US gasoline prices may finally adjust to a reasonable figure

[Lackadaisical2]

If the price starts getting too high, I suspect we'll start seeing a lot of people making their own alcohol based fuel. I know I'll consider it (or investigate the possibility of getting a diesel engine for my truck, which would allow me to use bio-diesel/WVO).

Which is far worse for the environment, or rather far less good then we would suspect, not to mention that it's causing food shortages around the world

Thats the problem with this sort of shit. Ruining my cheap food. I don't even have a working car and I'm against it.

[Brogavia]

So we ditch the suburbs. They're unsustainable anyways.

And do what with the millions of people who live in them? Resettle them Stalin style?

[L3 Communications]

Nuclear power.

^ Which is why we don't need to ramp up gas prices, we need more NPPs and electrical cars.

[NERVUN]

I just fueled up today, it was 126 yen/l. (Around and about $5 per gal).

And before you guys say anything about how Japan has wonderful public transportation (It does), I live in rural Japan. The store we go to is 20 minutes down the road, my school is 30 minutes away (26 km, or about 16 miles). But, see, Japan believes in smaller cars with much better fuel standards than the US.

It can be done and it just MIGHT get people out of their gas guzzlers.

[Panzerjaeger]

I know. Again, I'm not arguing from the standpoint of what is politically feasible or possible. I'm looking at what needs to be done if the nation is serious about reducing its reliance on oil.

I get what you are saying it is just depressing when you realize the US Government has zero intentions to wean itself off oil at this point in time. I mean denying the expansion of Nuclear Power is just insane but meh I don't make energy policy.

[Maurepas]

Nuclear power.

^ Which is why we don't need to ramp up gas prices, we need more NPPs and electrical cars.

IIRC, Texaco trashed our electric cars, >_>

[Orlkjestad]

So we ditch the suburbs. They're unsustainable anyways.

And do what with the millions of people who live in them? Resettle them Stalin style?

Can't we just expand bus networks to suburban America? Trams are expensive, and so are subways. Buses are the right answer.

[Rolling squid]

It does cost soemthing, but you know so do public transport systems, people don't live quite so centralized, fucking with gas prices will result in literally cutting whole towns off from the rest of the country. Pollution, etc. I can't argue, but I'm convinced that there is far more oil out there than we've been led to believe and advanced recovery techniques can significantly increase domestic oil production (ME oil is relatively easy to get out of the ground, which is why its cheap), for example I worked on a project earlier this year regarding an oil field in southern Illinois where the recovery rate was only about 3% of the actual oil in the ground and they're working on getting another 3% out...

Fair enough about the small towns, perhaps we could implement a locational tax, make it cost more if you live in the city than in the country. But people in small towns don't have to drive as much, everything tends to be within walking distance.

As for the oil, what are the environmental costs of continued extraction? And remember, for a high speed rail system, most of the emission cost is in the building phase. Once everything is up and running, powered by green energy or a nuclear plant, emissions are minimal.

[L3 Communications]

Nuclear power.

^ Which is why we don't need to ramp up gas prices, we need more NPPs and electrical cars.

IIRC, Texaco trashed our electric cars, >_>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_Leaf

[Maurepas]

I just fueled up today, it was 126 yen/l. (Around and about $5 per gal).

And before you guys say anything about how Japan has wonderful public transportation (It does), I live in rural Japan. The store we go to is 20 minutes down the road, my school is 30 minutes away (26 km, or about 16 miles). But, see, Japan believes in smaller cars with much better fuel standards than the US.

It can be done and it just MIGHT get people out of their gas guzzlers.

I can't afford the payments on my smaller, much better fuel standard car.

I can't afford $7/gallon gas on top of that.

[Rolling squid]

So we ditch the suburbs. They're unsustainable anyways.

And do what with the millions of people who live in them? Resettle them Stalin style?

No. Let the intelligent people come to the realization that their way of life is unsustainable, and let them move to the city. Hope the stupid ones follow.

So we ditch the suburbs. They're unsustainable anyways.

And do what with the millions of people who live in them? Resettle them Stalin style?

Can't we just expand bus networks to suburban America? Trams are expensive, and so are subways. Buses are the right answer.

Buses still burn gasoline. We need electric powered transportation.

[Orlkjestad]

I just fueled up today, it was 126 yen/l. (Around and about $5 per gal).

And before you guys say anything about how Japan has wonderful public transportation (It does), I live in rural Japan. The store we go to is 20 minutes down the road, my school is 30 minutes away (26 km, or about 16 miles). But, see, Japan believes in smaller cars with much better fuel standards than the US.

It can be done and it just MIGHT get people out of their gas guzzlers.

My penis is too small to let go of my Hummer.

[Khorata]

Here, our gas prices is 98.9 (99¢ in Canadian Money). Way cheaper than America has. If I must tell you something, here is something for all of those who live on the Canadian/USA border. Always drive into Canada to get gas. Even if it means running out of it as you are heading to Canada, just do it! It will make life simpler!

[NERVUN]

I just fueled up today, it was 126 yen/l. (Around and about $5 per gal).

And before you guys say anything about how Japan has wonderful public transportation (It does), I live in rural Japan. The store we go to is 20 minutes down the road, my school is 30 minutes away (26 km, or about 16 miles). But, see, Japan believes in smaller cars with much better fuel standards than the US.

It can be done and it just MIGHT get people out of their gas guzzlers.

I can't afford the payments on my smaller, much better fuel standard car.

I can't afford $7/gallon gas on top of that.

Ya know, the amazing thing is, America did so before...

[Enormous Gentiles]

LoL the gas tax could bring back a Prohibitionisk era of cracking down on moonshine.
I love it. I could see the feds randomly testing fuel tanks to make sure there is not unauthorized ethanol in there.
And the feds chasing moonshine delivery haulers through the back woods.

You better stay away from Copperhead Road

Win.

I look forward to ambushing the revenuers and fuel-tank checkers. Same as my daddy and his daddy before.

[Orlkjestad]

So we ditch the suburbs. They're unsustainable anyways.

And do what with the millions of people who live in them? Resettle them Stalin style?

No. Let the intelligent people come to the realization that their way of life is unsustainable, and let them move to the city. Hope the stupid ones follow.

Suburbs are not sustainable at least in their current form. Add larger bus networks, pass some eco-friendly legislation, and bam- we've got a sustainable, green suburb.

[United States of PA]

I just fueled up today, it was 126 yen/l. (Around and about $5 per gal).

And before you guys say anything about how Japan has wonderful public transportation (It does), I live in rural Japan. The store we go to is 20 minutes down the road, my school is 30 minutes away (26 km, or about 16 miles). But, see, Japan believes in smaller cars with much better fuel standards than the US.

It can be done and it just MIGHT get people out of their gas guzzlers.

NERV, my dads 71 Ford Pickup gets nearly 12mpg, and thats with it original engine, a shitty accelerator pump and a shitty carburetor. If a 71 (Year before the Crackdown on Gas Guzzlers began), gets nearly half the MPG as my mom's 86 Mercury Sable, i dont know what a gas guzzler is.

Heck, even those big diesel Pickups people are really fond of over here get's good fuel mileage, provided you get the Diesel Engines and not the gas. 20mpg out of a 08 Dodge 2500 Ram is nearly the same as many Economy fuel cars. Scion for example gets 27mpg highway, my Shop Teachers Dodge, which i stated before, gets 20mpg highway.

[Lackadaisical2]

It does cost soemthing, but you know so do public transport systems, people don't live quite so centralized, fucking with gas prices will result in literally cutting whole towns off from the rest of the country. Pollution, etc. I can't argue, but I'm convinced that there is far more oil out there than we've been led to believe and advanced recovery techniques can significantly increase domestic oil production (ME oil is relatively easy to get out of the ground, which is why its cheap), for example I worked on a project earlier this year regarding an oil field in southern Illinois where the recovery rate was only about 3% of the actual oil in the ground and they're working on getting another 3% out...

Fair enough about the small towns, perhaps we could implement a locational tax, make it cost more if you live in the city than in the country. But people in small towns don't have to drive as much, everything tends to be within walking distance.

But friends and family may live 50 miles away, or again with suburbs it means relocating far too many people. A locational tax at this time would just punish the urban poor (who in many cities, are simply the vast majority of people living there, I know my hometown is that way, gogo rustbelt).

As for the oil, what are the environmental costs of continued extraction?

I dunno, but the oil companies should pay for it. As far as I know putting in an oil well doesn't mean you have to clear cut a forest or anything, its only disasters like the gulf which have a major impact.

And remember, for a high speed rail system, most of the emission cost is in the building phase. Once everything is up and running, powered by green energy or a nuclear plant, emissions are minimal.

Very true, I'd never argue that public transport isn't massively more efficient in terms of energy use or pollution.

[Brogavia]

But people in small towns don't have to drive as much, everything tends to be within walking distance.

What are we defining as the limit for small town? I consider 3,000 people and down to be a small town.

[Allbeama]

I think if this happens, the Tea Party will finally start a revolution.

Which will result in total chaos and the Second American Civil War, due to the fact that so few of us here in the US can actually agree on anything. There would be at least 3 to 5 different factions involved.

[Klaus Devestatorie]

Planners know how to fix this. There simply ain't the money or the available land to do it (assuming a reintroduction of city-suburb trains)- the other option is to viciously curb urban sprawl, but I'm guessing people would hate that even more.

[Lackadaisical2]

I just fueled up today, it was 126 yen/l. (Around and about $5 per gal).

And before you guys say anything about how Japan has wonderful public transportation (It does), I live in rural Japan. The store we go to is 20 minutes down the road, my school is 30 minutes away (26 km, or about 16 miles). But, see, Japan believes in smaller cars with much better fuel standards than the US.

It can be done and it just MIGHT get people out of their gas guzzlers.

I can't afford the payments on my smaller, much better fuel standard car.

I can't afford $7/gallon gas on top of that.

Ya know, the amazing thing is, America did so before...

when was this?

[Borinata]

I take umbrage with you saying $7.00 a gallon gas reflects reality, unless you mean a reality of gasoline taxes in excess of 100%. (Please see below)


Source: European Commission, Oil Bulletin, and U.S. Department of Energy, Energy Information Administration, Weekly Petroleum Status Report, October 2007, Table 16.

See the original HERE.

[Panzerjaeger]

I think if this happens, the Tea Party will finally start a revolution.

Which will result in total chaos and the Second American Civil War, due to the fact that so few of us here in the US can actually agree on anything. There would be at least 3 to 5 different factions involved.

Hell yeah Balkanization! I lead the Ustaše-esque movement!

[Orlkjestad]

So we ditch the suburbs. They're unsustainable anyways.

And do what with the millions of people who live in them? Resettle them Stalin style?

No. Let the intelligent people come to the realization that their way of life is unsustainable, and let them move to the city. Hope the stupid ones follow.

So we ditch the suburbs. They're unsustainable anyways.

And do what with the millions of people who live in them? Resettle them Stalin style?

Can't we just expand bus networks to suburban America? Trams are expensive, and so are subways. Buses are the right answer.

Buses still burn gasoline. We need electric powered transportation.

We already have buses that run on natural gas, which is clean. Pretty soon we'll have electric and hydrogen buses.