Gay and Christian

[Ravenvalles]

Of course, I also think you should be a reasonable human being in the first place, recognize that the Bible - whether or not it was divinely inspired - was written, edited, and compiled by normal, fallible men, with all their politics and their bias and their non-divine interests, and use your own judgment in deciding which bits of it actually sound like something a god worth worshiping would say.

What you describe is spirit lead grace. many of us believe this way. We accept science too. However, the ones that get the most notice are the ones that do the stupid, ignorant, or just plain evil things in the name of Christ. Westboro comes to mind.

[Ceannairceach]

Why do you wear 'boys' clothing?

Because if I wore girls clothing I'd look like a freak?

No you wouldn't. Some people or some cultures might think so, but objectively, you would look like a man wearing, as society has deemed it, 'woman's clothing'.

[South East Europe]

I'm Catholic. I believe that sex is intended by God to be vaginal

I'm a transsexual, so does that mean that if I get an operation to have a vagina then its okay?

[Gagatron]

No, I think they were known for being naked behind their cloaks.

Bullshit. Once again, you demonstrate your astonishing lack of anything to do with women. Do you really think women went around "dripping on the ground while walking"? But wait ... you aren't even 16 yet. Why do I think you have any idea about how the adult world works, or did work, even 3,000 years ago?

Oh yeah, who was known for being naked under whose cloaks?

I refuse to talk to you until you treat me with dignity.

[Gagatron]

Because if I wore girls clothing I'd look like a freak?

No you wouldn't. Some people or some cultures might think so, but objectively, you would look like a man wearing, as society has deemed it, 'woman's clothing'.

I see myself as a male. I don't see it reasonable to wear clothing that was not made for me, or my kind. I have no desire to do things socially recognized as being female behaviors. And I believe it's okay to follow society's constructs, in most cases.

[South East Europe]

Because if I wore girls clothing I'd look like a freak?

Thanks for calling me a freak, I really appreciate it. Oh, by the way, being transsexual is so much more than just a biological male wearing girls clothing. I also live and identify as a female.

[Gagatron]

Because if I wore girls clothing I'd look like a freak?

Thanks for calling me a freak, I really appreciate it. Oh, by the way, being transsexual is so much more than just a biological male wearing girls clothing. I also live and identify as a female.

I wasn't calling you a freak. I was stating that *I* would look like a freak if I wore girls' clothing.

[Ceannairceach]

No you wouldn't. Some people or some cultures might think so, but objectively, you would look like a man wearing, as society has deemed it, 'woman's clothing'.

I see myself as a male. I don't see it reasonable to wear clothing that was not made for me, or my kind. I have no desire to do things socially recognized as being female behaviors. And I believe it's okay to follow society's constructs, in most cases.

There in lies the idea. You see yourself as a male, and therefore wear clothes that help you identify yourself as a male. However, transsexuals identify as of the female gender. Therefore, they wear clothes that help them identify as such. Some might not be inclined to change sex entirely, but the idea is they feel more comfortable in clothes made for women, as you feel more comfortable in clothing made for men.

[South East Europe]

I see myself as a male. I don't see it reasonable to wear clothing that was not made for me, or my kind. I have no desire to do things socially recognized as being female behaviors. And I believe it's okay to follow society's constructs, in most cases.

So you don't understand the transsexual rights movement because you aren't a transsexual and are simply unwilling to make an attempt at understanding what a transsexual is.

[Ravenvalles]

First, there has to be one person who is responsible for making the final decision in any household.

No, there doesn't. You can act like adults and reach a consensus.

Second, it is tempered by the statement to love your wife as Christ loved the church.

That is SO not "tempering" it. That passage is one of the creepiest things ever. I adore my boyfriend, but my relationship with him is not even remotely comparable to humans' relationship with an omnipotent, omniscient god. He's just a guy. He's a wonderful guy, but he is not the guiding, all-powerful deity to my frail, fallible humanity. Ick.

The needs of men and women are different. A man craves respect, a woman craves love. If done right this satisfies both.

Most people actually like both in a relationship - go figure! The idea that women somehow don't want to be respected by their partners is sick, and the idea that men don't want to be loved is, if anything, even sicker.

Anything written by Paul concerning the relationships of men and women has to be taken with a grain of salt. Many scolars believe that he was probably latent homosexual (non-practicing), and a bit of a misogynist.

No kidding.

What if one doesn't live in a perfect world and a consensus of two cannot be met?

The symbolism is obviously wasted on you.

I did not say that men do not crave love, and women do not crave respect. In most cases my statement would be what men and women would choose first. That has been proven time and time again.

[Ceannairceach]

I did not say that men do not crave love, and women do not crave respect. In most cases my statement would be what men and women would choose first. That has been proven time and time again.

Source?

[Eskandapolis]

I'm Catholic. I believe that sex is intended by God to be vaginal

I'm a transsexual, so does that mean that if I get an operation to have a vagina then its okay?

I'm a Catholic, and I don't see what's the big deal (having to do w/ religion) if your brain gender isnt the same as your bio physiology. There's religion, but there is science also

[South East Europe]

There in lies the idea. You see yourself as a male, and therefore wear clothes that help you identify yourself as a male. However, transsexuals identify as of the female gender. Therefore, they wear clothes that help them identify as such. Some might not be inclined to change sex entirely, but the idea is they feel more comfortable in clothes made for women, as you feel more comfortable in clothing made for men.

Well, gender and sex are different. My gender doesnt have to match my sex, its perfectly okay for a female to have a penis.

[Ceannairceach]

There in lies the idea. You see yourself as a male, and therefore wear clothes that help you identify yourself as a male. However, transsexuals identify as of the female gender. Therefore, they wear clothes that help them identify as such. Some might not be inclined to change sex entirely, but the idea is they feel more comfortable in clothes made for women, as you feel more comfortable in clothing made for men.

Well, gender and sex are different. My gender doesnt have to match my sex, its perfectly okay for a female to have a penis.

I know. I was simply pointing this out for the sake of preemptively answering the question "Well why don't they change sex, then?"

[South East Europe]

I'm a transsexual, so does that mean that if I get an operation to have a vagina then its okay?

I'm a Catholic, and I don't see what's the big deal (having to do w/ religion) if your brain gender isnt the same as your bio physiology. There's religion, but there is science also

Well, is it okay if I retain my penis then?

[South East Europe]

I know. I was simply pointing this out for the sake of preemptively answering the question "Well why don't they change sex, then?"

Ah, I see. Sorry.

[Gagatron]

I see myself as a male. I don't see it reasonable to wear clothing that was not made for me, or my kind. I have no desire to do things socially recognized as being female behaviors. And I believe it's okay to follow society's constructs, in most cases.

There in lies the idea. You see yourself as a male, and therefore wear clothes that help you identify yourself as a male. However, transsexuals identify as of the female gender. Therefore, they wear clothes that help them identify as such. Some might not be inclined to change sex entirely, but the idea is they feel more comfortable in clothes made for women, as you feel more comfortable in clothing made for men.

But why would you see yourself as something you're not? Your sex is what you're given when you're born. I've often wished I was Asian, but I'm not. Does that mean I should change my race?

[Eskandapolis]

There in lies the idea. You see yourself as a male, and therefore wear clothes that help you identify yourself as a male. However, transsexuals identify as of the female gender. Therefore, they wear clothes that help them identify as such. Some might not be inclined to change sex entirely, but the idea is they feel more comfortable in clothes made for women, as you feel more comfortable in clothing made for men.

But why would you see yourself as something you're not? Your sex is what you're given when you're born. I've often wished I was Asian, but I'm not. Does that mean I should change my race?

Hey if Michael Jackson did, why can't you?

[Ceannairceach]

There in lies the idea. You see yourself as a male, and therefore wear clothes that help you identify yourself as a male. However, transsexuals identify as of the female gender. Therefore, they wear clothes that help them identify as such. Some might not be inclined to change sex entirely, but the idea is they feel more comfortable in clothes made for women, as you feel more comfortable in clothing made for men.

But why would you see yourself as something you're not? Your sex is what you're given when you're born. I've often wished I was Asian, but I'm not. Does that mean I should change my race?

Micheal Jackson did it, why can't you?
Transsexualism has to do with your mind. "A man trapped in a womans body". You feel like a woman, you act like a woman, you want to be a woman, you like 'woman' things... Consensus? You must be a woman. They think of themselves as a woman, just... Not in the right body, one might say. And sex and gender are different. Sex is what you biologically are. Gender is what you see yourself as, or what you think you should be.

[Ravenvalles]

I did not say that men do not crave love, and women do not crave respect. In most cases my statement would be what men and women would choose first. That has been proven time and time again.

Source?

Start with: Love & Respect: The Love She Most Desires; The Respect He Desperately Needs by Emerson Eggerichs

[Eskandapolis]

I'm a Catholic, and I don't see what's the big deal (having to do w/ religion) if your brain gender isnt the same as your bio physiology. There's religion, but there is science also

Well, is it okay if I retain my penis then?

i couldnt care less

[South East Europe]

But why would you see yourself as something you're not? Your sex is what you're given when you're born. I've often wished I was Asian, but I'm not. Does that mean I should change my race?

Gender is also what you're given when you are born. Knowing that my gender is female is very different from wishing that your race is Asian. You are trying to compare two entirely different subjects here.

[Gagatron]

But why would you see yourself as something you're not? Your sex is what you're given when you're born. I've often wished I was Asian, but I'm not. Does that mean I should change my race?

Gender is also what you're given when you are born. Knowing that my gender is female is very different from wishing that your race is Asian. You are trying to compare two entirely different subjects here.

No, gender is a social construct, it is nurture over nature.

[Greater American Union]

gender is a social construct

[United Dependencies]

No, gender is a social construct, it is nurture over nature.

I'm sure then that you have the necessary studies and psychological reports that show that then?