American Politics IX: Winter is Coming

[The Jamesian Republic]

I guess that’s true. I’m not an expert politician and there’s a lot I don’t know. The best thought out plans of the imagination doesn’t shape up to cruelty of the waking world. *sigh* If reform turns into revolution. I needn’t worry. I know my place. My pen my ink and my paper shall be the tools I use. You and the others can take up arms, but my place will be in the shadows and these tools will comfort me and guide me. Eventually I want to sow the seeds of roses to bloom in this post revolutionary world.

This may surprise but not only is there a place for those who nurture and provide for their community in the revolution; those people are in fact a necessity to keep the movement alive.
Community kitchens, tenant strikes, unions, communes, co-opts, there are many forms of power and it follows there are many ways of resisting power.

Chances are you will find me there. Working in the kitchens feeding hungry revolutionaries, joining the strikers and working in the communes and co-opts. So in a way you have brought me hope.

Since it’s been about 7 months since I have joined this messy chaotic uncertain and at times frightening journey through American politics so I want to ask if this isn’t too off topic, what do you all think of me? I would like to believe I try to bring my thoughts to the table and provide a voice of reason.

As a person, from what I can tell, I think you are fine.

Politically, I find your politics to be a mix between social democracy and neoliberalism, while also being willing to consider other points of view and political ideas.

I think it is admirable you try to bring your thoughts to the table (though the internet culture nowadays, especially on NationStates seems to make this a futile endeavor more often than not, but it can still be helpful discourse from time to time).

I think the idea of voice of reason in online political discussion is kind of a myth, as many people have various reasonings that can contradict each other and it is nigh impossible for reason to win in a single discussion (it takes many discussions), and that is already assuming everyone is discussing in good faith and with intellectual rigor.

Thanks. In politics it’s good to keep an open mind and think about other people as the world of politics is rapidly changing and with it the players and spectators. As for my politics I think that’s accurate. When it comes to debate yeah it’s not an easy thing to win. I admit I say things that contradict my previous statements but I try to stay on point. Yes it’s always hard to tell if faith and rigor is there, but I try to stay in good faith and keep my rigor.

[Lady Victory]

Because government has incentive to play nice. Gangs and corporations don't.

Well.....some governments do. I'm convinced that the more you layers between the people and the decision makers the more corrupt and inefficient it inherently is.

Oh, absolutely. But the way governments function pretty much necessitates some degree of public support. Even the most Orwellian despotic states require, at the very least, some degree of support from the general public--or at the least apathy.

Corporations and gangs don't work that way. The former operates largely on legalism, loopholes, and technicalities while the latter is more blunt and aggressive. This isn't the Middle Ages where everyone sings "God Bless the King!" and the average joe doesn't think enough about politics to care who sits on the throne as long as they don't tax too much. Modern states require some degree of popular support to function, and if they don't they often crumble. Even countries like China and North Korea have to be careful not to push their people too far and risk losing everything in the process.

[Umeria]

You guys have nothing on Trump

It may seem like this is the case due to Democrats focusing on Russiagate and January 6, but there's actually quite a bit of criminal behavior that Trump engaged in while in office. For example, the Saudis funneled hundreds of thousands of dollars into Trump's DC hotel, then Trump gave Saudi Arabia a multi billion dollar weapons deal (all while Saudi Arabia commits a genocide in Yemen). That's a pretty clear case of corruption. The reason why Democrats didn't try to impeach him over that is because they also have ties to Saudi Arabia.

[American Legionaries]

Why would the gangs or corporations be far worse?

Because government has incentive to play nice. Gangs and corporations don't.

And yet government still manages to not play nice...

[The Lone Alliance]

Trumpism is proto-fascism. Ever heard of ICE?

You do know ICE existed before Trump and did a lot of bad things even before Trump was President right?

If ICE is Fascism, then Obama and Bush were also Proto-Fascist.

And not supporting illegal immigration isn't really an aspect of Fascism, specifically because under Fascism people try to leave the country to get away from the Fascism, they don't try to illegally sneak into the country.

Now if ICE starts turning their Refugee Overflow camps to "Work Camps" that'd be pretty Fascist.

[Maricarland]

Well.....some governments do. I'm convinced that the more you layers between the people and the decision makers the more corrupt and inefficient it inherently is.

Oh, absolutely. But the way governments function pretty much necessitates some degree of public support. Even the most Orwellian despotic states require, at the very least, some degree of support from the general public--or at the least apathy.

Corporations and gangs don't work that way. The former operates largely on legalism, loopholes, and technicalities while the latter is more blunt and aggressive. This isn't the Middle Ages where everyone sings "God Bless the King!" and the average joe doesn't think enough about politics to care who sits on the throne as long as they don't tax too much. Modern states require some degree of popular support to function, and if they don't they often crumble. Even countries like China and North Korea have to be careful not to push their people too far and risk losing everything in the process.

This understanding of governments, as opposed to gangs and corporations, may be accurate in many ways, but I don't think it is reasonable to treat them as distinct things. It is more complex than that. There are overlaps and spectrums and numerous other factors. A gang in certain circumstances may actually be less blunt and aggressive and more legalistic and technical than a government.

This feels like the wrong question and aspect of power and authority to be focusing on.

However, I always emphasize how nothing in reality is simple, all simplicity is a lie and abstraction to make it easier for us to wrap our minds around something and communicate about it. So maybe I am just being pedantic and should be ignored.

[Greater Miami Shores 3]

You're a liberal who means well but you've yet to see well-meaning movements be co-opted and brutalized, you think the system can still be reformed.
That's not your fault of course, it's exactly what US society fosters.

I guess that’s true. I’m not an expert politician and there’s a lot I don’t know. The best thought out plans of the imagination doesn’t shape up to cruelty of the waking world. *sigh* If reform turns into revolution. I needn’t worry. I know my place. My pen my ink and my paper shall be the tools I use. You and the others can take up arms, but my place will be in the shadows and these tools will comfort me and guide me. Eventually I want to sow the seeds of roses to bloom in this post revolutionary world.

President TJR, MR President, we are all political experts and political junkies on NS, if not we would not be on NS with our Political Manifestos, our nations, our laws and Pics of real world leaders or in your case Pics of leaders that represent your real world leaders. MR President, never say you are not a Political Expert. Never say it to your Political opponents like me. GMS.

[San Lumen]

I guess that’s true. I’m not an expert politician and there’s a lot I don’t know. The best thought out plans of the imagination doesn’t shape up to cruelty of the waking world. *sigh* If reform turns into revolution. I needn’t worry. I know my place. My pen my ink and my paper shall be the tools I use. You and the others can take up arms, but my place will be in the shadows and these tools will comfort me and guide me. Eventually I want to sow the seeds of roses to bloom in this post revolutionary world.

President TJR, MR President, we are all political experts and political junkies on NS, if not we would not be on NS with our Political Manifestos, our nations, our laws and Pics of real world leaders or in your case Pics of leaders that represent your real world leaders. MR President, never say you are not a Political Expert. Never say it to your Political opponents like me. GMS.

Can you stop with these word salads?

Your opinions are not facts. If someone believes the Earth is flat does that make it so? That's basically your argument.

I ask again if you were the Georgia Secretary of State would do what Trump asked?

[Greater Miami Shores 3]

President TJR, MR President, we are all political experts and political junkies on NS, if not we would not be on NS with our Political Manifestos, our nations, our laws and Pics of real world leaders or in your case Pics of leaders that represent your real world leaders. MR President, never say you are not a Political Expert. Never say it to your Political opponents like me. GMS.

Can you stop with these word salads?

Your opinions are not facts. If someone believes the Earth is flat does that make it so? That's basically your argument.

I ask again if you were the Georgia Secretary of State would do what Trump asked?

I answered your questions in details on the Georgia Secretary of State. Re Read the very detailed Post.

[Bombadil]

Thought this was an interesting tidbit I was previously unaware of..

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

America had hit rock bottom, beginning with the stock market crash three years earlier. Unemployment was at 16 million and rising. Farm foreclosures exceeded half a million. More than five thousand banks had failed, and hundreds of thousands of families had lost their homes. Financial capitalists had bilked millions of customers and rigged the market. There were no government safety nets – no unemployment insurance, minimum wage, social security or Medicare.

Economic despair gave rise to panic and unrest, and political firebrands and white supremacists eagerly fanned the paranoia of socialism, global conspiracies and threats from within the country. Populists Huey Long and Father Charles Coughlin attacked FDR, spewing vitriolic anti-Jewish, pro-fascist refrains and brandishing the “America first” slogan coined by media magnate William Randolph Hearst.

On 4 March 1933, more than 100,000 people had gathered on the east side of the US Capitol for Roosevelt’s inauguration. The atmosphere was slate gray and ominous, the sky suggesting a calm before the storm.

More..

[San Lumen]

Can you stop with these word salads?

Your opinions are not facts. If someone believes the Earth is flat does that make it so? That's basically your argument.

I ask again if you were the Georgia Secretary of State would do what Trump asked?

I answered your questions in details on the Georgia Secretary of State. Re Read the very detailed Post.

No you did not. Trump literally asked him to commit fraud. There is no alternative view of this. Trump is on tape telling the person in charge of elections to commit a felony so he could win the state.

What would you if you were Secretary of state?

Since you believe opinions are facts does that mean if someone believes the Earth is flat it therefore is?

[Greater Miami Shores 3]

You guys have nothing on Trump

It may seem like this is the case due to Democrats focusing on Russiagate and January 6, but there's actually quite a bit of criminal behavior that Trump engaged in while in office. For example, the Saudis funneled hundreds of thousands of dollars into Trump's DC hotel, then Trump gave Saudi Arabia a multi billion dollar weapons deal (all while Saudi Arabia commits a genocide in Yemen). That's a pretty clear case of corruption. The reason why Democrats didn't try to impeach him over that is because they also have ties to Saudi Arabia.

You mean democrats are corrupt political Hypocrites? wow.

[Alcala-Cordel]

It may seem like this is the case due to Democrats focusing on Russiagate and January 6, but there's actually quite a bit of criminal behavior that Trump engaged in while in office. For example, the Saudis funneled hundreds of thousands of dollars into Trump's DC hotel, then Trump gave Saudi Arabia a multi billion dollar weapons deal (all while Saudi Arabia commits a genocide in Yemen). That's a pretty clear case of corruption. The reason why Democrats didn't try to impeach him over that is because they also have ties to Saudi Arabia.

You mean democrats are corrupt political Hypocrites? wow.

Not everyone blindly worships political parties.

[San Lumen]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/11/politics ... index.html

Sheila Cherfilus-McCormick will win Florida special congressional election to replace the late Alcee Hastings.

[Nationalist Northumbria]

Thought this was an interesting tidbit I was previously unaware of..

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

America had hit rock bottom, beginning with the stock market crash three years earlier. Unemployment was at 16 million and rising. Farm foreclosures exceeded half a million. More than five thousand banks had failed, and hundreds of thousands of families had lost their homes. Financial capitalists had bilked millions of customers and rigged the market. There were no government safety nets – no unemployment insurance, minimum wage, social security or Medicare.

Economic despair gave rise to panic and unrest, and political firebrands and white supremacists eagerly fanned the paranoia of socialism, global conspiracies and threats from within the country. Populists Huey Long and Father Charles Coughlin attacked FDR, spewing vitriolic anti-Jewish, pro-fascist refrains and brandishing the “America first” slogan coined by media magnate William Randolph Hearst.

On 4 March 1933, more than 100,000 people had gathered on the east side of the US Capitol for Roosevelt’s inauguration. The atmosphere was slate gray and ominous, the sky suggesting a calm before the storm.

More..

A question for the Democrats here: if FDR was such a great president, why did he win 98% of the vote in segregationist South Carolina?

[The Black Forrest]

It may seem like this is the case due to Democrats focusing on Russiagate and January 6, but there's actually quite a bit of criminal behavior that Trump engaged in while in office. For example, the Saudis funneled hundreds of thousands of dollars into Trump's DC hotel, then Trump gave Saudi Arabia a multi billion dollar weapons deal (all while Saudi Arabia commits a genocide in Yemen). That's a pretty clear case of corruption. The reason why Democrats didn't try to impeach him over that is because they also have ties to Saudi Arabia.

You mean democrats are corrupt political Hypocrites? wow.

Some probably do have stuff with the Saudis. At least they are smarter then trump and keeping them hidden. However, by all means get your mindless masses to dig around and find the evidence.

I am all for stomping corruption. That’s needs proof of course.

Even then. Trump wont see the inside of prison. Not because he is an innocent man. The two parities won’t want to be scrutinized…..

[HISPIDA]

Thought this was an interesting tidbit I was previously unaware of..

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

America had hit rock bottom, beginning with the stock market crash three years earlier. Unemployment was at 16 million and rising. Farm foreclosures exceeded half a million. More than five thousand banks had failed, and hundreds of thousands of families had lost their homes. Financial capitalists had bilked millions of customers and rigged the market. There were no government safety nets – no unemployment insurance, minimum wage, social security or Medicare.

Economic despair gave rise to panic and unrest, and political firebrands and white supremacists eagerly fanned the paranoia of socialism, global conspiracies and threats from within the country. Populists Huey Long and Father Charles Coughlin attacked FDR, spewing vitriolic anti-Jewish, pro-fascist refrains and brandishing the “America first” slogan coined by media magnate William Randolph Hearst.

On 4 March 1933, more than 100,000 people had gathered on the east side of the US Capitol for Roosevelt’s inauguration. The atmosphere was slate gray and ominous, the sky suggesting a calm before the storm.

More..

A question for the Democrats here: if FDR was such a great president, why did he win 98% of the vote in segregationist South Carolina?

i'd say because he offered a solution and they were comfortable voting for democrats. it's not like the republicans had anything better.

Thought this was an interesting tidbit I was previously unaware of..

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

America had hit rock bottom, beginning with the stock market crash three years earlier. Unemployment was at 16 million and rising. Farm foreclosures exceeded half a million. More than five thousand banks had failed, and hundreds of thousands of families had lost their homes. Financial capitalists had bilked millions of customers and rigged the market. There were no government safety nets – no unemployment insurance, minimum wage, social security or Medicare.

Economic despair gave rise to panic and unrest, and political firebrands and white supremacists eagerly fanned the paranoia of socialism, global conspiracies and threats from within the country. Populists Huey Long and Father Charles Coughlin attacked FDR, spewing vitriolic anti-Jewish, pro-fascist refrains and brandishing the “America first” slogan coined by media magnate William Randolph Hearst.

On 4 March 1933, more than 100,000 people had gathered on the east side of the US Capitol for Roosevelt’s inauguration. The atmosphere was slate gray and ominous, the sky suggesting a calm before the storm.

More..

was the business plot ever proven to be an actual thing? from what i've heard it was mostly just shit that clark came up with.

[Umeria]

A question for the Democrats here: if FDR was such a great president, why did he win 98% of the vote in segregationist South Carolina?

"All voters in a state that has laws I don't like are evil, and winning such a state means you're evil too."

[Flanderstan]

So, what, expecting people actually follow the laws of the land and punished accordingly for breaking them is akin to fascism now?

*THUNK*

The laws of the land now say give up your guns.

Will you comply?

Bruh im 19 years old. I don't own any guns.
but yes
yes i would
If I had any


venssorr, regarding your question
https://www.history.com/news/9-things-you-may-not-know-about-mussolini#:~:text=Mussolini%20was%20a%20socialist%20before,Amilcare%20Cipriani%20and%20Andrea%20Costa.

[San Lumen]

Thought this was an interesting tidbit I was previously unaware of..

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

America had hit rock bottom, beginning with the stock market crash three years earlier. Unemployment was at 16 million and rising. Farm foreclosures exceeded half a million. More than five thousand banks had failed, and hundreds of thousands of families had lost their homes. Financial capitalists had bilked millions of customers and rigged the market. There were no government safety nets – no unemployment insurance, minimum wage, social security or Medicare.

Economic despair gave rise to panic and unrest, and political firebrands and white supremacists eagerly fanned the paranoia of socialism, global conspiracies and threats from within the country. Populists Huey Long and Father Charles Coughlin attacked FDR, spewing vitriolic anti-Jewish, pro-fascist refrains and brandishing the “America first” slogan coined by media magnate William Randolph Hearst.

On 4 March 1933, more than 100,000 people had gathered on the east side of the US Capitol for Roosevelt’s inauguration. The atmosphere was slate gray and ominous, the sky suggesting a calm before the storm.

More..

A question for the Democrats here: if FDR was such a great president, why did he win 98% of the vote in segregationist South Carolina?

You are aware that only whites could vote in the state at the time? And what does him winning 98 percent of vote matter for? FDR won in a landslide in many states in 1932 and 1936.

perhaps they also liked what FDR stood for?

[Greater Miami Shores 3]

You mean democrats are corrupt political Hypocrites? wow.

Not everyone blindly worships political parties.

Democrats are not Political Saints. I have explained in details many times why I, me and us strongly support President Trump, Ron DeSantis and President Ronald Reagan. To me and us they are the Greatest American Presidents ever of the USA and the Greatest Governor ever of the USA. Because we strongly agree with most of their economic, political and social views on the Issues, with Pride and Honor. GMS with Pride and Honor.

[The Black Forrest]

Thought this was an interesting tidbit I was previously unaware of..

Donald Trump’s elaborate plot to overthrow the democratically elected president was neither impulsive nor uncoordinated, but straight out of the playbook of another American coup attempt – the 1933 “Wall Street putsch” against newly elected Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

America had hit rock bottom, beginning with the stock market crash three years earlier. Unemployment was at 16 million and rising. Farm foreclosures exceeded half a million. More than five thousand banks had failed, and hundreds of thousands of families had lost their homes. Financial capitalists had bilked millions of customers and rigged the market. There were no government safety nets – no unemployment insurance, minimum wage, social security or Medicare.

Economic despair gave rise to panic and unrest, and political firebrands and white supremacists eagerly fanned the paranoia of socialism, global conspiracies and threats from within the country. Populists Huey Long and Father Charles Coughlin attacked FDR, spewing vitriolic anti-Jewish, pro-fascist refrains and brandishing the “America first” slogan coined by media magnate William Randolph Hearst.

On 4 March 1933, more than 100,000 people had gathered on the east side of the US Capitol for Roosevelt’s inauguration. The atmosphere was slate gray and ominous, the sky suggesting a calm before the storm.

More..

A question for the Democrats here: if FDR was such a great president, why did he win 98% of the vote in segregationist South Carolina?

Wait so if racists like a President that means he is bad?

My granddad will tell you simply because he was a leader. When you listened to him on the radio; you felt things would get better. The man spoke well.

Can you imagine Trump giving the Pearl Harbor speech?

[The Black Forrest]

Not everyone blindly worships political parties.

Democrats are not Political Saints. I have explained in details many times why I, me and us strongly support President Trump, Ron DeSantis and President Ronald Reagan. To me and us they are the Greatest American Presidents ever of the USA and the Greatest Governor ever of the USA. Because we strongly agree with most of their economic, political and social views on the Issues, with Pride and Honor. GMS with Pride and Honor.

Nobody has suggested the demos were saints. EVER.

Then there is you who think the republicans are and the worst thing you can say of trump is he can say mean things.

[HISPIDA]

A question for the Democrats here: if FDR was such a great president, why did he win 98% of the vote in segregationist South Carolina?

Wait so if racists like a President that means he is bad?

My granddad will tell you simply because he was a leader. When you listened to him on the radio; you felt things would get better. The man spoke well.

Can you imagine Trump giving the Pearl Harbor speech?

"I'm telling you, if Hoover were -- if Hoover were still here, there would be tons more. Tons more dead people."

[San Lumen]

Not everyone blindly worships political parties.

Democrats are not Political Saints. I have explained in details many times why I, me and us strongly support President Trump, Ron DeSantis and President Ronald Reagan. To me and us they are the Greatest American Presidents ever of the USA and the Greatest Governor ever of the USA. Because we strongly agree with most of their economic, political and social views on the Issues, with Pride and Honor. GMS with Pride and Honor.

Never mind the fact that Reagan said horrible things about LGBT people during the AIDS crisis.