Sordhau wrote:Neat. Not relevant tho.
Maybe not to the conversation we are about to have, but it was relevant to my discussion with Genivaria, who claims that employers use the threat of violence to get people to work.
Other people are under no obligation to provide resources to you, except as part of a voluntary trade.
Right, which is why in the Soviet Union if you didn't work you didn't eat. Labor for necessities was the trade.
Why should a faceless bureaucrat decide what my labor is worth? I'd much rather negotiate directly with my boss and be able to tell him to pound sand if he disagrees with my evaluation.
Indeed. Capitalism is not natural. It is an invention of man to better survive the threats of nature.
Impossible. Capitalism didn't exist until the European Renaissance.
Never said it was the only such system invented by man. Obviously other systems existed - mostly in the context of monarchies and feudalism. Thankfully, the world has moved to more democratic systems of government since the renaissance.
Don't you know how the tragedy of the commons works? Establishing property is necessary to ensure wise stewardship of resources.
Correct, which is why the state--not private individuals, organizations, or corporations--should have the sole stewardship of property.
Why would I trust a monolithic state more than private individuals like myself? Doesn't this effectively create a giant corporation that has a monopoly on all resources, all labor, and all violence? And with this single entity in total control of my life and my economic decisions, how could I possibly be free? How could I be anything other than a slave?
And you can't steal something if no one owns it.
People did own it, though.
By definition, no one owns "the commons".
I support the use of violence to deter theft.
Ah, so you support Socialism to deter wage theft! Wonderful, glad to have you on board comrade!
lol. I'll give you props for creativity. The main issue for me is I reject the labor theory of value. Value is subjective. Individuals have diverse needs and wants, so the value of a thing depends on the individual. I also reject the notion that profit is theft. If someone builds a factory, buys raw materials, and takes orders for products, that is a major part of production. Labor is just the last step to make it work. Likewise, a car runs on fuel - but you would never say the fuel which does the work is the thing solely responsible for the operation of a car. You would also credit the engine, the wheels, the driveshaft, numerous other parts, and the driver - in its operation. If someone organizes a company that can produce useful products, they deserve what profit they can generate (if any).
