NATION

PASSWORD

The Invasion of Ukraine, Russia Threatens Finland/Sweden

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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What do?

NATO should decline these demands and begin preparing for WW3 to break out.
683
38%
NATO should decline these demands and hope it's fine and/or limited to the invasion of Ukraine.
360
20%
NATO should negotiate.
502
28%
NATO should accept these demands.
267
15%
 
Total votes : 1812

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Hukhalia
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Ex-Nation

Postby Hukhalia » Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:15 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:
Deblar wrote:The French revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race. /s
It continues to happen, let the french revolution end, let the period of establishment of unions such as the European Union begin. Schengen border crossing is for the whole of Europe.Russia should see this, America should see this, the crusades should end, modern humanism should be for all humanity.

Modern humanism is bunk and the EU is a decrepit, imperialist entity only lauded by out-of-touch liberals and global corporate interests.
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Latvijas Otra Republika
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Latvijas Otra Republika » Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:21 pm

New Baltenstein wrote:
Latvijas Otra Republika wrote:This is pretty standard and healthy, many countries such as Iceland - the Nordic and Eastern Europe - are reviving old traditional faiths and symbolism. Due time.


I am honestly not sure which position is the more absurd one: condemning the rise of neopaganism or celebrating it. It's just make-believe born from identity issues, no more or less healthy than obsessing over stuff like Lord of the Rings

C'mon, if you want to be a real nihilistic post-modernist you need to step it up a bit. Every facet of human identity, culture, religion and every belief structure are all nothing more than illusory make-believe in the vacuum of space. It's absurd to be anything - so it is better to be blank food for worms. Something like that.

I'm just happy important elements of culture are preserved and not homogenised completely, whether it be in Africa or South-East Asia.
Last edited by Latvijas Otra Republika on Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Arvenia
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Arvenia » Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:38 pm

New Baltenstein wrote:Forcing Serbs and Albanians into the same state again would be foolish, so let's do the sensible thing and re-unite Serbs and Bosniaks instead ^_^

No, shun the Serbs! No one should be friends with Serbia (except for Russia and its European allies).
Free Algerstonia wrote:We should NEVER make Albania more powerful. Albania is the single most EVIL entity in the world, living there is worse than living in hell

That is pretty offensive, you know. Albania still has its geographic and cultural beauty as any other European country.
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GB and Ireland
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Founded: Jan 20, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby GB and Ireland » Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:41 pm

Arvenia wrote:
New Baltenstein wrote:Forcing Serbs and Albanians into the same state again would be foolish, so let's do the sensible thing and re-unite Serbs and Bosniaks instead ^_^

No, shun the Serbs! No one should be friends with Serbia (except for Russia and its European allies).
Free Algerstonia wrote:We should NEVER make Albania more powerful. Albania is the single most EVIL entity in the world, living there is worse than living in hell

That is pretty offensive, you know. Albania still has its geographic and cultural beauty as any other European country.

It could be argued that it's offensive to advocate "shunning the Serbs".
I'll keep calling it "Kiev".

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Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum
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Founded: Sep 24, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:24 pm

Hukhalia wrote:
Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:It continues to happen, let the french revolution end, let the period of establishment of unions such as the European Union begin. Schengen border crossing is for the whole of Europe.Russia should see this, America should see this, the crusades should end, modern humanism should be for all humanity.

Modern humanism is bunk and the EU is a decrepit, imperialist entity only lauded by out-of-touch liberals and global corporate interests.
So please explain to me that as a human being, why am I happier in European countries ? I do not feel safe in Russia or I do not feel safe in countries in the Asian region The proof that social liberals have done a better job for humanity than communists and capitalists is the European Union.
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Christian Confederation
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Moralistic Democracy

Postby Christian Confederation » Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:30 pm

I just want Germany and Austria reunited
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Port Caverton
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Port Caverton » Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:35 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:
Hukhalia wrote:Modern humanism is bunk and the EU is a decrepit, imperialist entity only lauded by out-of-touch liberals and global corporate interests.
So please explain to me that as a human being, why am I happier in European countries ? I do not feel safe in Russia or I do not feel safe in countries in the Asian region The proof that social liberals have done a better job for humanity than communists and capitalists is the European Union.

Social liberalism is still just capitalism
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Arvenia
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Arvenia » Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:37 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:
Hukhalia wrote:Modern humanism is bunk and the EU is a decrepit, imperialist entity only lauded by out-of-touch liberals and global corporate interests.
So please explain to me that as a human being, why am I happier in European countries ? I do not feel safe in Russia or I do not feel safe in countries in the Asian region The proof that social liberals have done a better job for humanity than communists and capitalists is the European Union.

It could be more better if there was no Article 13. Also, is Turkey unsafe as well?
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Arvenia
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Arvenia » Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:38 pm

Port Caverton wrote:
Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:So please explain to me that as a human being, why am I happier in European countries ? I do not feel safe in Russia or I do not feel safe in countries in the Asian region The proof that social liberals have done a better job for humanity than communists and capitalists is the European Union.

Social liberalism is still just capitalism

Albeit more regulatory.
Last edited by Arvenia on Sat Jan 29, 2022 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum
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Founded: Sep 24, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:28 pm

Arvenia wrote:
Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:So please explain to me that as a human being, why am I happier in European countries ? I do not feel safe in Russia or I do not feel safe in countries in the Asian region The proof that social liberals have done a better job for humanity than communists and capitalists is the European Union.

It could be more better if there was no Article 13. Also, is Turkey unsafe as well?
Unfortunately, this also applies to Turkey. I just want to be happy and useful to humanity like every other human being. I hate people who are greedy for war and money when there is sex and fun.
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Neanderthaland
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Neanderthaland » Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:36 pm

Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:
Arvenia wrote:Why do you advocate for a reunified Yugoslavia? You know that Yugoslav reunification won't happen due to the Yugoslav Wars. Kosovo would not want anything to do with Yugoslavia after the 90s.

Therefore, we should support the eventual unification of Albania and Kosovo.
I absolutely agree with you, sorry, sharing with a map will give meaning to what I said. The United States of Yugoslavia and Turkey can be a cultural and strategic European Union partner, and we can have strong trump cards in sanctions against Russia.We know that Iran, like Armenia, follows a strategic partnership with Russia. I think a united Cyprus will be important for the European Union for possible Syria sanctions.Gagauzia may be the region to be used as a border post between Ukraine and the European Union. The best lesson to be given to Russia and America for the European Union Shield defense union is the establishment of an independent People's Republic of Crimea, where European Union standards are preserved.
Image

If you don't want to be called an Imperialist, stop looking for lebensraum in Kurdistan. It's not yours and they don't want you. And this thread is not about Turkish nationalist wet dreams.
Last edited by Neanderthaland on Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Farnhamia
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Left-Leaning College State

Postby Farnhamia » Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:45 pm

Neanderthaland wrote:
Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum wrote:I absolutely agree with you, sorry, sharing with a map will give meaning to what I said. The United States of Yugoslavia and Turkey can be a cultural and strategic European Union partner, and we can have strong trump cards in sanctions against Russia.We know that Iran, like Armenia, follows a strategic partnership with Russia. I think a united Cyprus will be important for the European Union for possible Syria sanctions.Gagauzia may be the region to be used as a border post between Ukraine and the European Union. The best lesson to be given to Russia and America for the European Union Shield defense union is the establishment of an independent People's Republic of Crimea, where European Union standards are preserved.
Image

If you don't want to be called an Imperialist, stop looking for lebensraum in Kurdistan. It's not yours and they don't want you. And this thread is not about Turkish nationalist wet dreams.

I second this last sentiment.
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Shekelesh
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Founded: Jan 07, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Shekelesh » Sat Jan 29, 2022 3:49 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Shekelesh wrote:Yes actually it does. The Memorandum has a qualifier for when they are supposed to (which is also not obligation) seek UNSC action (which itself does not have to respond militarily).

Or being the key word here. An act of aggression is not the same as an a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used.

Otherwise they would have separated the two. The first part refers to military invasions while the latter is for nuclear weapons

No, it's referring to acts of aggression and/or threats of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used (or being threatened to be used). Even if it were to apply to more conventional acts of aggression it still does not confer an obligation upon the United States to act. It certainly gives the US space to legitimately act if it should choose to but there is no actual beholding of the US to Ukraine. It's a choice. There is really nothing to be gained by defending Ukraine.
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Antipatros
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Founded: Aug 26, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Antipatros » Sat Jan 29, 2022 3:54 pm

Britain considering major NATO deployment amid Ukraine crisis

The biggest deployments would be to the Nordics and Baltics.
Last edited by Antipatros on Sat Jan 29, 2022 3:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Shekelesh
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Ex-Nation

Postby Shekelesh » Sat Jan 29, 2022 3:54 pm

Anyway, if Russia does invade it'll most likely be after the Olympics have started.
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The Huskar Social Union
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Huskar Social Union » Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:12 pm

The brave fisherman of the Peoples Republic of Cork have triumphed over the Russian Navy

Minister for Foreign Affairs and Defence Simon Coveney has confirmed that Russian naval exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ).

Mr Coveney said he wrote a letter to the Russian defence minister this week requesting a reconsideration of naval exercises off the Irish coast.

“This evening I received a letter confirming the Russian exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s EEZ. I welcome this response,” Mr Coveney said on Twitter on Saturday.

Russian naval drills were due to be undertaken outside Ireland’s sea territory but within the State’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ) about 240km off the coast of west Cork next week.

This left Irish fishermen angry at the potential disruption to their traditional fishing grounds with up to 60 trawlers expected to start fishing these waters.

Russian ambassador to Ireland Yuriy Filatov confirmed the decision of Russia’s defence minister Sergey Shoigu to relocate the military exercises following requests from the Irish Government and the Irish South and West Fish Producers Organisation, which met the ambassador at the embassy in Dublin earlier this week.

Mr Filatov said in a statement that the decision was made by Mr Shoigu as “a gesture of goodwill” with “the aim not to hinder fishing activities by the Irish vessels in the traditional fishing areas”.

=CONTINUES=


Bow before them Moscow, bow before them!
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Shekelesh
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Ex-Nation

Postby Shekelesh » Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:23 pm

The Huskar Social Union wrote:The brave fisherman of the Peoples Republic of Cork have triumphed over the Russian Navy

Minister for Foreign Affairs and Defence Simon Coveney has confirmed that Russian naval exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ).

Mr Coveney said he wrote a letter to the Russian defence minister this week requesting a reconsideration of naval exercises off the Irish coast.

“This evening I received a letter confirming the Russian exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s EEZ. I welcome this response,” Mr Coveney said on Twitter on Saturday.

Russian naval drills were due to be undertaken outside Ireland’s sea territory but within the State’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ) about 240km off the coast of west Cork next week.

This left Irish fishermen angry at the potential disruption to their traditional fishing grounds with up to 60 trawlers expected to start fishing these waters.

Russian ambassador to Ireland Yuriy Filatov confirmed the decision of Russia’s defence minister Sergey Shoigu to relocate the military exercises following requests from the Irish Government and the Irish South and West Fish Producers Organisation, which met the ambassador at the embassy in Dublin earlier this week.

Mr Filatov said in a statement that the decision was made by Mr Shoigu as “a gesture of goodwill” with “the aim not to hinder fishing activities by the Irish vessels in the traditional fishing areas”.

=CONTINUES=


Bow before them Moscow, bow before them!

One could say they put a cork in Russia's plans.
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Ethel mermania
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Libertarian Police State

Postby Ethel mermania » Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:24 pm

The Huskar Social Union wrote:The brave fisherman of the Peoples Republic of Cork have triumphed over the Russian Navy

Minister for Foreign Affairs and Defence Simon Coveney has confirmed that Russian naval exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ).

Mr Coveney said he wrote a letter to the Russian defence minister this week requesting a reconsideration of naval exercises off the Irish coast.

“This evening I received a letter confirming the Russian exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s EEZ. I welcome this response,” Mr Coveney said on Twitter on Saturday.

Russian naval drills were due to be undertaken outside Ireland’s sea territory but within the State’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ) about 240km off the coast of west Cork next week.

This left Irish fishermen angry at the potential disruption to their traditional fishing grounds with up to 60 trawlers expected to start fishing these waters.

Russian ambassador to Ireland Yuriy Filatov confirmed the decision of Russia’s defence minister Sergey Shoigu to relocate the military exercises following requests from the Irish Government and the Irish South and West Fish Producers Organisation, which met the ambassador at the embassy in Dublin earlier this week.

Mr Filatov said in a statement that the decision was made by Mr Shoigu as “a gesture of goodwill” with “the aim not to hinder fishing activities by the Irish vessels in the traditional fishing areas”.

=CONTINUES=


Bow before them Moscow, bow before them!

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Qihein
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Founded: Nov 30, 2019
Capitalizt

Postby Qihein » Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:29 pm

I love seeing communist defending imperialist Russia like there still the USSR. Although it's fun to watch two imperialist powers point fingers at each other.
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Deblar
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Founded: Jan 28, 2021
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Deblar » Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:34 pm

The Huskar Social Union wrote:The brave fisherman of the Peoples Republic of Cork have triumphed over the Russian Navy

Minister for Foreign Affairs and Defence Simon Coveney has confirmed that Russian naval exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ).

Mr Coveney said he wrote a letter to the Russian defence minister this week requesting a reconsideration of naval exercises off the Irish coast.

“This evening I received a letter confirming the Russian exercises will be relocated outside of Ireland’s EEZ. I welcome this response,” Mr Coveney said on Twitter on Saturday.

Russian naval drills were due to be undertaken outside Ireland’s sea territory but within the State’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ) about 240km off the coast of west Cork next week.

This left Irish fishermen angry at the potential disruption to their traditional fishing grounds with up to 60 trawlers expected to start fishing these waters.

Russian ambassador to Ireland Yuriy Filatov confirmed the decision of Russia’s defence minister Sergey Shoigu to relocate the military exercises following requests from the Irish Government and the Irish South and West Fish Producers Organisation, which met the ambassador at the embassy in Dublin earlier this week.

Mr Filatov said in a statement that the decision was made by Mr Shoigu as “a gesture of goodwill” with “the aim not to hinder fishing activities by the Irish vessels in the traditional fishing areas”.

=CONTINUES=


Bow before them Moscow, bow before them!

Who’s your daddy?

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Gallia-
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Posts: 25421
Founded: Oct 09, 2013
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Gallia- » Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:39 pm

Antipatros wrote:Would a kind of Finlandization be a good outcome for Ukraine?

Ukraine could stay out of NATO, but associate itself with the West economically and politically. Militarily, it would be a neutral buffer state.


Russia doesn't care about NATO membership. It cares about Ukraine being aligned with the West. These are basically the same thing.

There are two ways Ukraine ends:

1) It joins NATO or aligns itself in some other way with the West. Ukraine and the West destroy Russia.
2) NATO doesn't let it join, or ignores it; Russia (re-)conquers Ukraine and UA is integrated back into it.

NATO seems more interested in 2 than 1, since it means it doesn't have to do anything directly, and whatever happens doesn't concern NATO in any real sense, so there's no point to doing anything. For all the talk Joe is putting out the smart move would be to let Ukraine just sorta muddle through the issue. If they can defeat Russia by themselves, great. If not, then who cares, besides Ukrainians. It's not like Russia is interested in Estonia or Poland and it wouldn't be able to beat NATO writ large, since it can probably barely defeat the much worse-than-either "Ukrainian Army".

Latvijas Otra Republika wrote:
Bear Stearns wrote:ukraine is so ethnonationalist that it has a thriving pagan revival movement called rodnovery. goddamn

This is pretty standard and healthy


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Last edited by Gallia- on Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Christian Confederation
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Founded: Dec 12, 2018
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Christian Confederation » Sat Jan 29, 2022 6:55 pm

Lmao Ireland just politely asked Russia to move their military exercise because ot would affect there Fishing Industry and the Russian Navy went "Understandable have a nice day!" It's almost like Diplomacy or something like that.
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Antipatros
Minister
 
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Founded: Aug 26, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Antipatros » Sat Jan 29, 2022 11:23 pm


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Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum
Minister
 
Posts: 2727
Founded: Sep 24, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum » Sun Jan 30, 2022 7:56 am

Qihein wrote:I love seeing communist defending imperialist Russia like there still the USSR. Although it's fun to watch two imperialist powers point fingers at each other.
no war is fun i think the european union model for the whole world.
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Incelastan
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 409
Founded: Nov 02, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Incelastan » Sun Jan 30, 2022 8:13 am

Qihein wrote:I love seeing communist defending imperialist Russia like there still the USSR. Although it's fun to watch two imperialist powers point fingers at each other.


It's weird seeing "leftists" defend Nazi militias in the Ukraine, but here we are.
Last edited by Incelastan on Sun Jan 30, 2022 8:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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