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The Ukrainian War IV: "And von Moltke Laughed ..."

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The Two Jerseys
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Founded: Jun 07, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Two Jerseys » Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:02 pm

Not Alie wrote:
The Two Jerseys wrote:But "mUh StRoNg RuBlE!"

At least they now make anti-sanctions car! Never mind the complete lack of "safety feature" or "pollution control" crap, is true Franco-Russian automobile for true European Russian people!
*proceeds to crash into concrete barrier killing himself*

Nyet, comrade, this is still car of Western imperialism! True Russians roll down windows to adjust mirrors manually!
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Not Alie
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Not Alie » Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:23 pm

The Two Jerseys wrote:
Not Alie wrote:At least they now make anti-sanctions car! Never mind the complete lack of "safety feature" or "pollution control" crap, is true Franco-Russian automobile for true European Russian people!
*proceeds to crash into concrete barrier killing himself*

Nyet, comrade, this is still car of Western imperialism! True Russians roll down windows to adjust mirrors manually!

Ey Artyom! Restart VAZ-2107 production! SRAZU ZHE!

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Last edited by Not Alie on Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Perikuresu
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Perikuresu » Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:35 am

Another bridge in Kherson oblast has been struck by Ukraine's missiles, has Russian forces been mostly cut off from Kherson city at this point, it's been a long time that I've forgotten quite a bit
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Beyaz Toros
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Postby Beyaz Toros » Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:28 pm

Vistulange wrote:This is one of those events where I wish we didn't have another thread iteration. Nothing constructive to add from the previous thread—just condolences for all the Ukrainians who're facing difficult times.


I saw your post on the previous thread. I agree with it. I’m sorry I don’t know how to quote it here. I can only hope our leadership is brave. I was wondering if the lackluster response initially was from fear of Russian arms. That is my hope versus they are craven and don’t believe in their own system. My apologies for delay I had real life.

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BEEstreetz
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Founded: May 28, 2022
Anarchy

Postby BEEstreetz » Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:07 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:It would also promote racism against Russians.


Kind of the reason why I rarely interact in this thread chain.
People don't really understand (nor try to) how different Ukraine/Russia/Belarus prism of worldview is compared to that of most NS users (Anglo-Eurocentric). They lack a lot of knowledge not just on the society and history of this very specific civilization but also on why it's important to know a civilization before giving yourself the privilege to make (any) judgements on it.
I rarely see that discussed. It's mostly "who is the aggressor" and "what will happen next". These are urgent but they're secondary in the long-term.
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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:46 pm

BEEstreetz wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:It would also promote racism against Russians.


Kind of the reason why I rarely interact in this thread chain.
People don't really understand (nor try to) how different Ukraine/Russia/Belarus prism of worldview is compared to that of most NS users (Anglo-Eurocentric). They lack a lot of knowledge not just on the society and history of this very specific civilization but also on why it's important to know a civilization before giving yourself the privilege to make (any) judgements on it.
I rarely see that discussed. It's mostly "who is the aggressor" and "what will happen next". These are urgent but they're secondary in the long-term.


Ukraine and Russia haven't been the same civilization for over a thousand years or so. That ended when Kievan Rus fell apart and Ukrainians and Russians took very different historical paths.
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Picairn
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Picairn » Sun Aug 14, 2022 8:19 pm

BEEstreetz wrote:They lack a lot of knowledge not just on the society and history of this very specific civilization but also on why it's important to know a civilization before giving yourself the privilege to make (any) judgements on it.
I rarely see that discussed. It's mostly "who is the aggressor" and "what will happen next". These are urgent but they're secondary in the long-term.

If you are searching for a discussion on Russian and Ukrainian civilizations, your place would be in an anthropology conference, not a thread on warfare between the two nations.
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Free Algerstonia
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Free Algerstonia » Sun Aug 14, 2022 8:22 pm

The House of Hamid wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Ya know if all the US cared about was money then we literally would not have dropped nearly 40 billion dollars on Ukraine.

We also wouldn’t have bothered with NATO and protecting Europe or really any military venture that didn’t make us money.

Clearly we don’t just care about money


P*** off back to the united states of A****holery then. Go "protect" someone else, ami go home! Nobody wants you to spread you ideology of greed here or anywhere else. All you care for is that your rich people get richer, off our backs and from our wallets. And take your bloody companies with you! Facebook is sh*** anyway.

facebook: ran by lizards
twitter: ran by leftists
tiktok: ran by lame china
instagram: ran by lizards (same lizards that run facebook)
reddit: ran by losers
all of the above: supports ukraine

i rest my case
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Don Flippers
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Founded: May 26, 2022
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Don Flippers » Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:03 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
The Jamesian Republic wrote:First.

Did I forget the part where the first person who posts "First" goes straight to the Eastern Front? :eyebrow:


What about the second person to post, First?

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Don Flippers
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Founded: May 26, 2022
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Don Flippers » Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:56 pm

Sordhau wrote:
Vistulange wrote:Oh, yes. The fifth columnists within Europe. Hopefully, it'll stay restricted to Orbán. I'm not familiar with Italian politics, so I can only say I hope Salvini isn't elected. What I fear is—in the event of a Salvini premiership—Italy becoming the enabler for pro-Russian EU nations, replacing Poland (though, needless to say, Poland's enabling was in regard to the rule of law and liberal democracy, not pro-Russian policies).


Very strange to consider the leaders of sovereign states as 'fifth columnists'. Who exactly are they working to undermine? Some nebulous concept of a united European 'nation'?


That's so on the nose I wouldn't be surprised to hear that reasoning paraphrased by said leaders of sovereign states being considered as fifth columnists.

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Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum
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Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:14 am

Long live Ukraine Long live the European Union !
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Emotional Support Crocodile
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Founded: Jun 06, 2022
New York Times Democracy

Postby Emotional Support Crocodile » Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:31 am

Ukraine hits Russian Wagner mercenary HQ in east

I also see Russia is cosying up to North Korea.
Just another surprising item on the bagging scale of life

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The Huskar Social Union
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Founded: Apr 04, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Huskar Social Union » Mon Aug 15, 2022 3:55 am

Emotional Support Crocodile wrote:Ukraine hits Russian Wagner mercenary HQ in east

I also see Russia is cosying up to North Korea.

Maybe we actually are gona get the cursed timeline of North Korean soldiers fighting in Ukraine.
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Emotional Support Crocodile
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Emotional Support Crocodile » Mon Aug 15, 2022 4:15 am

The Huskar Social Union wrote:
Emotional Support Crocodile wrote:Ukraine hits Russian Wagner mercenary HQ in east

I also see Russia is cosying up to North Korea.

Maybe we actually are gona get the cursed timeline of North Korean soldiers fighting in Ukraine.


It's hard to imagine what else Russia could want from them, unless they want lots of methamphetamine. Breaking Vlad perhaps.
Just another surprising item on the bagging scale of life

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Deblar
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Deblar » Mon Aug 15, 2022 5:10 am

Emotional Support Crocodile wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Maybe we actually are gona get the cursed timeline of North Korean soldiers fighting in Ukraine.


It's hard to imagine what else Russia could want from them, unless they want lots of methamphetamine. Breaking Vlad perhaps.

Unjust invasion of a sovereign nation stuck in a bind? Better call Saul!

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Perikuresu
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Perikuresu » Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:20 am

Russia leaves 20,000 soldiers stranded in tactical withdrawal to the east
*Russia has begun withdrawing troops across a key river to escape a Ukrainian counter offensive, Ukrainian officials claimed yesterday.

Vitaly Kim, the governor of Mykolayiv district, said the entire Russian command staff was retreating from the west bank of the Dnipro river that flows through the occupied city of Kherson in the south east.

If confirmed, that would leave an estimated 20,000 or more Russian soldiers isolated from their commanders and cut off from supply lines by the half-mile-wide river, over which the main bridges in the Kherson region have been damaged by Ukrainian attacks.

“I feel just a bit sorry - but not much - for the stupid orcs who had been abandoned on the right bank of the Dnipro,” Mr Kim said in a message posted to the Telegram social media app, using his favoured derogatory term for Russian soldiers.

“All of the commanders are moving to the other side.”

Early in Vladimir Putin’s invasion of Ukraine, Russian forces surged north from the annexed Crimean Peninsula and quickly seized territory to connect with separatist enclaves in eastern Ukraine. They also advanced westwards, hoping to link up with pro-Russian separatists in Moldova, creating a landbridge that would entirely cut off Ukraine from the Black Sea.

While Russian forces seized Kherson, the only regional capital to have fallen in the invasion, their advance halted east of Mykolaiv, leaving a vulnerable pocket of Russian-controlled territory sandwiched between frontlines, the wide Dnipro River to the east and the Black Sea to the south.

Since then Ukrainian forces have repeatedly targeted the bridges across which nearly all Russian resupplies must pass.'

Video of explosions shared online on Sunday suggested the Antonovksy bridge in Kherson’s suburbs had been targeted again on Saturday night, while Ukrainian forces reported striking another bridge on the Kakhovka Hydroelectric Power Plant dam again on Saturday, reportedly rendering it impassable for heavy vehicles.

On Saturday, the British Ministry of Defence (MoD) said that the two main road bridges to the Russian-controlled pocket “are now probably out of use for the purposes of substantial military resupply”.

Regional official Sergiy Khlan told Ukrainian television that the only way for Russian soldiers to cross the river were pontoons near the Antonovsky bridge that “cannot totally meet their needs”.

Russia was moving its command centres to the left bank of the river knowing that they would struggle to evacuate them if fighting escalated, he added.

While the bridges remain passable on foot, their inability to handle heavy traffic could spell eventual defeat for Russian troops west of the Dnipro, according to the Institute for the Study of War.

“Russian forces on the west bank of the Dnipro will likely lose the ability to defend themselves against even limited Ukrainian counterattacks,” it said in an analysis.

“Bringing ammunition, fuel, and heavy equipment sufficient for offensive or even large-scale defensive operations across pontoon ferries or by air is impractical if not impossible.”

In a bid to relieve pressure, Russian forces may be increasing attacks northeast in the Donbas region in a bid to divert the attention of Ukrainian forces preparing a major counteroffensive in southern Ukraine.

Russia’s priority over the past week has likely been to reorient units to strengthen its campaign in southern Ukraine, the MoD said on Sunday.

Russian-backed forces of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic in the Donbas continued to attempt assaults to the north of Donetsk city, according to the intelligence update.

Ukraine’s military command on Saturday said “fierce fighting” continued in Pisky, an eastern village which Russia had earlier said it had full control over.

Meanwhile, Volodymyr Zelensky, Ukraine’s president, warned that Russian soldiers who shoot at Europe’s largest nuclear power station or use it as a base to shoot from will become a “special target” for Ukrainian forces.

Russian troops captured the Zaporizhzhia nuclear facility in southern Ukraine early in the war, but it is still being run by Ukrainian technicians.

Amid fears of a nuclear catastrophe over renewed shelling there over the past days, United Nations Secretary-General Antonio Guterres has called for the establishment of a demilitarised zone. Ukraine and Russia blame each other for the shelling.

“Every Russian soldier who either shoots at the plant or shoots using the plant as cover, must understand that he becomes a special target for our intelligence agents, for our special services, for our army,” Mr Zelensky said in his nightly address on Saturday.*


tl;dr, methinks Russians are fleeing Kherson
Note that tis the British Telegraph, and the only other sources I can find on these seem to be British tabloid sites
Last edited by Perikuresu on Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:32 am, edited 2 times in total.
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The Huskar Social Union
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Huskar Social Union » Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:39 am

Perikuresu wrote:Russia leaves 20,000 soldiers stranded in tactical withdrawal to the east
*Russia has begun withdrawing troops across a key river to escape a Ukrainian counter offensive, Ukrainian officials claimed yesterday.

Vitaly Kim, the governor of Mykolayiv district, said the entire Russian command staff was retreating from the west bank of the Dnipro river that flows through the occupied city of Kherson in the south east.

If confirmed, that would leave an estimated 20,000 or more Russian soldiers isolated from their commanders and cut off from supply lines by the half-mile-wide river, over which the main bridges in the Kherson region have been damaged by Ukrainian attacks.

“I feel just a bit sorry - but not much - for the stupid orcs who had been abandoned on the right bank of the Dnipro,” Mr Kim said in a message posted to the Telegram social media app, using his favoured derogatory term for Russian soldiers.

“All of the commanders are moving to the other side.”

Early in Vladimir Putin’s invasion of Ukraine, Russian forces surged north from the annexed Crimean Peninsula and quickly seized territory to connect with separatist enclaves in eastern Ukraine. They also advanced westwards, hoping to link up with pro-Russian separatists in Moldova, creating a landbridge that would entirely cut off Ukraine from the Black Sea.

While Russian forces seized Kherson, the only regional capital to have fallen in the invasion, their advance halted east of Mykolaiv, leaving a vulnerable pocket of Russian-controlled territory sandwiched between frontlines, the wide Dnipro River to the east and the Black Sea to the south.

Since then Ukrainian forces have repeatedly targeted the bridges across which nearly all Russian resupplies must pass.'

Video of explosions shared online on Sunday suggested the Antonovksy bridge in Kherson’s suburbs had been targeted again on Saturday night, while Ukrainian forces reported striking another bridge on the Kakhovka Hydroelectric Power Plant dam again on Saturday, reportedly rendering it impassable for heavy vehicles.

On Saturday, the British Ministry of Defence (MoD) said that the two main road bridges to the Russian-controlled pocket “are now probably out of use for the purposes of substantial military resupply”.

Regional official Sergiy Khlan told Ukrainian television that the only way for Russian soldiers to cross the river were pontoons near the Antonovsky bridge that “cannot totally meet their needs”.

Russia was moving its command centres to the left bank of the river knowing that they would struggle to evacuate them if fighting escalated, he added.

While the bridges remain passable on foot, their inability to handle heavy traffic could spell eventual defeat for Russian troops west of the Dnipro, according to the Institute for the Study of War.

“Russian forces on the west bank of the Dnipro will likely lose the ability to defend themselves against even limited Ukrainian counterattacks,” it said in an analysis.

“Bringing ammunition, fuel, and heavy equipment sufficient for offensive or even large-scale defensive operations across pontoon ferries or by air is impractical if not impossible.”

In a bid to relieve pressure, Russian forces may be increasing attacks northeast in the Donbas region in a bid to divert the attention of Ukrainian forces preparing a major counteroffensive in southern Ukraine.

Russia’s priority over the past week has likely been to reorient units to strengthen its campaign in southern Ukraine, the MoD said on Sunday.

Russian-backed forces of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic in the Donbas continued to attempt assaults to the north of Donetsk city, according to the intelligence update.

Ukraine’s military command on Saturday said “fierce fighting” continued in Pisky, an eastern village which Russia had earlier said it had full control over.

Meanwhile, Volodymyr Zelensky, Ukraine’s president, warned that Russian soldiers who shoot at Europe’s largest nuclear power station or use it as a base to shoot from will become a “special target” for Ukrainian forces.

Russian troops captured the Zaporizhzhia nuclear facility in southern Ukraine early in the war, but it is still being run by Ukrainian technicians.

Amid fears of a nuclear catastrophe over renewed shelling there over the past days, United Nations Secretary-General Antonio Guterres has called for the establishment of a demilitarised zone. Ukraine and Russia blame each other for the shelling.

“Every Russian soldier who either shoots at the plant or shoots using the plant as cover, must understand that he becomes a special target for our intelligence agents, for our special services, for our army,” Mr Zelensky said in his nightly address on Saturday.*


tl;dr, methinks Russians are fleeing Kherson
Note that tis the British Telegraph, and the only other sources I can find on these seem to be British tabloid sites

Its also being claimed by the Ukrainian military so we should wait and see for more information to come out from other sources to see if its real.
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The Selkie
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Posts: 15905
Founded: Sep 17, 2014
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby The Selkie » Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:51 am

Perikuresu wrote:Russia leaves 20,000 soldiers stranded in tactical withdrawal to the east
*Russia has begun withdrawing troops across a key river to escape a Ukrainian counter offensive, Ukrainian officials claimed yesterday.

Vitaly Kim, the governor of Mykolayiv district, said the entire Russian command staff was retreating from the west bank of the Dnipro river that flows through the occupied city of Kherson in the south east.

If confirmed, that would leave an estimated 20,000 or more Russian soldiers isolated from their commanders and cut off from supply lines by the half-mile-wide river, over which the main bridges in the Kherson region have been damaged by Ukrainian attacks.

“I feel just a bit sorry - but not much - for the stupid orcs who had been abandoned on the right bank of the Dnipro,” Mr Kim said in a message posted to the Telegram social media app, using his favoured derogatory term for Russian soldiers.

“All of the commanders are moving to the other side.”

Early in Vladimir Putin’s invasion of Ukraine, Russian forces surged north from the annexed Crimean Peninsula and quickly seized territory to connect with separatist enclaves in eastern Ukraine. They also advanced westwards, hoping to link up with pro-Russian separatists in Moldova, creating a landbridge that would entirely cut off Ukraine from the Black Sea.

While Russian forces seized Kherson, the only regional capital to have fallen in the invasion, their advance halted east of Mykolaiv, leaving a vulnerable pocket of Russian-controlled territory sandwiched between frontlines, the wide Dnipro River to the east and the Black Sea to the south.

Since then Ukrainian forces have repeatedly targeted the bridges across which nearly all Russian resupplies must pass.'

Video of explosions shared online on Sunday suggested the Antonovksy bridge in Kherson’s suburbs had been targeted again on Saturday night, while Ukrainian forces reported striking another bridge on the Kakhovka Hydroelectric Power Plant dam again on Saturday, reportedly rendering it impassable for heavy vehicles.

On Saturday, the British Ministry of Defence (MoD) said that the two main road bridges to the Russian-controlled pocket “are now probably out of use for the purposes of substantial military resupply”.

Regional official Sergiy Khlan told Ukrainian television that the only way for Russian soldiers to cross the river were pontoons near the Antonovsky bridge that “cannot totally meet their needs”.

Russia was moving its command centres to the left bank of the river knowing that they would struggle to evacuate them if fighting escalated, he added.

While the bridges remain passable on foot, their inability to handle heavy traffic could spell eventual defeat for Russian troops west of the Dnipro, according to the Institute for the Study of War.

“Russian forces on the west bank of the Dnipro will likely lose the ability to defend themselves against even limited Ukrainian counterattacks,” it said in an analysis.

“Bringing ammunition, fuel, and heavy equipment sufficient for offensive or even large-scale defensive operations across pontoon ferries or by air is impractical if not impossible.”

In a bid to relieve pressure, Russian forces may be increasing attacks northeast in the Donbas region in a bid to divert the attention of Ukrainian forces preparing a major counteroffensive in southern Ukraine.

Russia’s priority over the past week has likely been to reorient units to strengthen its campaign in southern Ukraine, the MoD said on Sunday.

Russian-backed forces of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic in the Donbas continued to attempt assaults to the north of Donetsk city, according to the intelligence update.

Ukraine’s military command on Saturday said “fierce fighting” continued in Pisky, an eastern village which Russia had earlier said it had full control over.

Meanwhile, Volodymyr Zelensky, Ukraine’s president, warned that Russian soldiers who shoot at Europe’s largest nuclear power station or use it as a base to shoot from will become a “special target” for Ukrainian forces.

Russian troops captured the Zaporizhzhia nuclear facility in southern Ukraine early in the war, but it is still being run by Ukrainian technicians.

Amid fears of a nuclear catastrophe over renewed shelling there over the past days, United Nations Secretary-General Antonio Guterres has called for the establishment of a demilitarised zone. Ukraine and Russia blame each other for the shelling.

“Every Russian soldier who either shoots at the plant or shoots using the plant as cover, must understand that he becomes a special target for our intelligence agents, for our special services, for our army,” Mr Zelensky said in his nightly address on Saturday.*


tl;dr, methinks Russians are fleeing Kherson
Note that tis the British Telegraph, and the only other sources I can find on these seem to be British tabloid sites


They are neither fleeing nor withdrawing, they are, in a strategically sound move, advancing backwards.
In a bit more seriousness, the Redaktionsnetzwerk Deutschland reports something similar (article in German). Granted, they admit, that one of their sources, especially for the retreat of Russian commanders, is the Ukrainian Governeur of the region, who has his information from an Ukrainian newspaper. More interesting is, that the local dam has apparently been damaged, no one knows how heavily.
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Salus Maior
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Founded: Jun 16, 2014
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Postby Salus Maior » Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:52 am

The Huskar Social Union wrote:
Perikuresu wrote:Russia leaves 20,000 soldiers stranded in tactical withdrawal to the east


tl;dr, methinks Russians are fleeing Kherson
Note that tis the British Telegraph, and the only other sources I can find on these seem to be British tabloid sites

Its also being claimed by the Ukrainian military so we should wait and see for more information to come out from other sources to see if its real.


Hopefully Ukraine will be able to keep pushing east.
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"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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Picairn
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Founded: Feb 21, 2020
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Picairn » Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:51 am

Picairn's Ministry of Foreign Relations
Minister: Edward H. Cornell
WA Ambassador: John M. Terry (Active)
Factbook | Constitution | Newspaper
Albrenia wrote:With great power comes great mockability.

Proctopeo wrote:I'm completely right and you know it.

Moralityland wrote:big corporations allied with the communist elite
Social democrat, passionate political observer, and naval warfare enthusiast.
Listen here Jack, we're going to destroy malarkey.
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The Holy Therns
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Postby The Holy Therns » Mon Aug 15, 2022 7:57 am


And if they were being wasted, that might have been a problem.
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Finalis
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Founded: Jul 28, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Finalis » Mon Aug 15, 2022 12:06 pm

The Holy Therns wrote:

And if they were being wasted, that might have been a problem.

they have indeed been wasted.
the end

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Finalis
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Founded: Jul 28, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Finalis » Mon Aug 15, 2022 12:06 pm


almost as if we're damaging our national security to save a corrupt eastern european regime
the end

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Salus Maior
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Founded: Jun 16, 2014
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Postby Salus Maior » Mon Aug 15, 2022 12:36 pm

Finalis wrote:

almost as if we're damaging our national security to save a corrupt eastern european regime


We have more than enough to defend ourselves. Keeping Russia from their expansionist ideas at the very least will pay off in the future.
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"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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Vassenor
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 65385
Founded: Nov 11, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Mon Aug 15, 2022 12:52 pm

Finalis wrote:
The Holy Therns wrote:And if they were being wasted, that might have been a problem.

they have indeed been wasted.


Wasted doing what?
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