My Friend is Pondering Suicide...

[Isselmere]

As so many have written, your friend needs a therapist.

I knew a guy who committed suicide over a girl at about that age; as you might imagine, it solved nothing.

[Triniteras2]

I knew a guy who committed suicide over a girl at about that age; as you might imagine, it solved nothing.

That's not true, the girl was no longer bothered by the guy.

[Snafturi]

Uh, third leading cause of death among people 15-24. Uh, there's dozens of ways to kill yourself (and as an aside, you are a complete asshole if you blow your brains out). Uh, this isn't the kind of thing to keep private, people in the medical field with years and years of training say that. Uh, teen males are more likely to attempt and more likely to be successful when they start talking about it.

I appreciate the subtle trolling there. Very nice.

"Third leading cause of death" doesn't actually translate into "serious risk of death". The UK, if I remember correctly, has a higher rate of suicide than the US, and suicide over there peaked at 16 people in every 100,000, about two decades ago. That's 0.016%. That's barely even clinging to existence.

Did you know most males who attempt suicide do it with a gun? That's because it's fast, painless and almost certain to kill you. If he does want to keep this private then he certainly won't work with unreliable means like pills. But of course, that's pretty much irrelevant, because...

...once again, I haven't recommended keeping this totally private, which you may notice if you start reading my posts at some point. I said to get him to one of those professionals you just quoted, and allow them to decide with the knowledge they gather whether or not to speak to his parents about it. I'm not sure what your hang-up is with not just blurting out the situation to his parents.

Facts aren't trolling, sorry. CDC reports a very sharp increase in suicide rates. The overwhelming majority of teen suicides are male. Males are more likely to use a firearm when you compare them to females, but there are dozens of more definitive ways to end one's life.

You are under the bizarre delusion that telling a therapist will keep things private. He'll be put on a 5150 (or whatever it is in his area), which is exactly what he needs. Sure he can keep that a secret if he doesn't live at home, but it'll be a bit obvious if he does. Why tell parents? I don't know, they probably want to make sure their son doesn't try to harm himself. Just a thought. Really as long as a mandatory reporter is told, he'll get the help he needs.

[Yootopia]

Why tell parents? I don't know, they probably want to make sure their son doesn't try to harm himself.

If it's a teenage lad moping over some lose love of his, I'm pretty sure the parents will have been made aware by his behavior.

[Snafturi]

Uh, there's dozens of ways to kill yourself (and as an aside, you are a complete asshole if you blow your brains out).

It is a bit inconsiderate. Mostly because it leaves a hell of a mess(bits of skull and brain matter and blood everywhere)and you're not going to be around to clean it up are you? So in addition to the normal grief they're feeling, your family has to deal with cleaning up the bits of your head that you carelessly scattered around.

If you're going to kill yourself in a way that's going to leave a mess, at least do it in a public space, where the city will have to clean it up.

Maybe that's a good idea for a business: Brain and Skull Removal Specialists.

[Snafturi]

Why tell parents? I don't know, they probably want to make sure their son doesn't try to harm himself.

If it's a teenage lad moping over some lose love of his, I'm pretty sure the parents will have been made aware by his behavior.

They might know of the moping, but not that he's threatening suicide.

[Yootopia]

Why tell parents? I don't know, they probably want to make sure their son doesn't try to harm himself.

If it's a teenage lad moping over some lose love of his, I'm pretty sure the parents will have been made aware by his behavior.

They might know of the moping, but not that he's threatening suicide.

"talking about for an entire month after he split up with some lass" =/= "threatening and in immediate danger", though, let's be honest. He probably just loves the attention everyone gives him. Tell him to take up drama out of school hours, or get a new girlfriend. Or tell him to take up drama, and then have him find love there, thus fixing absolutely all of his teenage problems.

[Ryadn]

Why tell parents? I don't know, they probably want to make sure their son doesn't try to harm himself.

If it's a teenage lad moping over some lose love of his, I'm pretty sure the parents will have been made aware by his behavior.

And if they treat it the same way a LOT of people do, they'll note it, figure he'll get over it with time, and watch him either get over it or kill himself.

It's most likely he'll get over it, but there is a chance he'll kill himself. Is that a risk his friend should take?

[Ryadn]

If it's a teenage lad moping over some lose love of his, I'm pretty sure the parents will have been made aware by his behavior.

They might know of the moping, but not that he's threatening suicide.

"talking about for an entire month after he split up with some lass" =/= "threatening and in immediate danger", though, let's be honest. He probably just loves the attention everyone gives him. Tell him to take up drama out of school hours, or get a new girlfriend. Or tell him to take up drama, and then have him find love there, thus fixing absolutely all of his teenage problems.

Yeah, that attention-whoring bastard. No one who talks about suicide that much ever ends up really trying to kill themselves! Real suicides keep it to themselves and never cry out for help; the only people who do that are poseurs!

[Yootopia]

Why tell parents? I don't know, they probably want to make sure their son doesn't try to harm himself.

If it's a teenage lad moping over some lose love of his, I'm pretty sure the parents will have been made aware by his behavior.

And if they treat it the same way a LOT of people do, they'll note it, figure he'll get over it with time, and watch him either get over it or kill himself.

It's most likely he'll get over it, but there is a chance he'll kill himself. Is that a risk his friend should take?

As someone who's been a friend to many mopey people who have threatened suicide before, they only get worse the more attention you give them. Get the root cause of their "life-crushing depression" fixed and they cheer up massively. Indulge their hormonal whining, and they just fucking go on, and on, and on.

[Ryadn]

And if they treat it the same way a LOT of people do, they'll note it, figure he'll get over it with time, and watch him either get over it or kill himself.

It's most likely he'll get over it, but there is a chance he'll kill himself. Is that a risk his friend should take?

As someone who's been a friend to many mopey people who have threatened suicide before, they only get worse the more attention you give them. Get the root cause of their "life-crushing depression" fixed and they cheer up massively. Indulge their hormonal whining, and they just fucking go on, and on, and on.

As someone who's been a friend to people who have attempted or successfully committed suicide, I don't gamble with my friends' lives. If you want to do so with yours, that's your prerogative.

[Tubbsalot]

Facts aren't trolling, sorry.

Okay dude, you can pretend that's what I was referring to if you like. In any case, I'm not interested in getting a mod involved, but I would still appreciate being treated decently.

CDC reports a very sharp increase in suicide rates. The overwhelming majority of teen suicides are male. Males are more likely to use a firearm when you compare them to females, but there are dozens of more definitive ways to end one's life.

Let's take a hilariously blown-up estimate of suicide rate, then, and say 0.05%. One in every 2000 people. How many people do you think have some sort of suicidal thoughts during their stay in the 13-23 age range? A few more than 1 in 2000? Probably more like 1 in 20, at the very very least? Suicide is a terrible thing, but let's not kid ourselves about the genuine risk here. In all likelihood, the damage will be psychological, not lethally physical.

You are under the bizarre delusion that telling a therapist will keep things private.

No, I'm not. Again, I'd really appreciate if you read what I wrote. All I'm saying is that it would be best to have him go to a psychologist or psychiatrist, and let that expert decide whether it's necessary to tell the parents. Doing things without his consent will only make him feel worse.

[Ryadn]

Let's take a hilariously blown-up estimate of suicide rate, then, and say 0.05%. One in every 2000 people. How many people do you think have some sort of suicidal thoughts during their stay in the 13-23 age range? A few more than 1 in 2000? Probably more like 1 in 20, at the very very least? Suicide is a terrible thing, but let's not kid ourselves about the genuine risk here. In all likelihood, the damage will be psychological, not lethally physical.

While this is true, it's also true that many (most?) people know someone who committed suicide. I'd wager the vast majority of people know someone who attempted it, though they may not know it. While not lethal, unsuccessful suicide attempts can cause serious and lasting damage--they also increase the risk of completed suicide fivefold.

No, I'm not. Again, I'd really appreciate if you read what I wrote. All I'm saying is that it would be best to have him go to a psychologist or psychiatrist, and let that expert decide whether it's necessary to tell the parents. Doing things without his consent will only make him feel worse.

I agree with this. At least in California, school counselors can see any student once in an emergency without requiring parental notification--this would certainly seem like a good time to cash that particular chip.

[Snafturi]

Facts aren't trolling, sorry.

Okay dude, you can pretend that's what I was referring to if you like. In any case, I'm not interested in getting a mod involved, but I would still appreciate being treated decently.

Whatever. If you think it's trolling report it, but you really need to look at the definition of trolling.

CDC reports a very sharp increase in suicide rates. The overwhelming majority of teen suicides are male. Males are more likely to use a firearm when you compare them to females, but there are dozens of more definitive ways to end one's life.

Let's take a hilariously blown-up estimate of suicide rate, then, and say 0.05%. One in every 2000 people. How many people do you think have some sort of suicidal thoughts during their stay in the 13-23 age range? A few more than 1 in 2000? Probably more like 1 in 20, at the very very least? Suicide is a terrible thing, but let's not kid ourselves about the genuine risk here. In all likelihood, the damage will be psychological, not lethally physical.

Source? And while you're at it, why don't you tell me why the CDC is exaggerating the statistics.

You are under the bizarre delusion that telling a therapist will keep things private.

No, I'm not. Again, I'd really appreciate if you read what I wrote. All I'm saying is that it would be best to have him go to a psychologist or psychiatrist, and let that expert decide whether it's necessary to tell the parents. Doing things without his consent will only make him feel worse.

And he's going to pay for that how? What if he doesn't go? What about the other options I laid out which you conveniently ignore?

Yes, yes, you know more than the experts. I know, all the doctors and medical professionals who write about teen suicide and depression don't really know what they are talking about. They give out advice that clearly doesn't work and doesn't save lives.

[Snafturi]

If it's a teenage lad moping over some lose love of his, I'm pretty sure the parents will have been made aware by his behavior.

And if they treat it the same way a LOT of people do, they'll note it, figure he'll get over it with time, and watch him either get over it or kill himself.

It's most likely he'll get over it, but there is a chance he'll kill himself. Is that a risk his friend should take?

As someone who's been a friend to many mopey people who have threatened suicide before, they only get worse the more attention you give them. Get the root cause of their "life-crushing depression" fixed and they cheer up massively. Indulge their hormonal whining, and they just fucking go on, and on, and on.

There's more than just parents to tell. Listening to them piss and moan doesn't do anything, but you're shooting dice with that person's life if you don't get them to someone who can evaluate how serious they are. That means getting the parents or authorities or both involved.

[Heinleinites]

Maybe that's a good idea for a business: Brain and Skull Removal Specialists.

There are companies here in America that do specialize in crime-scene/disaster site/old lady died alone in the house and cats ate most of her before dying themselves type clean up jobs. It's exactly as nasty as you might think.

By the way, is your flag a duck with a gun, or a duck wearing a jet pack? Either way, it's funny.

[Snafturi]

Maybe that's a good idea for a business: Brain and Skull Removal Specialists.

There are companies here in America that do specialize in crime-scene/disaster site/old lady died alone in the house and cats ate most of her before dying themselves type clean up jobs. It's exactly as nasty as you might think.

By the way, is your flag a duck with a gun, or a duck wearing a jet pack? Either way, it's funny.

That has to be the worst job ever. My flag is a duck with a jetpack. I'm glad you like.

[Tubbsalot]

Source? And while you're at it, why don't you tell me why the CDC is exaggerating the statistics.

Source for what? Suicidal thoughts? I suppose I should have known you'd look askew at a conservative estimation. Let's say 1 in 50, then, because it really doesn't matter. The point stands.

edit: by the way, the reason I didn't address the second part of that quote is because it's entirely irrelevant. I'm already using an estimate almost absurdly outsized. If they say that even more people than that are committing suicide, then do link me, but otherwise, I don't see your point.

And he's going to pay for that how? What if he doesn't go? What about the other options I laid out which you conveniently ignore?

The financial aspect is a good point. Honestly, I doubt he'd have enough money for more than a couple of sessions, but that's better than none at all.

If he doesn't go, well, he doesn't go. New strategy needed. I still wouldn't tell the parents, but it's up to Rhodm in the end.

As for the other options you laid out - wait, sorry, you laid out other options? When did that happen?

Yes, yes, you know more than the experts. I know, all the doctors and medical professionals who write about teen suicide and depression don't really know what they are talking about. They give out advice that clearly doesn't work and doesn't save lives.

And we should apply their advice to every situation all the time, regardless of any context or alternative options we are provided.

(as a side note, their advice is to prevent people from killing themselves, not to make people happy. That is the real problem here.)

[Snafturi]

Source? And while you're at it, why don't you tell me why the CDC is exaggerating the statistics.

Source for what? Suicidal thoughts? I suppose I should have known you'd look askew at a conservative estimation. Let's say 1 in 50, then, because it really doesn't matter. The point stands.

That those CDC statistics are overblown. That teen suicide isn't all that big of a deal or all that likely to happen.

edit: by the way, the reason I didn't address the second part of that quote is because it's entirely irrelevant. I'm already using an estimate almost absurdly outsized. If they say that even more people than that are committing suicide, then do link me, but otherwise, I don't see your point.

I linked to the CDC statistics, that way you don't have to pull them out of the air. That's what I don't get. Why are you making up stats when there are reliable stats to look at.

And he's going to pay for that how? What if he doesn't go? What about the other options I laid out which you conveniently ignore?

The financial aspect is a good point. Honestly, I doubt he'd have enough money for more than a couple of sessions, but that's better than none at all.

If he doesn't go, well, he doesn't go. New strategy needed. I still wouldn't tell the parents, but it's up to Rhodm in the end.


As for the other options you laid out - wait, sorry, you laid out other options? When did that happen?

In my first post and subsequesnt posts...

And we should apply their advice to every situation all the time, regardless of any context or alternative options we are provided.

(as a side note, their advice is to prevent people from killing themselves, not to make people happy. That is the real problem here.)

If the alternative options worked, don't you think they'd mention them? Why on earth would they not lay out alternatives if they worked. The context of the situation is irrelevant, the OP isn't qualified to determine what is relevent and what isn't. That's the point. All he can do is get his friend in the hands of someone who can help.

As to your side note, what are you talking about? They don't lock people away in a padded and throw away the key if they say they're suicidal. You know this, yes. So if the fellow is going to walk around on his own, he's going to have to be made unsuicidal which would entail treating his underlying issues. His underlying issues are what's making him unhappy.

[Heinleinites]

That has to be the worst job ever. My flag is a duck with a jetpack. I'm glad you like.

It's right up there in contention. On the other hand, it pays extremely well. On the other other hand, you find yourself saying things like 'Did we ever find that other eyeball?" and needing multiple showers.

[TheCapitalWasteland]

Whoever thinks suicide is the way to go because they were dumped should off themself. One more fucking idiot off this planet. You know what, my dad just died about three days ago and I've tried to get happier, the only thought of suicide I had was of my mom commiting suicide because everyone treats her like shit or atleast she says so and she cries a lot, but you knwo, she has gotten over it way faster than me. For god's sake, I'm still crying. Whoever thinks suicide is the way to go because of some stupid ass bullshit should kill themselves, the world would be a much less sad place without any whiny bullshiting emo bitches.

[The Third Power (Ancient)]

For one thing, I respect the right to end one's own life, and it's a decision you can make like any other, IMO.

BUT his reason is ridiculous. Does he think all people at age 50+ kill themselves because they ceased being attractive to women? Hell, I'm a walking pot of acne grease, and I still seem pretty much alive. Thing is, he's depressed right now, and while I do accept the right to make such a decision, I do not accept the right to make such a decision without full control of your mental faculties. And since it appears that your friend is mentally impaired right now, obviously he needs to be prevented from carrying out his decision.

Oh, and, yes, putting up religious stuff helps a _lot_ - just describe in vivid colors the firey hell and eternal pain and suffering that awaits those who end their lives - you might read to him from the Divine Comedy for example.

[United Russian State]

You need to tell his parents.

I wish I told someone and they told my parents. Maybe they could of knocked some sense in me before I went and damged my liver.

[Ryadn]

For one thing, I respect the right to end one's own life, and it's a decision you can make like any other, IMO.

BUT his reason is ridiculous. Does he think all people at age 50+ kill themselves because they ceased being attractive to women? Hell, I'm a walking pot of acne grease, and I still seem pretty much alive. Thing is, he's depressed right now, and while I do accept the right to make such a decision, I do not accept the right to make such a decision without full control of your mental faculties. And since it appears that your friend is mentally impaired right now, obviously he needs to be prevented from carrying out his decision.

Oh, and, yes, putting up religious stuff helps a _lot_ - just describe in vivid colors the firey hell and eternal pain and suffering that awaits those who end their lives - you might read to him from the Divine Comedy for example.

But don't let him try to hack his own arm off to see how it would really hurt. That would kind of ruin the point.

[Kantria]

Whoever thinks suicide is the way to go because they were dumped should off themself. One more fucking idiot off this planet. You know what, my dad just died about three days ago and I've tried to get happier, the only thought of suicide I had was of my mom commiting suicide because everyone treats her like shit or atleast she says so and she cries a lot, but you knwo, she has gotten over it way faster than me. For god's sake, I'm still crying. Whoever thinks suicide is the way to go because of some stupid ass bullshit should kill themselves, the world would be a much less sad place without any whiny bullshiting emo bitches.

"Emo" has become the new "fag", I guess.

I feel sorry for your loss, but you're speaking like a real arrogant, obnoxious prick. Why the does it bother you so much what these "whiny bullshitting emo bitches" are doing? Just because they're "emo" doesn't mean they have no worth as human beings. They have problems that need to be resolved. For a lot of them, they'll probably resolve simply with maturity. However, there are people who do feel very depressed, sometimes for no good reason. Break-ups and abuse aggravate it, but it's usually already there. People can't always cope. Stop acting as if you know the answer to every problem just because you've experienced something very difficult without becoming suicidal. Not everyone is like you.