Page 1 of 12

Was Jesus a Communist?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:16 am
by Pandas and Heineken
After watching some religious crap, it seems that Jesus hated the rich and loved the poor. To me, it seems that Jesus constantly stated that the rich had no power over the poor. Jesus even said himself:
"It's very hard for a rich man to get into Heaven. It's easier for a camel to get through the eye of a needle."
This says to me that unless you're poor, you're going to Hell. Thoughts?

NOTE: PLEASE DON'T TURN THIS INTO A RELIGION DISCUSSION!

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:17 am
by Ifreann
I didn't think hating rich people implied communism. Nor do I think Jesus hated anyone.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:19 am
by Natapoc
yes. He gave everything away for free and insisted the rich give all they had if they wanted to follow him.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:19 am
by Pandas and Heineken
Ifreann wrote:I didn't think hating rich people implied communism. Nor do I think Jesus hated anyone.

Well, maybe hated isn't the right word. How 'bout he preferred the poor over the rich?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:21 am
by Pandas and Heineken
Natapoc wrote:yes. He gave everything away for free and insisted the rich give all they had if they wanted to follow him.

And if they didn't, they couldn't follow him.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:22 am
by Living Freedom Land
The Holy Bible wrote:It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.


The Bible clearly says, with God, all things are possible. The real problem is not wealth, but that men let wealth get between them and God.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:23 am
by Lunatic Goofballs
I'm not convinced that an individual can be a communist. Oh, an individual might tout the benefits of communism both real and imagined, but to actually practice communism, he really needs some people to practice communism with.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:28 am
by Dododecapod
No. The Jesus of the Bible was an ascetic - one who seeks to live simply, without the distractions of goods and ownership, that he may perfect himself spiritually. When asked how to be a good folower of him, he says to do likewise, to give away your worldly goods and follow the ascetic path.
A good communist wants everyone to have equal access to everything. Jesus wanted to have nothing.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:29 am
by Barringtonia
Apparently there's some get-out clause through 'render unto Caesar' that people are able to exploit by which they can becomes as rich as they like.. as well as choose tax-free offshore Caesar Islands in the Caribbean to render unto..

..fantastic stuff,

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:31 am
by Glorious Homeland
Living Freedom Land wrote:
The Holy Bible wrote:It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.


The Bible clearly says, with God, all things are possible. The real problem is not wealth, but that men let wealth get between them and God.

Funny how the rich Americans always say that. But then America is a country that was founded by heretics. Socialism in the UK took a large amount of support from the likes of the Methodist church, which supported socialism on theological grounds.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:31 am
by Aelosia
Dododecapod wrote:No. The Jesus of the Bible was an ascetic - one who seeks to live simply, without the distractions of goods and ownership, that he may perfect himself spiritually. When asked how to be a good folower of him, he says to do likewise, to give away your worldly goods and follow the ascetic path.
A good communist wants everyone to have equal access to everything. Jesus wanted to have nothing.


Nice to know someone here still have someidea about how things are.

Perfect explanation.

In other words..

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:31 am
by Wamitoria
Dododecapod wrote:No. The Jesus of the Bible was an ascetic - one who seeks to live simply, without the distractions of goods and ownership, that he may perfect himself spiritually. When asked how to be a good folower of him, he says to do likewise, to give away your worldly goods and follow the ascetic path.
A good communist wants everyone to have equal access to everything. Jesus wanted to have nothing.

^This

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:33 am
by Lackadaisical2
Barringtonia wrote:Apparently there's some get-out clause through 'render unto Caesar' that people are able to exploit by which they can becomes as rich as they like.. as well as choose tax-free offshore Caesar Islands in the Caribbean to render unto..

..fantastic stuff,

That doesn't get you out of the possibility of private charity.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:33 am
by Living Freedom Land
Glorious Homeland wrote:
Living Freedom Land wrote:
The Holy Bible wrote:It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.


The Bible clearly says, with God, all things are possible. The real problem is not wealth, but that men let wealth get between them and God.

Funny how the rich Americans always say that. But then America is a country that was founded by heretics. Socialism in the UK took a large amount of support from the likes of the Methodist church, which supported socialism on theological grounds.

America was not founded by heretics. Rather, Americans were fleeing heretical oppression.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:35 am
by Wamitoria
Living Freedom Land wrote:
Glorious Homeland wrote:
Living Freedom Land wrote:
The Holy Bible wrote:It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.


The Bible clearly says, with God, all things are possible. The real problem is not wealth, but that men let wealth get between them and God.

Funny how the rich Americans always say that. But then America is a country that was founded by heretics. Socialism in the UK took a large amount of support from the likes of the Methodist church, which supported socialism on theological grounds.

America was founded not founded by heretics. Rather, Americans were fleeing heretical oppression.

And they proceeded to persecute everyone who didn't agree with their personal beliefs, your point?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:35 am
by Barringtonia
Lackadaisical2 wrote:
Barringtonia wrote:Apparently there's some get-out clause through 'render unto Caesar' that people are able to exploit by which they can becomes as rich as they like.. as well as choose tax-free offshore Caesar Islands in the Caribbean to render unto..

..fantastic stuff,

That doesn't get you out of the possibility of private charity.


I believe this fine donation to your church will get me in through the back door,

Do you accept cheques?

Tax-free? Don't mind if I do..

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:38 am
by Living Freedom Land
Wamitoria wrote:
Living Freedom Land wrote:
Glorious Homeland wrote:
Living Freedom Land wrote:
The Holy Bible wrote:It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.


The Bible clearly says, with God, all things are possible. The real problem is not wealth, but that men let wealth get between them and God.

Funny how the rich Americans always say that. But then America is a country that was founded by heretics. Socialism in the UK took a large amount of support from the likes of the Methodist church, which supported socialism on theological grounds.

America was founded not founded by heretics. Rather, Americans were fleeing heretical oppression.

And they proceeded to persecute everyone who didn't agree with their personal beliefs, your point?

I fail to see how the nation that pioneered freedom of religion is a nation rife with persecution. Sure, some people like the Puritans in Massachusetts originally restricted other religions, but the Pennsylvanians were pacifist Quakers that wanted to harm nobody. By the time a real American identity was established, freedom of religion was an idea gaining ground and was adopted in the First Amendment of the Constitution.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:40 am
by Pythria
No. He didn't think people should be forced by a government to give to the poor- it's the act of charity that matters. Rich people can get into heaven if they are generous to the poor.

EDIT: I doubt poor people have a ticket to heaven, either.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:40 am
by Tungookska
Lunatic Goofballs wrote:I'm not convinced that an individual can be a communist. Oh, an individual might tout the benefits of communism both real and imagined, but to actually practice communism, he really needs some people to practice communism with.

you mean like the 12 guys and the prostitute that he hung out with?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:42 am
by Ifreann
Lunatic Goofballs wrote:I'm not convinced that an individual can be a communist. Oh, an individual might tout the benefits of communism both real and imagined, but to actually practice communism, he really needs some people to practice communism with.

A commune, as it were.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:43 am
by Wamitoria
Living Freedom Land wrote:
Wamitoria wrote:
Living Freedom Land wrote:
Glorious Homeland wrote:
Living Freedom Land wrote:
The Holy Bible wrote:It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.


The Bible clearly says, with God, all things are possible. The real problem is not wealth, but that men let wealth get between them and God.

Funny how the rich Americans always say that. But then America is a country that was founded by heretics. Socialism in the UK took a large amount of support from the likes of the Methodist church, which supported socialism on theological grounds.

America was founded not founded by heretics. Rather, Americans were fleeing heretical oppression.

And they proceeded to persecute everyone who didn't agree with their personal beliefs, your point?

I fail to see how the nation that pioneered freedom of religion is a nation rife with persecution. Sure, some people like the Puritans in Massachusetts originally restricted other religions, but the Pennsylvanians were pacifist Quakers that wanted to harm nobody. By the time a real American identity was established, freedom of religion was an idea gaining ground and was adopted in the First Amendment of the Constitution.

I phrased that wrong, our founders persecuted anyone who didn't look like them.
Black slaves, Native Americans to name a few. Sure, the slaves were eventually freed, but the Native Americans were all but exterminated. But, I'm getting off-topic...

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:44 am
by Bamabam
I think Jesus wants you to give out of your own heart not have a government steal it from you.He meant that you should stop caring after material things so much,because after you die it doesnt matter,so you should give away to those who need it more.Communism also is a secular government trying to build a utopia without God,which God warns against.God also many times in the bible talks laziness and warns against it,and says you should earn based off your work.Which is against marxism thought that all deserve equal pay no matter the work done.So i could say Jesus was a conservative with a very ,very warm giving heart.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:47 am
by Communist Phanafia
We all knew it was coming.

Image

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:47 am
by Living Freedom Land
Wamitoria wrote:I phrased that wrong, our founders persecuted anyone who didn't look like them.
Black slaves, Native Americans to name a few. Sure, the slaves were eventually freed, but the Native Americans were all but exterminated. But, I'm getting off-topic...

America isn't a perfect nation, by no means. But to counter that, George Washington did release his slaves at the time of his death, and he set a totally unfollowed precedent of peace with the tribal nations. Benjamin Franklin and Samuel Adams both though slavery was abhorrent.

But yeah, back on topic...

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:49 am
by Chrobalta
Probably. During the early middle ages, much of the Christians in Europe were actually barred from making profits.