Israeli Judicial Overhaul Resumes

[Northern Socialist Council Republics]

The Habsburg ideal of the universal jurisdiction is in all honesty not that different from the systems of world government that globalists like me advocate for. They have more in common with each other than either does with the theocratic ethnostate of Israel.

The main difference is in what principles such a universal state would stand for and how it would be governed.

[Fahran]

and they're awful for doing so. fuck the US and the UK.

They have likely been among the most successful polities in history in such matters. The USSR certainly doesn’t hold a candle to the modern US or UK given it engaged in genocide and settler-colonialism for the entirety of its existence. China? Same thing. India? Careening towards becoming an overt apartheid state. If your beginning silo is “everything up until now has been unacceptable” and you cannot even begin to overcome one of the inherent problems of empire, I don’t know what you expect to accomplish.

[Fahran]

Many Israeli leaders and their agents have proposed the destruction of Iran though.

Who? Also, so what? It doesn’t have any impact on what I’ve said. Do you think these hypothetical people would get a pass from me just because they’re Jewish or Israeli?

Funny how the UK and US get criticised for the same thing Israel gets celebrated for. Ethnostate for thee but not for me I guess.

It’s funny to you that different groups of people have different opinions about nationalism?

Besides, pretty sure the UK and US favour certain other groups especially in regards to who gets to decide foreign policy.

Don’t be coy. Mention the ZOG so we can wrap this up.

[Fahran]

Hopefully never. Ethnostates can follow them into shameful history that should not be repeated.

I mean… any global political polity or system, such as the one you ostensibly espouse, is going to involve some form of ethnic favoritism given how hegemony works.

[Alcala-Cordel]

Hopefully never. Ethnostates can follow them into shameful history that should not be repeated.

I mean… any global political polity or system, such as the one you ostensibly espouse, is going to involve some form of ethnic favoritism given how hegemony works.

It should still be avoided at all costs. The prevalence of ethnic favoritism doesn't justify its existence.

[Fahran]

It should still be avoided at all costs. The prevalence of ethnic favoritism doesn't justify its existence.

When we examine the ethnic pluralism of the United States, which remains deeply flawed despite constituting a massive improvement over previous instances of ethnic pluralism, I'm not certain how precisely one could go about avoiding it altogether. One could, of course, seek to mute it, but that can probably occur alongside ethnic self-determination under the right material conditions. In terms of practical politics, I don't think anarchism or communism offers terribly much aside from critique.

[Bahrimontagn]

Many Israeli leaders and their agents have proposed the destruction of Iran though.

Who? Also, so what? It doesn’t have any impact on what I’ve said. Do you think these hypothetical people would get a pass from me just because they’re Jewish or Israeli?

Funny how the UK and US get criticised for the same thing Israel gets celebrated for. Ethnostate for thee but not for me I guess.

It’s funny to you that different groups of people have different opinions about nationalism?

Besides, pretty sure the UK and US favour certain other groups especially in regards to who gets to decide foreign policy.

Don’t be coy. Mention the ZOG so we can wrap this up.

Where is the lie? Israel has large influence over UK and US politicians.

[Fahran]

Where is the lie? Israel has large influence over UK and US politicians.

It’s an exaggeration, one so egregious that it becomes deceptive. I would recommend studying the Cold War and the early history of Israeli-American, Arab-American, and Soviet-Arab relations.

[Bahrimontagn]

Where is the lie? Israel has large influence over UK and US politicians.

It’s an exaggeration, one so egregious that it becomes deceptive. I would recommend studying the Cold War and the early history of Israeli-American, Arab-American, and Soviet-Arab relations.

How is it an exaggeration?

[Fahran]

How is it an exaggeration?

Obsessive reporting on Israeli-American relations misses that the US provides abundant aid to countries like South Korea, Afghanistan, Iraq, Jordan, and Japan and that we maintain very close diplomatic and trading relationships with a variety of countries. Taken as a whole, we provide hundreds of millions more to Arab countries than Israel. Our closest ally, at the moment, is probably the UK. Our most important trading partners are Mexico and Canada - with China and Japan up next. Militarily, Poland, Ukraine, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey get a lot of consideration - even when they pull shenanigans that annoy other allies.

Additionally, Israeli lobbying and Jewish representatives alone do not actually explain the level of consistent support observed in the US and UK. I've pointed out before that Israel provides a fairly practical, if occasionally dubious, ally, especially in the context of the Cold War. There's never going to be a good practical reason to discard Israel barring a major geopolitical realignment or a collapse of sorts in Israel itself because discarding Israel doesn't actually forge new and useful alliances. We'd need to sacrifice Saudi Arabia, the UAE, and Pakistan to make nice with Iran and Syria. And Palestine has nothing to offer except more infighting and despotism.

[Bahrimontagn]

How is it an exaggeration?

Obsessive reporting on Israeli-American relations misses that the US provides abundant aid to countries like South Korea, Afghanistan, Iraq, Jordan, and Japan and that we maintain very close diplomatic and trading relationships with a variety of countries. Taken as a whole, we provide hundreds of millions more to Arab countries than Israel. Our closest ally, at the moment, is probably the UK. Our most important trading partners are Mexico and Canada - with China and Japan up next. Militarily, Poland, Ukraine, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey get a lot of consideration - even when they pull shenanigans that annoy other allies.

Additionally, Israeli lobbying and Jewish representatives alone do not actually explain the level of consistent support observed in the US and UK. I've pointed out before that Israel provides a fairly practical, if occasionally dubious, ally, especially in the context of the Cold War. There's never going to be a good practical reason to discard Israel barring a major geopolitical realignment or a collapse of sorts in Israel itself because discarding Israel doesn't actually forge new and useful alliances. We'd need to sacrifice Saudi Arabia, the UAE, and Pakistan to make nice with Iran and Syria. And Palestine has nothing to offer except more infighting and despotism.

An ally that is warm with Russia, an ally that bombs american naval ships, an ally that steals US secrets and sells them to China. Some ally you describe. Palestine is the moral position to hold, just as being anti-apartheid was regarding South Africa.

[Fahran]

An ally that is warm with Russia, an ally that bombs american naval ships, an ally that steals US secrets and sells them to China. Some ally you describe. Palestine is the moral position to hold, just as being anti-apartheid was regarding South Africa.

A dubious or lukewarm ally remains an ally. We haven’t abandoned Pakistan or Turkey over their shenanigans either.

Israel’s relationship with Russia is fairly ambivalent. A sizable minority of Israelis are former Soviet citizens or their descendants, and speak Russian fluently. One would expect there to be ties as a result in much the same way as ties between Arabic-speaking Jews and the meager remnants of the Diaspora have been rekindled as a result of normalization. This makes Israel a good go-between with countries like Russia, Poland, and Ukraine. Which is useful.

USS Liberty? I’ve discussed that in the past and I don’t think you understand the history of Israeli-American relations if you’re bringing it up. The US didn’t wholly commit to supporting Israeli war efforts until 1973 and, understandably, the Israelis responded aggressively to a surveillance ship close enough to an active war zone that intelligence might have been leaked to the Syrians in advance of a crucial offensive on the Golan Heights. Spying on your allies, right?

You’re at least correct about Israeli double-dealing with China. It’s a serious problem in some regards, and we ought to take appropriate precautions in what we permit to Israel to prevent issues in operational security and national defense. That said, Israel isn’t selling everything to China either. Because that’d put them at risk as well given Chinese-Iranian cooperation.

Palestine was an apartheid state before it ethnically cleansed its entire Jewish population. A two-state solution is the only one that doesn’t impose apartheid.

[Bahrimontagn]

USS Liberty? I’ve discussed that in the past and I don’t think you understand the history of Israeli-American relations if you’re bringing it up. The US didn’t wholly commit to supporting Israeli war efforts until 1973 and, understandably, the Israelis responded aggressively to a surveillance ship close enough to an active war zone that intelligence might have been leaked to the Syrians in advance of a crucial offensive on the Golan Heights. Spying on your allies, right?
.

So does that justify an Israeli "ally" bombing a clearly flagged US ship??? Your use of mental gymnastics to justify israeli double dealing is astounding. Imagine if Iran had done that, you would be calling for blood.

Israel’s relationship with Russia is fairly ambivalent. A sizable minority of Israelis are former Soviet citizens or their descendants, and speak Russian fluently. One would expect there to be ties as a result in much the same way as ties between Arabic-speaking Jews and the meager remnants of the Diaspora have been rekindled as a result of normalization. This makes Israel a good go-between with countries like Russia, Poland, and Ukraine. Which is useful.

.

By that logic I guess Pakistan's ISI is a good go-between the US and the Taliban, and same for Syria between US and Iran. Or is that treatment only reserved for the "Chosen People"

Palestine is based. Israel is a filthy monkey. end of.

[New Visayan Islands]

USS Liberty? I’ve discussed that in the past and I don’t think you understand the history of Israeli-American relations if you’re bringing it up. The US didn’t wholly commit to supporting Israeli war efforts until 1973 and, understandably, the Israelis responded aggressively to a surveillance ship close enough to an active war zone that intelligence might have been leaked to the Syrians in advance of a crucial offensive on the Golan Heights. Spying on your allies, right?
.

So does that justify an Israeli "ally" bombing a clearly flagged US ship??? Your use of mental gymnastics to justify israeli double dealing is astounding. Imagine if Iran had done that, you would be calling for blood.

Israel’s relationship with Russia is fairly ambivalent. A sizable minority of Israelis are former Soviet citizens or their descendants, and speak Russian fluently. One would expect there to be ties as a result in much the same way as ties between Arabic-speaking Jews and the meager remnants of the Diaspora have been rekindled as a result of normalization. This makes Israel a good go-between with countries like Russia, Poland, and Ukraine. Which is useful.

.

By that logic I guess Pakistan's ISI is a good go-between the US and the Taliban, and same for Syria between US and Iran. Or is that treatment only reserved for the "Chosen People"

Palestine is based. Israel is a filthy monkey. end of.

Accounting for recent history, take *** one day off for trolling *** to read and review the Rules.

New Visayan Islands
Game Moderator

[El Lazaro]

Guess what’s back? Well, it’s in the title. Here’s a summary (para 1) and recent events (para 2):

The judicial overhaul was halted for months as the coalition and opposition opened negotiations to de-escalate the tense standoff over concerns of political unrest and even civil war. To recap, the overhaul as proposed earlier this year would de facto abolish the Supreme Court’s powers, allowing a bare majority in the Knesset to consolidate total power. This is partly motivated by the personal interests of politicians (mainly Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu) to block ongoing corruption proceedings, but far-right coalition partners have also lambasted Supreme Court rulings in favor of human rights and democratic institutions. Regardless, the opposition has characterized the authoritarian push as dictatorial and extreme, and the process has even garnered unanticipated criticism from Israel’s allies.

So why is it back? Basically, tensions have flared this month over a Judicial Selections Committee dispute. The Committee, made up of a politicians and legal experts, chooses judges. Traditionally, an appointment would require 7 votes out of 3 government, 1 opposition, and 5 lawyer/judge members. A major part of the overhaul involves packing the Judicial Selections Committee (and thus, the Supreme Court) with cronies to prevent the unanimity hypothetically needed to enforce rulings, so when the coalition attempted to exclude the opposition from the panel, the opposition threatened to withdraw from compromise talks. In the secret vote on the appointments, several MKs broke ranks and hamstrung the attempt, frustrating Netanyahu and failing to fully resolve the issue. Netanyahu accused the opposition of acting in bad faith and unilaterally cancelled negotiations. Now, judicial overhaul has officially resumed, with the first proposed bill targeting the “extreme unreasonableness” standard, which was used earlier this year to bar the ministerial appointment of Shas leader and Likud ally Aryeh Deri for being a violation of his corruption plea deal. It’s not clear whether the most contentious changes will be reintroduced, but that hasn’t prevented nationwide protests from erupting once again

https://apnews.com/article/israel-polit ... caf01d6d25
https://apnews.com/article/israel-netan ... d0fd8c2a17
https://www.timesofisrael.com/knesset-r ... ness-test/

[Commonwealth of Adirondack]

US military operation when?

Seriously, this is too far. it's time to kick all the ultranationalist camps out of power and re-establish liberal democracy in Israel.

Seems ironic that Israel is bringing ultranationalism to their country….

It's always been there. It's always been an ethnostate, that's the whole intention behind its founding.

So nobody should be shocked or surprised that Israel is becoming less and less tolerant of non-Jews when the state explicitly is not for them.

[Corrian]

Oh this is going to be fun (again), isn't it?

[Narland]

Oh this is going to be fun (again), isn't it?

As fun as watching the second coat of paint dry on a wall as was watching the first coat. Plaid would be a nice color.

I used to think they should try for more of an Australian take of judicial independence. Unfortunately, I haven't been there in 30 years to make an well informed opinion. I agree that the court has separation of powers and over-reach lawlessness problems that need resolved. Judicial reform is an admiral goal for a part of government that for many has become a government unto itself. But reforming the court without changing why the court has moved in the direction that it did is going to be an exercise in futility.

[Fahran]

So does that justify an Israeli "ally" bombing a clearly flagged US ship??? Your use of mental gymnastics to justify israeli double dealing is astounding. Imagine if Iran had done that, you would be calling for blood.

Our geopolitical relationship with Israel and with Iran are separate and different things. The US has arrested Israeli intelligence assets in the past during peacetime. Israel hasn't decided to break off the alliance in response. Israel neutralizing a US intelligence asset present in a sensitive area during wartime isn't exactly surprising in a context where we Americans remained neutral during the conflict in question. It was certainly an international incident and one that strained relations, but it's a rather expected response to espionage activities, which likely explains why the State Department hasn't decided to axe the alliance and cooperation altogether.

By that logic I guess Pakistan's ISI is a good go-between the US and the Taliban, and same for Syria between US and Iran. Or is that treatment only reserved for the "Chosen People"

Unironically, yes. We haven't broken off relations with Pakistan over the high levels of support for the Taliban in its government, military, and intelligence institutions and it's probable that any overtures we make to the Taliban would involve Pakistani institutions such as the ISI - who we have probably collaborated with throughout the War on Terror in spite of how dubious they are as a reliable ally. Israel is less cozy with Russia than the ISI is with the Taliban, and, in point of fact, multiple Russian officials have gone on Antisemitic rants in the past year. It has nothing to do with Jews being the Chosen People and everything to do with not overreacting and sabotaging useful partnerships.

Palestine is based. Israel is a filthy monkey. end of.

Palestine is unfathomably based. The rest of your post is just Antisemitic nonsense though.

[Oceasia]

Israeli military carries out an invasion of Jenin

Didn't feel like making a new thread about it and it seems relevant enough for this thread.

[Bahrimontagn]

Israeli military carries out an invasion of Jenin

Didn't feel like making a new thread about it and it seems relevant enough for this thread.

Palestine has a right to defend itself against terrorism.

[Oceasia]

Israeli military carries out an invasion of Jenin

Didn't feel like making a new thread about it and it seems relevant enough for this thread.

Palestine has a right to defend itself against terrorism.

Some people are saying that this is partly Netanyahu trying to distract the populace from his continued judicial reform plans, and I'm inclined to agree with them. Anyway, the West should loudly condemn this invasion and halt all military aid to Israel.

[El Lazaro]

Israeli military carries out an invasion of Jenin

Didn't feel like making a new thread about it and it seems relevant enough for this thread.

Here’s a Deutsche Welle article for anyone who doesn’t have a Twitter account.

[Diopolis]

Guess what’s back? Well, it’s in the title. Here’s a summary (para 1) and recent events (para 2):

The judicial overhaul was halted for months as the coalition and opposition opened negotiations to de-escalate the tense standoff over concerns of political unrest and even civil war. To recap, the overhaul as proposed earlier this year would de facto abolish the Supreme Court’s powers, allowing a bare majority in the Knesset to consolidate total power. This is partly motivated by the personal interests of politicians (mainly Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu) to block ongoing corruption proceedings, but far-right coalition partners have also lambasted Supreme Court rulings in favor of human rights and democratic institutions. Regardless, the opposition has characterized the authoritarian push as dictatorial and extreme, and the process has even garnered unanticipated criticism from Israel’s allies.

So why is it back? Basically, tensions have flared this month over a Judicial Selections Committee dispute. The Committee, made up of a politicians and legal experts, chooses judges. Traditionally, an appointment would require 7 votes out of 3 government, 1 opposition, and 5 lawyer/judge members. A major part of the overhaul involves packing the Judicial Selections Committee (and thus, the Supreme Court) with cronies to prevent the unanimity hypothetically needed to enforce rulings, so when the coalition attempted to exclude the opposition from the panel, the opposition threatened to withdraw from compromise talks. In the secret vote on the appointments, several MKs broke ranks and hamstrung the attempt, frustrating Netanyahu and failing to fully resolve the issue. Netanyahu accused the opposition of acting in bad faith and unilaterally cancelled negotiations. Now, judicial overhaul has officially resumed, with the first proposed bill targeting the “extreme unreasonableness” standard, which was used earlier this year to bar the ministerial appointment of Shas leader and Likud ally Aryeh Deri for being a violation of his corruption plea deal. It’s not clear whether the most contentious changes will be reintroduced, but that hasn’t prevented nationwide protests from erupting once again

https://apnews.com/article/israel-polit ... caf01d6d25
https://apnews.com/article/israel-netan ... d0fd8c2a17
https://www.timesofisrael.com/knesset-r ... ness-test/

It's worth noting that although Netanyahu is not a particularly trustworthy figure to actually do so, the Israeli supreme court does have to be reigned in somehow.

[Risottia]

It's worth noting that although Netanyahu is not a particularly trustworthy figure to actually do so, the Israeli supreme court does have to be reigned in somehow.

Not going to happen without a proper Constitution, something that Bibi and his pals oppose vehemently.