Legal Right to die

[Servantium]

It doesn't have to be negative.

Suicide is always negative.

The rest of that sentence should be: "...in my opinion."

[The Scandinvans]

I actually heard a person say all doctors should be required to give euthanasia themselves to willing individuals...

I facepalmed in response.

As for the topic at hand. I should not be a legal offense nor should it be covered by national finances or unwilling insurance companies.

[Eireann Fae]

It doesn't have to be negative.

Suicide is always negative.

Well that's just, like, your opinion, man. I prefer to call it the beginning of an unlife :)

Or the end of a useless ugly bag of mostly water. Or an end to suffering in general. Buddhists can see it as the beginning of their next life :D

There's lots of ways to look at suicide. Open your eyes a little. It's not inherently 'negative'.

[Eireann Fae]

I actually heard a person say all doctors should be required to give euthanasia themselves to willing individuals...

I facepalmed in response.

As for the topic at hand. I should not be a legal offense nor should it be covered by national finances or unwilling insurance companies.

I wouldn't force doctors to do it, but I wouldn't stop the ones that want to offer the service.

[Urcea]

Well that's just, like, your opinion, man. I prefer to call it the beginning of an unlife

Or the end of a useless ugly bag of mostly water. Or an end to suffering in general. Buddhists can see it as the beginning of their next life

There's lots of ways to look at suicide. Open your eyes a little. It's not inherently 'negative'.

The effect of a suicide on those who knew the person is, frankly, indescribable. In addition, it's shameful, in my opinion; you've been given this life, no matter atheist, Christian, or otherwise; it's a shame to let this opportunity go to waste.

[Servantium]

I actually heard a person say all doctors should be required to give euthanasia themselves to willing individuals...

I facepalmed in response.

As for the topic at hand. I should not be a legal offense nor should it be covered by national finances or unwilling insurance companies.

I wouldn't force doctors to do it, but I wouldn't stop the ones that want to offer the service.

If it were legal hospitals would probably have a "euthanasia team" that does everybody.

[UCUMAY]

I know the is no "right to die" in the states. I live in USA. Deplorable is an opinion (your opinion). Please present something with fact like the aftermath when someone invokes the right to die.

So you're going to argue suicide is a positive?

I'm arguing right to choice. Sucide and death for that matter only harm those left behind. So my humble opinion is regardless whether it's right, wrong, or indifferent I should be able to do with my body what I please. Whether it's pierce my ears, get a tattoo, or asking for help in dying.

My personal opinion (which is up to debate) and my life experience (which is not) help form these. I have been both chronically (physically) ill, and mental ill so I can say this from experience if I were to crop up with some autoimmune like Lupus, or MS. I would prefer to DIE than to live that life again (because of the health issues). So yes for me if that were to happen to me it would be positive. Because I would be a drain on the medical profession with no easy options, or ways out. I would have the choices to be so immune deprieved that I have no quality of life, or let the MS/lupus ravage me. Again my personal viewpoint and situation. Your's I'm sure is different.

[Mike the Progressive]

I don't think so, unless they are terminally ill or sick beyond any point of saving and will just instead suffer.

[UCUMAY]

The right to die seems to have the same three stigmas all the other major social issues do. I'm (uncomfortable, against my religion, don't like it ect.), I (agree, accept, understand, feel) people should have more (rights, freedoms, self-ownership), or what's wrong with the way it is now...

[Norstal]

Oic, an MD like you should've told me first hand that all cancer is a disease of the mind.

It's not, but I don't see what the difference is, as I was talking with bottle before.

Cancer is painful, and, in some cases, incurable. In those cases, people will writhe in pain until they die.

Depression is painful, and, in some cases, incurable. In those cases, the person will writhe in pain until they die.

What's the difference?

No, really Galloism. I wish a qualified MD told me that bone cancer and lung cancer somehow affects the brain the way Major Depressive Disorder does.

The difference between cancer (except brain cancer) and depression is that it affects the brain. And we just talked about that some depressed patients can't make sound judgement. What I'm aiming is at is whether a depressive patient can make sound judgement or not and that we can't tell the difference.

Cancer patients (again, who doesn't have brain cancer) is able to choose whether they want to live or not because they're able to. Depressed patients can't because they have a mental disorder. Not to mention the medicine that they're taking can cause the suicide themselves. So, no, treatment-resistant depression patients who wants to suicide should not be allowed to be given euthanasia.

[Norstal]

According to you they should.

No? Doctors do have the power to control the life of their patients.

I'm starting to think you're a hermit to think that's the way things work.

Fortunately you're an anonymous internet troll and not a medical professional.

Says the person who lurks on a forum late at night.

[Galloism]

It's not, but I don't see what the difference is, as I was talking with bottle before.

Cancer is painful, and, in some cases, incurable. In those cases, people will writhe in pain until they die.

Depression is painful, and, in some cases, incurable. In those cases, the person will writhe in pain until they die.

What's the difference?

No, really Galloism. I wish a qualified MD told me that bone cancer and lung cancer somehow affects the brain the way Major Depressive Disorder does.

Constant unrelenting incurable pain often affects the brain. I'm not sure the way the two different kinds of pain affect the brain, identically or not, but if you don't think that constant unrelenting affects the brain, I don't know what to tell you.

The difference between cancer (except brain cancer) and depression is that it affects the brain. And we just talked about that some depressed patients can't make sound judgement. What I'm aiming is at is whether a depressive patient can make sound judgement or not and that we can't tell the difference.

We can't? Then why do we let them drive vehicles, operate gas appliances, and cross the street on their own? The reason is that we recognize some (most) depressed people as capable of making sound decisions. Hell, in most cases, they choose their own doctors, and can accept or reject medications at their discretion.

See, in some cases, these things are restricted, because we are capable of telling whether a person is competent to make decisions. Those that are get to go on with their lives and make decisions about it. Those that can't get committed. See?

Cancer patients (again, who doesn't have brain cancer) is able to choose whether they want to live or not because they're able to. Depressed patients can't because they have a mental disorder. Not to mention the medicine that they're taking can cause the suicide themselves. So, no, treatment-resistant depression patients who wants to suicide should not be allowed to be given euthanasia.

Demonstrate, please, that all depressed persons are incapable of making sound decisions. It seems we don't treat them that way, except regarding this one particular issue.

[Galloism]

According to you they should.

No? Doctors do have the power to control the life of their patients.

No, actually they don't, except in very rare circumstances.

If a patient is conscious and cognizant, he may refuse any treatment at any time for any reason, and if the doctor proceeds, it's at the very least malpractice, if not battery.

If the patient has a medical power of attorney, and the doctor acts against its instructions while the patient is unconscious, it's battery.

If the patient has previously refused a treatment, and the doctor does it after he is incapacitated, without getting consent from the patient's medical representative, it's battery.

Are we getting the picture?

[Norstal]

No, really Galloism. I wish a qualified MD told me that bone cancer and lung cancer somehow affects the brain the way Major Depressive Disorder does.

Constant unrelenting incurable pain often affects the brain. I'm not sure the way the two different kinds of pain affect the brain, identically or not, but if you don't think that constant unrelenting affects the brain, I don't know what to tell you.

The difference between cancer (except brain cancer) and depression is that it affects the brain. And we just talked about that some depressed patients can't make sound judgement. What I'm aiming is at is whether a depressive patient can make sound judgement or not and that we can't tell the difference.

We can't? Then why do we let them drive vehicles, operate gas appliances, and cross the street on their own? The reason is that we recognize some (most) depressed people as capable of making sound decisions. Hell, in most cases, they choose their own doctors, and can accept or reject medications at their discretion.

See, in some cases, these things are restricted, because we are capable of telling whether a person is competent to make decisions. Those that are get to go on with their lives and make decisions about it. Those that can't get committed. See?

Cancer patients (again, who doesn't have brain cancer) is able to choose whether they want to live or not because they're able to. Depressed patients can't because they have a mental disorder. Not to mention the medicine that they're taking can cause the suicide themselves. So, no, treatment-resistant depression patients who wants to suicide should not be allowed to be given euthanasia.

Demonstrate, please, that all depressed persons are incapable of making sound decisions. It seems we don't treat them that way, except regarding this one particular issue.

Tbh, if everyone makes good points like you, I would've concede a long time ago. Instead, what I got was facepalms and accusations of me trolling.

But, I can see where you're coming from now.

[Galloism]

Constant unrelenting incurable pain often affects the brain. I'm not sure the way the two different kinds of pain affect the brain, identically or not, but if you don't think that constant unrelenting affects the brain, I don't know what to tell you.



We can't? Then why do we let them drive vehicles, operate gas appliances, and cross the street on their own? The reason is that we recognize some (most) depressed people as capable of making sound decisions. Hell, in most cases, they choose their own doctors, and can accept or reject medications at their discretion.

See, in some cases, these things are restricted, because we are capable of telling whether a person is competent to make decisions. Those that are get to go on with their lives and make decisions about it. Those that can't get committed. See?


Demonstrate, please, that all depressed persons are incapable of making sound decisions. It seems we don't treat them that way, except regarding this one particular issue.

Tbh, if everyone makes good points like you, I would've concede a long time ago. Instead, what I got was facepalms and accusations of me trolling.

But, I can see where you're coming from now.

Good deal. I bear you no ill will, but you were not seeing that it was not all black and white. Every situation is different, and should be treated accordingly.

If I have opened your mind a bit to what other people face, and allowed you to feel sympathy, I am satisfied with today's work.

[Mike the Progressive]

no because its hilariously open to abuse and not exactly the sign of someone who has the right capacity to be making such a decision

Why does wishing to die automatically imply insanity?

How does one know that the depression is not temporary? Will dumped middle school girls be lining themselves up in front of clinics of death? Will a man fired from his job, in a moment of unclear thinking, be terminated by the state with all blessing? My gosh, I never could imagine a world where we accept suicide or at least look at it as any other thing but negative.

[Servantium]

Why does wishing to die automatically imply insanity?

How does one know that the depression is not temporary?

Why should that matter?

[Lackadaisical2]

Yes, people should have the right to commit suicide, based on the same self-ownership principles which tend to make me support legalization fo drugs and the like.

[Lackadaisical2]

As for the topic at hand. I should not be a legal offense nor should it be covered by national finances or unwilling insurance companies.

I'd think insurance companies would jump at the chance to cover it tbh.

[GeneralHaNor]

As for the topic at hand. I should not be a legal offense nor should it be covered by national finances or unwilling insurance companies.

I'd think insurance companies would jump at the chance to cover it tbh.

Well that depends on what else is wrong with you
If you are otherwise healthy and paying more into insurance then you are taking out, then offing you isn't cost effective, they need your money to pay for other peoples healthcare.

However if your a financial burden to the Insurance, I would totally see them suggesting/encouraging suicide as a cost effective alternative treatment, indeed they might make it one of the only options under certain conditions

And the really crooked ones, would probably pay doctors to mess up your paperwork, and replace your morphine drip with a cyanide drip.

"He asked to die...I have the paperwork right here"

[Sungai Pusat]

Yes, they should have the right to die, because it's their body, not some state's body. (Saying this in reference to the ban of euthansia in most countries.)

[Georgism]

Everybody should be able to choose their own time of death if they feel they can go on longer.

I do however feel that suicide is bad and should thus be punished by death.

[NordLander]

If you commit suicide, you are sooo gonna be arrested!

[UCUMAY]

Everybody should be able to choose their own time of death if they feel they can go on longer.

I do however feel that suicide is bad and should thus be punished by death.

Great arguement it makes a lot of sense....

[The Alma Mater]

Everybody should be able to choose their own time of death if they feel they can go on longer.

I do however feel that suicide is bad and should thus be punished by death.

Great arguement it makes a lot of sense....

That actually was the law in quite a few countries for quite a while.

And it even makes sense from a Christian perspective. Suiciders go to hell. People that were sentenced to death not necessarily.