Is safety or freedom better?

[Zerotaxia]

You have all the personal freedom when you're the last person on earth, but you have no-one to help when you need it. On the other hand, if you're not allowed to do things because theyre unsafe you have basically no learning opportunities.

So as usual, theres a golden middle(or gray area) where we're protected from the worst excesses of both. I find myself sticking to this gray area, though I do stretch or shrink it from time to time and depending on the moral justifications of an issue, I might move within the gray area or move it entirely.

1. No one should be forced to help anyone else.
2. No one should be forced to accept help from anyone.

The police are a government monopoly that you are forced to pay for and use, with no way to opt out of the system. If you want safety and protection (which police suck at btw), fine; but don't force your choice on others.

[Pangurstan]

You have all the personal freedom when you're the last person on earth, but you have no-one to help when you need it. On the other hand, if you're not allowed to do things because theyre unsafe you have basically no learning opportunities.

So as usual, theres a golden middle(or gray area) where we're protected from the worst excesses of both. I find myself sticking to this gray area, though I do stretch or shrink it from time to time and depending on the moral justifications of an issue, I might move within the gray area or move it entirely.

1. No one should be forced to help anyone else.
2. No one should be forced to accept help from anyone.

The police are a government monopoly that you are forced to pay for and use, with no way to opt out of the system. If you want safety and protection (which police suck at btw), fine; but don't force your choice on others.

liberalism moment

[Ryemarch]

1. No one should be forced to help anyone else.

Have fun building your own roads, then.

[Techocracy101010]

Have fun building your own roads, then.

thats life though no ones ever gonna help me nor am i obligated to help them. You pay for your own healthcare you pay for your transportation house education etc . The only thing the govt does is facilitate transportation and keep the only recognized monopoly on violence ( not a fan of that bit.)

[Ryemarch]

I'd argue that in a civilized society you don't pay for your own healthcare or education, but go off.

[Floofybit]

No?

Could have fooled us.

Could have. But pretending I have a kink isn't as fun as other things

[Neutraligon]

I do not think you can have safety without freedom. After all a government that rules all can do anything, meaning that it's people are not safe from it.

[Narland]

Have fun building your own roads, then.

People do build their own roads in many locations out West. It isn't that complicated. But it is hard work that takes dedication, skill, and people who know what they are doing.

Most government controlled roads deliberately sacrifice the quality of durability for make-work to keep a batch of people perpetually employed (inefficiently). It's overall inefficiency as an
insulate bureaucracy further decreases the quality of life and standard of living of those affected. The more the government gets in the way the more costly it is for us to build and maintain our roads.

Roads are best maintained by those who have most to gain by facilitating the natural liberty of individuals to exercise their right to travel freely by their most accustomed means of conveyance, and from the beneficence that it brings to others. Roads can be built and maintained without the force and coercion of bureaucratic taskmasters. As a person who has contributed to building and maintaining our own roads, I prefer private citizens and our communities contracted for public works. In rural communities, we can do it safer, faster, and more efficient than some disconnected bureaucracy always needing more and more money and giving less and less in return. I am sure a case can be made to return roadbuilding back to the public in places like New Jersey where the cost of infrastructure that is promised and the negligence it delivers borders on criminal fraud.

Roads Without the State - FEE

[Relikai]

Freedom of living taken away in Allen Texas yet again

[Kernen]

Freedom of living taken away in Allen Texas yet again

Still no reason to start oppressing folk.

[Relikai]

Freedom of living taken away in Allen Texas yet again

Still no reason to start oppressing folk.

Yes let folks oppress folks and have the same folks lose more folks.

Sounds like a good idea to have the trash take themselves out.

[Alasiqak]

Have fun building your own roads, then.

thats life though no ones ever gonna help me nor am i obligated to help them. You pay for your own healthcare you pay for your transportation house education etc . The only thing the govt does is facilitate transportation and keep the only recognized monopoly on violence ( not a fan of that bit.)

That’s asinine. All of human history has been about helping each other out and living in social groups, if you don’t want to participate in that then fine, go exile yourself to the woods and stop bothering the normal social primates.

[Alasiqak]

.

[Techocracy101010]

thats life though no ones ever gonna help me nor am i obligated to help them. You pay for your own healthcare you pay for your transportation house education etc . The only thing the govt does is facilitate transportation and keep the only recognized monopoly on violence ( not a fan of that bit.)

That’s asinine. All of human history has been about helping each other out and living in social groups, if you don’t want to participate in that then fine, go exile yourself to the woods and stop bothering the normal social primates.

i keep trying but yall keep expanding civilization i moved 2,000 plus miles lol where i live now our winters hit -50 f. And yes in america no one helps us really pay . We just get fucked just how life is and will be forever . So i just adapt to it.

[Zadea]

I think it's a given that both safety and freedom are important.

I pretty much believe that people should have the freedom to do whatever they want up until the point where that freedom infringes on the freedom and safety of others.

[Kernen]

Still no reason to start oppressing folk.

Yes let folks oppress folks and have the same folks lose more folks.

Sounds like a good idea to have the trash take themselves out.

Exactly.

[Kernen]

thats life though no ones ever gonna help me nor am i obligated to help them. You pay for your own healthcare you pay for your transportation house education etc . The only thing the govt does is facilitate transportation and keep the only recognized monopoly on violence ( not a fan of that bit.)

That’s asinine. All of human history has been about helping each other out and living in social groups, if you don’t want to participate in that then fine, go exile yourself to the woods and stop bothering the normal social primates.

Technocracy is right. You lot have made it impossible to totally detach from the rest of society. Until you give us the option to actually disconnect, there's no reason to stop frustrating your eusocial dystopia. I have no problem living on a self sustaining plot with only those who chose to join me, but I can't just leave you alone. You still demand taxes and compliance with regulations that I shouldn't have to comply with if I'm detaching from society anyway.

Until you make opting out a real choice, many of us are going to keep fighting to minimize those obligations.

[Relikai]

Yes let folks oppress folks and have the same folks lose more folks.

Sounds like a good idea to have the trash take themselves out.

Exactly.

Found the simp for mass murders

[Engadine Mcdonalds 1997]

Have the state provide what is needed for the population, thus allowing for true freedom from the struggles of economic hardship, whilst simultaneously destroying those who would seek to dismantle this envisioned system, thus providing safety

[Floofybit]

Have the state provide what is needed for the population, thus allowing for true freedom from the struggles of economic hardship, whilst simultaneously destroying those who would seek to dismantle this envisioned system, thus providing safety

That sounds like a nice idea.

[Kernen]

Exactly.

Found the simp for mass murders

I believe in a self cleaning system.

[Engadine Mcdonalds 1997]

Have the state provide what is needed for the population, thus allowing for true freedom from the struggles of economic hardship, whilst simultaneously destroying those who would seek to dismantle this envisioned system, thus providing safety

That sounds like a nice idea.

It's literally what the Soviet Union attempted and what the PRC is going to shift towards lmao

[Vossiya Foxia]

If you sacrifice freedom for the sake of security. you deserve NEITHER.

Not my opinion, but Benjamin Franklin´s.

[Relikai]

If you sacrifice freedom for the sake of security. you deserve NEITHER.

Not my opinion, but Benjamin Franklin´s.

So many people worshipping a zombie

[Kernen]

If you sacrifice freedom for the sake of security. you deserve NEITHER.

Not my opinion, but Benjamin Franklin´s.

So many people worshipping a zombie

Some zombies have wisdom worth heeding.