The Return Of Book Bannings

[North Macaronesa]

What? Racial Oppression or Anti-LGBT Reactionaries? (That’s a modernist thing... not prehistoric!)

Racism has always been happening, people used to NEVER accept gay people. It's honestly gotten a lot better for LGBTQ people and people of colour.

It has, but it's still not enough. My friend, whose parents are conservative and barred her from going to the Pride club in middle school, is afraid of coming out because her parents might disown her. Amazon Alexa misunderstands 35% of words that people of color say to it. It might be better, but it's not good enough.

[Debate Proxy 1]

Up to the parents. Sex education is really nothing more than a pharmaceutical money grab scheme designed to sell birth control pills and abortions thru the use of hostage customers. It's not unlike debt entrapment. Most people SHOULD be able to agree upon stopping corporate malfeasance.

Have you ever actually taken a good sex ed course, because that is not what it is...at all.

Planned Parenthood (a pharmaceutical lobby) runs most of the sex education courses in the nation and admits it on their own website. How else do we end up geting outright pornographic books in schools, if not to teach people to make self-destructive life choices and turn to Big Business to "help?"

[Jewish Underground State]

Up to the parents. Sex education is really nothing more than a pharmaceutical money grab scheme designed to sell birth control pills and abortions thru the use of hostage customers. It's not unlike debt entrapment. Most people SHOULD be able to agree upon stopping corporate malfeasance.

Have you ever actually taken a good sex ed course, because that is not what it is...at all.

There's such a thing as good one?

Ok back on the topic:

Case by case really. Banning history books or trying to censor certain historical topics (ie American slavery and its impact on society both past and present) is dumb and always will be no matter how they try to spin it, but I'm not as fussed about some of the LGBT related books that are getting caught up in such things because quite a few of them are sexually explicit (to the point that posting excerpts or pictures of some of them would get you banned from a place like NSG) and so it makes sense to remove them from school libraries for the same reasons we block Pornhub on school computers.

I remember my school library had a couple of what would be considered hetero soft-core porn. They where quit popular. By the time you hit 16 years old sex is something you are very interested in and I am not sure why those that age should be completely cut off from it at school. For those who are younger sure, but by that age most students are starting to have or have already had a sexual experience.

Fair, I still think schools should ban books with adult content like sex. I feel like that should be a conversation for the child and the parent, although some people might not have parents willing to talk to them or are gay and the parents can't relate to that. I guess that's when the bannings get more complicated.

[Neutraligon]

Have you ever actually taken a good sex ed course, because that is not what it is...at all.

Planned Parenthood (a pharmaceutical lobby) runs most of the sex education courses in the nation and admits it on their own website. How else do we end up geting outright pornographic books in schools, if not to teach people to make self-destructive life choices and turn to Big Business to "help?"

Mostly people donate it and they are not checked by the library is my guess. That did not answer my question. Also, even if run by the same group, that does not mean that the class being taught is a good one. Abstinence only education comes to mind.

[Loeje]

Have you ever actually taken a good sex ed course, because that is not what it is...at all.

There's such a thing as good one?

Yes, there is, and the same attitude that is behind these book bans is the reason that the United States doesn't have good sex ed.

Americans really don't seem to believe that schools should be educating their kids.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Case by case really. Banning history books or trying to censor certain historical topics (ie American slavery and its impact on society both past and present) is dumb and always will be no matter how they try to spin it, but I'm not as fussed about some of the LGBT related books that are getting caught up in such things because quite a few of them are sexually explicit (to the point that posting excerpts or pictures of some of them would get you banned from a place like NSG) and so it makes sense to remove them from school libraries for the same reasons we block Pornhub on school computers.

I remember my school library had a couple of what would be considered hetero soft-core porn. They where quit popular. By the time you hit 16 years old sex is something you are very interested in and I am not sure why those that age should be completely cut off from it at school. For those who are younger sure, but by that age most students are starting to have or have already had a sexual experience.

Soft core nudity and whatnot is one thing, visually depicting blowjobs and anal is another entirely. That's not sex-ed or important info about LGBT people, that's just porn at that point and it's always going to be a losing battle to say otherwise.

[Neutraligon]

Have you ever actually taken a good sex ed course, because that is not what it is...at all.

There's such a thing as good one?

Ok back on the topic:

I remember my school library had a couple of what would be considered hetero soft-core porn. They where quit popular. By the time you hit 16 years old sex is something you are very interested in and I am not sure why those that age should be completely cut off from it at school. For those who are younger sure, but by that age most students are starting to have or have already had a sexual experience.

Fair, I still think schools should ban books with adult content like sex. I feel like that should be a conversation for the child and the parent, although some people might not have parents willing to talk to them or are gay and the parents can't relate to that. I guess that's when the bannings get more complicated.

We also have the interesting question of books about sex assault and the like. I remember when I was a kid that there was a bunch of books about dealing with various forms of abuse and assault specifically written for young kids. Nothing graphic, but clear enough so that kids would know what is happening is not ok. Where and how do you draw a line when there is no line just a spectrum?

[Vassenor]

I remember my school library had a couple of what would be considered hetero soft-core porn. They where quit popular. By the time you hit 16 years old sex is something you are very interested in and I am not sure why those that age should be completely cut off from it at school. For those who are younger sure, but by that age most students are starting to have or have already had a sexual experience.

Soft core nudity and whatnot is one thing, visually depicting blowjobs and anal is another entirely. That's not sex-ed or important info about LGBT people, that's just porn at that point and it's always going to be a losing battle to say otherwise.

Was it actually proven that that was an actual library book?

[The Lone Alliance]

"Return?" Book bannings didn't go away in the slightest and both parties have been up for banning books they didn't like.

I seem to remember a couple years back some karens wanted to ban "To Kill a Mocking Bird" because it had a woman who falsely lied about being raped and in the #Metoo era that was an uncomfortable narrative. Let's not also get started on that book ban several years back because of offensive bad words.

The sick truth is people from either side love to ban things for saying things they don't like, they just use different methods for doing so, Republicans play up the degeneracy angle and Democrats play up "This might trigger people!"

Ultimately the goal is the same, censorship.

[Terra dei Cittadini]

Any kind of information-censorship is an atrocity against humankind.

If we do not learn our own mistakes, we are doomed to repeat them for all eternity (or at least until we get access to learning about them again).

No matter what the ban is on, it results in an ignorant, benighted, cognitively enslaved society.

Ban the Republican Party (plus any attempts to revitalize it, other similar parties, etc.), not information we desperately need during an age where WWIII is possibly around the horizon.

TLDR; book bans are bad. GOP is bad. Ban the party, not the books.

[Neutraligon]

Soft core nudity and whatnot is one thing, visually depicting blowjobs and anal is another entirely. That's not sex-ed or important info about LGBT people, that's just porn at that point and it's always going to be a losing battle to say otherwise.

Was it actually proven that that was an actual library book?

The ones I am thinking out I could check out. So yes it was a library book in the system. I think it was my first into to that sort of thing. Am I admitting to reading them...absolutely.

[Regnum Alea Spaceflee]

"Return?" Book bannings didn't go away in the slightest and both parties have been up for banning books they didn't like.

I seem to remember a couple years back some karens wanted to ban "To Kill a Mocking Bird" because it had a woman who falsely lied about being raped and in the #Metoo era that was an uncomfortable narrative.

The sick truth is people from either side love to ban things for saying things they don't like, they just use different methods for doing so, Republicans play up the Degeneracy angle and Democrats play up "This might trigger people and we mustn't allow people to be hurt".

Ultimately the goal is the same, censorship.

Some people just want to have some kind of power, no matter what they have to do to get it.

[Shermania]

Soft core nudity and whatnot is one thing, visually depicting blowjobs and anal is another entirely. That's not sex-ed or important info about LGBT people, that's just porn at that point and it's always going to be a losing battle to say otherwise.

Was it actually proven that that was an actual library book?

I'm skeptical as well. Back when Looking for Alaska was being decried as a pornographic book, I remember thinking, "If that's porn, it's got to be the worst porn I've ever read. Not erotic at all."

The manufactured outrage machine is real.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Soft core nudity and whatnot is one thing, visually depicting blowjobs and anal is another entirely. That's not sex-ed or important info about LGBT people, that's just porn at that point and it's always going to be a losing battle to say otherwise.

Was it actually proven that that was an actual library book?

Yes, it's how I learned about it through the grapevine. I'm pretty insulated from the culture war because I don't use social media but even I've seen the pictures and screenshots of these things in some school libraries. Stuff like that is always going to be a massive win for the GOP.

Any kind of information-censorship is an atrocity against humankind.

Objectively not true.

[Floofybit]

Any kind of information-censorship is an atrocity against humankind.

If we do not learn our own mistakes, we are doomed to repeat them for all eternity (or at least until we get access to learning about them again).

No matter what the ban is on, it results in an ignorant, benighted, cognitively enslaved society.

Ban the Republican Party (plus any attempts to revitalize it, other similar parties, etc.), not information we desperately need during an age where WWIII is possibly around the horizon.

TLDR; book bans are bad. GOP is bad. Ban the party, not the books.

Let me get this straight. You're saying that the GOP is taking away freedom of speech, so we should take away the GOP's freedom of speech? Hypocrisy at it's finest

[Floofybit]

I seem to remember a couple years back some karens wanted to ban "To Kill a Mocking Bird" because it had a woman who falsely lied about being raped and in the #Metoo era that was an uncomfortable narrative. Let's not also get started on that book ban several years back because of offensive bad words.

I'm literally reading that book right now

[Neutraligon]

I seem to remember a couple years back some karens wanted to ban "To Kill a Mocking Bird" because it had a woman who falsely lied about being raped and in the #Metoo era that was an uncomfortable narrative. Let's not also get started on that book ban several years back because of offensive bad words.

I'm literally reading that book right now

Read it in school, was one of the more enjoyable school books as far as narrative goes. Also watched the movie in class. I do remember there where groups even back then trying to ban it. Also Huck Finn and a other books as well.

[Mountains and Volcanoes]

Any kind of information-censorship is an atrocity against humankind.

If we do not learn our own mistakes, we are doomed to repeat them for all eternity (or at least until we get access to learning about them again).

No matter what the ban is on, it results in an ignorant, benighted, cognitively enslaved society.

Ban the Republican Party (plus any attempts to revitalize it, other similar parties, etc.), not information we desperately need during an age where WWIII is possibly around the horizon.

TLDR; book bans are bad. GOP is bad. Ban the party, not the books.

Let me get this straight. You're saying that the GOP is taking away freedom of speech, so we should take away the GOP's freedom of speech? Hypocrisy at it's finest

Honestly, they deserve it! Given their relentless attacks on minorities and lack of democratic values!

[Terra dei Cittadini]

Any kind of information-censorship is an atrocity against humankind.

If we do not learn our own mistakes, we are doomed to repeat them for all eternity (or at least until we get access to learning about them again).

No matter what the ban is on, it results in an ignorant, benighted, cognitively enslaved society.

Ban the Republican Party (plus any attempts to revitalize it, other similar parties, etc.), not information we desperately need during an age where WWIII is possibly around the horizon.

TLDR; book bans are bad. GOP is bad. Ban the party, not the books.

Let me get this straight. You're saying that the GOP is taking away freedom of speech, so we should take away the GOP's freedom of speech? Hypocrisy at it's finest

Other countries (particularly U.S. allies) have laws prohibiting extremist/far-right/neo-Nazi parties.

The fact we don't have laws like that is the reason these shitheads like DeSantis are running rampant without repercussions.

So, riddle me this, you right-wing "Freedom Fighter"; the GOP is already invalidating freedom of speech, so why doesn't it get punishment for already violating the constitution?

Think about it.

[Debate Proxy 1]

Planned Parenthood (a pharmaceutical lobby) runs most of the sex education courses in the nation and admits it on their own website. How else do we end up geting outright pornographic books in schools, if not to teach people to make self-destructive life choices and turn to Big Business to "help?"

Mostly people donate it and they are not checked by the library is my guess. That did not answer my question. Also, even if run by the same group, that does not mean that the class being taught is a good one. Abstinence only education comes to mind.

I can only form judgments by personal experience of what I've seen. Not the perfect sample size, admittedly, and I'd assume you're doing the same to reach your conclusion.

To everyone:

If you want to stop anti-LGBT discrimination (not every rightist does it, but some do,) you'd do well to remember the adage that a man's heart is where his treasure is. Build a case on why it harms straight people to make needless antagonisms of LGBT people. Bring up people aligned more or less with our faction on other issues as examples because they're more likely to be listened to.

I mean, you had Glenn Greenwald (gay) and Chelsea Manning (trans) making contributions to the defense of the Constitution. Gay/LGBT rights are constitutional rights, after all, and the growing mental association of LGBT with the anti-Constitution movement is giving right-wing extremism (the opposite of populism) more of an audience.

Both sides need to reject extremism and embrace broad-based populism based on finding common vested economic interests if you want discrimination truly ended.

[Jabberwocky]

No book banning allowed. The intellect must remain unfettered.

[Loeje]

I'm literally reading that book right now

Read it in school, was one of the more enjoyable school books as far as narrative goes. Also watched the movie in class. I do remember there where groups even back then trying to ban it. Also Huck Finn and a other books as well.

It's a good book, it's a shame that so many people are trying to ban it. And for so many reasons, too. In general, banning books is a terrible thing.

[Floofybit]

lack of democratic values!

I don't really see the problem with not having left wing values. Left wing doesn't seem like enlightenment. It seems like the opposite

[Debate Proxy 1]

Let me get this straight. You're saying that the GOP is taking away freedom of speech, so we should take away the GOP's freedom of speech? Hypocrisy at it's finest

Other countries (particularly U.S. allies) have laws prohibiting extremist/far-right/neo-Nazi parties.

The fact we don't have laws like that is the reason these shitheads like DeSantis are running rampant without repercussions.

So, riddle me this, you right-wing "Freedom Fighter"; the GOP is already invalidating freedom of speech, so why doesn't it get punishment for already violating the constitution?

Think about it.

Thank you for making the case that the American people don't have allies.

[Neutraligon]

I wonder if books like American girl doll books would be banned, after all while not graphic (since children's books) they do depict things like slavery, factory injury and the like, at least the first five series did. Have not read the later ones.