Christian Theology Thread

[St George of England]

I am a Baptist Christian.

No. You're an American Baptist Christian. There's a difference.

I believe Jesus is the Son of God, and is part of the Holy Trinity. I believe that God created the universe through a 6 day creation, and that he punished mankind 4,400 years ago with a worldwide flood.

And your evidence of this is?

I believe that Jesus was born of a Virgin, and grew up to become the Sacrifice needed to save the world from it's sins.

I would agree with you.

I believe that the Catholic Religion is not true 'Christianity' because it paganizes many of the True principles. Reasons for this:
the Renaming of established Roman gods with Christian Names (Venus=Mary, Sol=Jesus, ETC)
You have to work for salvation. Jesus taught that he is the only way to heaven.
It's leaders secretly know the truth that the Bible says Jesus is the only way, but uses it's traditions and rituals to keep it's People in check.

As opposed to other denominations?

Christianity is the only belief that has a Scientifically accurate holy book. Things like ocean currents, the Earth Being round, sending messages by electricity.

Therefore Judaism does also.

My dislikes:
Evolution- A heavily guarded state Religion, in the guise of Science. a Majority of the supposed proofs of Evolution can be proven wrong and false. Evolution is the tree that, Racism, Communism, Socialism, Nazism, and Marxism, all branched out from.

Rubbish. Complete Bullshit. What you said was all around before evolution.

Homosexuality- Human actions that go against the natural order.

so Lobe thy neighbour means nothing?

Abortion-Murder of thousands of innocent lives. It's a shame when humanity chars more for preserving animal rights than saving babies lives.

So if having a baby is likely to kill the mother, you'd still be against it? Or if the mother is a rape victim?

[Panzerjaeger]

Actually he was born Austrian; was raised as a Catholic a studied in a Catholic school. He became a German citizen in 1932 only.

Yeah this was true. Somewhere along the lines he became athiest and started making jokes and rants about religion at private parties while on the other hand making pro-religion speeches to gather the support of Germans during his reign as Fuhrer

People still take the Hitler Table Talks seriously in that regard? Hitler was always a Christian he just wasn't big on Organized Religions he just worked with them as long as he had their support. In fact the 3 sects that weren't banned from worship throughout the war if I remember correctly were Catholics, Lutherans and Mormons oddly enough.

[Newest Accord]

Ever hear of the Holocaust? Anyone who says that Hitler was "kind and gentle" is insane! The Lord, I think, bided his time regarding Hitler, and waited until the time was right. Hitler shoots himself, and his body is burned, just like the bodies of those he ordered executed. This is justice, and I bet you that God was laughing as He sent that Nazi bastard to Hell.

That's the best yet. Believe as you will. You're saying your God is a sadist then? Hitler shot himself to prevent Soviet capture; not because God pulled the trigger. Let's take this to this thread if you want to source fight. http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=72883

[AETEN II]

I am sorta a partial Christian, I think it is foolish to trust every damned sentence in a book that is more than a thousand years old, and has been REPEATEDLY edited by rather un-trustworthy people. I believe there is a creator since I find it hard to believe the Universe pulled itself outa its own ass. That's really my only argument since I consider myself to be an ignorant fool who knows as little as the universe as any other man. I only hope that there is an after life of some sort (ultra dimensional, I'll take ANYTHING as long as my consistence continues on.), due to the fact that my 16 years on this Earth have been far from sweet, as the rest of my life will likely be.

Edit,

lol wut?

Hitler's death was an act of God? The man was mentally estranged (his family had a history of it) the thought of capture by the Russians and the likeliness of torture and execution made him commit suicide.

[St George of England]

I am sorta a partial Christian, I think it is foolish to trust every damned sentence in a book that is more than a thousand years old, and has been REPEATEDLY edited by rather un-trustworthy people. I believe there is a creator since I find it hard to believe the Universe pulled itself outa its own ass. That's really my only argument since I consider myself to be an ignorant fool who knows as little as the universe as any other man. I only hope that there is an after life of some sort (ultra dimensional, I'll take ANYTHING as long as my consistence continues on.), due to the fact that my 16 years on this Earth have been far from sweet, as the rest of my life will likely be.

This is the best summation of my own beliefs I've ever heard.

[Risottia]

Not quite, there. I was merely pointing out that, as proving the existance of God is a key issue in the Aquinas' work, and as the Pope insisted that his doctrine is doctrine of the Church, we can say that the point of the existance of God is pivotal in Christian Theology.

Hmmm; I'd still argue that the point of negative and positive theology isn't so much proving the existence of God - which most Christian doctrines would take as a given - but rather how best to approach defining the nature of God.

Dunno - that sounds to me more like the point of rational theology (be it positive or negative) as opposed to irrational theology (whose bases we can see in the credo quia absurdum).
The Western rational theology was deeply influenced by Aristoteles and the idea that what is real can always be explained through reason, implying that if something cannot be explained rationally then it isn't real.
Hence the long research about a proof of the existence of God, which didn't stop even after Kant noted that existence cannot be a predicate. Even Goedel tried an ontological proof through modal logic.
(Btw, I always found hilarious that Goedel is doubly divine: God + El !)

But you're almost certainly more familiar with the specifics of Catholic doctrine than I am...

To a point... you know, I never received formal teaching about Catholicism, so I'm hardly an expert.

[AETEN II]

I am sorta a partial Christian, I think it is foolish to trust every damned sentence in a book that is more than a thousand years old, and has been REPEATEDLY edited by rather un-trustworthy people. I believe there is a creator since I find it hard to believe the Universe pulled itself outa its own ass. That's really my only argument since I consider myself to be an ignorant fool who knows as little as the universe as any other man. I only hope that there is an after life of some sort (ultra dimensional, I'll take ANYTHING as long as my consistence continues on.), due to the fact that my 16 years on this Earth have been far from sweet, as the rest of my life will likely be.

This is the best summation of my own beliefs I've ever heard.

-sticks a wooden post in front of a shanty house with a cross-

W00T, the Church of Aeten II is now OPEN!

I also dislike the church for the utter atrocities they have committed, the Crusades were almost as bad as the Holocaust, and the fact that they say they love all when they mean they love thy self.

[St George of England]

This is the best summation of my own beliefs I've ever heard.

-sticks a wooden post in front of a shanty house with a cross-

W00T, the Church of Aeten II is now OPEN!

I'll join, as long as don't go *inserts name of christian cult leader here* on us...

[The Mal Clan]

I am a Baptist Christian.

No. You're an American Baptist Christian. There's a difference.

I believe Jesus is the Son of God, and is part of the Holy Trinity. I believe that God created the universe through a 6 day creation, and that he punished mankind 4,400 years ago with a worldwide flood.

And your evidence of this is?

I believe that Jesus was born of a Virgin, and grew up to become the Sacrifice needed to save the world from it's sins.

I would agree with you.

I believe that the Catholic Religion is not true 'Christianity' because it paganizes many of the True principles. Reasons for this:
the Renaming of established Roman gods with Christian Names (Venus=Mary, Sol=Jesus, ETC)
You have to work for salvation. Jesus taught that he is the only way to heaven.
It's leaders secretly know the truth that the Bible says Jesus is the only way, but uses it's traditions and rituals to keep it's People in check.

As opposed to other denominations?
The main thing other denominations get wrong is what bible they preach from, and how they preach it.

Christianity is the only belief that has a Scientifically accurate holy book. Things like ocean currents, the Earth Being round, sending messages by electricity.

Therefore Judaism does also.

My dislikes:
Evolution- A heavily guarded state Religion, in the guise of Science. a Majority of the supposed proofs of Evolution can be proven wrong and false. Evolution is the tree that, Racism, Communism, Socialism, Nazism, and Marxism, all branched out from.

Rubbish. Complete Bullshit. What you said was all around before evolution.

Evolution still supports it. When Karl Marx wrote 'The communist Manifesto', he dedicated his book to Charles Darwin's 'Origins of Species'

Homosexuality- Human actions that go against the natural order.

so Lobe thy neighbour means nothing?

The verse is 'Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself'. It means to care for others.

Abortion-Murder of thousands of innocent lives. It's a shame when humanity chars more for preserving animal rights than saving babies lives.

So if having a baby is likely to kill the mother, you'd still be against it? Or if the mother is a rape victim?

That doesn't justify the thousands of deaths performed by doctors on perfectly healthy Mothers, who just can't live up to the responsibility of taking care of children.

[The Archregimancy]

Though I've been guilty of dipping my own toes into the same off-topic discussion (gives self informal warning for derail), this is just a gentle reminder that this is a thread about Christian theology, not about whether Hitler was a Christian.

Discussion of the other main theme in this thread - the reliability of the Bible as documentary evidence - is more relevant, since this necessarily impacts discussions of theology. But let's try and keep the Nazis out of here, please.

[AETEN II]

Equal rights for all FTW.
(but it is fun to occasionally make a totalitarian state on here.)
The only thing that mind ****s me is the idea that if God IS real, did HE pull HIMSELF out of his own ass, or is it like HALO and there's forerunners, precursor's, etc.

LOL, a book older than a thousand years, edited over and over again should NOT be taken word-for-word, if it even WAS written by God, it has been edited so many times that is likely ALL factual information has been lost.

Don't get me STARTED on Noah's Ark

[St George of England]

No. You're an American Baptist Christian. There's a difference.

And your evidence of this is?

I would agree with you.

As opposed to other denominations?
The main thing other denominations get wrong is what bible they preach from, and how they preach it.



Therefore Judaism does also.

Rubbish. Complete Bullshit. What you said was all around before evolution.

Evolution still supports it. When Karl Marx wrote 'The communist Manifesto', he dedicated his book to Charles Darwin's 'Origins of Species'


so Lobe thy neighbour means nothing?

The verse is 'Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself'. It means to care for others.


So if having a baby is likely to kill the mother, you'd still be against it? Or if the mother is a rape victim?

That doesn't justify the thousands of deaths performed by doctors on perfectly healthy Mothers, who just can't live up to the responsibility of taking care of children.

It all depends on when you consider a fetus to be "alive". A baby's heart is beating at 5 weeks. Is it at this point it is "alive"? Or is it later on in the pregnancy.
I agree that the current limit of 24 weeks (in the UK) is too long, and would prefer a time scale of 10 - 16 weeks with up to 24 if the baby has a high chance of being born severely disabled or having the baby would endanger the mother's life.

[AETEN II]

That doesn't justify the thousands of deaths performed by doctors on perfectly healthy Mothers, who just can't live up to the responsibility of taking care of children.

It all depends on when you consider a fetus to be "alive". A baby's heart is beating at 5 weeks. Is it at this point it is "alive"? Or is it later on in the pregnancy.
I agree that the current limit of 24 weeks (in the UK) is too long, and would prefer a time scale of 10 - 16 weeks with up to 24 if the baby has a high chance of being born severely disabled or having the baby would endanger the mother's life.

It doesn't matter if it is alive, an ant is alive. What matters is when it achieves sentience.

And as I always say to friends, quit whining about THOUSANDS of babies dying, WHAT ABOUT GOD DAMNED AFRICA, WHAT ABOUT GOD DAMNED MIDDLE EAST?!

There are MUCH more serious things to campaign against, like Malaria, cancer, terrorist, etc.


/rant

[The Archregimancy]

That doesn't justify the thousands of deaths performed by doctors on perfectly healthy Mothers, who just can't live up to the responsibility of taking care of children.

It all depends on when you consider a fetus to be "alive". A baby's heart is beating at 5 weeks. Is it at this point it is "alive"? Or is it later on in the pregnancy.
I agree that the current limit of 24 weeks (in the UK) is too long, and would prefer a time scale of 10 - 16 weeks with up to 24 if the baby has a high chance of being born severely disabled or having the baby would endanger the mother's life.

And if I don't want to see this turn into a 'Hitler was a Christian' thread, I equally don't want to see it turn into just another abortion thread.

This thread has managed surprisingly well so far - let's please not please derail it now with two of the most flogged to death topics in NSG.

Note that if you can relate abortion to this thread's topic of Christian theology, then that would be fine. But I see little attempt to do so in the last two quotes above.

[Bears Armed]

Regarding where 'God' would have been before Creation, if He exists: Was there actually a passage of Time before Creation, or was there just a state of timelessness (one eternal moment, as it were...) that means He would effectively have come into existence only when -- and as a direct consequence of the fact that -- He started creating?
(Parallel here to the scientific question about what happened before the 'Big Bang'...)

BTW, although personally an agnostic-tending-towards-atheism who considers current geological & evolutionary theories to be probably correct overall, I do have a (hypothetical) theological explanation for the existence of fossils that doesn't rely on their being either a test of faith or "deceits of the Devil": I call it the 'Doodles in the margin' idea. Want to know more?

[AETEN II]

Regarding where 'God' would have been before Creation, if He exists: Was there actually a passage of Time before Creation, or was there just a state of timelessness (one eternal moment, as it were...) that means He would effectively have come into existence only when -- and as a direct consequence of the fact that -- He started creating?
(Parallel here to the scientific question about what happened before the 'Big Bang'...)

BTW, although personally an agnostic-tending-towards-atheism who considers current geological & evolutionary theories to be probably correct overall, I do have a (hypothetical) theological explanation for the existence of fossils that doesn't rely on their being either a test of faith or "deceits of the Devil": I call it the 'Doodles in the margin' idea. Want to know more?

I tend to believe in the Multi-Universal theory, that there are an unlimited amounts of universes, its the only thing I could use to explain the whole "infinity" thing for myself. Then again, that leaves me with more questions.
(Technically speaking, there never was a beginning and there will never be an end since something must exist BEFORE to start a "beginning")

Fossils are fossils, we have extracted blood tissues from a T.Rex fossil, there is no question to as is if they are real, they are real.

[Bears Armed]

Regarding where 'God' would have been before Creation, if He exists: Was there actually a passage of Time before Creation, or was there just a state of timelessness (one eternal moment, as it were...) that means He would effectively have come into existence only when -- and as a direct consequence of the fact that -- He started creating?
(Parallel here to the scientific question about what happened before the 'Big Bang'...)

BTW, although personally an agnostic-tending-towards-atheism who considers current geological & evolutionary theories to be probably correct overall, I do have a (hypothetical) theological explanation for the existence of fossils that doesn't rely on their being either a test of faith or "deceits of the Devil": I call it the 'Doodles in the margin' idea. Want to know more?

I tend to believe in the Multi-Universal theory, that there are an unlimited amounts of universes, its the only thing I could use to explain the whole "infinity" thing for myself. Then again, that leaves me with more questions.
(Technically speaking, there never was a beginning and there will never be an end since something must exist BEFORE to start a "beginning")

Fossils are fossils, we have extracted blood tissues from a T.Rex fossil, there is no question to as is if they are real, they are real.

Oops! Let me re-phrase my earlier remark slightly _
"I do have a (hypothetical) theological explanation for the existence of fossils without evolution that doesn't rely on their being either a test of faith or "deceits of the Devil": I call it the 'Doodles in the margin' idea. Want to know more?"

[St George of England]

The floor is yours, Mr Bear...

[Bears Armed]

(Edits, added now because I had to log off previously, are all in red...)

Thank you.

"God created Man in his own image."
Now, obviously we aren't talking about physical image here -- because what need would God the Father have for an appendix or sweat glands, to name only two examples, after all -- we're talking about mental image. Okay so far?
Right, and what's a common practice when Humans are designing something? They make blueprints, models, and -- as my title for this idea mentions -- doodles on the margins of their notes (or tablecloths, or whatever)... and some of these ideas eventually make it into the final work, but others might not do so.
Okay, so when God started Creation maybe he hadn't worked out all of the details beforehand* -- which seems especially likely if, as I suggested before, there was only timelessness before the first moment of Creation -- and consequently was thinking about them as he went along. What material did he have for making models with, or doodles on? Yes, the rocks and minerals that he was laying down to give the Earth's upper layers a varied structure, right?
And often He derived one design from another that He had already considered and designed blueprints for, hence the appearance of evolution.
But sometimes He ran with an idea for a while, and looked at numerous variations on a possible theme, but then discarded it wholesale and didn't incorporate any of it into His finished work: So, goodby (for example) to the idea of Dinosaurs. (The designs for Beetles, on the other paw, He was evidently still playing around with when He reached the point of deciding to complete the creation of Insects... )
And as He finished considering each of His ideas, He simply dumped any finished-with models/doodles into the layer of rocks that he was currently putting into place.
(This doesn't try to rule out the possibility of some evolution having taken place since Creation, of course, merely suggests a potential reason why it might not be necessary for explaining fossils...)

(* In defence of this idea, theologically, I raise the question: if He had worked it all out completely in advance then why, taking omnipotence as a given, did He spend six 'days' to complete Creation rather than doing the whole job in a single instant?)

Well?

[Terishany]

Lutheran...of the LCMS flavor.

[Risottia]

Thank you.

"God created Man in his own image."
(snip)
Well?

To me, it just looks like another way of letting God back in the equation, without any necessity for having him in it.
That's the problem with deities: as they cannot be derived a posteriori, they must be assumed a priori as axioms - if one chooses to do so.

[Political Pilgrims]

My first thought on seeing the poll was, "Wow, look at all the Catholics!" Yes, I'm skipping all your comments to jump in with my view.

I am a Nazarene. It's a Wesleyan/Holiness denomination. I support it and choose to be part of it because it goes along with what I find that Jesus Christ taught.

I part with most other denominations for things that I find somewhat critical. I disagree with Catholicism's departure from the Bible and the early church, although I am glad that they're becoming more tolerant of Protestants. I disagree with predestination because I find that it creates more problems than it solves. I believe that Jesus Christ didn't die for a select group, but for all. I disagree with Pentacostals in that I put more emphasis on the fruits of the Spirit than on the gifts of the Spirit. I do admire their worship and their excitement about God and his grace. My cousin and his family are Pentecostal. I've been to a few of their camp meetings.

[The Alma Mater]

My first thought on seeing the poll was, "Wow, look at all the Catholics!"

Well, Catholics do outnumber all other Christians combined in the real world.. so not that odd

[Bondashk]

Swedish Baptist right here.

[Unhealthy2]

Completely naturalistic atheist, but with some culturally Christian leanings. (i.e. still celebrate many of the supposedly "Christian" [though actually pagan] holidays, etc.)