numbers actually.

*Gives you $5 american dollars.*

[Norstal]

Hey, I want 1 trillion Zimbabwean dollars on my bank account.

I just like large numbers actually.

*Gives you $5 american dollars.*

Here's your change!

*Gives $4 back.*

[Hathradic States]

States which are in favor of my nation would be supported by me, along with those who go against my enemies.

Example:

Nazi Germany: So long as they kept giving the Soviets trouble
Mubarak's Egypt: Keeps oil cheaper

Overthrow:
France: They do not seem to like American interest

[Rolamec]

*Gives you $5 american dollars.*

Here's your change!

*Gives $4 back.*

this amuses me a drunk guy so

[Genivar]

States which are in favor of my nation would be supported by me, along with those who go against my enemies.

Example:

Nazi Germany: So long as they kept giving the Soviets trouble
Mubarak's Egypt: Keeps oil cheaper

Overthrow:
France: They do not seem to like American interest

Sounds like another country I know.

[Brutland and Norden]

Pancakes. Yum.

Seriously? That depends on my state. If my state is an oppressive authoritarian dictatorship, a hostile democratic country may get my support. My RL country stands at #3: "A somewhat friendly (mostly neutral, really) state whose elections and government are marred by widespread fraud and corruption, respectively, while dissidents and reformers frequently "disappear."

[Hathradic States]

States which are in favor of my nation would be supported by me, along with those who go against my enemies.

Example:

Nazi Germany: So long as they kept giving the Soviets trouble
Mubarak's Egypt: Keeps oil cheaper

Overthrow:
France: They do not seem to like American interest

Sounds like another country I know.

WHich one?

[Genivar]

Sounds like another country I know.

WHich one?

Mine, America.

[Rolamec]

WHich one?

Mine, America.

Of course....

[Minotzia]

WHich one?

Mine, America.

Ehhh... Not quite. Obama's pushing to get Mubarak out, we supported the Soviets against the Nazis, and I've never heard of an American plot to overthrow France. Seems like a dumb idea, really.

[Hathradic States]

WHich one?

Mine, America.

Pfft. America wishes it had a leader with the balls I have.

[Rolamec]

Mine, America.

Pfft. America wishes it had a leader with the balls I have.

Well Obama is black, so good chance they're probably bigger.

[Minotzia]

Pfft. America wishes it had a leader with the balls I have.

Well Obama is black, so good chance they're probably bigger.

OHHHH SNAP!