NATION

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Revisiting Interesting Incel Perspectives.

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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The Sherpa Empire
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Postby The Sherpa Empire » Mon May 29, 2023 6:14 pm

Saiwana wrote:
Katganistan wrote:The reasoning behind not doing it is rooted in the outdated patriarchal idea that women are necessary for bearing children and replacing old or deceased population, especially in and after wartime.


None of that calculus or logic has changed up to the present day, when people really think about it. That is still going to be the outcome in the event that most of the fighting men were to die. If people don't have an alternative that can fully cover that "what if" -then it isn't obsolete and is perfectly rational.

Besides which, what does a typical military want women for, if the men that're available are preferred for almost all roles within warfare? The only major combat roles women have outperformed men on that comes to mind, are snipers and pilots. Although there may be more. Usually the men can make it through harsher training and have enough physical advantages as to make that more possible.


Female submarine crews would make sense, since you have so many small spaces on a submarine.
༄༅། །འགྲོ་བ་མི་རིགས་ག་ར་དབང་ཆ་འདྲ་མཉམ་འབད་སྒྱེཝ་ལས་ག་ར་གིས་གཅིག་གིས་གཅིག་ལུ་སྤུན་ཆའི་དམ་ཚིག་བསྟན་དགོས།
Following new legislation in The Sherpa Empire, life is short but human kindness is endless.
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Techocracy101010
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Postby Techocracy101010 » Mon May 29, 2023 6:14 pm

Primitive Communism wrote:
Techocracy101010 wrote:Now on sexual objectification another reason as a man i would nit mind being objectified is that it pays. I already sell my body and soul in labor if i could get a few extra bucks jerking off on a cam from women that would be great. However male camers do not make money same for strippers like very few dudes have folks pay to see them. The extra bucks would be nice


You're talking about degrading yourself for money. Please stop and listen to what you're saying; this is not a privilege that women 'enjoy'. It is humiliating and dehumanizing.


so is working 15 hour days with 2 hour commute and repeatedly nearly wrapping my car around trees due to me falling asleep while driving. If i could have earned that cash via stripping hooking or camming you bet your sweet ass i would have. I already de humanize myself and take a cocktail of ped that no one knows the long term effects of to keep up with my jobs . Thats life

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Techocracy101010
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Postby Techocracy101010 » Mon May 29, 2023 6:16 pm

The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Saiwana wrote:
None of that calculus or logic has changed up to the present day, when people really think about it. That is still going to be the outcome in the event that most of the fighting men were to die. If people don't have an alternative that can fully cover that "what if" -then it isn't obsolete and is perfectly rational.

Besides which, what does a typical military want women for, if the men that're available are preferred for almost all roles within warfare? The only major combat roles women have outperformed men on that comes to mind, are snipers and pilots. Although there may be more. Usually the men can make it through harsher training and have enough physical advantages as to make that more possible.


Female submarine crews would make sense, since you have so many small spaces on a submarine.

bulk head doors torpedos etc all are heavy trust me an all female submarine would perform no better . Being smaller is rarely a straightforward performance boost in tasks where muscle is required also most women do not want these jobs sure you can find an exception but if i were to ask men and women who is willing ti take a job where they potentially have to bash another persons skull in with the butt of a rifle i know men will way out weigh women in that. The military overall is institutionalized violence and as pointed out via crime stats women do vastly less violent crime and are not as violent so it follows that women would have less interest in violent jobs. Humans are sexually dimorphic men have denser bones and muscles our hips and upper body bone structure is thicker and more conducive to fighting. We have higher amounts of testosterone and put on muscle easier . Were naturally more aggressive were the hamer of our species disposable from a reproductive point of view. You can kill75 percent of your nations men the 25 percent left can take up their slack kill 75 percent of women your society crumbles
Last edited by Techocracy101010 on Mon May 29, 2023 6:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Kenowa
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Postby Kenowa » Mon May 29, 2023 6:17 pm

Okay when tf did this turn into a debate about prostitution?

Anyways, I believe that prostitution comes from the despair of men rather than the value of women. This can be proven by the fact that over 1 in 10 men have paid for prostitution in their lifes, not accounting for OnlyFans that is pretty much just E-Prostitution at this point. And also the fact that straight men that become prostitutes end up having sex with gay men more often than they do with women, which is unimaginable for female prostitutes.

Men desire women more than women desire men and that's just a fact. That's why there are so many incels and why men are so lonely. I don't know if it is a biological thing, a social thing or a bit of both, but it can be proven by citing Tinder's 4/1 male to female ratio.

I don't really think the theory of women going specifically for the very best man is really true, they just go for them because people in general like attractive people and we live in a physical society. If we men were able to choose between an average girl and an attractive man we would go for the later since we as humans are taught to see people as things rather than as fellow persons.

Women have the choice between three men, and the first filter is their looks. We ugly men don't hold much of a chance and most likely will die alone as our culture gets more and more narcissistic, but incels make it seem like we will get skinned alive and burnt at the stake just for being sightly unattractive, which is kinda dumb.
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Galloism
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Postby Galloism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:18 pm

Primitive Communism wrote:
Stellar Colonies wrote:alright nvm

...well I can think of a few examples.

The first being one which you've purportedly expressed concern about.

Galloism wrote:Their penises, more than anything. Do you know boys routinely suffer genital mutilation shortly after birth, something that's banned to do to girls, even with less invasive and harmful forms of it?


While I agree that circumcision should not be legal the fact girls are exempt from genital mutilation by law is not because of preference but because the practice has a greater degree of permanent health risks, or even death, when compared to circumcision. It also doesn't have any health benefits whatsoever, which is not true for circumcision. At any rate this is more an issue of children's rights than anything.


Again, female genital mutilation - even very very minor kinds like the ritual knick or the pin prick for a single drop of blood - is banned. Even though they are less harmful and have fewer permanent health risks than the most common form of male genital mutilation.

Why?

Also, the health benefits of male genital mutilation are very minor, easily offset by the harms, and largely can't be reproduced outside of Africa.

I actually disagree with this. We have a real bad problem in society where "most needed" and "most valued" are largely misaligned (a few align like doctor, but a few misalign severely like stocker trader or trucker). Trucking isn't valued as a profession despite its sheer necessity, while stock trader is valued even though their value is mostly theoretical.


You, also, are not understanding. The position itself is valuable - it would not exist otherwise - but the people in that position are not.


Are you arguing every profession - from president to prostitute - is inherently valued because it exists?

You claimed this. But in fact, even if this is the basis, it's literally the same thing - black men are seen as *more threatening* than white men, and that is the source of their oppression. Black women are seen as *more threatening* than white women. Black women are seen as *less threatening* than white men. White women are seen as least threatening overall.

This means that being black means you are seen as *more threatening*. This is explicit racial discrimination based on inborn characteristics of being black. Men are seen as *more threatening*. This is explicit seist discrimination based on the inborn characteristic of being a man.


They are seen as more threatening because they are black, not because they are men.


It is both. That's why black men get the short end of almost every conceivable stick.


The only intersectionality here is that the women are deemed less threatening than the men; which is because they're women, and society views women as being weaker than men. You're watching the river flow from the lake and into the sea and yet, for some reason, are trying to argue that the river is flowing from the sea into the lake.


Just like society views white people as being physically weaker than black people. Come on - this isn't hard. It's the same type of discrimination men suffer that black people suffer, in the same direction, for the same reason.

I hope actually pulling the exact phrase where it explicitly points out blackness and masculinity are related will get you to stop ignoring the results. The long paragraph was apparently too much to read through.


I know what you're studies say. I don't have to even read them; they're wrong.


If you refuse to read them, how do you know they are wrong?

They are looking at these phenomena wrong. They are demonstrating that women are treated as lesser than men, but are arguing the opposite - just as you are. This is the intrinsic male bias inherit in a misogynistic society: the experiences of men matter more than that of women. You're just proving me right without even realizing it.


I'm talking about discrimination. The discrimination men face for being men, when compared to the comparison group, which is women.

Do you know that most men who are raped are raped by women according to the CDC (if one uses a nonsexist definition of rape including being forced to penetrate), and according to the FBI, they almost never see justice?


This is almost certainly not true given the sheer scale of prison rape, which I'm guessing was deliberately excluded from the list. It also likely excludes the molestation of young boys by men, and of course sense a man being raped by another man is a great mark of shame and effeminacy this is very likely not even covering even half of all reported rapes of men.

But since you're bringing sexual crimes I feel the need to point out that men - not women - constitute the overwhelming majority of sex criminals, and that women - not men - constitute the overwhelming majority of victims of sexual violence. But I'm sure you have an argument for why this isn't a naked example of a misogynistic and patriarchal culture.


Molestation of children and prison rape are both included to the extent the victims are in the sample population (IE, they have a phone or an address).

Here's a handy dandy link for you:

https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/ ... rtBook.pdf

This is a sum up of 3 years of data from the CDC, where they asked people about being victimized. Even though I have some issues with the lifetime numbers here, since you brought up molestation, we will use the lifetime numbers.

In their lifetime:

1,692,000 men reported being raped by being penetrated. 86.5% reported male perpetrators only, or about 1,463,580. The remainder (about 228,420) reported either female or female and male perpetrators both.
6,764,000 men reported being raped by being made to penetrate. 78.5% reported female perpetrators only, or about 5,309,740. The remainder (about 1454260) reported either male or female and male perpetrators both.

As you can see, the majority of men who are raped are raped by women, and yet they get no justice.
Did you know that when they are raped, if a child results, not only do they as a practice get no say regarding that child, the courts will actually let the child stay with the rapist and then force the rape victim to support the rapist?

And did you know this is true even if the rape victim is a *child*?


I did know that, and it's the only accurate thing you've said so far.

Sorry, everything is accurate and sourced. The fact you don't like the results of the studies is your fault.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
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Primitive Communism
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Postby Primitive Communism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:19 pm

The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Techocracy101010 wrote:Now on sexual objectification another reason as a man i would nit mind being objectified is that it pays. I already sell my body and soul in labor if i could get a few extra bucks jerking off on a cam from women that would be great. However male camers do not make money same for strippers like very few dudes have folks pay to see them. The extra bucks would be nice


Male strippers are a thing.

Not the most common job, but if it is something you really want to do, you could always try.


Please don't encourage his self-destructive thinking.

Stellar Colonies wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:

While I agree that circumcision should not be legal the fact girls are exempt from genital mutilation by law is not because of preference but because the practice has a greater degree of permanent health risks, or even death, when compared to circumcision. It also doesn't have any health benefits whatsoever, which is not true for circumcision. At any rate this is more an issue of children's rights than anything.

...

That would depend on what type of FGM you are referring too...some forms inflict more damage than male circumcision, some inflict less. Regardless, infant genital mutilation is all the same and it all deserves to be banned.

Those medical benefits are also disputed, and even if they exist they concern a minority of cases which can be solved with far less destructive intervention. Girls experience more UTIs than boys do, and we don't see much investigation being made into whether FGM can be used for that.


FGM has not been found to have any benefits, at all, whatsoever. Not even ones that can be disputed.

But yes, I do believe genital mutilation in general should be annihilated entirely - everywhere. This is again more of a children's rights issue than a matter of sexism.

Techocracy101010 wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:
You're talking about degrading yourself for money. Please stop and listen to what you're saying; this is not a privilege that women 'enjoy'. It is humiliating and dehumanizing.


so is working 15 hour days with 2 hour commute and repeatedly nearly wrapping my car around trees due to me falling asleep while driving. If i could have earned that cash via stripping hooking or camming you bet your sweet ass i would have. I already de humanize myself and take a cocktail of ped that no one knows the long term effects of to keep up with my jobs . Thats life


That's capitalism.
going after that sweet sweet DOS

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The Sherpa Empire
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Postby The Sherpa Empire » Mon May 29, 2023 6:21 pm

Kenowa wrote:Men desire women more than women desire men and that's just a fact. That's why there are so many incels and why men are so lonely. I don't know if it is a biological thing, a social thing or a bit of both, but it can be proven by citing Tinder's 4/1 male to female ratio.


Not everyone that is interested in dating is going to use Tinder.
༄༅། །འགྲོ་བ་མི་རིགས་ག་ར་དབང་ཆ་འདྲ་མཉམ་འབད་སྒྱེཝ་ལས་ག་ར་གིས་གཅིག་གིས་གཅིག་ལུ་སྤུན་ཆའི་དམ་ཚིག་བསྟན་དགོས།
Following new legislation in The Sherpa Empire, life is short but human kindness is endless.
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Kenowa
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Postby Kenowa » Mon May 29, 2023 6:22 pm

The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Kenowa wrote:Men desire women more than women desire men and that's just a fact. That's why there are so many incels and why men are so lonely. I don't know if it is a biological thing, a social thing or a bit of both, but it can be proven by citing Tinder's 4/1 male to female ratio.


Not everyone that is interested in dating is going to use Tinder.

I know, but it's the most common dating app and a good source of information about the topic.
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"Prosperity Through Community"

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Galloism
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Postby Galloism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:23 pm

Stellar Colonies wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:

While I agree that circumcision should not be legal the fact girls are exempt from genital mutilation by law is not because of preference but because the practice has a greater degree of permanent health risks, or even death, when compared to circumcision. It also doesn't have any health benefits whatsoever, which is not true for circumcision. At any rate this is more an issue of children's rights than anything.

...

That would depend on what type of FGM you are referring too...some forms inflict more damage than male circumcision, some inflict less. Regardless, infant genital mutilation is all the same and it all deserves to be banned.

Those medical benefits are also disputed, and even if they exist they concern a minority of cases which can be solved with far less destructive intervention. A commonly cited condition, UTIs, are suffered by women far more often than men due to anatomical differences and we don't see much investigation being made into whether FGM can "treat" that.

Sadly... those from African and Middle east are trying that now. They're trying to research into the health benefits of FGM to try and carve out a niche for it like male genital mutilation has been (retroactively - it became popular as a cure for masturbation, as allegedly the memory of the pain would prevent a boy from masturbating. Thanks Dr. Kellogg.)
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


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Techocracy101010
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Postby Techocracy101010 » Mon May 29, 2023 6:23 pm

The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Techocracy101010 wrote:Now on sexual objectification another reason as a man i would nit mind being objectified is that it pays. I already sell my body and soul in labor if i could get a few extra bucks jerking off on a cam from women that would be great. However male camers do not make money same for strippers like very few dudes have folks pay to see them. The extra bucks would be nice


Male strippers are a thing.

Not the most common job, but if it is something you really want to do, you could always try.


isn’t worth it i looked into the pay rates and asked around shit i even have an of made. Turns out you mostly get gay dudes pay sucks and std rates are even higher then female strippers by a few times due to high std rates in gay men . So nah .

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Galloism
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Postby Galloism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:24 pm

Primitive Communism wrote:
FGM has not been found to have any benefits, at all, whatsoever. Not even ones that can be disputed.

But yes, I do believe genital mutilation in general should be annihilated entirely - everywhere. This is again more of a children's rights issue than a matter of sexism.

Given it's specifically allowed or banned based solely on the sex of the child, I don't see how it's NOT quite specifically sexism to say "hey, this child has bodily autonomy rights because of their sex, but this child does not because of their sex".

Techocracy101010 wrote:
The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Male strippers are a thing.

Not the most common job, but if it is something you really want to do, you could always try.


isn’t worth it i looked into the pay rates and asked around shit i even have an of made. Turns out you mostly get gay dudes pay sucks and std rates are even higher then female strippers by a few times due to high std rates in gay men . So nah .

Ok so... strippers don't have to have sex with the customers.

#StripperFacts
Last edited by Galloism on Mon May 29, 2023 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


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Kenowa
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Postby Kenowa » Mon May 29, 2023 6:25 pm

Techocracy101010 wrote:
The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Male strippers are a thing.

Not the most common job, but if it is something you really want to do, you could always try.


isn’t worth it i looked into the pay rates and asked around shit i even have an of made. Turns out you mostly get gay dudes pay sucks and std rates are even higher then female strippers by a few times due to high std rates in gay men . So nah .

... You know straight men can have STDs too, right? And also it's pretty damn common for female prostitutes to get STDs and several drug addictions while they are at it due to their work enviroment. It's not really worth it to do prostitution, like, in general. Just open an OF or something if you really are into that kind of stuff.
Last edited by Kenowa on Mon May 29, 2023 6:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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The Sherpa Empire
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Postby The Sherpa Empire » Mon May 29, 2023 6:27 pm

Primitive Communism wrote:
The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Male strippers are a thing.

Not the most common job, but if it is something you really want to do, you could always try.


Please don't encourage his self-destructive thinking.


I'm not.

What he is doing now is clearly not working for him. He's miserable and clearly needs to make some kind of change.

I don't know if being a male stripper would be an improvement or not, but that's why it's "if it is something you really want to do."
༄༅། །འགྲོ་བ་མི་རིགས་ག་ར་དབང་ཆ་འདྲ་མཉམ་འབད་སྒྱེཝ་ལས་ག་ར་གིས་གཅིག་གིས་གཅིག་ལུ་སྤུན་ཆའི་དམ་ཚིག་བསྟན་དགོས།
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Stellar Colonies
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Postby Stellar Colonies » Mon May 29, 2023 6:28 pm

Primitive Communism wrote:...

FGM has not been found to have any benefits, at all, whatsoever. Not even ones that can be disputed.

But yes, I do believe genital mutilation in general should be annihilated entirely - everywhere. This is again more of a children's rights issue than a matter of sexism.

And how is male children being subjected to genital mutilation while female children are not...not a matter of sexism? Or specifically of the subcategory misandry?

Primitive Communism wrote:That's capitalism.

Capitalism's hijacking of bigotry to gain profit, in this case the misandric type of male disposability, is well-documented.
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The Sherpa Empire
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Postby The Sherpa Empire » Mon May 29, 2023 6:29 pm

Kenowa wrote:
The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Not everyone that is interested in dating is going to use Tinder.

I know, but it's the most common dating app and a good source of information about the topic.


There's no reason to think it's a representative sample of the whole dating market.
༄༅། །འགྲོ་བ་མི་རིགས་ག་ར་དབང་ཆ་འདྲ་མཉམ་འབད་སྒྱེཝ་ལས་ག་ར་གིས་གཅིག་གིས་གཅིག་ལུ་སྤུན་ཆའི་དམ་ཚིག་བསྟན་དགོས།
Following new legislation in The Sherpa Empire, life is short but human kindness is endless.
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Techocracy101010
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Postby Techocracy101010 » Mon May 29, 2023 6:30 pm

Galloism wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:
FGM has not been found to have any benefits, at all, whatsoever. Not even ones that can be disputed.

But yes, I do believe genital mutilation in general should be annihilated entirely - everywhere. This is again more of a children's rights issue than a matter of sexism.

Given it's specifically allowed or banned based solely on the sex of the child, I don't see how it's NOT quite specifically sexism to say "hey, this child has bodily autonomy rights because of their sex, but this child does not because of their sex".

Techocracy101010 wrote:
isn’t worth it i looked into the pay rates and asked around shit i even have an of made. Turns out you mostly get gay dudes pay sucks and std rates are even higher then female strippers by a few times due to high std rates in gay men . So nah .

Ok so... strippers don't have to have sex with the customers.

#StripperFacts


you want extra cash you do . Its how you get repeat high tippers . you find a whale and keep them happy so they come back. Sure strippers say they do not engage in prostitution but thats where the cash is . I know i uhhh have been clubbing before

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Galloism
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Postby Galloism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:30 pm

Stellar Colonies wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:...

FGM has not been found to have any benefits, at all, whatsoever. Not even ones that can be disputed.

But yes, I do believe genital mutilation in general should be annihilated entirely - everywhere. This is again more of a children's rights issue than a matter of sexism.

And how is male children being subjected to genital mutilation while female children are not...not a matter of sexism? Or specifically of the subcategory misandry?

Primitive Communism wrote:That's capitalism.

Capitalism's hijacking of bigotry to gain profit, in this case the misandric type of male disposability, is well-documented.

To be clear, capitalism does this with circumcision as well.

Daily reminder that we use the removed foreskins for beauty creams (predominantly used by women). They tend to benefit from the mutilation of babies, whether they realize it or not.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
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Primitive Communism
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Posts: 172
Founded: Apr 04, 2023
Ex-Nation

Postby Primitive Communism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:31 pm

Galloism wrote:Are you arguing every profession - from president to prostitute - is inherently valued because it exists?


Well, technically speaking if it exists then, yes, it is valued by *someone* - maybe not all of society, but I digress. That doesn't mean it's *useful*, of course. We do not need either presidents or prostitutes; loggers and truckers, on the other hand are very much necessary.

It is both. That's why black men get the short end of almost every conceivable stick.


It is not both. If it was both then black women would be equal to white men.

Just like society views white people as being physically weaker than black people. Come on - this isn't hard. It's the same type of discrimination men suffer that black people suffer, in the same direction, for the same reason.


White people are not seen as physically weaker; they are seen as less aggressive, because society deems them "civilized" - something it does not extend to black people. You severely overestimating the role of sex here and severely underestimating the power of racism.

If you refuse to read them, how do you know they are wrong?


I didn't say I wasn't reading them; I said I don't need to. I know what they're arguing for, and they're looking at it wrong.

I'm talking about discrimination. The discrimination men face for being men, when compared to the comparison group, which is women.


Men do not face discrimination for being men; they face discrimination from *not* being men. We've been over this.

As you can see, the majority of men who are raped are raped by women, and yet they get no justice.


I stand corrected, then.

Except on the "get no justice" part; that is because, by being raped, they are no longer seen as men. Which goes back to my first point: un-masculine men are not equal to masculine men, and do not benefit from patriarchy as they do. This has been the case since Ancient Rome: men who had sex with men had to be the dominant party, if they were the "bottom" being penetrated they were submissive, weak, and effeminate. This hasn't changed in the last 2,000 years.

Sorry, everything is accurate and sourced. The fact you don't like the results of the studies is your fault.


I'm not disputing the results; the results affirm my views. You and the pollsters are reading the results incorrectly, almost certainly on purpose, because as I said: the experience and perspective of women doesn't matter and is not considered.
going after that sweet sweet DOS

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Techocracy101010
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Posts: 1298
Founded: May 04, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Techocracy101010 » Mon May 29, 2023 6:32 pm

Kenowa wrote:
Techocracy101010 wrote:
isn’t worth it i looked into the pay rates and asked around shit i even have an of made. Turns out you mostly get gay dudes pay sucks and std rates are even higher then female strippers by a few times due to high std rates in gay men . So nah .

... You know straight men can have STDs too, right? And also it's pretty damn common for female prostitutes to get STDs and several drug addictions while they are at it due to their work enviroment. It's not really worth it to do prostitution, like, in general. Just open an OF or something if you really are into that kind of stuff.


std risk is way lower . Anal sex has much higher transmission rate plus the population you are serving is high risk. You do not see Prep P being market to straight dudes and women as an hiv preventative as the ros in these populations is low

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Kenowa
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Founded: Nov 19, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Kenowa » Mon May 29, 2023 6:32 pm

The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Kenowa wrote:I know, but it's the most common dating app and a good source of information about the topic.


There's no reason to think it's a representative sample of the whole dating market.

People on Tinder want to date. People go on Tinder BECAUSE they want to date. If there are more men on Tinder than there are women, it is likely because men are seeking harder for women than women are seeking men. So basically men want to date more than women do.

It's not really a big streech in this case. I do get that women on Tinder have egos more inflated than the economy of Venezuela, but that's not what I'm citing.
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Ethel mermania
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Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Ethel mermania » Mon May 29, 2023 6:36 pm

Galloism wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:
FGM has not been found to have any benefits, at all, whatsoever. Not even ones that can be disputed.

But yes, I do believe genital mutilation in general should be annihilated entirely - everywhere. This is again more of a children's rights issue than a matter of sexism.

Given it's specifically allowed or banned based solely on the sex of the child, I don't see how it's NOT quite specifically sexism to say "hey, this child has bodily autonomy rights because of their sex, but this child does not because of their sex".

Techocracy101010 wrote:
isn’t worth it i looked into the pay rates and asked around shit i even have an of made. Turns out you mostly get gay dudes pay sucks and std rates are even higher then female strippers by a few times due to high std rates in gay men . So nah .

Ok so... strippers don't have to have sex with the customers.

#StripperFacts


Drat
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The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

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Galloism
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 73183
Founded: Aug 20, 2005
Father Knows Best State

Postby Galloism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:39 pm

Primitive Communism wrote:
Galloism wrote:Are you arguing every profession - from president to prostitute - is inherently valued because it exists?


Well, technically speaking if it exists then, yes, it is valued by *someone* - maybe not all of society, but I digress. That doesn't mean it's *useful*, of course. We do not need either presidents or prostitutes; loggers and truckers, on the other hand are very much necessary.


Sure, but that's not the same as valued. Until they strike.

It is both. That's why black men get the short end of almost every conceivable stick.


It is not both. If it was both then black women would be equal to white men.


Black women are treated *better* than white men when it comes to the justice system. Quite clearly and obviously. So in point of fact, since black women are *privileged* compared to *white men* when it comes to the justice system treatment (as shown in the studies above), what does that mean?

Just like society views white people as being physically weaker than black people. Come on - this isn't hard. It's the same type of discrimination men suffer that black people suffer, in the same direction, for the same reason.


White people are not seen as physically weaker; they are seen as less aggressive, because society deems them "civilized" - something it does not extend to black people. You severely overestimating the role of sex here and severely underestimating the power of racism.


Sex has a role 6 times the size of race when it comes to sentencing. I can't be overestimating it by comparing it to race when the effect is six times larger than race.

If you refuse to read them, how do you know they are wrong?


I didn't say I wasn't reading them; I said I don't need to. I know what they're arguing for, and they're looking at it wrong.


Sure. Random person on the internet.

I'm talking about discrimination. The discrimination men face for being men, when compared to the comparison group, which is women.


Men do not face discrimination for being men; they face discrimination from *not* being men. We've been over this.


Then why do men face heavier sentences for being men? When do men face genital mutilation that women do not for being men? Why do men face higher killings by police that women do not for being men?

This is all discrimination.

It's also discrimination for african americans, who suffer all the same things, on all the same lines, for all the same reasons.

As you can see, the majority of men who are raped are raped by women, and yet they get no justice.


I stand corrected, then.

Except on the "get no justice" part; that is because, by being raped, they are no longer seen as men. Which goes back to my first point: un-masculine men are not equal to masculine men, and do not benefit from patriarchy as they do. This has been the case since Ancient Rome: men who had sex with men had to be the dominant party, if they were the "bottom" being penetrated they were submissive, weak, and effeminate. This hasn't changed in the last 2,000 years.


So you probably have never talked to a man raped by a woman, so you're making these weird claims because you don't know their actual experience. They're typically not seen as unmasculine for having been raped by a woman. In fact, they're congratulated, told they're lucky, and that she must have thought he was "hot". If they press, then they're told it's impossible for a woman to rape a man, because that's been the narrative for fuck ever.

In fact, to have a woman aggressively sexually take a man is, by default, seen as a symbol of the man's masculine prowess. He's seen as *more* masculine as a result. This makes the man very uncomfortable, because although everyone else sees it that way, he does not on the inside. He sees that something has gone horribly wrong, but due to indoctrination of all the things above, he often can't put a finger on what it is, and won't call it rape - even if he's passed out, drugged, or 12 years old.

Now, where that takes a turn is if he tries to report it. I often recommend they take a lawyer if they go to the police, because one of the most common results is police to threaten them with jail or a fine for wasting police time, because they often don't believe it's even physically possible. It's not questioning his manliness - in fact, quite the reverse. It's taking his manliness, amplifying it, and using it to protect his rapist.

Sorry, everything is accurate and sourced. The fact you don't like the results of the studies is your fault.


I'm not disputing the results; the results affirm my views. You and the pollsters are reading the results incorrectly, almost certainly on purpose, because as I said: the experience and perspective of women doesn't matter and is not considered.

The results affirm that blackness and masculinity are correlated. Black men are seen as more masculine than white men, just as black women are seen as more masculine than white women.

And, quelle surprise, the discrimination that we see occurring based on sex (60% bonus to prison time for being male) carries into discrimination based on race.
Last edited by Galloism on Mon May 29, 2023 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


User avatar
Primitive Communism
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 172
Founded: Apr 04, 2023
Ex-Nation

Postby Primitive Communism » Mon May 29, 2023 6:41 pm

Galloism wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:
FGM has not been found to have any benefits, at all, whatsoever. Not even ones that can be disputed.

But yes, I do believe genital mutilation in general should be annihilated entirely - everywhere. This is again more of a children's rights issue than a matter of sexism.

Given it's specifically allowed or banned based solely on the sex of the child, I don't see how it's NOT quite specifically sexism to say "hey, this child has bodily autonomy rights because of their sex, but this child does not because of their sex".


Primarily because children don't have bodily autonomy rights at all. Children, in fact, have less rights than any other demographic and essentially constitute a slave caste.

But that's another discussion for another time.

Stellar Colonies wrote:
Primitive Communism wrote:That's capitalism.

Capitalism's hijacking of bigotry to gain profit, in this case the misandric type of male disposability, is well-documented.


It isn't "male disposability"; it's male *value*. Woman are explicitly not wanted for these positions specifically because they are seen as too weak, fragile, or cowardly for them. It is the excluded party - not the included one - which is being discriminated against. Capitalism actually benefits from the expansion of equal treatment as it allows for further exploitation of groups who were otherwise not being exploited to their full potential; bigotry in fact gets in the way of profits.

Galloism wrote:Daily reminder that we use the removed foreskins for beauty creams (predominantly used by women). They tend to benefit from the mutilation of babies, whether they realize it or not.


Yet it wasn't women who circumcised those babies, nor was it women who manufactured those creams, nor was it women who sold those creams, nor was it women who advertised said creams to women, nor was it women who decided they needed these creams because it wasn't women who decided the beauty standards that men held them to.

This is textbook "missing the forest for the trees".
going after that sweet sweet DOS

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The Sherpa Empire
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Posts: 3224
Founded: Jan 15, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Sherpa Empire » Mon May 29, 2023 6:41 pm

Kenowa wrote:
The Sherpa Empire wrote:
There's no reason to think it's a representative sample of the whole dating market.

People on Tinder want to date. People go on Tinder BECAUSE they want to date. If there are more men on Tinder than there are women, it is likely because men are seeking harder for women than women are seeking men. So basically men want to date more than women do.

It's not really a big streech in this case. I do get that women on Tinder have egos more inflated than the economy of Venezuela, but that's not what I'm citing.


You need to account for the fact that even if people want to date, they won't necessarily take the same approach to looking for a date.

Like I want to date, but I wouldn't touch Tinder with a 10 ft pole.
༄༅། །འགྲོ་བ་མི་རིགས་ག་ར་དབང་ཆ་འདྲ་མཉམ་འབད་སྒྱེཝ་ལས་ག་ར་གིས་གཅིག་གིས་གཅིག་ལུ་སྤུན་ཆའི་དམ་ཚིག་བསྟན་དགོས།
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Kenowa
Envoy
 
Posts: 319
Founded: Nov 19, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Kenowa » Mon May 29, 2023 6:43 pm

The Sherpa Empire wrote:
Kenowa wrote:People on Tinder want to date. People go on Tinder BECAUSE they want to date. If there are more men on Tinder than there are women, it is likely because men are seeking harder for women than women are seeking men. So basically men want to date more than women do.

It's not really a big streech in this case. I do get that women on Tinder have egos more inflated than the economy of Venezuela, but that's not what I'm citing.


You need to account for the fact that even if people want to date, they won't necessarily take the same approach to looking for a date.

Like I want to date, but I wouldn't touch Tinder with a 10 ft pole.

Same here, but let's think about it. Tinder is inherently a woman-centric space, as they are looked for instead of them looking for men. If a woman was truly down bad she can open Tinder, do the most half-assed profile and get a date in hours. But men cannot do that, because Tinder and most dating apps are mostly full of men. So men want to date more, so women are in higher demand because of straight men.
Last edited by Kenowa on Mon May 29, 2023 6:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
✿ Co Dimokratiá Tde Kenowa ★
"Prosperity Through Community"

He/Him, 17, Apparently a fascist, Argentinean
“We must create a kind of globalization that works for everyone and not just for a few.”
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