Civil Discourse: A History Thread

[The Grand Fifth Imperium]

"The past is the key to the future." 

This is perhaps one of the most cliché statements one could make, but there is a bit of inherent truth in it, namely, that if you do not know where you have been, you cannot know where you are; if you do not know where you are, you cannot know where it is that you are going. 

Inspired somewhat by La Xinga's NationStates Elects the President, I decided it would be nice to have an OOC thread where people can discuss all things history.* After all, history is a very important and interesting thing, much more than the boring list of names, dates, and places that most education systems makes it out to be. History is rather the stories of men and women of the past— tales of their exploits, adventures, and ideas. History is the recording medium of the fateful twists and turns of time that bring about the rise and fall of empires. History is the greatest epic to be written! The story of human civilization! 

So that is the purpose of this thread: the dissemination of knowledge of the past. It doesn't have to be serious either. Tell us a funny history fact! (Like the time a reporter sat on J. Q. Adams' clothes while he was swimming nude in the Potomac, and refused to get up until the President did an interview.) Give us an interesting story of your grandparents or great-grandparents or whatever that gives insight into the times in which they lived.** (I would say try to keep it historically relevant. Like I might tell you how food was so scarce in WWII Italy my grandfather ate a cat, but I wouldn't consider how your grandmother lost her hearing aids in the couch cushions to be providing much historical insight.) Talk about how the Egyptian pyramids were built; talk about the Mongolian Empire; talk about Native American archeological finds; talk about whatever! (History related, of course; I assure you, Moderation isn't fond of threadjacking.) 

Also, I understand historical facts can often be interpreted many different ways, but as a friendly reminder, please do keep it civil. (Hence the title.)

EDIT: I have decided to add a weekly poll. I will try to put up a new poll as soon as the old one expires but I promise nothing. Results of the polls will be kept in the following spoiler:

Weekly Poll One: Was Napoleon a Good Person

Yes, he was a champion of the Enlightenment ideals: 3 votes - 15%
No, he was a tyrant filled with powerlust: 7 votes - 35%
Yes, for other reasons: 6 votes - 30%
No, for other reasons: 0 votes - 0%
I don't know: 0 votes - 0%
Isn't that an ice cream flavor?: 4 votes - 20%

______________________________

Weekly Poll Two: Which Ancient Civilization was Best

Celtic: 2 votes - 6%
Chinese: 2 votes - 6%
Egyptian: 2 votes - 6%
Greek: 2 votes - 6%
Hebrew: 3 votes - 9%
Incan: 5 votes - 16%
Phoenician: 1 vote - 3%
Roman: 6 votes - 19%
None of them: 6 votes - 19%
Crap I'm out of options: 3 votes - 9%
Total votes : 32

______________________________

Weekly Poll Three: Who was the Best General
*suggested by La Xing*

*Friendly heads up: for the most part, I would not consider present events or politics (especially the latter) to be relevant to a history thread. 
**Another friendly heads up, keep it PG-13, as per site rules.

[Estebere]

Interesting historical fact: There almost was a war between France and Brazil over fishing rights on the coast(or close to it) of Brazil, with French fishermen operating there due to the demand that people in France had for lobster. Brazil didn’t like that, so they sent warships to get the French ships to leave, but France just sent warships to protect their ships and so things began escalating, but luckily France and Brazil reached an agreement and a third world war never came about. Well, that probably wouldn’t have caused one anyways but it’s a possibility.

[The Grand Fifth Imperium]

Idk why but that reminds me of the time the US almost went to war Britain over a pig. (Probably the whole ridiculous "big war over miniscule problem" thing.) Rather amusing, in my opinion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pig_War_(1859)

[La Xinga]

Inspired somewhat by La Xinga's NationStates Elects the President,

*happies*

Anyway, Cato the Younger was a terrible person. Change my mind.

Idk why but that reminds me of the time the US almost went to war Britain over a pig. (Probably the whole ridiculous "big war over miniscule problem" thing.) Rather amusing, in my opinion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pig_War_(1859)

I enjoyed Oversimplified's video on it, though I don't know how accurate it is.

[The Grand Fifth Imperium]

Why d'you say Cato was terrible? Is it because his middle name is Porcius? (It would be pronounced Porky-oos in Classical Roman, which is hilarious.) Or is it because he opposed Caesar? And Pompey. And Caesar again. Either way, Idk much about Cato the younger other than the basics, and that he was in Bill Shakespeare's Julius Caesar.

[La Xinga]

Why d'you say Cato was terrible? Is it because his middle name is Porcius? (It would be pronounced Porky-oos in Classical Roman, which is hilarious.) Or is it because he opposed Caesar? And Pompey. And Caesar again.

Because they could've almost avoided a civil war, at least for the time, by accepting the Caesarian faction's pretty moderate offer here. However, Cato rejected it, and caused his own downfall.

[Southland]

The Pyramids were not actually built by Israelite slaves. The common archeological consensus is that they were built by both skilled workers and poor farmers in the off-season. The slaves account was first proposed by Herodotus (who was the "Source: Dude trust me" meme personified in antiquity), with it being popularized during the Renaissance.

[La Xinga]

The Pyramids were not actually built by Israelite slaves. The common archeological consensus is that they were built by both skilled workers and poor farmers in the off-season. The slaves account was first proposed by Herodotus (who was the "Source: Dude trust me" meme personified in antiquity), with it being popularized during the Renaissance.

In fact, Jewish tradition (at least Orthodox) claims that פרעה (Pharaoh) had them build on unstable land, causing whatever they built to crumble, forcing them to rebuild it all again.

[Verkhoyanska]

The Anglo-Zanzibar war was the shortest war in history, and lasted for a grand total of around FORTY MINUTES.


You could call that a skirmish by how short it was compared to today's standards (looking at you, Afghanistan!).

[La Xinga]

The Anglo-Zanzibar war was the shortest war in history, and lasted for a grand total of around FORTY MINUTES.


You could call that a skirmish by how short it was compared to today's standards (looking at you, Afghanistan!).

At the same time, it really wasn't a fair fight.

[The United Penguin Commonwealth]

fun fact I learned today: the papal tiara wasn’t always three-tiered. it used to be just one hat, but two popes in the 12-1300s decided to add on two more.

[The Grand Fifth Imperium]

The Pyramids were not actually built by Israelite slaves. The common archeological consensus is that they were built by both skilled workers and poor farmers in the off-season. The slaves account was first proposed by Herodotus (who was the "Source: Dude trust me" meme personified in antiquity), with it being popularized during the Renaissance.

Ah yes, Herodotus, alternatively known as "The Father of History" and/or "The Father of Lies". But in his defense, he told history more as a way of entertaining people than as a way of recording the past. Relying on Herodotus would be like reading Macbeth as an accurate account of Scottish history. Not to mention that ancient historians in general had a tendency to write up hearsay and legend as fact. Shoot, just this afternoon I was reading Amerigo Vespucci's (yes, I know that's not exactly ancient, but bear with me here) account of his first voyage to the Americas, and he wrote about an island which some of the natives he encountered had said was inhabited only by warrior women who wore suits of bronze armor. I wondered if they ordered those off Amazon? I think I'm very punny, don't I?

[Greater Qwerty]

Henry Wallace was five feet away from becoming the US president in 1944.

[The Grand Fifth Imperium]

So I was thinking, should I add some kind of history related poll? Truthfully I can't think of anything in particular to poll, but I've noticed discussion threads with polls tend to keep people's attention more. (And are all around better, in my not so humble opinion.)

[La Xinga]

So I was thinking, should I add some kind of history related poll? Truthfully I can't think of anything in particular to poll, but I've noticed discussion threads with polls tend to keep people's attention more. (And are all around better, in my not so humble opinion.)

It could be fun:

1. Who was the best general in history?
2. Which side would you have wanted to win in the Napoleonic Wars?
3. Who is the best heir to the Roman Empire, Charlamagne, the Kingdom of Franc, etc, etc?
4. What do you think was the cause of the Bronze Age Collapse?
5. Was the colonization of the Americas a net good for the world?
6. Who was the greatest Roman Emperor?

There are many more ideas!

[Vrbo]

Idk why but that reminds me of the time the US almost went to war Britain over a pig. (Probably the whole ridiculous "big war over miniscule problem" thing.) Rather amusing, in my opinion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pig_War_(1859)

I enjoyed Oversimplified's video on it, though I don't know how accurate it is.

It is meant to be an oversimplified and dramatized version of it, obviously going in with a grain of salt is best. However, he does do good research, but his sarcasm can run so dry it really does blur the line between sarcasm and reality. While yes, the pig was a catalyst I would argue the generals and military decision-makers were a larger reason as to why it escalated.

[Ethel mermania]

The Pyramids were not actually built by Israelite slaves. The common archeological consensus is that they were built by both skilled workers and poor farmers in the off-season. The slaves account was first proposed by Herodotus (who was the "Source: Dude trust me" meme personified in antiquity), with it being popularized during the Renaissance.

Best part of the pyramid construction:

You were part of the construction team, your wife gets her period, you get the day off.

[Soviet Haaregrad]

Interesting historical fact: There almost was a war between France and Brazil over fishing rights on the coast(or close to it) of Brazil, with French fishermen operating there due to the demand that people in France had for lobster. Brazil didn’t like that, so they sent warships to get the French ships to leave, but France just sent warships to protect their ships and so things began escalating, but luckily France and Brazil reached an agreement and a third world war never came about. Well, that probably wouldn’t have caused one anyways but it’s a possibility.

I seem to recall Canada and Spain, and Iceland and the UK having similar beefs.

[Haganham]

The Pyramids were not actually built by Israelite slaves. The common archeological consensus is that they were built by both skilled workers and poor farmers in the off-season. The slaves account was first proposed by Herodotus (who was the "Source: Dude trust me" meme personified in antiquity), with it being popularized during the Renaissance.

Indeed, By the time of Exodus the pyramids where already over a thousand years old.

[The Grand Fifth Imperium]

So I was thinking, should I add some kind of history related poll? Truthfully I can't think of anything in particular to poll, but I've noticed discussion threads with polls tend to keep people's attention more. (And are all around better, in my not so humble opinion.)

It could be fun:

1. Who was the best general in history?
2. Which side would you have wanted to win in the Napoleonic Wars?
3. Who is the best heir to the Roman Empire, Charlamagne, the Kingdom of Franc, etc, etc?
4. What do you think was the cause of the Bronze Age Collapse?
5. Was the colonization of the Americas a net good for the world?
6. Who was the greatest Roman Emperor?

There are many more ideas!

Good suggestions! From hence forth:
If anyone has poll suggestions, telegram me. (I might not see it on the thread.)

[Bombadil]

The Pyramids were not actually built by Israelite slaves. The common archeological consensus is that they were built by both skilled workers and poor farmers in the off-season. The slaves account was first proposed by Herodotus (who was the "Source: Dude trust me" meme personified in antiquity), with it being popularized during the Renaissance.

Best part of the pyramid construction:

You were part of the construction team, your wife gets her period, you get the day off.

That's the last day I want to be stuck at home..

[Ethel mermania]

Best part of the pyramid construction:

You were part of the construction team, your wife gets her period, you get the day off.

That's the last day I want to be stuck at home..

So they were being cruel? And I of all people should know better.

[Pizza Friday Forever91]

I do not like Kaiser Wilhelm the second.

[The Grand Fifth Imperium]

I do not like Kaiser Wilhelm the second.

Ok. That's totally not just randomly out of the blue. Any particular reason?

[La Xinga]

I do not like Kaiser Wilhelm the second.

Ok. That's totally not just randomly out of the blue.

Is this thread being poll-based? I thought this was a thread where we could talk about all history, just like we're able to talk about all food in TFDI. We're able to do that here too, right?