Should Students be Expelled for Religious/Sexual Beliefs?

[Blouman Empire]

Seems fair to me if it was an atheist or homosexual being kicked out that would be a different story.

[Katganistan]

Maybe she wants to counsel other Christians?
Seems to me that would be her likely clientele.
Or do you not want her to be a counselor at all?

That's still risky. What if she counsels closet homosexual Christians? None of her advise to them could possibly be psychologically healthy.

Of course it'd be healthy. If they follow her advice then they're much less likely to get AIDS.

Except that the poor, not homosexuals, are much more likely to be infected with HIV. But you knew that, right? And women are more likely to get it than men.

[Blouman Empire]

Maybe she wants to counsel other Christians?
Seems to me that would be her likely clientele.
Or do you not want her to be a counselor at all?

That's still risky. What if she counsels closet homosexual Christians? None of her advise to them could possibly be psychologically healthy.

Of course it'd be healthy. If they follow her advice then they're much less likely to get AIDS.

Except that the poor, not homosexuals, are much more likely to be infected with HIV. But you knew that, right? And women are more likely to get it than men.

Hard to contract AIDS if you're not having sex.

[Katganistan]

This is from World Net Daily, a "publication" to which I give no credence whatsoever. I don't believe a single thing they say.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... versities/

Try this one.

Or for another opinion... http://www.towleroad.com/2010/07/antiga ... ality.html

[Katganistan]

the right to freedom of speech and religion as defined by the US constiution will end this rather quickly.

Is the government telling her she cannot express her views?

[Zephie]

the right to freedom of speech and religion as defined by the US constiution will end this rather quickly.

Is the government telling her she cannot express her views?

I think it could stir up trouble if the school receives government funding.

[Katganistan]

Referring to the story linked by the OP specifically, I don't think school administrators have any right to expel students for being ignorant.

They didn't, they're not allowing her to complete a course in counseling where she does not accept homosexuality as anything but a sinful choice nor will she provide unbiased advice on abortions.

Essentially, those disqualify her from being a counsellor, and rightly so.

You come to counselors for advice- if you know she feels that way, then don't go to them. It she thinks it's a choice, then she can think that.

A rather extreme example of something similar would be asking a racist friend for advice. If you didn't want racist advice, don't go to the racist friend. With all this said, I don't really see what she did that was so bad.

And how would you know that she believed that, coming through her door?
And how will that help someone who is already in crisis, to be told that they're sinful?

[Katganistan]

Also, what's this about gays doing it for attention?

Well dahling, persecution is quite fabulous donchano?

Oh, let's not talk about persecution. Christians are routinely persecuted and ostracized while homosexuality is celebrated and accepted.

As a Roman Catholic American, let me just say, "Oh, PLEASE."

[Katganistan]

The HIV virus is small enough to get through the rubber of the condom

This is an often-exposed lie, widely circulated by the Catholic Church.

You want proof? Have at it! http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1411838

The phrase "reduction by 4 orders of magnitude" means "less than one chance in 10,000". If you want to pretend that that justifies what the Church has told people, go ahead. I say the Church has massive amounts of blood on its hands.

Let's be honest, 10,000 fucks isn't a lot of sex. I mean, if Ford had a car that blew up 1 out of 10,000; they'd be screwed pretty badly.

It's three times a day, every day, for 10 years.

So some of our more prolific posters must be capable of X-treme Multi-Tasking!!!!!

[Galloism]

So some of our more prolific posters must be capable of X-treme Multi-Tasking!!!!!

You know it, baby.

[Sebally-Orwitskia]

What the heck is wrong with you people and your double standards?

Cant believe nine people favored voting yes to expel her based on her beliefs. Just the heck is wrong with you?

She deserved it because she's a right wing christian and therefore doesn't agree with us.

...Your line alone now gives me this equation:
Georgism = Extremist Christian.
Your practically one of them.

[Katganistan]

I mean, in almost any other profession I think I'd understand, but c'mon... As I said before, we're talking about a counselor. The sort of people who make hard decisions for teenagers like what acne cream to avoid. We're not exactly talking hard science here or hard rules. I know this could be construed to be a tad unfair, but when the profession is like a step away from being a Zen Balancer or some other "practitioner," I'm always a little amused because people put on airs and talk about integrity for quasi-useless professions like it was a matter of life'n'death.

You do know that school counselors are often called on to counsel students who may be suicidal, who may have just found out that they or their partner is pregnant or has an STD, to deal specifically with students struggling with gender identity, horrific child abuse, sexual assault....

Oh, right. You don't.

[Sebally-Orwitskia]

Also, what's this about gays doing it for attention?

Well dahling, persecution is quite fabulous donchano?

Oh, let's not talk about persecution. Christians are routinely persecuted and ostracized while homosexuality is celebrated and accepted.

As a Roman Catholic American, let me just say, "Oh, PLEASE."

As a Roman Catholic in Asia, "Yes we are being persecuted."

[Vervaria]

[Katganistan]

Again, I am sorry to point out the blatant flaw in your statement, but I must. Proposition 8 was a large step in the right direction. While it is fashionable to mock Christians and the deeply held beliefs about morality that they hold sacred, I and others who hold those beliefs are derided and ostracized. Who's the bigot now? While I find the practice of homosexuality evil and deeply disturbing, I nevertheless defend the right of those who hold positions contrary to mine to express them freely. My issue is that Christians are not allowed the same courtesy.

Sorry -- didn't you just express your opinion? Has anyone jailed you? Beaten you? Has it been edited in any way? Or are you upset that people can and will criticize it -- the same way you criticize homosexuality be calling it evil and deeply disturbing?

Just trying to get some clarification here.

[Katganistan]

Wait, for real?

How many open atheists are there in the US Congress? How many open Christians are there? Do you realize that atheists are among the least popular groups in the country, according to poll data?

I never said atheists were never attacked. But from my experience, I see atheists provoking it. We have freedom of religion in the U.S I don't see why everyone can't just respect that.

Do rape victims provoke it too?
Just curious.

[Vervaria]

Wait, for real?

How many open atheists are there in the US Congress? How many open Christians are there? Do you realize that atheists are among the least popular groups in the country, according to poll data?

I never said atheists were never attacked. But from my experience, I see atheists provoking it. We have freedom of religion in the U.S I don't see why everyone can't just respect that.

Do rape victims provoke it too?
Just curious.

Oh, you just went there.

[Unchecked Expansion]

So some of our more prolific posters must be capable of X-treme Multi-Tasking!!!!!

You know it, baby.

Remember to keep your fluids up

[Katganistan]

But from my experience, I see atheists provoking it.

Atheists, after millenia of literally being told that we will justly suffer eternal torment for our beliefs, have finally, in a few cases, stopped being perfectly respectful of people's religious beliefs--and thus we are "provoking it"?

You are collectivizing it throughout history; I am talking about the present. The past is irrelevant.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." -- George Santayana

[Katganistan]

What the heck is wrong with you people and your double standards?

Cant believe nine people favored voting yes to expel her based on her beliefs. Just the heck is wrong with you?

She has refused to abide by the ethical code required by the school and the licensing authority. What the heck is wrong with being refused the degree under those circumstances?

[Dakini]

If you're in a counseling program and willing to ignore what leading psychological associations say then yes, you should fail out. It would be like taking a degree in biology and refusing to read about evolution because you're a young Earth creationist. Except that in this case, she could do severe psychological damage to someone if she's given her degree and the right to be a counselor.

But then I also think that pharmacists who refuse to dispense medication because they disagree with it should be canned too.

[Vandengaarde]

But from my experience, I see atheists provoking it.

Atheists, after millenia of literally being told that we will justly suffer eternal torment for our beliefs, have finally, in a few cases, stopped being perfectly respectful of people's religious beliefs--and thus we are "provoking it"?

I'm not even religious and I agree with Zephie. (this one time, never again!) I usually see atheists being the people who say "God is some floating invisible guy, why would you believe in him?" and baiting Christians/Muslims/whoever. The mods always ignore it because they're biased, but it doesn't change the facts.

[Unchecked Expansion]

What the heck is wrong with you people and your double standards?

Cant believe nine people favored voting yes to expel her based on her beliefs. Just the heck is wrong with you?

She has refused to abide by the ethical code required by the school and the licensing authority. What the heck is wrong with being refused the degree under those circumstances?

'Professor Kat, I plagiarised my whole degree thesis from a book I found on the web, because I don't believe in academic integrity. Do I pass?'

[Sebally-Orwitskia]

Help! We are soo making up our persecution!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecutio ... present.29

[Vervaria]

But from my experience, I see atheists provoking it.

Atheists, after millenia of literally being told that we will justly suffer eternal torment for our beliefs, have finally, in a few cases, stopped being perfectly respectful of people's religious beliefs--and thus we are "provoking it"?

I'm not even religious and I agree with Zephie. (this one time, never again!) I usually see atheists being the people who say "God is some floating invisible guy, why would you believe in him?" and baiting Christians/Muslims/whoever. The mods always ignore it because they're biased, but it doesn't change the facts.

So you're saying the mods are all atheists?