Calls for violence against LGBTQ people intensify

[Arkhane]

As much as I like to believe that we live in a world where rights and privileges are not zero sum, that is not the case.

Only one side wins the war, while one nation is a world power, enjoying the privilege of resources and freedoms mean subjugating other countries to produce the labor and supplies the other needs, we have chocolate and designer clothes because at some part of the world, plantation slaves and sweatshop workers are forced to produce them for our consumption.

As per laws and legislation, its near impossible to make them cater to all which is why we vote and deliberate on them.

One side winning means the other side will have to acquiesce and agree to the terms that were voted on. Some people want guns to give themselves security while others want guns gone altogether for the same reason. Some people want their pronouns respected and validated while others feel respect is earned and must be consensually given.

There is no perfect, non-zero sum solution, the best we have is a case by case investigation and specific review, which is why the law and politics is so messy and complex.

Unfortunately, posts like these make it into a black and white situation where the only apparent solution is open conflict. Something that has never worked in the history of humanity.

Then good news, bud, the right are going to lose on this just like they lost on gay marriage. Most people don't buy into their fearmongering about the transes coming to hose down entire school districts with hormones. That's part of why they did so bad in the midterms.

Then I fail to see this post on why it's insisting that the lgbt community is in some sort of peril and that the only solution is force and open conflict like the others claim.

[Necroghastia]

...Remind me, whose rights are being negatively impacted by trans people having access to healthcare?

Given the faction supporting trans healthcare opposes unfettered free speech, the right to bear arms, the right to self-defense against child molesters (Rittenhouse), etc. quite a few people’s. But, more generally, rights as a concept require balancing disparate and conflicting interests in many cases. Or winning people over.

It's not my fault they can't support more rights.

[Necroghastia]

Then good news, bud, the right are going to lose on this just like they lost on gay marriage. Most people don't buy into their fearmongering about the transes coming to hose down entire school districts with hormones. That's part of why they did so bad in the midterms.

Then I fail to see this post on why it's insisting that the lgbt community is in some sort of peril and that the only solution is force and open conflict like the others claim.

Children are being separated from their families. Trans *adults* are having their healthcare taken from them. People wearing clothes not associated with the letter on their birth certificate are being considered "impersonators" and treated as if they are doing a strip show to children. Lawmakers are openly calling us literal demons. And that's just a start.

[Rhodevus]

Then good news, bud, the right are going to lose on this just like they lost on gay marriage. Most people don't buy into their fearmongering about the transes coming to hose down entire school districts with hormones. That's part of why they did so bad in the midterms.

Then I fail to see this post on why it's insisting that the lgbt community is in some sort of peril and that the only solution is force and open conflict like the others claim.

Just because the right will eventually lose doesn't mean they aren't causing damage now.

[Ifreann]

Then good news, bud, the right are going to lose on this just like they lost on gay marriage. Most people don't buy into their fearmongering about the transes coming to hose down entire school districts with hormones. That's part of why they did so bad in the midterms.

Then I fail to see this post on why it's insisting that the lgbt community is in some sort of peril and that the only solution is force and open conflict like the others claim.

Because the right isn't going to lose quietly. People radicalised by the right wing media machine are going attack the LGBT community.

[Fahran]

Given the faction supporting trans healthcare opposes unfettered free speech, the right to bear arms, the right to self-defense against child molesters (Rittenhouse), etc. quite a few people’s. But, more generally, rights as a concept require balancing disparate and conflicting interests in many cases. Or winning people over.

It's not my fault they can't support more rights.

I didn’t say it was your fault, hon, though, even if it was for whatever reason, it doesn’t make sense not to pursue your rights simply because they conflict with somebody else’s. I was pointing out before that, as a political community, we balance these things out through discourse, policy, and coercion. That’s just how it works.

EDIT: Also, just recalled from my convos with Suri that “hon” is potentially a slur in trans circles. That’s not how I was using it.

[Arkhane]

Then I fail to see this post on why it's insisting that the lgbt community is in some sort of peril and that the only solution is force and open conflict like the others claim.

Just because the right will eventually lose doesn't mean they aren't causing damage now.

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

[Washington Resistance Army]

As much as I like to believe that we live in a world where rights and privileges are not zero sum, that is not the case.

Only one side wins the war, while one nation is a world power, enjoying the privilege of resources and freedoms mean subjugating other countries to produce the labor and supplies the other needs, we have chocolate and designer clothes because at some part of the world, plantation slaves and sweatshop workers are forced to produce them for our consumption.

As per laws and legislation, its near impossible to make them cater to all which is why we vote and deliberate on them.

One side winning means the other side will have to acquiesce and agree to the terms that were voted on. Some people want guns to give themselves security while others want guns gone altogether for the same reason. Some people want their pronouns respected and validated while others feel respect is earned and must be consensually given.

There is no perfect, non-zero sum solution, the best we have is a case by case investigation and specific review, which is why the law and politics is so messy and complex.

Unfortunately, posts like these make it into a black and white situation where the only apparent solution is open conflict. Something that has never worked in the history of humanity.

Then good news, bud, the right are going to lose on this just like they lost on gay marriage. Most people don't buy into their fearmongering about the transes coming to hose down entire school districts with hormones. That's part of why they did so bad in the midterms.

I wouldn't be so sure on this, actually. Polling has shown the majority views on the topic are pretty all over the place and doesn't really lean in favor of what either side is preaching. WaPo did a poll a few months back that showed while the majority support gender affirming therapy and counseling they also support bans on puberty blockers and hormone treatments for children and teenagers, as an example.

[Rhodevus]

...Remind me, whose rights are being negatively impacted by trans people having access to healthcare?

Given the faction supporting trans healthcare opposes unfettered free speech, the right to bear arms, the right to self-defense against child molesters (Rittenhouse), etc. quite a few people’s. But, more generally, rights as a concept require balancing disparate and conflicting interests in many cases. Or winning people over.

of these, I'm pro-trans rights, pro-free speech (against the government. in the case of everyone else? Well, you have the right to speak, and also the right to the consequences of what you say). I'm anti-guns, and pro-the torture and killing of child molesters, as long as they are actual child molesters and not just trans people whom the state have labelled as child molesters because they are trans (ahem. I'm looking at you, Florida)

[Rhodevus]

Just because the right will eventually lose doesn't mean they aren't causing damage now.

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

It's not the automatic solution. If it was, there would be a lot more LGBT+ led shootings (yes, there are 4 or so in the last bunch of years. I know). The solution that is being used by the vast VAST vast majority is protest and voting. sitting down and discussing things is the reasonable and calm way that has resulted in winning rights. Not rocking the boat? Well, that has only ever lead to no change.

edit: also, the LGBT community isn't a hive mind. If you a letter, you in the community

[Ifreann]

Just because the right will eventually lose doesn't mean they aren't causing damage now.

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

Gay rights weren't won by sitting down and not rocking the boat, there was a big fucking riot.

[The Black Forrest]

...Remind me, whose rights are being negatively impacted by trans people having access to healthcare?

Given the faction supporting trans healthcare opposes unfettered free speech, the right to bear arms, the right to self-defense against child molesters (Rittenhouse), etc. quite a few people’s. But, more generally, rights as a concept require balancing disparate and conflicting interests in many cases. Or winning people over.

I don’t think Rittenhouse knew he was a child molester and I don’t think there was an attempt of sexual assault involved.

Unfettered free speech? That’s usually the complaint of those who want to say whatever they want to whomever they want without ramifications. Last comment I overheard talking about that was they felt it was wrong to be punished for calling people the “N bomb”

[Neutraligon]

Just because the right will eventually lose doesn't mean they aren't causing damage now.

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

[Rhodevus]

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

*aside from stonewall

[Fahran]

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

Homofront existed on II at one point.

[Arkhane]

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

I made no such claims, I specifically mentioned that we have won our rights by patiently deliberating instead of holding a gun at people. I propose we continue to do so.

Some of the people in this thread, as well as extremist views in the general community, however, do not agree and claim violence and open force of arms is needed in order to defend their rights.

[Neutraligon]

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

*aside from stonewall

Which was a response to police violence.

[American Legionaries]

Again, I ask, why is the solution automatically violence and conflict? If sitting down and not rocking the boat and discussing things reasonably and calmly has resulted in winning rights through votes and deliberation, why not continue?

Bloodthirst and impulsive resort to force is also one of the reasons I left the lgbt community.

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

I mean, I've seen some rather violent actions from lgbt folks. Saw a guy get acquainted with some pavement at high velocity for calling a dude a "faggot" at a bar once.

[Rhodevus]

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

Homofront existed on II at one point.

on II? As in International Incidents? The fiction roleplaying forum on NS?

[Fahran]

Given the faction supporting trans healthcare opposes unfettered free speech, the right to bear arms, the right to self-defense against child molesters (Rittenhouse), etc. quite a few people’s. But, more generally, rights as a concept require balancing disparate and conflicting interests in many cases. Or winning people over.

I don’t think Rittenhouse knew he was a child molester and I don’t think there was an attempt of sexual assault involved.

Unfettered free speech? That’s usually the complaint of those who want to say whatever they want to whomever they want without ramifications. Last comment I overheard talking about that was they felt it was wrong to be punished for calling people the “N bomb”

I was being a touch absurd there on purpose, but you do understand my point, yes?

Was this person a fourteen year old gamer? But, in any case, shouting the n-word probably shouldn’t be illegal, even if it’s widely and rightly seen as a dick move. If we criminalized saying offensive or stupid things, I’d be sending a lot of people to the pony farm for reformation.

[Rhodevus]

Where in general has the lgbt movement been violent?

I mean, I've seen some rather violent actions from lgbt folks. Saw a guy get acquainted with some pavement at high velocity for calling a dude a "faggot" at a bar once.

As in, a person f*cked around and found out? You call a black duded the N-word, you're probably gonna get acquainted with some pavement too. Does that mean black folks are violent?

[Fahran]

Homofront existed on II at one point.

on II? As in International Incidents? The fiction roleplaying forum on NS?

Yes, you understood the joke.

[American Legionaries]

I mean, I've seen some rather violent actions from lgbt folks. Saw a guy get acquainted with some pavement at high velocity for calling a dude a "faggot" at a bar once.

As in, a person f*cked around and found out? You call a black duded the N-word, you're probably gonna get acquainted with some pavement too. Does that mean black folks are violent?

If a black man slammed the face of someone into pavement, that would be violent, yes.

[Rhodevus]

on II? As in International Incidents? The fiction roleplaying forum on NS?

Yes, you understood the joke.

sorry, kinda hard to tell jokes/sarcasm on a written platform.

[Stellar Colonies]

Homofront existed on II at one point.

on II? As in International Incidents? The fiction roleplaying forum on NS?

It was a roleplay thing.