NationStates

New Manvir wrote:

Santa Claus (or "Klaus" as he's known to his East German handlers) is the code name of one Kris Kringle, nationality and age unknown, who operates as a spy for the Soviet Union. Claus presents an image of himself as a philanthropist and humanitarian, however new evidence suggests that he operates a gulag-like labour camp somewhere in the high arctic. Claus is suspected of employing slave labour in the construction of hidden surveillance equipment disguised as children's toys. He keeps his operation going by running a very effective propaganda campaign that has enamoured countless children and adults with his ideology. In reality Claus is an unabashed communist who is actively working with the Soviet Union and other communist nations to subvert the capitalist system of the United States and other Western democracies.

Claus' ingenious plan involves bankrupting American industry by mass producing consumer goods with the use of slave labour. In addition to this, he targets the children of high ranking diplomats and other civil servants with surveillance equipment in order to pass sensitive data to foreign government agencies. When this proves ineffective Claus is known to break into the homes and offices of government officials using chimneys and other ventilation systems. How he accomplishes this is still unknown.

Claus is known to be in the company of fierce and possibly rabid animals that he uses for protection. His main means of conveyance seems to be a sleigh that flies. Again, how he accomplishes such a feat is unknown, but it seems he lacks any sort of stealth technology as he is consistently spotted by NORAD on an annual basis. Claus' use of slave labour is well documented by the testimony of escaped prisoners. Prisoners are deliberately malnourished in an attempt to lower their stature and make escape increasingly difficult. The prisoners are frequently known as E.L.V.E.S., what the acronym stands for is currently unknown.

Claus presents a clear and present danger to the United States and it's allies, as well as current world stability and hegemony. He constantly flouts international air travel regulations and hundreds of other laws. In addition to this Claus frequently wears a red uniform to represent his communist beliefs.

Very nice.

I can't believe that Mr. Claus wasn't eliminated in the 50's, him being a communist and all.

SaintB wrote:

Menschenverstand wrote:Christmas is a holiday celebrated in honor of the birth of our Savior, Jesus Christ. Why anyone would want to fight that is beyond me. It's a part of the whole religious freedom deal. If you're against freedom of religion and believe that you are the only person on Earth who could possibly be right, you have some overlooking of your life to get to.

people are fighting having someone else's opinion and beliefs shoved down their throat, they are fighting being looked down on when they say happy Hanukkah, they are fighting being treated unfairly because their own holidays aren't Christmas.

They aren't fighting Christmas.

Having other's religious beliefs would, indeed, be a problem, but I've not seen it happen yet. It's broadcasted loudly, but that's because people are proud of it. They're just celebrating. Any attempt to force one into a religion would be closer to the "Crusaders" or "Muslim Conquest of Asia" side of the scale, rather than hanging lights, decorating trees, caroling, church services, etc.

As a side note, the Christians who scream about other's religion being broadcasted are probably sheltered, pasty-white people who live in California and wear slacks on the weekends.

The Nuclear Fist wrote:As a Jew, I believe that (if there was such a thing), it would most likely be a war on Hanukkah. Going with historical evidance at least.

However, I don't particularly care about one's religious beliefs.

To be fair, Hanukkah is actually not all that important a holiday in Judaism. Certainly not to the extent that Christmas is to Christianity.

OuroborosCobra wrote:

The Nuclear Fist wrote:As a Jew, I believe that (if there was such a thing), it would most likely be a war on Hanukkah. Going with historical evidance at least.

However, I don't particularly care about one's religious beliefs.

To be fair, Hanukkah is actually not all that important a holiday in Judaism. Certainly not to the extent that Christmas is to Christianity.

It became important to Jewish children who wondered why they weren't getting presents when everyone else was. Because of this it became important to their parents. They real meaning has become secondary to a newer issue - allowing Jewish children to fit in with their non-Jewish peers.

Menschenverstand wrote:As a side note, the Christians who scream about other's religion being broadcasted are probably sheltered, pasty-white people who live in California and wear slacks on the weekends.

Sheltered and pasty white, yes, but more likely from Kansas, Texas and Oklahoma. Most Californians are politically correct, easily led, pseudo-liberals who like to spend other people's money and who come all over conservative when someone scares them with "teh ebil gayz". (please note, this is not all Californians, just most).

Imsogone wrote:

OuroborosCobra wrote:To be fair, Hanukkah is actually not all that important a holiday in Judaism. Certainly not to the extent that Christmas is to Christianity.

It became important to Jewish children who wondered why they weren't getting presents when everyone else was. Because of this it became important to their parents. They real meaning has become secondary to a newer issue - allowing Jewish children to fit in with their non-Jewish peers.

...which still doesn't make it important to Judaism.

I'd also point out that as an avenue of bringing "normality" with Christian peers, it doesn't work that well. Hanukkah rarely actually coincides with Christmas. Take this year, Hanukkah ended almost two weeks ago, and we're still a week out from Christmas. Jewish kids won't be getting gifts on Christmas unless their parents are giving them Christmas gifts. As a child growing up, I was still "different" during the Christmas time of year, whether I got presents on Hanukkah or not.

Annoyingly (in terms of the gift giving Hanukkah tradition), we already had a holiday with a tradition of gift giving similar to that of Christmas. Purim. Also, Purim is an all around more fun holiday than anything I've seen out of Christianity

Journal Entry

Battle of Mistletoe, Day 11

We've secured fortifications near a choke point in near the town of Yule, but I fear that it won't be long until Dawkins' troops break our line and force our withdrawal into Mistletoe itself. Even then, continuous hard candy shelling and TOW missiles have already caused enough damage to the city to make it nigh uninhabitable - Tiny Tim himself would all but decry the conditions!

Dawkins' elite units, called the Militant Atheists... they have been the real force of reckoning in this fight. Our light truffels and throwing candy canes have been completely ineffective against their onslaught; hundreds, nay, thousands have died from the hateful bile they spew! Even our most powerful weapon - the deadly fruitcake - has merely dented their nigh-impenetrable armor of Evil.

Whatever hopes we have left lie with Master Cringle. He is the only one of us aptly equipped to take on this insidious enemy. Some say that only one man cannot possibly win in the face of such an overpowering army - but all we need is one man! A Leader, A Figher... Our Savior!


My one hope is that I survive this War on Christmas long enough for my family to see what I saw.

My regards,
Silent Night

OuroborosCobra wrote:

Imsogone wrote:
It became important to Jewish children who wondered why they weren't getting presents when everyone else was. Because of this it became important to their parents. They real meaning has become secondary to a newer issue - allowing Jewish children to fit in with their non-Jewish peers.

...which still doesn't make it important to Judaism.

I'd also point out that as an avenue of bringing "normality" with Christian peers, it doesn't work that well. Hanukkah rarely actually coincides with Christmas. Take this year, Hanukkah ended almost two weeks ago, and we're still a week out from Christmas. Jewish kids won't be getting gifts on Christmas unless their parents are giving them Christmas gifts. As a child growing up, I was still "different" during the Christmas time of year, whether I got presents on Hanukkah or not.

Annoyingly (in terms of the gift giving Hanukkah tradition), we already had a holiday with a tradition of gift giving similar to that of Christmas. Purim. Also, Purim is an all around more fun holiday than anything I've seen out of Christianity

At least you weren't as different as Jehovah's Witnesses. My family was atheist/agnostic and that's how I was raised - we celebrated Christmas and Easter as secular festivals. As far as I could see, the Jewish kids in my school celebrated holidays and festivals, just at different times and for different reasons - it was no big deal. But the JW kids - they didn't say the pledge of allegiance, they didn't celebrate anything, not even Thanksgiving. I found this, when I was a kid, weird and kind of creepy. Now I just find it sad.

Christmahanikwanzikah wrote:Journal Entry

+1000

Glenn Beck: We're at war. Nobody wants to admit it, but Christmas is under attack. One very specific man might be the only thing that stands between Christmas, and the greatest threat of Christianity's brief existence.

Rudolph: Santa!

Sarah Palin: The Atheists are still out there. If we lose Santa, Christmas might well follow.

Richard Dawkins: I WILL SHOW YOU TRUE POWER

Glenn Beck:We need a leader, and surround them with the brightest, the toughest... the deadliest allies we can find.

Santa: Jesus!

Michael Steele: Take the fight to the Atheists in person... looking forward to the action.

Sean Hannity: Attacking the Atheists would require understanding the Bill of Rights, no Evangelical has ever returned from doing so.

Glenn Beck: The team will have to be strong, their resolve unquestionable.

Santa: We have to give everything, even if that means our lives. We will stop at nothing. We will fight for the Saved.

Mass Effect 2 The War on Christmas.

Geniasis wrote:

Christmahanikwanzikah wrote:Journal Entry

+1000

Glenn Beck: We're at war. Nobody wants to admit it, but Christmas is under attack. One very specific man might be the only thing that stands between Christmas, and the greatest threat of Christianity's brief existence.

Rudolph: Santa!

Sarah Palin: The Atheists are still out there. If we lose Santa, Christmas might well follow.

Richard Dawkins: I WILL SHOW YOU TRUE POWER

Glenn Beck:We need a leader, and surround them with the brightest, the toughest... the deadliest allies we can find.

Santa: Jesus!

Michael Steele: Take the fight to the Atheists in person... looking forward to the action.

Sean Hannity: Attacking the Atheists would require understanding the Bill of Rights, no Evangelical has ever returned from doing so.

Glenn Beck: The team will have to be strong, their resolve unquestionable.

Santa: We have to give everything, even if that means our lives. We will stop at nothing. We will fight for the Saved.

Mass Effect 2 The War on Christmas.

If I could make models like those ones from the Christmas specials from my childhood I would totally do skit with that script with Christmased up versions of those people in it.


I get a red line under Christmased, OMG Firefox is at war with Christmas!

Imsogone wrote:

OuroborosCobra wrote:...which still doesn't make it important to Judaism.

I'd also point out that as an avenue of bringing "normality" with Christian peers, it doesn't work that well. Hanukkah rarely actually coincides with Christmas. Take this year, Hanukkah ended almost two weeks ago, and we're still a week out from Christmas. Jewish kids won't be getting gifts on Christmas unless their parents are giving them Christmas gifts. As a child growing up, I was still "different" during the Christmas time of year, whether I got presents on Hanukkah or not.

Annoyingly (in terms of the gift giving Hanukkah tradition), we already had a holiday with a tradition of gift giving similar to that of Christmas. Purim. Also, Purim is an all around more fun holiday than anything I've seen out of Christianity

At least you weren't as different as Jehovah's Witnesses. My family was atheist/agnostic and that's how I was raised - we celebrated Christmas and Easter as secular festivals. As far as I could see, the Jewish kids in my school celebrated holidays and festivals, just at different times and for different reasons - it was no big deal. But the JW kids - they didn't say the pledge of allegiance, they didn't celebrate anything, not even Thanksgiving. I found this, when I was a kid, weird and kind of creepy. Now I just find it sad.

Yeah, I'll freely admit that for the most part (there are some notable exceptions that I won't get into right now) my Judaism hasn't caused me many problems. I'm probably the first generation of my family in the United States who can say that, all of my ancestors had things happen such as schools refusing them because of Jewish limiting quotas, teachers intentionally giving them poor grades after finding out their grandfather was a Jewish community leader, getting curbstomped by some "unfriendly people," etc. Almost all I had was that sometimes some there'd be curious questioning from the other kids in school, but not much beyond that.

That is with people who actually know I'm Jewish. I've had some very interesting experiences with what people would say to me about Jews before they knew I was Jewish...

One funny thing I remember from my childhood was that I knew very early on that there was no Santa Claus, but made a conscious effort through early elementary school not to ruin it for my Christian friends.

OuroborosCobra wrote:One funny thing I remember from my childhood was that I knew very early on that there was no Santa Claus, but made a conscious effort through early elementary school not to ruin it for my Christian friends.

That's why Jews have no imagination!

I am totally NOT serious.

SaintB wrote:

OuroborosCobra wrote:One funny thing I remember from my childhood was that I knew very early on that there was no Santa Claus, but made a conscious effort through early elementary school not to ruin it for my Christian friends.

That's why Jews have no imagination!

I am totally NOT serious.

My parents had me believing in the Jon Lovitz "Hanukkah Harry" for a few years, actually

Okay, here I am, on the soapbox. It is that damned time of year (again, for the two thousand tenth time), but what happened to the War on Christmas? I am going to create the 2nd War on Christmas, by...

- Proving that Santa doesn't exist at all
- 8 decades history provided by Coca-Cola that will be dismissed in a minute, or so
- What should constitute a Christmas Movie
- That if even if Santa does exist, his HQ will be somewhere else
- What Christmas really means
- And the conclusion

First off, from the beginning, we followed the propaganda that Coca-Cola propagated sometime in the 1930's, that Santa Claus does exist. While he may exist (like Sinterklaas), the modern form was made by Coca-Cola, and since then, we followed that he lives in the North Pole (if you live in the Nordic countries, change it to where your equivalent of where Santa makes his gifts), with elves to make gifts 364 days a year (365 on leap years), preparing for a special night where he travels around the world to deliver gifts. First off, that is impossible, since it will require him to go twice the speed of light, and he could not go through that many chimneys at that time. Where does the gifts come from? Other people, and how are they delivered? By mailman who sneak in on Christmas Eve, delivering gifts, and leaving the house, all silent. You may say it is Santa, but it is mailman. But where do you get that damned lump of coal that you get every so often? From your nearest coal mine. And reindeer cannot fly! Reindeer flying happens as often as when a pig sprouts wings.

Until the 1930's, Santa's were usually skinny, but when Coca-Cola made a prominent image, of an obese man who leads the Elves, it was stuck. Oh, sure, there was an illustration, but it is Coca-Cola that finally stuck that into your mind, and made his image prominent. His flying reindeer was mentioned, and, you may not know it, but according to Wikipedia, the song, "Rudolph, the red nosed reindeer," was composed by a Montgomery Wards copywriter. Next up...

What a Christmas movie should mention two of the following things. A star, an angel, a manger, 3 wise men, baby Jesus, Mary (Jesus' mother), gold, frankincense and myrrh, not about Santa. So far, no movie (maybe a few) that I know, except Veggietales has that concept. Instead, they use what Coca-Cola taught them, spread throughout the generations, and so that people would keep believing in Santa, when we all know he doesn't exist, just to "get their hopes" up. Honestly, every movie that portrays Santa Claus (except Fred Claus, and the Santa Claus trilogy) has him as a Mary Sue, just in the guy package.

Even if Santa did exist, his headquarters would be somewhere else, because unlike Antarctica (or any other continent, for that matter), all Arctic has is water, islands and a sheet of ice. It is really easy to prove, and you can say that is why Santa doesn't exist. His HQ would most likely be at the South Pole, but because there is no sign of workshops of Santa, it is false, but Santa could be anywhere. Coming up next...

Christmas means the birthday of Jesus Christ, the son of God, who arrived through virginal birth by his mother, Mary. It was gods will that made Jesus come to exist, and did he come on Christmas Day, in the fields near Bethlehem, in a manger. As such, it was why God chose Jesus, and spread the teachings of Christianity, and for years, it was like that, but nowadays, it is so secular that if you aren't Christian, you can celebrate Christmas, either by following the path of Coca-Cola, or converting to Christianity. It is your choice, but Christmas is the birthday of Jesus Christ, not Muhammad, not Santa Claus (after all, who would give gifts away on their own birthday, eh?), not David, just Jesus. If it were another prophet's birthday, another religion would claim Christmas, but because Jesus was born on that day, it is a gift of Christianity. Everyone has a birthday, and Jesus' birthday was on December 25th, and was met with celebration throughout Judea. And for the conclusion...

To conclude this topic, I hope you would understand why we need to stop ourselves in believing Santa Claus, proving he doesn't exist, history made by Coca-Cola, why we should stop following the propaganda, to understand the true meaning of geography and Christmas. Besides, to conclude my view, as a farmer whose only source is FOX News and church, Arctic and Christmas, unless in the Christian kind, DO NOT MIX. It is like mixing Pop Rocks and a soft drink, you will have a 95/5 chance in your stomach exploding. Kind of... And that ends my views. Now, express yours.

Nobody cares. With the world in an economic recession, culture wars are so 90s. Seriously dude, get over yourself. And have a fucking Merry Christmas!

Or ... we could just leave well enough alone, and let folks celebrate what they like, how they like, and not go out of our way to spoil other people's harmless enjoyment of things, for whatever reasons they may have.

Just a thought.

Goodness, aren't we the determined little killjoy.

Seriously, go watch a football match and get smashed like the rest of us do.

Mike the Progressive wrote:Nobody cares. With the world in an economic recession, culture wars are so 90s. Seriously dude, get over yourself. And have a fucking Merry Christmas!

Thanks for that, but we are getting out of the recession, and it is fun to start a debate over Xmas.

Dread Lady Nathicana wrote:Or ... we could just leave well enough alone, and let folks celebrate what they like, how they like, and not go out of our way to spoil other people's harmless enjoyment of things, for whatever reasons they may have.

Just a thought.

I understand, I don't mean to offend anyone, but we need a debate. A really long one, over Christmas, and that OP is my actual views.

Katganistan wrote:Goodness, aren't we the determined little killjoy.

Seriously, go watch a football match and get smashed like the rest of us do.

I do, it is called "Soccer," in these parts.

Syvorji wrote:

Mike the Progressive wrote:Nobody cares. With the world in an economic recession, culture wars are so 90s. Seriously dude, get over yourself. And have a fucking Merry Christmas!

Thanks for that, but we are getting out of the recession, and it is fun to start a debate over Xmas.

Dread Lady Nathicana wrote:Or ... we could just leave well enough alone, and let folks celebrate what they like, how they like, and not go out of our way to spoil other people's harmless enjoyment of things, for whatever reasons they may have.

Just a thought.

I understand, I don't mean to offend anyone, but we need a debate. A really long one, over Christmas, and that OP is my actual views.

Katganistan wrote:Goodness, aren't we the determined little killjoy.

Seriously, go watch a football match and get smashed like the rest of us do.

I do, it is called "Soccer," in these parts.

Well your calling it the wrong thing aren't you?

Horsefish wrote:

Syvorji wrote:
Thanks for that, but we are getting out of the recession, and it is fun to start a debate over Xmas.



I understand, I don't mean to offend anyone, but we need a debate. A really long one, over Christmas, and that OP is my actual views.



I do, it is called "Soccer," in these parts.

Well your calling it the wrong thing aren't you?

Well, I am from the USA, I am a farmer whose only source is church and FOX News, so it is soccer, eh?

P.S. Why did you merge my thread? Really, you might as well make a mega-thread.

Syvorji wrote: First off, from the beginning, we followed the propaganda that Coca-Cola propagated sometime in the 1930's, that Santa Claus does exist. While he may exist (like Sinterklaas), the modern form was made by Coca-Cola, and since then, we followed that he lives in the North Pole (if you live in the Nordic countries, change it to where your equivalent of where Santa makes his gifts), with elves to make gifts 364 days a year (365 on leap years), preparing for a special night where he travels around the world to deliver gifts. First off, that is impossible, since it will require him to go twice the speed of light, and he could not go through that many chimneys at that time. Where does the gifts come from? Other people, and how are they delivered? By mailman who sneak in on Christmas Eve, delivering gifts, and leaving the house, all silent. You may say it is Santa, but it is mailman. But where do you get that damned lump of coal that you get every so often? From your nearest coal mine. And reindeer cannot fly! Reindeer flying happens as often as when a pig sprouts wings.

Who says the reindeer have to fly and Santa goes through chimneys? It's just silly Americans who lack basic knowledge in physics due to their crappy education system.

Syvorji wrote:Even if Santa did exist, his headquarters would be somewhere else, because unlike Antarctica (or any other continent, for that matter), all Arctic has is water, islands and a sheet of ice. It is really easy to prove, and you can say that is why Santa doesn't exist. His HQ would most likely be at the South Pole, but because there is no sign of workshops of Santa, it is false, but Santa could be anywhere. Coming up next...

The reason for the whole North Pole belief is that, again due to their crappy education system, Americans think anything north of the Arctic Circle is North Pole. Santa lives at Korvatunturi, and yes, that's inside the Arctic Circle and also on continent.

Syvorji wrote:Christmas means the birthday of Jesus Christ, the son of God, who arrived through virginal birth by his mother, Mary. It was gods will that made Jesus come to exist, and did he come on Christmas Day, in the fields near Bethlehem, in a manger. As such, it was why God chose Jesus, and spread the teachings of Christianity, and for years, it was like that, but nowadays, it is so secular that if you aren't Christian, you can celebrate Christmas, either by following the path of Coca-Cola, or converting to Christianity. It is your choice, but Christmas is the birthday of Jesus Christ, not Muhammad, not Santa Claus (after all, who would give gifts away on their own birthday, eh?), not David, just Jesus. If it were another prophet's birthday, another religion would claim Christmas, but because Jesus was born on that day, it is a gift of Christianity. Everyone has a birthday, and Jesus' birthday was on December 25th, and was met with celebration throughout Judea. And for the conclusion...

If it was Jesus' birthday, why is Santa giving out presents to everyone except Jesus himself? At least 'round these parts birthday presents are given to those whose birthday it is.

The thing is, it predates Christianity.

Sebytania wrote:-snip-

Well, many portrayals show him as having flying reindeer and going down chimneys, and what I meant when describing the Arctic was most of the places north of the Arctic circle are islands, water and sheets of ice. And why would Santa not give presents to Jesus? Because he has met God years ago. And the fact it predates Christianity is just liberal propaganda, it was developed by none other than Jesus himself. If you don't believe me, do not look it up on any source except church and FOX News and my statement will be true.

Syvorji wrote:

Sebytania wrote:-snip-

Well, many portrayals show him as having flying reindeer and going down chimneys, and what I meant when describing the Arctic was most of the places north of the Arctic circle are islands, water and sheets of ice. And why would Santa not give presents to Jesus? Because he has met God years ago. And the fact it predates Christianity is just liberal propaganda, it was developed by none other than Jesus himself. If you don't believe me, do not look it up on any source except church and FOX News and my statement will be true.

According to my Church, Jesus does acid. Thus, the flying reindeers.