Gun Control 2023 (V) - ATF Shenanigans, States Fight Back!

[Ryemarch]

Then why not say "I don't see the fact that the United States has had nearly 200 mass shootings in 2023 (so far) as a problem."?

Is it because the follow-up question will likely be along the lines of "Why not?"

Oh look, it's that number again.

Ah, my apologies. How many dead children is too many?

[Paddy O Fernature]

Oh look, it's that number again.

Ah, my apologies. How many dead children is too many?

[American Legionaries]

Oh look, it's that number again.

Ah, my apologies. How many dead children is too many?

Why do you assume there's a number?

[Ryemarch]

Ah, my apologies. How many dead children is too many?

I disagree, but at least you have the courage to be upfront about it.

[The Two Jerseys]

Why would I "fix" something that isn't a problem?

Then why not say "I don't see the fact that the United States has had nearly 200 mass shootings in 2023 (so far) as a problem."?

Is it because the follow-up question will likely be along the lines of "Why not?"

You gonna provide a credible source for that number?

[Grinning Dragon]

Oh look, it's that number again.

Ah, my apologies. How many dead children is too many?

So.. dead adults are tolerable but dead kids is a bridge too far?
Look the only reason you are using "children" is for the emotional angle.
Other than that, my rights trump your dead.

[Urkennalaid]

Being like, "I don't care how many children die as long as other people get to get easy access to guns" does make you guys look psychotic so thank you for doing more activism for those who want gun reform. If you're going to be like, "all children should die before I consider allowing gun reform" then you're just genuinely making an argument for pro gun reform.

[Urkennalaid]

Ah, my apologies. How many dead children is too many?

So.. dead adults are tolerable but dead kids is a bridge too far?
Look the only reason you are using "children" is for the emotional angle.
Other than that, my rights trump your dead.

Yeah, tell that to a parent of a school shooting victim. Not even republicans would say that openly.

Also, yeah, people are using children for the emotional angle, but it's more telling on YOU that you're like, "I don't care."

[Grinning Dragon]

Being like, "I don't care how many children die as long as other people get to get easy access to guns" does make you guys look psychotic so thank you for doing more activism for those who want gun reform. If you're going to be like, "all children should die before I consider allowing gun reform" then you're just genuinely making an argument for pro gun reform.

And yet, more children die by accidental death and car accidents than by someone with a firearm.
But please go on with the plea to emotion.

[Urkennalaid]

Being like, "I don't care how many children die as long as other people get to get easy access to guns" does make you guys look psychotic so thank you for doing more activism for those who want gun reform. If you're going to be like, "all children should die before I consider allowing gun reform" then you're just genuinely making an argument for pro gun reform.

And yet, more children die by accidental death and car accidents than by someone with a firearm.
But please go on with the plea to emotion.

I don't need to use appeal to emotion, cause if you straight up admit you don't care about school shooting victims, then you're already making your side look psychotic. "Appeal to emotion" in response to dead children is just...insane.

[Grinning Dragon]

And yet, more children die by accidental death and car accidents than by someone with a firearm.
But please go on with the plea to emotion.

I don't need to use appeal to emotion, cause if you straight up admit you don't care about school shooting victims, then you're already making your side look psychotic. "Appeal to emotion" in response to dead children is just...insane.

The fact that you seem to know my thoughts and mind, please tell me how I feel about faster than light travel?

[Ryemarch]

You gonna provide a credible source for that number?

I'm quite certain there's no source you'd consider credible.

So.. dead adults are tolerable but dead kids is a bridge too far?
Look the only reason you are using "children" is for the emotional angle.

It's very considerate of you to tell me why I'm referring to children, since obviously you know my mind better than I do myself /s

The fact that you seem to know my thoughts and mind

Pot; kettle.

I mention the children because they're the people who least deserve to be victims of fatal violence in my eyes.

Other than that, my rights trump your dead.

So is it simply that they're "my" dead? Would you care if it was your loved ones being murdered, or would your right to bear arms still matter more than their right to life?

Edited to highlight Grinning Dragon's hypocrisy on the subject of mind-reading.

[Urkennalaid]

At this point, I don't even care. Your rights aren't being restricted, every first world country has been able to do this and it fixed the problem. If you're going to be like, "I don't care how many children need to die" I'm going to be like, "I don't care if gun restrictions make it harder to own guns."

Straight up don't even care anymore. Your need to feel powerful with a gun isn't as important as children not having to worry about dying and needing to be taught battlefield medical care

[Galloism]

Naturally, addressing the actual social causes of violence is superior to banning implement after implement thereof and leaving the actual causes unaddressed.

Honestly even putting the political realities aside I’m not sure we could fix the root causes. American society is fundamentally broken in so many different ways that it might as well not even exist. I’m not sure what could be done to try and rectify that.

That’s pessimistic.

[Ryemarch]

Honestly even putting the political realities aside I’m not sure we could fix the root causes. American society is fundamentally broken in so many different ways that it might as well not even exist. I’m not sure what could be done to try and rectify that.

That’s pessimistic.

Definitely. What's less definite is whether it's incorrect.

[Galloism]

At this point, I don't even care. Your rights aren't being restricted, every first world country has been able to do this and it fixed the problem.

As an aside, this is 100% false (and I’m not even talking about disregarding the oldest human right known to exist). If one looks at trend lines over time, the other “first world” countries have never had the problems we do, even when guns were easy to acquire and own.

And, in many of those countries, violence increased after their effective bans were enacted.

You’re comparing apples and hand grenades here, and besides being small and roundish, they aren’t all that similar.

[Galloism]

That’s pessimistic.

Definitely. What's less definite is whether it's incorrect.

I’m on an optimism kick and you aren’t going to ruin it.

[Ryemarch]

Definitely. What's less definite is whether it's incorrect.

I’m on an optimism kick and you aren’t going to ruin it.

Not my intent, and indeed I wish you well. I'm on the opposite train, unfortunately.

[Galloism]

I’m on an optimism kick and you aren’t going to ruin it.

Not my intent, and indeed I wish you well. I'm on the opposite train, unfortunately.

Just remember, even though the pessimist is more likely to be right, the optimist enjoys the journey a lot more.

[Paddy O Fernature]

So.. dead adults are tolerable but dead kids is a bridge too far?
Look the only reason you are using "children" is for the emotional angle.
Other than that, my rights trump your dead.

Yeah, tell that to a parent of a school shooting victim. Not even republicans would say that openly.

Also, yeah, people are using children for the emotional angle, but it's more telling on YOU that you're like, "I don't care."

Oh spare me the bullshit appeals to emotion here, it's not impressing anyone and is only making you look like an fool every time you use it.

At this point, I don't even care. Your rights aren't being restricted, every first world country has been able to do this and it fixed the problem. If you're going to be like, "I don't care how many children need to die" I'm going to be like, "I don't care if gun restrictions make it harder to own guns."

Straight up don't even care anymore. Your need to feel powerful with a gun isn't as important as children not having to worry about dying and needing to be taught battlefield medical care

Please, continue trying to flat out lie to our faces using a statement that has already been disproved a hundred times over. We all could use the continued amusement.

[The Two Jerseys]

You gonna provide a credible source for that number?

I'm quite certain there's no source you'd consider credible.

I find the FBI to be a credible source.

But no, your side insists on referring to the numbers published by an organization that's been caught manipulating the numbers...

[Washington Resistance Army]

Honestly even putting the political realities aside I’m not sure we could fix the root causes. American society is fundamentally broken in so many different ways that it might as well not even exist. I’m not sure what could be done to try and rectify that.

That’s pessimistic.

It is, but it's also true.

At this point, I don't even care. Your rights aren't being restricted, every first world country has been able to do this and it fixed the problem. If you're going to be like, "I don't care how many children need to die" I'm going to be like, "I don't care if gun restrictions make it harder to own guns."

Straight up don't even care anymore. Your need to feel powerful with a gun isn't as important as children not having to worry about dying and needing to be taught battlefield medical care

Ngl the only reason children have to worry about those things is because adults and the media have blown it so far out of proportion for clicks. 99.999% of kids going to school in this country will never see a weapon be used in a school. They're actually thousands and thousands of times more likely to die on the drive to school or from accidentally poisoning themselves with something while at school. Those just don't make good stories for CNN and don't get constant coverage.

[Paddy O Fernature]

I'm quite certain there's no source you'd consider credible.

I find the FBI to be a credible source.

But no, your side insists on referring to the numbers published by an organization that's been caught manipulating the numbers...

Indeed.

However, that source is the GVA, what a surprise I know.

Considering it's an already established bullshit source, I guess we can safely toss your number into the garbage can where it belongs with all the other garbage GCA's have attempted to pass off here in the past.

[Ryemarch]

Just remember, even though the pessimist is more likely to be right, the optimist enjoys the journey a lot more.

Aye, that's so.

I find the FBI to be a credible source.

Do you have a link to an FBI statement on the number of mass shootings in 2023? My Google-fu may be weak, as I didn't find one.

But no, your side insists on referring to the numbers published by an organization that's been caught manipulating the numbers...

My "side"? Good heavens, man. As for the "organization that's been caught manipulating the numbers[,]" you can blame Google. It was the first result I got.

[Adamede]

Oh look, it's that number again.

Ah, my apologies. How many dead children is too many?

I’ve not killed a single kid so I don’t see why I should be punished over it.