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American Politics XII: We Can Do Bad All By Ourselves

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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What Issues Are Most Important To You This Cycle?

The Economy(Non-Inflation Issues)
52
12%
Defence
28
6%
Civil/Human Rights
73
17%
Court Reform
27
6%
Healthcare
46
11%
Inflation
55
13%
Education
29
7%
The Environment
71
16%
Infrastructure
39
9%
Other(Let us Know!)
13
3%
 
Total votes : 433

User avatar
American Legionaries
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5005
Founded: Nov 03, 2021
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby American Legionaries » Thu May 12, 2022 1:28 pm

San Lumen wrote:
American Legionaries wrote:
Because my rights are more valuable than my enemies' rights. Presuming I even agree with what they're arguing is a right.

even if it means a ruined environment and one party dictatorship.


The former is, so far as I can tell, inevitable. And the latter is beneficial.

User avatar
The Jamesian Republic
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10031
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Thu May 12, 2022 1:36 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
San Lumen wrote:even if it means a ruined environment and one party dictatorship.


The former is, so far as I can tell, inevitable. And the latter is beneficial.


Because gun rights.

But what if I told you you can have all the guns you want and have a multiparty democracy.

User avatar
The United Penguin Commonwealth
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1801
Founded: Feb 01, 2022
Democratic Socialists

Postby The United Penguin Commonwealth » Thu May 12, 2022 1:36 pm

Prima Scriptura wrote:
American Legionaries wrote:
I try to avoid seeing Sean Hannity in general.



I think it more likely the pressure came from the company.


A lot of hard right conservatives are pissed off at Trump for backing Oz. He is seen as a Hollywood elite and out of touch with the working class.


yeah, because Trump is a working-class man who is very in touch with the people.

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User avatar
American Legionaries
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5005
Founded: Nov 03, 2021
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby American Legionaries » Thu May 12, 2022 1:37 pm

The Jamesian Republic wrote:
American Legionaries wrote:
The former is, so far as I can tell, inevitable. And the latter is beneficial.


Because gun rights.

But what if I told you you can have all the guns you want and have a multiparty democracy.


Would you be telling the truth?

User avatar
Port Caverton
Minister
 
Posts: 2105
Founded: Oct 01, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Port Caverton » Thu May 12, 2022 1:38 pm

The United Penguin Commonwealth wrote:
Prima Scriptura wrote:
A lot of hard right conservatives are pissed off at Trump for backing Oz. He is seen as a Hollywood elite and out of touch with the working class.


yeah, because Trump is a working-class man who is very in touch with the people.

I mean that's what his voters unironically believe
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User avatar
The United Penguin Commonwealth
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1801
Founded: Feb 01, 2022
Democratic Socialists

Postby The United Penguin Commonwealth » Thu May 12, 2022 1:39 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
San Lumen wrote:even if it means a ruined environment and one party dictatorship.


The former is, so far as I can tell, inevitable. And the latter is beneficial.


so literally anything is cool with you as long as it means you can have guns?

Alignment: LibLeft
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Heloin wrote:If your faith is hatred towards other people for being born a way then your faith isn’t worth a whole lot.

Kannap wrote:Gotta deny people are born gay because then you have to wrestle with the idea that if people are born gay then its by God's design and, if such, serves a God-given purpose and that doesn't mesh with God believing its a sin.

User avatar
The Jamesian Republic
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10031
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Thu May 12, 2022 1:41 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
The Jamesian Republic wrote:
Because gun rights.

But what if I told you you can have all the guns you want and have a multiparty democracy.


Would you be telling the truth?


Yes. Ideally in a multiparty democracy a gay couple could defend their weed farm with their guns.

User avatar
The United Penguin Commonwealth
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1801
Founded: Feb 01, 2022
Democratic Socialists

Postby The United Penguin Commonwealth » Thu May 12, 2022 1:43 pm

I thought Oz would win, but now that I’m not sure whether it’ll be Oz or McCormick. Probably not Barnette. It’s still anyone’s win, though.
Last edited by The United Penguin Commonwealth on Thu May 12, 2022 1:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Alignment: LibLeft
Ideology: Libertarian Social Democracy
8values: results
LeftValues: results
Compass: results
SapplyValues: results
InfValues: results

Heloin wrote:If your faith is hatred towards other people for being born a way then your faith isn’t worth a whole lot.

Kannap wrote:Gotta deny people are born gay because then you have to wrestle with the idea that if people are born gay then its by God's design and, if such, serves a God-given purpose and that doesn't mesh with God believing its a sin.

User avatar
Forsher
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 20311
Founded: Jan 30, 2012
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Forsher » Thu May 12, 2022 1:45 pm

San Lumen wrote:ending farm subsides is utterly moronic.


If you're doing it for environmental reasons, yes.

It's honestly hilarious watching Americans whine about the urban agenda and crow about their commitment to free market principles when there are countries vastly more reliant on agriculture (and primary industries in general) that have functionally no subsidies whatsoever...
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User avatar
Necroghastia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7078
Founded: May 11, 2019
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Necroghastia » Thu May 12, 2022 1:47 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
Necroghastia wrote:Why?


Because my rights are more valuable than my enemies' rights. Presuming I even agree with what they're arguing is a right.

You do realize your so-called "enemies'" rights are ALSO your rights, right?

Also, again, just how far are you willing to go? If people pay lip-service to the idea of you being able to have a fucking bazooka or whatever, would you stand idly by as they tortured trans people? Locked up people who miscarry because as far as they're concerned it's an abortion?

Hell, you didn't even answer my question. Why is it that important to you?
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User avatar
American Legionaries
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5005
Founded: Nov 03, 2021
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby American Legionaries » Thu May 12, 2022 1:47 pm

Prima Scriptura wrote:
Shrillland wrote:
I'm not sure that it can be done given how the Dems are actually opposed to a lot of farmers on more things than just social issues. A lot of Dems want to see farm subsidies and ethanol subsidies gutted to try to alleviate world poverty, never mind the horrific consequences such measures would have here with the effective price controls such subsidies bring turned off, or the fact that it would make the agribusiness conglomerates ever more powerful as small farmers could no longer hope to make money against foreign imports or big business. Out west, the Dems side against farmers and ranchers on things like water rights and land use rights, something that we who live east of the Mississippi have never had to contemplate because the BLM barely owns land here. On top of all this, the increasingly Democratic mantra of the city as the crowning achievement of civilisation draws a lot of resentment as us rural folks face ever-worsening
poverty, drug use, and suicide rates from lack of economic opportunity.


Unless someone that considers themselves a paternalistic conservative, I sympathize with the problems that people in rural areas face. I want to help them along with people experiencing the same issues in urban areas. There’s gonna have to be some class collaboration and we need to drop the “us vs them”

Also, there has to be a limit on the populism that many rural folk embrace. It’s going to come to a point where anybody that has more than a high school diploma, this includes associates and trade schools is part of the “elite”.


The "Elites" are, at least in my experience, categorized less my education level, and more by manner and expertise. Of every person who lives in a mile radius of me, I'm the only adult who isn't a college graduate. And yet these people are almost of one voice in lambasting the "elites".

User avatar
The Jamesian Republic
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10031
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Thu May 12, 2022 1:47 pm

Forsher wrote:
San Lumen wrote:ending farm subsides is utterly moronic.


If you're doing it for environmental reasons, yes.

It's honestly hilarious watching Americans whine about the urban agenda and crow about their commitment to free market principles when there are countries vastly more reliant on agriculture (and primary industries in general) that have functionally no subsidies whatsoever...


Didn’t New Zealand have more sheep than people at one point?

User avatar
Necroghastia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7078
Founded: May 11, 2019
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Necroghastia » Thu May 12, 2022 1:49 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
San Lumen wrote:even if it means a ruined environment and one party dictatorship.


The former is, so far as I can tell, inevitable. And the latter is beneficial.

It's only inevitable as long as you keep masturbating the egos of those who pay lip service to the idea of muh guns while they give break after break and kickback after kickback to the fossil fuels industries.
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User avatar
Senkaku
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24516
Founded: Sep 01, 2012
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Senkaku » Thu May 12, 2022 1:49 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
San Lumen wrote:
You care about one thing and one thing alone.


Sure, and I'm unflinching in my willingness to put people like you through any degree of hardship necessary to get it.

I don’t think you actually care about anything at all, you just get excited about imagining “putting people like you through (((any degree of hardship)))”— it’s not at all clear to me that right-wing autocracy will be meaningfully more committed to letting you buy weapons of mass destruction on credit or whatever brand of incoherent maximalism you’re embracing for provocative purposes these days; you just enjoy the most nihilist strains of the culture war
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User avatar
American Legionaries
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5005
Founded: Nov 03, 2021
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby American Legionaries » Thu May 12, 2022 1:49 pm

The Jamesian Republic wrote:
American Legionaries wrote:
Would you be telling the truth?


Yes. Ideally in a multiparty democracy a gay couple could defend their weed farm with their guns.


We don't live in your ideal, we live in the real world.

User avatar
The Jamesian Republic
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10031
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Thu May 12, 2022 1:50 pm

I’m getting ready to red pill this entire thread: You can own a bazooka be trans and have sole authority over your body at the same time.

User avatar
Senkaku
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24516
Founded: Sep 01, 2012
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Senkaku » Thu May 12, 2022 1:51 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
Prima Scriptura wrote:
Unless someone that considers themselves a paternalistic conservative, I sympathize with the problems that people in rural areas face. I want to help them along with people experiencing the same issues in urban areas. There’s gonna have to be some class collaboration and we need to drop the “us vs them”

Also, there has to be a limit on the populism that many rural folk embrace. It’s going to come to a point where anybody that has more than a high school diploma, this includes associates and trade schools is part of the “elite”.


The "Elites" are, at least in my experience, categorized less my education level, and more by manner and expertise. Of every person who lives in a mile radius of me, I'm the only adult who isn't a college graduate. And yet these people are almost of one voice in lambasting the "elites".

“Elite”: meaningful term, or just a vibe? You won’t want to hear, but fortunately will barely be able to understand, what the far right wingnuts we polled had to say!
retvrn to modernity

User avatar
The Jamesian Republic
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10031
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Thu May 12, 2022 1:51 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
The Jamesian Republic wrote:
Yes. Ideally in a multiparty democracy a gay couple could defend their weed farm with their guns.


We don't live in your ideal, we live in the real world.


Alas we don’t. But it would be nice though.

User avatar
Vassenor
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 64393
Founded: Nov 11, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Thu May 12, 2022 1:53 pm

The Far-Right Is Doxxing Judges and Calling For Their Assassinations

As peaceful protesters camp outside the homes of Supreme Court justices after the leaked draft that would overturn Roe v. Wade, far-right activists are doxxing Democratic federal judges and calling for their assassination.

The posts, which appear on a far-right Telegram channel, feature the names and addresses of federal court judges (among other public figures perceived as enemies to the far-right) alongside a bio and a slick red graphic with a Kalashnikov rifle.

The image of the channel on Telegram—the popular encrypted messaging and posting app known in the past for being a safe haven for neo-Nazi terror groups—is the profile of an unidentified militant in a balaclava pointing an assault rifle.

“Remember, change starts with you,” the channel said in its top-line, pinned post. “No one is coming to save us.”


But remember, the real threat is the people standing outside Kav's house trying to ask nicely to get him to keep abortion legal.
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Port Caverton
Minister
 
Posts: 2105
Founded: Oct 01, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Port Caverton » Thu May 12, 2022 1:54 pm

Vassenor wrote:The Far-Right Is Doxxing Judges and Calling For Their Assassinations

As peaceful protesters camp outside the homes of Supreme Court justices after the leaked draft that would overturn Roe v. Wade, far-right activists are doxxing Democratic federal judges and calling for their assassination.

The posts, which appear on a far-right Telegram channel, feature the names and addresses of federal court judges (among other public figures perceived as enemies to the far-right) alongside a bio and a slick red graphic with a Kalashnikov rifle.

The image of the channel on Telegram—the popular encrypted messaging and posting app known in the past for being a safe haven for neo-Nazi terror groups—is the profile of an unidentified militant in a balaclava pointing an assault rifle.

“Remember, change starts with you,” the channel said in its top-line, pinned post. “No one is coming to save us.”


But remember, the real threat is the people standing outside Kav's house trying to ask nicely to get him to keep abortion legal.

Make Gitmo Great Again
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User avatar
American Legionaries
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5005
Founded: Nov 03, 2021
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby American Legionaries » Thu May 12, 2022 1:54 pm

The Jamesian Republic wrote:
American Legionaries wrote:
We don't live in your ideal, we live in the real world.


Alas we don’t. But it would be nice though.


Sure, we all would like if the world just aligned with what we wanted from it. But it doesn't.

User avatar
The Jamesian Republic
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10031
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Thu May 12, 2022 1:55 pm

American Legionaries wrote:
The Jamesian Republic wrote:
Alas we don’t. But it would be nice though.


Sure, we all would like if the world just aligned with what we wanted from it. But it doesn't.


I know.

User avatar
The Jamesian Republic
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10031
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Thu May 12, 2022 1:56 pm

Port Caverton wrote:
Vassenor wrote:The Far-Right Is Doxxing Judges and Calling For Their Assassinations



But remember, the real threat is the people standing outside Kav's house trying to ask nicely to get him to keep abortion legal.

Make Gitmo Great Again


Crusade Time.

User avatar
American Legionaries
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5005
Founded: Nov 03, 2021
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby American Legionaries » Thu May 12, 2022 1:57 pm

Necroghastia wrote:
American Legionaries wrote:
The former is, so far as I can tell, inevitable. And the latter is beneficial.

It's only inevitable as long as you keep masturbating the egos of those who pay lip service to the idea of muh guns while they give break after break and kickback after kickback to the fossil fuels industries.


You really believe that the environment will be just fine if Democrats came to power?

User avatar
Senkaku
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24516
Founded: Sep 01, 2012
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Senkaku » Thu May 12, 2022 1:57 pm

Vassenor wrote:The Far-Right Is Doxxing Judges and Calling For Their Assassinations

As peaceful protesters camp outside the homes of Supreme Court justices after the leaked draft that would overturn Roe v. Wade, far-right activists are doxxing Democratic federal judges and calling for their assassination.

The posts, which appear on a far-right Telegram channel, feature the names and addresses of federal court judges (among other public figures perceived as enemies to the far-right) alongside a bio and a slick red graphic with a Kalashnikov rifle.

The image of the channel on Telegram—the popular encrypted messaging and posting app known in the past for being a safe haven for neo-Nazi terror groups—is the profile of an unidentified militant in a balaclava pointing an assault rifle.

“Remember, change starts with you,” the channel said in its top-line, pinned post. “No one is coming to save us.”


But remember, the real threat is the people standing outside Kav's house trying to ask nicely to get him to keep abortion legal.

I feel like hitting actual government-by-assassination territory will be my cue to actually emigrate tbh. Although tbf most of these guys are like Telconi and like posting about murdering people more than they actually want to hurt anyone, cold comfort though that may be once they finally wind some lurker up enough to kick things off.
retvrn to modernity

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