NationStates

Πιστεύομεν εἰς ἕνα Θεὸν Πατέρα παντοκράτορα
ποιητὴν οὐρανοῦ καὶ γῆς ὁρατῶν τε πάντων καὶ ἀοράτων·
καὶ εἰς ἕνα Κύριον Ἰησοῦν Χριστὸν
τὸν υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν Μονογενῆ,
τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων,
Φῶς ἐκ Φωτός,
Θεὸν ἀληθινὸν ἐκ Θεοῦ ἀληθινοῦ,
γεννηθέντα οὐ ποιηθέντα,
ὁμοούσιον τῷ Πατρί,
δι' οὗ τὰ πάντα ἐγένετο·
τὸν δι' ἡμᾶς τοὺς ἀνθρώπους καὶ διὰ τὴν ἡμετέραν σωτηρίαν κατελθόντα ἐκ τῶν οὐρανῶν,
καὶ σαρκωθέντα ἐκ Πνεύματος Ἁγίου καὶ Μαρίας τῆς παρθένου,
καὶ ἐνανθρωπήσαντα,
σταυρωθέντα τε ὑπὲρ ἡμῶν ἐπὶ Ποντίου Πιλάτου,
καὶ παθόντα, καὶ ταφέντα,
καὶ ἀναστάντα τῇ τρίτῃ ἡμέρᾳ κατὰ τὰς γραφὰς,
καὶ ἀνελθόντα εἰς τοὺς οὐρανοὺς,
καὶ καθεζόμενον ἐν δεξιᾷ τοῦ Πατρὸς,
καὶ πάλιν ἐρχόμενον μετὰ δόξης κρῖναι ζῶντας καὶ νεκρούς,
οὗ τῆς βασιλείας οὐκ ἔσται τέλος·
καὶ εἰς τὸ Πνεῦμα τὸ Ἅγιον, τὸ Κύριον καὶ Ζωοποιόν,
τὸ ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς ἐκπορευόμενον,
τὸ σὺν Πατρὶ καὶ Υἱῷ συμπροσκυνούμενον καὶ συνδοξαζόμενον,
τὸ λαλῆσαν διὰ τῶν προφητῶν·
εἰς μίαν ἁγίαν καθολικὴν καὶ ἀποστολικὴν ἐκκλησίαν·
ὁμολογοῦμεν ἓν βάπτισμα εἰς ἄφεσιν ἁμαρτιῶν·
προσδοκῶμεν ἀνάστασιν νεκρῶν,
καὶ ζωὴν τοῦ μέλλοντος αἰῶνος. ἀμήν.

Credimus in unum Deum,
Patrem omnipotentem,
factorem coeli et terrae, visibilium omnium et invisibilium,
et in unum Dominum Jesum Christum,
Filium Dei unicum,
de Patre natum ante omnia saecula;
Deum verum de Deo vero;
natum, non factum;
ejusdemque substantiae qua Pater est;
per quem omnia facta sunt;
qui propter nos homines et propter nostram salutem descendit,
incarnatus est de Spiritu sancto, in Maria virgine homo factus,
crucifixus pro nobis sub Pontio Pilato, sepultus,
resurrexit tertia die,
ascendit ad coelos,
sedet ad dexteram Patris;
inde venturus est cum gloria judicare vivos ac mortuos,
cujus regni non erit finis.
Et in Spiritum sanctum, Dominum ac vivificatorem
a Patre procedentem,
qui cum Patre et Filio adoratur et glorificatur,
qui locutus est per Prophetas;
in unam catholicam atque apostolicam Ecclesiam.
Confitemur unum baptismum in remissionem peccatorum;
speramus resurrectionem mortuorum,
vitam futuri saeculi. Amen.

We believe in one God, the Father almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all things visible and invisible; And in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, begotten from the Father before all ages, light from light, true God from true God, begotten not made, of one substance with the Father, through Whom all things came into existence, Who because of us men and because of our salvation came down from the heavens, and was incarnate from the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man, and was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried, and rose again on the third day according to the Scriptures and ascended to heaven, and sits on the right hand of the Father, and will come again with glory to judge living and dead, of Whose kingdom there will be no end; And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and life-giver, Who proceeds from the Father and the Son, Who with the Father and the Son is together worshipped and together glorified, Who spoke through the prophets; in one holy Catholic and apostolic Church. We confess one baptism to the remission of sins; we look forward to the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come. Amen

Welcome!

This is the Thirteenth edition of our little corner of NSG, where participants can discuss Christianity in general, the differences between the denominations, general comparative theology (both within and without Christianity), Church history, and many other topics.

While discussion naturally covers a broad range of themes, members of the moderation team (including those participating in the thread) may occasionally gently suggest that some topics might be best taken to a separate thread. This will usually only occur when a subject is itself the subject of discussion in recurring separate NSG threads, and would risk dominating this thread if discussed here (examples include, but are not limited to, abortion, homosexuality, the existence of the historical Jesus and/or the existence of God.) It should be explicitly noted that this is a place for Good faith discussion between those wishing to learn and discover. It is not a place to tilt at the religious members of NSG, Christian or otherwise. If that is your goal, I suggest you start a new thread or partake in one of the numerous already made for that purpose.


Link to version 12: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=505741#p38705682

First. Also, godspeed to the Christian thread.

Get it? Godspeed? Christians? God?

Hehe.

I do not normally post in these threads (I am obviously not a Christian), but the pun in the title alone means we damn someone as well.

Big Jim P wrote:I do not normally post in these threads (I am obviously not a Christian), but the pun in the title alone means we damn someone as well.

I'm quite aware that the punishment for my many abuses of early pope names will make Sisyphus' ordeal look like afternoon tea, but it is a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

OK, Jokes aside.

I was born and raised a southern baptist. I meandered through a variety of religious beliefs, studied the apparent human need for such beliefs, and found Satanism.

Now, I know, I am a guest (intruder) here, but I would like to know what the NS Christians think of Satanism. Both the secular atheistic and your theistic opposites.

I do NOT want this to be a threadjack. Just an exploration of another facet. After all, we DID take our name from your mythology.

Tarsonis wrote:

Big Jim P wrote:I do not normally post in these threads (I am obviously not a Christian), but the pun in the title alone means we damn someone as well.

I'm quite aware that the punishment for my many abuses of early pope names will make Sisyphus' ordeal look like afternoon tea, but it is a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

I noted those. This one was exceptional. My demons will be seeing you soon. Pet the gray one.

Big Jim P wrote:OK, Jokes aside.

I was born and raised a southern baptist. I meandered through a variety of religious beliefs, studied the apparen human need for such beliefs, and found Satanism.

Now, I know, I am a guest (intruder) here, but I would like to know what thew NS Christians think of Satanism. Both the secular atheistic and your theistic opposites.

I do NOT want this to be a threadjack. Just an exploration of another facet. After all, we DID take our name from your mythology.

Secular Satanism is just Atheism with Miltonian flair. It's a curiosity, but I kind of find it along side the same as Wicca, minor movements started by 20th century occult fanboys. If it works for you, by all means live long and prosper.


Theistic Satanism on the other hand, is just kinda dumb. I mean, you can't accept the premise of Theistic Satanism without accepting the larger premise of Christianity. It's basically the theological equivalent of cheering for the Buffalo Sabers. Never gonna win, no matter how much they believe.

Big Jim P wrote:

Tarsonis wrote:

I'm quite aware that the punishment for my many abuses of early pope names will make Sisyphus' ordeal look like afternoon tea, but it is a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

I noted those. This one was exceptional. My demons will be seeing you soon. Pet the gray one.

Unironically, I am a real life Hagrid, and I probably would try to pet one if I ever saw one.

Big Jim P wrote:OK, Jokes aside.

I was born and raised a southern baptist. I meandered through a variety of religious beliefs, studied the apparent human need for such beliefs, and found Satanism.

Now, I know, I am a guest (intruder) here, but I would like to know what the NS Christians think of Satanism. Both the secular atheistic and your theistic opposites.

I do NOT want this to be a threadjack. Just an exploration of another facet. After all, we DID take our name from your mythology.

Anton LaVey is what happens when you mix Ayn Rand with Aleister Crowley.

Theistic Satanism is the religious equivalent of "Why are you simping for him? He's not going to fuck you."

Ozisi wrote:First. Also, godspeed to the Christian thread.

Get it? Godspeed? Christians? God?

Hehe.

Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

New Visayan Islands wrote:

Ozisi wrote:First. Also, godspeed to the Christian thread.

Get it? Godspeed? Christians? God?

Hehe.

Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

I would think “gods-speed” for the polytheists, from what I know from Jewish friends there isn’t a proper one to use, and idk on Muslims.

New Visayan Islands wrote:Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

Isn't the Muslim name for God just the Arabic word for "god," similarly to how we use the word in English? I think "Godspeed" would work for them as well if that's the case.

Asucki wrote:

New Visayan Islands wrote:Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

Isn't the Muslim name for God just the Arabic word for "god," similarly to how we use the word in English? I think "Godspeed" would work for them as well if that's the case.

More or less. It pretty much works across the board as the phrase seems to be used more Deistically than specifically Christian. Kind of like "God Bless You" after someone sneezes.

New Visayan Islands wrote:

Ozisi wrote:First. Also, godspeed to the Christian thread.

Get it? Godspeed? Christians? God?

Hehe.

Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

For the Jews, would it be "G*dspeed"?

Sordhau wrote:

Big Jim P wrote:OK, Jokes aside.

I was born and raised a southern baptist. I meandered through a variety of religious beliefs, studied the apparent human need for such beliefs, and found Satanism.

Now, I know, I am a guest (intruder) here, but I would like to know what the NS Christians think of Satanism. Both the secular atheistic and your theistic opposites.

I do NOT want this to be a threadjack. Just an exploration of another facet. After all, we DID take our name from your mythology.

Anton LaVey is what happens when you mix Ayn Rand with Aleister Crowley.

Theistic Satanism is the religious equivalent of "Why are you simping for him? He's not going to fuck you."

Well, Tom Ellis might

continuing from last thread:

Tarsonis wrote:

Sordhau wrote:
No, his problem was that he couldn't separate his anti-theism from his political philosophy. Lot of Atheists are like that.

That's a distinction without a difference. People's backgrounds always influence their product. Naturally is Marx wasn't an atheist, his philosophy wouldn't have been anti-religious, quite the opposite. So not only was Marx's atheism a key quality in making him repugnant to religious societies, but the fact that it influenced so much of his work, even more so.

honestly, i think that this is jumping the gun a bit. marx's actual views on religion were more complex than "religion bad!" and his "opium of the people" quote is a bit misinterpreted.

marx's view on religion is less "religion is a bad thing and should be stamped out!"; his views on religion are more akin to a materialist atheist view. marx's view on religion was that religion was a proto-revolutionary idealism, an expression of discomfort and at the same time a protest against the cause of said discomfort, such as oppression. when the oppression is destroyed, such as society's transition from a capitalist to socialist to communist society, then religion will lose relevance because oppression no longer exists. in a sense, it's a "withering away of religion" in the same vein as the withering away of the state. this is a classic example of dialectical materialism. (now obviously i don't agree with this considering i'm a christian, that's just marx's view on the subject)

marx wasn't necessarily an "anti-theist"--- he had nothing against religion, per se --- he was more of a "post-theist," really, and thought that as society advanced the need for religion would eventually die out. his actual "opium of the people" quote is as follows (with some parts cut out for brevity's sake):

Karl Marx, 1843 wrote:The foundation of irreligious criticism is: Man makes religion, religion does not make man... Man is the world of man – state, society. This state and this society produce religion... It is the fantastic realization of the human essence since the human essence has not acquired any true reality...

...Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.

can you tell he liked italics?

Lord Dominator wrote:

New Visayan Islands wrote:Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

I would think “gods-speed” for the polytheists, from what I know from Jewish friends there isn’t a proper one to use, and idk on Muslims.

Yeah that sounds about right for us, we usually just tend to make things plural and it usually works out.

Washington Resistance Army wrote:

Lord Dominator wrote:I would think “gods-speed” for the polytheists, from what I know from Jewish friends there isn’t a proper one to use, and idk on Muslims.

Yeah that sounds about right for us, we usually just tend to make things plural and it usually works out.

Y'all also get to say lines like "Great Odin's Raven!" and "By the beard of Zues!"

Tarsonis wrote:

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Yeah that sounds about right for us, we usually just tend to make things plural and it usually works out.

Y'all also get to say lines like "Great Odin's Raven!" and "By the beard of Zues!"

Gotta admit I’ve never said the latter but I might just have to remember that one lol

New Visayan Islands wrote:

Ozisi wrote:First. Also, godspeed to the Christian thread.

Get it? Godspeed? Christians? God?

Hehe.

Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

The closest equivalent in Arabic would probably be "الله معَك" (if talking to a man) / "الله معِك" (if talking to a woman), or "Allah ma'ak" / "Allah ma'ik". It means "God be with you", but it's not a pan-Arabic goodbye. I never heard anyone use it in Egypt, for example. I think it's more of a Lebanese / Syrian thing. It would be understood in the rest of the Arabic-speaking world, though.

Diarcesia wrote:

New Visayan Islands wrote:Would it still be “Godspeed” when addressing adherents of polytheistic belief systems, or “Gods-speed?” And how exactly would that phrase work for our Jewish and Muslim cousins?

For the Jews, would it be "G*dspeed"?

There really isn’t one. It’s kinda verboten to use gods name so ya, the closest thing to it in the Jewish tradition would be Shalom Aleichem which roughly means peace be with/upon you

Am I the only Christian that is pissed off at the secularization of "Amazing Grace"?
"

Prima Scriptura wrote:Am I the only Christian that is pissed off at the secularization of "Amazing Grace"?
"

I didn't think it was ever secularized, I've always found the song to be religious.

Denoidumbutoniurucwivobrs wrote:

Prima Scriptura wrote:Am I the only Christian that is pissed off at the secularization of "Amazing Grace"?
"

I didn't think it was ever secularized, I've always found the song to be religious.

The song is religious, I'm talking about it's use in the secular sense.

Prima Scriptura wrote:

Denoidumbutoniurucwivobrs wrote:I didn't think it was ever secularized, I've always found the song to be religious.

The song is religious, I'm talking about it's use in the secular sense.

such as?