NATION

PASSWORD

A Family Matter

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Regarding your brother

Option 1: He betrayed me. It’s unforgivable. We are no longer brothers.
5
25%
Option 2: I would be very very angry at him but after a few months/years, I would be able to forgive him because he acted out of cowardice and not malice or calculation.
9
45%
Option 3: I would be very angry. But in a matter of weeks I would forgive.
2
10%
Option 4: I wouldn’t be angry at him at all. The fault lies with me for not planning and executing this thing properly. I made too many tactical errors and expected him to find courage in an psychologically oppressive scenario.
4
20%
 
Total votes : 20

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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 38837
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

A Family Matter

Postby Infected Mushroom » Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:11 pm

Please consider the following hypothetical (based on the Succession show):

You are a member of a dysfunctional billionaire media empire family. Your elderly father is a business world legend who built the company up from nothing but as a family man he’s an emotionally abusive, manipulative, narcissistic patriarch.

As a result of this upbringing, you and your siblings do not function very well as adults. For years now, you and your siblings have been played off against each over the will and positions at the company. If you disappoint or fail big daddy, then he will use tactics of adult cruelty to embarrass you and put you in your place.

You, your brother, one uncle, and your dad (who is the CEO) have membership on the 13 member company board.

In the recent month, your dad really angered you by telling the whole company for months that he’s stepping down as CEO and having you take over. However, this turned out to a “test” which you failed, not only does he stay as CEO but through it you were also tricked into signing some will rights away. From your new position, you saved the company from a 3 billion dollar debt by letting in new investors… your reward? Your dad calls you a worthless idiot because you let in other investors even though it was his judgment calls that led to the 3 billion debt in the first place.

Eventually you decide that it’s time to initiate a Vote of No Confidence at the next meeting and take over the company as the new CEO (to finally step out from your father’s shadow). You and your brother form an alliance and secretly convince 5 others to vote against your dad forming a super block of 7 votes.

You understand that your dad can’t vote since he’s the CEO and that he can count on 3 loyalist votes but you’re not too concerned. As a matter of historical precedent, the uncle (who hates your dad) and another corporate member NEVER attend this thing.

On the day of the vote you get a call from that one member who suddenly says they are determined to come to the meeting (days before, out of nerves you tried a little too hard to check up on whether or not they’re not coming so this tipped them off something big would happen). Feeling suddenly insecure, you fly on your private helicopter to that person’s home to talk to them and you convince them that your dad should be replaced as CEO. You are successful.

However, you can’t fly to the meeting in time because of a sudden terror alert grounding all flights. You take the car but get fatefully trapped in the traffic; you are now late for the meeting.

Your dad arrives at the meeting on time and forces the meeting to start. Your main ally stalls the meeting but is eventually forced to go through the thin list. Sensing something is off, your dad moves to close the meeting, thus forcing you to initiate the Vote of No Confidence over the phone (while you’re sprinting across entire city blocks).

Your father: I can’t believe it.

Your father refuses to leave the room. Your ally aggressively starts asking for people to raise their hands to support the motion. No one moves.

Over the phone you make a speech and then say your hand is raised. Your ally then raises his hand, another ally raises their hand too. Three people oppose the motion and support the dad. (3-3). A further call comes in to support it, making it 4-3.

Two of your remaining three allies decide to play politics and not anger either side so they both say they abstain after saying it’s a family matter.

Then to everyone’s surprise, the uncle who hates the dad shows up (somehow having been tipped off) and decides that despite his feud with Big Daddy he’s still family and stealing the company’s not cool so he votes for the dad; this locks it into a 4-4.

Your other ally says they have “no dog in this fight” and abstain, betraying the agreement as well.

As you reach the elevator, you realize that the final deciding vote will be cast by your brother.

Your dad gives him the death stare and tells him to think very very carefully. The brother is terrified as all hell because it all falls on him and you’re not in the room. He was going vote for but then crumbles and whimpers “Against, I vote against.”

Having been re-instated as CEO and once again having powers above the law, Big Daddy immediately fires off everyone who voted against him. When you show up in terror, Big Daddy tells you that 5-4 is the best you can do. A ton of guards are then summoned and all the fired parties are dragged away in a walk of shame sequence through the office.

Your brother and those who abstained or backed the father retain their positions at the company though your dad is seriously distrustful off them now.



Now completely disinherited and the target of a massive smear campaign focusing on your addiction problems by your dad’s corporation, you launch legal proceedings against your dad and his company for the unlawful firing of half the board (though you are somewhat certain it will amount to nothing because this is IM Verse Corporate America and Big Daddy is basically above the law except for that voting period). Meanwhile, you attempt to build your own business to plan for your return.

The discussion question is, how would you feel about the brother? Why?

Option 1: He betrayed me. It’s unforgivable. We are no longer brothers.

Option 2: I would be very very angry at him but after a few months/years, I would be able to forgive him because he acted out of cowardice and not malice or calculation.

Option 3: I would be very angry. But in a matter of weeks I would forgive.

Option 4: I wouldn’t be angry at him at all. The fault lies with me for not planning and executing this thing properly. I made too many tactical errors and expected him to find courage in an psychologically oppressive scenario.


I think I would go with option 2. I’d KNOW that a huge part of the fault lies with me for poor planning and execution (the voting day was filled with stupid) but being human, I think I don’t take well to perceived betrayal. I would have expected him to stand by our agreement because 200 percent if our positions were switched, I would have kept my word. Is it unfair to expect that if someone with a different personality? Maybe. However, he’s still family so ultimately I’d get over it.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Second JELLIAN Republic
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Ex-Nation

Postby The Second JELLIAN Republic » Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:22 pm

Hmm.
Seems like a combination of 4 and one the other ones.
You did not do a good job planning, you should have seen it coming, and you cannot necessarily blame the brother.
Someone who has always known fear, will not know what is on the other side.
If the dad is a bad person. Then expose them. No need to take over the company.
(It is also arguable that it might be wrong to seek an inherited fortune, instead of trying to make your own).
Although, If you really wanted to take over the company, you should have met with all the people on the board. Either they are good and can be convinced, or they are bad and need to some how be neutralized (stall them, ect) but of course, this way of thinking only works if you believe the ends justify the means, and I do not believe that.

Really I would probably find a way to bring some of the good people with me, and stake it out away from the business. If the bad dad is aggressive enough and goes after you, sooner or later, they will get what’s coming to them (exposed).

That’s my take on it.

Option 4 mostly kinda
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Diahon
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Founded: Apr 01, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Diahon » Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:23 pm

let them eat one another

they're all fucking monsters anyway

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Neanderthaland
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Founded: Sep 10, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Neanderthaland » Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:44 pm

I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit.
Ug make fire. Mod ban Ug.

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Heloin
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Founded: Mar 30, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Heloin » Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:46 pm

I ferment a socialist revolution.

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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
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Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:09 pm

The Second JELLIAN Republic wrote:Hmm.
Seems like a combination of 4 and one the other ones.
You did not do a good job planning, you should have seen it coming, and you cannot necessarily blame the brother.
Someone who has always known fear, will not know what is on the other side.
If the dad is a bad person. Then expose them. No need to take over the company.
(It is also arguable that it might be wrong to seek an inherited fortune, instead of trying to make your own).
Although, If you really wanted to take over the company, you should have met with all the people on the board. Either they are good and can be convinced, or they are bad and need to some how be neutralized (stall them, ect) but of course, this way of thinking only works if you believe the ends justify the means, and I do not believe that.

Really I would probably find a way to bring some of the good people with me, and stake it out away from the business. If the bad dad is aggressive enough and goes after you, sooner or later, they will get what’s coming to them (exposed).

That’s my take on it.

Option 4 mostly kinda


Makes sense to me. I like this.

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Dexterra
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Dexterra » Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:12 pm

Just want to say, anyone who hasn't seen Succession yet absolutely needs to, it is one of the best shows on television right now
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Dundee Derry
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Ex-Nation

Postby Dundee Derry » Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:17 pm

Option 4. Then, Cut all ties with the family. Get a book deal with a publisher. Get the exposé book written, (probably ghost written tbh, though i'd like to think i'd acknowlege the existence of the ghost writer). Go and work for the competition for a few years, squirrel enough money away to open a Hardware store in Podunk, Arizona. Paint landscapes in my free time. Find God.
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Infected Mushroom
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Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:17 pm

Dexterra wrote:Just want to say, anyone who hasn't seen Succession yet absolutely needs to, it is one of the best shows on television right now


Absolutely.

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Infected Mushroom
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Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Nov 09, 2021 3:58 am

Any aspiring boardroom characters here want to weigh in? Anyone here a big fan of the corporate world?
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Tue Nov 09, 2021 3:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The Blaatschapen
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Anarchy

Postby The Blaatschapen » Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:04 am

Dammit, I hope my dad doesn't read NationStates.

I mean, this is a huge spoiler for our board meeting next Monday.
The Blaatschapen should resign

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Kaczynskisatva
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Founded: Nov 02, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Kaczynskisatva » Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:14 am

This is an irrational question.

Getting angry with people does not change the facts of any matter. People are biological objects, they execute behavior algorithms, and they can be programmed. If, in dealing with them, you are focused on your feelings and not on programming their behavior, you do not belong on the board of a company, or in any serious position to make practical decisions about anything, as you are clearly neither a serious nor a practical person.

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The Second JELLIAN Republic
Spokesperson
 
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Founded: Oct 20, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby The Second JELLIAN Republic » Tue Nov 09, 2021 7:45 am

Kaczynskisatva wrote:This is an irrational question.

Getting angry with people does not change the facts of any matter. People are biological objects, they execute behavior algorithms, and they can be programmed. If, in dealing with them, you are focused on your feelings and not on programming their behavior, you do not belong on the board of a company, or in any serious position to make practical decisions about anything, as you are clearly neither a serious nor a practical person.


You have described a sociopath
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This is not my first account.

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Hemakral
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Founded: Nov 02, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Hemakral » Tue Nov 09, 2021 8:18 am

Neanderthaland wrote:I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit.

Ol' reliable
._.

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Dogmeat
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Dogmeat » Tue Nov 09, 2021 8:19 am

Hemakral wrote:
Neanderthaland wrote:I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit.

Ol' reliable

It's the only response to an IM hypothetical.
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Infected Mushroom
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Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Nov 09, 2021 9:24 am

So a plurality of voters assign a great deal of blame to the brother, though it’s not unforgivable? Interesting.

What does this show about human nature?
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Tue Nov 09, 2021 9:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The Two Jerseys
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Two Jerseys » Tue Nov 09, 2021 10:39 am

>Family Matter
>No Steve Urkel

I am disappoint.
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The Second JELLIAN Republic
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Ex-Nation

Postby The Second JELLIAN Republic » Tue Nov 09, 2021 10:46 am

Human nature ?

Most people seem to get rightly mad at brother for being big stupid
But then recognize that you don’t hold a grudge forever, and forgive

I think if you asked this question to people 100 years ago, besides asking “what’s a phone”
They would probably have picked option 1, but now people seem more emotionally wise
Kinda…
“Why..”, (Chaotic good), “Debate, don’t argue”, American.
“I know one thing, I know nothing”
This is not my first account.

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Senkaku
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 25692
Founded: Sep 01, 2012
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Senkaku » Tue Nov 09, 2021 12:07 pm

I secretly manipulate the company’s general counsel into starting a bizarre and illicit psychosexual affair with him to eventually use as blackmail to ensure his loyalty for an eventual second attempt :p
agreed honey. send bees

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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 38837
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Nov 09, 2021 4:17 pm

The Second JELLIAN Republic wrote:Human nature ?

Most people seem to get rightly mad at brother for being big stupid
But then recognize that you don’t hold a grudge forever, and forgive

I think if you asked this question to people 100 years ago, besides asking “what’s a phone”
They would probably have picked option 1, but now people seem more emotionally wise
Kinda…


I see... Indeed, I think we've evolved in our emotional understanding as a species.

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Tommy Boy
Political Columnist
 
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Founded: Jun 29, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Tommy Boy » Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:27 pm


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Eahland
Minister
 
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Libertarian Police State

Postby Eahland » Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:35 pm

What, you think I would kick off something like this if there were even the smallest chance I could fail? I never needed or wanted to win the vote. It was just an excuse to get all those monsters into the same room. At the moment Daddy Dearest thought he'd won, I triggered the small tactical nuclear device I had concealed in the boardroom. I deliberately tipped off the habitual non-attendee so I would have an excuse to not be present that wouldn't make anyone suspicious... there was a day or two there where I thought I had been too subtle and he wouldn't take the bait. I arranged the terror threat too, to further that excuse, and to reduce collateral damage. You have to admit it wasn't a false report!
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Highway Stars
Political Columnist
 
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Ex-Nation

Postby Highway Stars » Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:51 pm

A mega dose of colorless, tasteless lysergic acid diethylamide. Placed into his morning orange juice, about an hour before his next meeting with Daddy.

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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
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Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:56 pm

I am mostly interested in your feelings towards the brother.

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Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
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Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Nov 09, 2021 6:02 pm

Kaczynskisatva wrote:This is an irrational question.

Getting angry with people does not change the facts of any matter. People are biological objects, they execute behavior algorithms, and they can be programmed. If, in dealing with them, you are focused on your feelings and not on programming their behavior, you do not belong on the board of a company, or in any serious position to make practical decisions about anything, as you are clearly neither a serious nor a practical person.


Curious. So you wouldn’t take it personally?

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