Russian Discussion Thread I

[Republic Of Ludwigsburg]

Previous thread was gone because of OP rules.
This is a thread discussing about Russian History, Politics, and the sort.
Russia is in a constant state of decline since 1991. It is in a strange state in their politics because of the United Russia Party. Putin is seen to be authoritarian based in politics, but more liberal based on personal freedom, at least compared to the USSR. It is considered to be a very misogynistic due to backwards domestic violence laws.

Let the discussion, begin!

[Repreteop]

I pray to God that your not serious.

[Republic Of Ludwigsburg]

I am very satisfied with Russian cultural policies. Their stances on LGBTQ and religious issues, as well as form of soviet patriotism. I still though prefer stalinist form of economics, or in general centrally planned ones and for Russia to be less dependent on external markets. But due to russia being sanctioned, russia is finally forced to develop a self-sufficient economy, at least to an extent, through import-substitution policy.
Other than that, Putin is a right guy in right time, i dont believe there is a better leader for Russia at this time. Russian politics is extremely complicated and its geo-political situation in general, and having "correct" views simply is not enough for russian leadership. I dont agree with Putin on everything, but i do trust him, cause again, he deserves it.

I feel like the Russian Government did a really bad thing decriminalizing domestic violence. It's very sad seeing males beating their spouses in the 21st century.

[Republic Of Ludwigsburg]

I pray to God that your not serious.

Of course the marxist leninist says that

[FNU]

On a more positive note, in spite of my opinions on the 1991-2000 era being the last of Russia's decline before some level of reform was attempted, they at least have a decent space program, though it's a shame that the Soviets failed to properly manage their Lunar Program alongside Buran.

[Lady Victory]

Addressing this from the first thread:

Russians are ethnically descended from Swedes, not Slavs. Fun fact.

This isn't true.

Norse traders originating from Sweden sailed through the rivers leading from the Baltic Sea and the Gulf of Finland into the Black Sea as part of the Varangian trade routes to Constantinople. This trade route passed by the territory of many cultures as it stretched from Riga and Lake Ladoga to the mouth of the Dniester River. Most of the territory along the route stretching from Lake Ladoga to the Dniester belonged to East Slavic tribes, passing through many already existing settlements such as Kyiv, Smolensk, Velikiy Novgorod, and a few others. The latter became the capital of the domain of Rurik, a Varangian adventurer who was invited to rule over the Slavs living around Lake Ilmen. According to legend the Varangians had already ruled over the East Slavs before (referred to as the Rus' Khaganate) but had been thrown out by Slavic revolts, only for the Slavs to descend into infighting and longing for the return of Norse rule. Two other Norse rulers, Askold and Dir, ruled out of Kyiv further south. Oleg, and later Igor, would succeed Rurik and spread their control over most of the East Slavs resulting in the creation of the Kyivan Rus'. Although Norsemen officially ruled over the East Slavs there is no evidence to suggest that the East Slavs were supplanted by Norse settlers and it's far more likely that the Norse rulers simply assimilated into local East Slavic culture. This seems to have occurred at earliest by the time of Sviatoslav I as all his successors (Rurik, Oleg, Igor, and St. Olga of Kyiv) had Norse equivalent names but he and his successors (save for St. Vladimir the Great) did not which suggests the Norse language had fallen out of favor among the Varangian leadership.

There may have been some mixing of Norse settlers with native East Slavs (just as there had been mixing of East Slavs with Scythians, Turkics, Baltics, Alans, Finno-Ugrics, Vlachs, South Slavs, Magyars, and West Slavs) but there is nothing to suggest that modern Russians are genetically descended from any Nordic people and in fact have a closer genetic link to other Eastern European and Balkan peoples (most of whom are Slavs) than they do to Swedes or Finns. There is no conclusive evidence that Nordic migration, colonization, and settling of what is today Western Russia resulted in the displacement of native East Slavic populations.

[Postauthoritarian America]

Russian dressing is very good. One of the essential ingredients of a proper Reuben sandwich.

[Shrillland]

Well, the Midterms are coming up on Sunday, but I don't really have anything to say about them to be honest. All the parties are sycophants to Putin and United Russia in one form or another.

[Mexico4]

They say because of climate warming that the Siberian taiga is on fire but its not really mentioned much on the news. They say the blazes in the Amazon or even the US cannot compare to the huge fires going on in Siberia. On the other hand, climate warming has opened up the Russian artic to navigation.

Edit - Catherine the Greats anthem sounds really powerful - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV0-gMuAClQ

[Destructive Government Economic System]

It's a real pain to try to learn the language.

I want to learn Russian down the road (it sounds very down-to-earth and I like that), but I first have to get used to Mandarin and French.

[The North Polish Union]

Addressing this from the first thread:

Russians are ethnically descended from Swedes, not Slavs. Fun fact.

Norse traders originating from Sweden sailed through the rivers leading from the Baltic Sea and the Gulf of Finland into the Black Sea as part of the Varangian trade routes to Constantinople. This trade route passed by the territory of many cultures as it stretched from Riga and Lake Ladoga to the mouth of the Dniester River. Most of the territory along the route stretching from Lake Ladoga to the Dniester belonged to East Slavic tribes, passing through many already existing settlements such as Kyiv, Smolensk, Velikiy Novgorod, and a few others. The latter became the capital of the domain of Rurik, a Varangian adventurer who was invited to rule over the Slavs living around Lake Ilmen. According to legend the Varangians had already ruled over the East Slavs before (referred to as the Rus' Khaganate) but had been thrown out by Slavic revolts, only for the Slavs to descend into infighting and longing for the return of Norse rule. Two other Norse rulers, Askold and Dir, ruled out of Kyiv further south. Oleg, and later Igor, would succeed Rurik and spread their control over most of the East Slavs resulting in the creation of the Kyivan Rus'.

This much is correct.

Although Norsemen officially ruled over the East Slavs there is no evidence to suggest that the East Slavs were supplanted by Norse settlers and it's far more likely that the Norse rulers simply assimilated into local East Slavic culture. This seems to have occurred at earliest by the time of Sviatoslav I as all his successors (Rurik, Oleg, Igor, and St. Olga of Kyiv) had Norse equivalent names but he and his successors (save for St. Vladimir the Great) did not which suggests the Norse language had fallen out of favor among the Varangian leadership.

There may have been some mixing of Norse settlers with native East Slavs (just as there had been mixing of East Slavs with Scythians, Turkics, Baltics, Alans, Finno-Ugrics, Vlachs, South Slavs, Magyars, and West Slavs) but there is nothing to suggest that modern Russians are genetically descended from any Nordic people and in fact have a closer genetic link to other Eastern European and Balkan peoples (most of whom are Slavs) than they do to Swedes or Finns. There is no conclusive evidence that Nordic migration, colonization, and settling of what is today Western Russia resulted in the displacement of native East Slavic populations.

Here is where we get into some controversy, which is the result of some creative historiography by the Russians since the XVIII Century. The Rus' did come from Scandinavia and ruled over a large collection of areas from Kijów to Nowogród Wielki but these were not ethnically homogeneous. Here is an approximate map of ethnic groups during the IX Century, it is possible to see that the Slavs are only inhabiting the regions now part of Ukraina and Białoruś.

After Christianity, the Rus' adopted the Old Church Slavonic as a liturgical language and this did have an impact, but it did not make the Rus' Slavs. In the west, Latin was the liturgical language for many centuries and many English words are Latin in origin, but this does not make the English Romans in the same way the French and Spanish are. Liutprand writes that "A certain people made up of a part of the Norse, whom the Greeks call the Russi on account of their physical features, we designate as Norsemen because of the location of their origin." In addition, there are runes with Byzantine crosses on them in the regions of Sweden from which Hrærekr was purported to have come from and inscriptions telling of the kinship and commerce of Sweden and Rus'

The idea that the Rus' were Slavs not primarily Swedes gained popularity as Moskwa tried to interfere in the affairs of its Slavic neighbours in end of XVII and start of XVIII centuries. Russian "historians" needed to justify military adventures in Poland and other Slavic states and so created the myth of false "kinship". This was easy to do because of Slavic elements in the language as Rus' borrowed words from Old Church Slavonic and because of there having been some Slavs in old Rus' lands (interesting that they do not choose to be "descended" from Chuds, Krivichs, or Ves who are also mentioned in Primary Chronicle, Hmmm very convenient).

Russian "Slavness" is today nothing more than excuse to keep on militarily attacking Ukraina and occupying Białoruś and Królewiec. It is interesting that you do not know this since you have Helga Kijówski, who was a Rus', as your flag!

[Lady Victory]

Addressing this from the first thread:



Norse traders originating from Sweden sailed through the rivers leading from the Baltic Sea and the Gulf of Finland into the Black Sea as part of the Varangian trade routes to Constantinople. This trade route passed by the territory of many cultures as it stretched from Riga and Lake Ladoga to the mouth of the Dniester River. Most of the territory along the route stretching from Lake Ladoga to the Dniester belonged to East Slavic tribes, passing through many already existing settlements such as Kyiv, Smolensk, Velikiy Novgorod, and a few others. The latter became the capital of the domain of Rurik, a Varangian adventurer who was invited to rule over the Slavs living around Lake Ilmen. According to legend the Varangians had already ruled over the East Slavs before (referred to as the Rus' Khaganate) but had been thrown out by Slavic revolts, only for the Slavs to descend into infighting and longing for the return of Norse rule. Two other Norse rulers, Askold and Dir, ruled out of Kyiv further south. Oleg, and later Igor, would succeed Rurik and spread their control over most of the East Slavs resulting in the creation of the Kyivan Rus'.

This much is correct.

Although Norsemen officially ruled over the East Slavs there is no evidence to suggest that the East Slavs were supplanted by Norse settlers and it's far more likely that the Norse rulers simply assimilated into local East Slavic culture. This seems to have occurred at earliest by the time of Sviatoslav I as all his successors (Rurik, Oleg, Igor, and St. Olga of Kyiv) had Norse equivalent names but he and his successors (save for St. Vladimir the Great) did not which suggests the Norse language had fallen out of favor among the Varangian leadership.

There may have been some mixing of Norse settlers with native East Slavs (just as there had been mixing of East Slavs with Scythians, Turkics, Baltics, Alans, Finno-Ugrics, Vlachs, South Slavs, Magyars, and West Slavs) but there is nothing to suggest that modern Russians are genetically descended from any Nordic people and in fact have a closer genetic link to other Eastern European and Balkan peoples (most of whom are Slavs) than they do to Swedes or Finns. There is no conclusive evidence that Nordic migration, colonization, and settling of what is today Western Russia resulted in the displacement of native East Slavic populations.

Here is where we get into some controversy, which is the result of some creative historiography by the Russians since the XVIII Century. The Rus' did come from Scandinavia and ruled over a large collection of areas from Kijów to Nowogród Wielki but these were not ethnically homogeneous. Here is an approximate map of ethnic groups during the IX Century, it is possible to see that the Slavs are only inhabiting the regions now part of Ukraina and Białoruś.

After Christianity, the Rus' adopted the Old Church Slavonic as a liturgical language and this did have an impact, but it did not make the Rus' Slavs. In the west, Latin was the liturgical language for many centuries and many English words are Latin in origin, but this does not make the English Romans in the same way the French and Spanish are. Liutprand writes that "A certain people made up of a part of the Norse, whom the Greeks call the Russi on account of their physical features, we designate as Norsemen because of the location of their origin." In addition, there are runes with Byzantine crosses on them in the regions of Sweden from which Hrærekr was purported to have come from and inscriptions telling of the kinship and commerce of Sweden and Rus'

The idea that the Rus' were Slavs not primarily Swedes gained popularity as Moskwa tried to interfere in the affairs of its Slavic neighbours in end of XVII and start of XVIII centuries. Russian "historians" needed to justify military adventures in Poland and other Slavic states and so created the myth of false "kinship". This was easy to do because of Slavic elements in the language as Rus' borrowed words from Old Church Slavonic and because of there having been some Slavs in old Rus' lands (interesting that they do not choose to be "descended" from Chuds, Krivichs, or Ves who are also mentioned in Primary Chronicle, Hmmm very convenient).

Russian "Slavness" is today nothing more than excuse to keep on militarily attacking Ukraina and occupying Białoruś and Królewiec. It is interesting that you do not know this since you have Helga Kijówski, who was a Rus', as your flag!

Amazing.

Every word you said was wrong.

[Saiwania]

Russian aviation has this claim to fame: the An-225, the largest and heaviest air worthy transport aircraft in the world. Only question is, how to actually produce more of the same type or even surpass it? It is truly one of a kind if only one exists. Construction of a planned 2nd plane has failed to be completed since 1988 to this day.

[The North Polish Union]

This much is correct.


Here is where we get into some controversy, which is the result of some creative historiography by the Russians since the XVIII Century. The Rus' did come from Scandinavia and ruled over a large collection of areas from Kijów to Nowogród Wielki but these were not ethnically homogeneous. Here is an approximate map of ethnic groups during the IX Century, it is possible to see that the Slavs are only inhabiting the regions now part of Ukraina and Białoruś.

After Christianity, the Rus' adopted the Old Church Slavonic as a liturgical language and this did have an impact, but it did not make the Rus' Slavs. In the west, Latin was the liturgical language for many centuries and many English words are Latin in origin, but this does not make the English Romans in the same way the French and Spanish are. Liutprand writes that "A certain people made up of a part of the Norse, whom the Greeks call the Russi on account of their physical features, we designate as Norsemen because of the location of their origin." In addition, there are runes with Byzantine crosses on them in the regions of Sweden from which Hrærekr was purported to have come from and inscriptions telling of the kinship and commerce of Sweden and Rus'

The idea that the Rus' were Slavs not primarily Swedes gained popularity as Moskwa tried to interfere in the affairs of its Slavic neighbours in end of XVII and start of XVIII centuries. Russian "historians" needed to justify military adventures in Poland and other Slavic states and so created the myth of false "kinship". This was easy to do because of Slavic elements in the language as Rus' borrowed words from Old Church Slavonic and because of there having been some Slavs in old Rus' lands (interesting that they do not choose to be "descended" from Chuds, Krivichs, or Ves who are also mentioned in Primary Chronicle, Hmmm very convenient).

Russian "Slavness" is today nothing more than excuse to keep on militarily attacking Ukraina and occupying Białoruś and Królewiec. It is interesting that you do not know this since you have Helga Kijówski, who was a Rus', as your flag!

Amazing.

Every word you said was wrong.

The attitude of Russians themselves has changed on this often enough to raise suspicion. In the XVIII Century, historians such as G.H. Muller who attempted to claim that the Russians were Norsemen were vigorously attacked by Russian historians themselves. By the XIX Century the attitude had reversed, and Russian scholars saw themselves as Norse. The Soviets didn't take a stance until WWII, when they vigorously pushed the idea that Russians are Slavs to distance themselves from the Germanic Nazis (who they had allied with to invade Poland just a few years prior)

[Republic Of Ludwigsburg]

Russians are ethnically descended from Swedes, not Slavs. Fun fact.

This is completely wrong. The name of Russia comes from the Rus. The "Rus" were Vikings who invaded modern day Russia and made the Kievan Rus. The Slavs were the people under the Kievan Rus. The Rus ruled the Slavs during the Kievan Rus. Then the Mongols invaded and they installed puppets there. Then when the Mongols left, the Muscovy was ruled by Slavs, not the Rus.

[Novus America]

Russian aviation has this claim to fame: the An-225, the largest and heaviest air worthy transport aircraft in the world. Only question is, how to actually produce more of the same type or even surpass it? It is truly one of a kind if only one exists. Construction of a planned 2nd plane has failed to be completed since 1988 to this day.

The An-225 is Ukrainian, not Russian. And there is no real purpose in trying to build more. The plane has limited use. It was built specifically to ferry the Soviet Buran space shuttle, which is gone.

[Novus America]

On a more positive note, in spite of my opinions on the 1991-2000 era being the last of Russia's decline before some level of reform was attempted, they at least have a decent space program, though it's a shame that the Soviets failed to properly manage their Lunar Program alongside Buran.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.thegua ... f-position

Russia’s space program is living off the Soviet legacy, and struggling as a result.
Old Soviet designs from the 50s and 60s are solid, but there are better options out there now.

Other than he is buddies with Putin there is no reason Rogozin should be there. The rampant cronyism and corruption, lack of funding and technology restructuring due to conflict with the West really doom it.

Russia simply does not have the economic or demographic strength to support its outsized ambitions.
Soave is no exception.

[Republic Of Ludwigsburg]

Russian aviation has this claim to fame: the An-225, the largest and heaviest air worthy transport aircraft in the world. Only question is, how to actually produce more of the same type or even surpass it? It is truly one of a kind if only one exists. Construction of a planned 2nd plane has failed to be completed since 1988 to this day.

The An-225 is Ukrainian, not Russian. And there is no real purpose in trying to build more. The plane has limited use.

As long as the military does not revolt, Putin's puppetry would not stop.

[Immortan Khan]

For starters, genetically Russians are most closely related to Ukrainians, Belarusians, Poles and Slovaks. Some parts of northwestern Russia also have genetic links to Balto-Finns. So this idea that Russians are not Slavs is actually hilarious. This isn't getting into how out of the East Slavic languages, the one closest to Old East Slavic is Russian, meaning that Russians have maintained a closer linguistic link to Kievan Rus than either the Ukrainians or Belarusians.

Polish nationalism is hilarious. Germans wipe out close to 1/5 of your people with plans to wipe out the remaining 4/5 but the Russians are still the big bad guys to the point where basic cultural and genetic facts get ignored. Oh yeah that is another thing, even if Russians weren't genetically predominately East Slavic, it wouldn't matter since culturally they are. Most Serbs and Bulgarians are actually descended from pre-Slavic peoples but that doesn't make them non-Slavic either.

[Shrillland]

The Midterms were yesterday and, surprise, surprise, United Russia stays in the lead.

Although the Centre-right New People Party did get into the Duma for the first time, they, like the other parties, are basically Putinist sycophants. Oh, and there's evidence the vote was rigged. Again.

[Duvniask]

The Rus' did come from Scandinavia and ruled over a large collection of areas from Kijów to Nowogród Wielki!

Ukraina and Białoruś

Ukraina and occupying Białoruś and Królewiec

Why are you being so weird about writing everything Slavic in the Polish style specifically?

[World Anarchic Union]

The Midterms were yesterday and, surprise, surprise, United Russia stays in the lead.

Although the Centre-right New People Party did get into the Duma for the first time, they, like the other parties, are basically Putinist sycophants. Oh, and there's evidence the vote was rigged. Again.

United Russia won, but they lost quite some seats compared to last time, which is a marginally positive development at least.

[The North Polish Union]

Russians are ethnically descended from Swedes, not Slavs. Fun fact.

This is completely wrong. The name of Russia comes from the Rus. The "Rus" were Vikings who invaded modern day Russia and made the Kievan Rus. The Slavs were the people under the Kievan Rus. The Rus ruled the Slavs during the Kievan Rus. Then the Mongols invaded and they installed puppets there. Then when the Mongols left, the Muscovy was ruled by Slavs, not the Rus.

The Mongols appointed Aleksander Newski's (a descendant of Rurik) son Daniel as Grand Prince of Moskwa and his dynasty well outlasted the Mongols. So no, after the Mongols left Russia was not ruled by Slavs

For starters, genetically Russians are most closely related to Ukrainians, Belarusians, Poles and Slovaks. Some parts of northwestern Russia also have genetic links to Balto-Finns. So this idea that Russians are not Slavs is actually hilarious. This isn't getting into how out of the East Slavic languages, the one closest to Old East Slavic is Russian, meaning that Russians have maintained a closer linguistic link to Kievan Rus than either the Ukrainians or Belarusians.

What evidence is there that Russians are genetically related to the Slavs? Show it to me.

I already explained earlier that there is a Slavic influence in Russian thanks to the use of Old Church Slavonic as a liturgical language, just as there is Latin influence on English and other non-Romance Western European languages for the same reason. This doesn't make the language itself Slavic.

Polish nationalism is hilarious. Germans wipe out close to 1/5 of your people with plans to wipe out the remaining 4/5 but the Russians are still the big bad guys to the point where basic cultural and genetic facts get ignored. Oh yeah that is another thing, even if Russians weren't genetically predominately East Slavic, it wouldn't matter since culturally they are. Most Serbs and Bulgarians are actually descended from pre-Slavic peoples but that doesn't make them non-Slavic either.

Who said that I am sympathetic to the Germans? In any case, they do not falsely claim a shared cultural heritage, and use that claim to push bloodshed and oppression on the neighbors. The Russians are not culturally Slavic either, any more than the Germans are.

The Rus' did come from Scandinavia and ruled over a large collection of areas from Kijów to Nowogród Wielki!

Ukraina and Białoruś

Ukraina and occupying Białoruś and Królewiec

Why are you being so weird about writing everything Slavic in the Polish style specifically?

I am transcribing words from Cyrillic to Latin alphabets. There is no one correct way to transliterate this. Would you prefer that I used "Київ", "Великий Новгород", "Україна", "Беларусь", and "Калининград"? I personally think this would make it more confusing for the many readers who are not familiar with Cyrillic.

[Duvniask]

Why are you being so weird about writing everything Slavic in the Polish style specifically?

I am transcribing words from Cyrillic to Latin alphabets. There is no one correct way to transliterate this. Would you prefer that I used "Київ", "Великий Новгород", "Україна", "Беларусь", and "Калининград"? I personally think this would make it more confusing for the many readers who are not familiar with Cyrillic.

That's not what you're doing, lol.

"Kijów" is literally just the Polish name. If you're going to pretend to be rendering how natives say it, then write Kyiv. Same goes for the others. In fact, if you didn't want to confuse people, why the fuck are you writing "Królewiec" instead of Kaliningrad?

Again I ask: why are you being so weird about this?

[Immortan Khan]

What evidence is there that Russians are genetically related to the Slavs? Show it to me.

Knock yourself out.

I already explained earlier that there is a Slavic influence in Russian thanks to the use of Old Church Slavonic as a liturgical language, just as there is Latin influence on English and other non-Romance Western European languages for the same reason. This doesn't make the language itself Slavic.

I don't think you understood what I said. Russian has the greatest claim to being the direct successor to the old East Slavic language. If it's not Slavic, then neither are Ukrainian or Belarusian. But it is Slavic and you'd be laughed out of a linguistics department for suggesting otherwise.

Who said that I am sympathetic to the Germans? In any case, they do not falsely claim a shared cultural heritage, and use that claim to push bloodshed and oppression on the neighbors. The Russians are not culturally Slavic either, any more than the Germans are.

I mean this is what I mean, you're treating the Russians far worse for dumb and insane reasons.

I am transcribing words from Cyrillic to Latin alphabets. There is no one correct way to transliterate this. Would you prefer that I used "Київ", "Великий Новгород", "Україна", "Беларусь", and "Калининград"? I personally think this would make it more confusing for the many readers who are not familiar with Cyrillic.

In English, the language you are communicating in, there are approved transliterations. You aren't using the English spelling but the Polish one.