American Politics Thread VI: Can't We All Just Get Along?

[Kowani]

What does California have to do with the article?

I mean that if coal miners had been primarily concentrated in California they'd be politically irrelevant, and mindless opposition to action on climate change wouldn't be necessary for Republicans or Democrats hanging on by a thread in red states.

reminder that the climate provisions Manchin is trying to cut would funnel tens of billions of dollars to some of the neediest people in his state

[The Black Forrest]

Larry Elder is already claiming the recall election is going to be stolen, claims to have prepared lawyers

Hey if worked for 45; why not?

Should I hide because I voted no and wrote in “None of the Above” ?

[Lord Dominator]

Larry Elder is already claiming the recall election is going to be stolen, claims to have prepared lawyers

So long as it gets more Republicans not voting in the future

[San Lumen]

Larry Elder is already claiming the recall election is going to be stolen, claims to have prepared lawyers

So long as it gets more Republicans not voting in the future

It might have been a factor in Georgia runoffs.

[Lord Dominator]

So long as it gets more Republicans not voting in the future

It might have been a factor in Georgia runoffs.

That, and Trump not being on the ballot personally but still being around

[Ifreann]

I mean that if coal miners had been primarily concentrated in California they'd be politically irrelevant, and mindless opposition to action on climate change wouldn't be necessary for Republicans or Democrats hanging on by a thread in red states.

reminder that the climate provisions Manchin is trying to cut would funnel tens of billions of dollars to some of the neediest people in his state

Almost like his interest is not the people of his state, but the fossil fuel lobbyists who have bought his vote.

[San Lumen]

https://richmond.com/news/state-and-reg ... op-story-1

Winsome Sears, GOP nominee for Virginia lieutenant governor, lets go of campaign team, ex-aide says

Never a sign of a campaign that is up in the polls.

[Untecna]

Larry Elder is already claiming the recall election is going to be stolen, claims to have prepared lawyers

So long as it gets more Republicans not voting in the future

The GOP just needs to find more people to represent, then they'll actually get the votes they want.

Otherwise it's purely their fault that they lost.

[The Andorian System]

Larry Elder is already claiming the recall election is going to be stolen, claims to have prepared lawyers

Larry Elder, like his Lord and Master Donald Trump, is well known for SAYING a lot of things. It doesn't matter if what they say is true.

Neither Elder nor Trump have ever had a shred of credibility. Don't believe the hype.

[Antipatros]

Not only did Donald Trump get elected as President of the United States, he established the future model for all Republican political losses: bust out the lawyers and say that the other side cheated.

This is really the most cursed timeline, isn't it?

[Kowani]

Alabama is dropping its lawsuit over the Census Bureau's use of differential privacy to keep people anonymous in 2020 census redistricting data

[Tarsonis]

Not only did Donald Trump get elected as President of the United States, he established the future model for all Republican political losses: bust out the lawyers and say that the other side cheated.

This is really the most cursed timeline, isn't it?

The inmates are running the asylum at this point.

[The Andorian System]

Not only did Donald Trump get elected as President of the United States, he established the future model for all Republican political losses: bust out the lawyers and say that the other side cheated.

This is really the most cursed timeline, isn't it?

I could understand anticipating a close vote and hiring lawyers just in case, but what Trump did and what Elder is doing are intentionally raising doubt about our electoral system. They want elections like they have in Russia & Hungary. Heads, I win; tails, it's rigged.

If the Republicans ever gain power again, the next step could be a truly rigged system. Many GOP states are already working to tilt the playing field in their direction. They know that when there's an even playing field, they lose more elections than they win.

[Merrill]

Welfare programs were created to keep the poor dependent on the government, and it has worked. If public welfare is so awesome, why do we still have it generations later? Shouldn't the goal be to lift people up, not enable them in their situation?

I literally wouldn’t be alive today if it wasn’t because of welfare. That’s gotta count for something

Please clarify, thank you.

[Merrill]

Welfare programs were created to keep the poor dependent on the government, and it has worked. If public welfare is so awesome, why do we still have it generations later? Shouldn't the goal be to lift people up, not enable them in their situation?

If school is so awesome, why do we still have it generations later? Shouldn't the goal be to educate people, not enable them in their ignorance?

First, each generation needs to be educated. However, poverty shouldn’t be recurring condition. The fact that there are multi generational welfare families proves my point: government has either failed in its goal, or lied about the goal to begin with.

As for the indoctrination camps, ie, public schools; their failure feeds the failure of welfare. If the schools actually taught life and employment skills, instead of cultural marxism, there would be fewer poor people. Schools should be privatized, churches, social groups, and businesses can subsidize with scholarships.

[Alcala-Cordel]

Welfare programs didn't spring to life for no reason - it was because the charitable donations weren't covering the needs of the poor (including children). You want to go back when it wasn't caring for the needs of the poor, and claim this time it will be different.

No, it won't.

Welfare programs were created to keep the poor dependent on the government, and it has worked. If public welfare is so awesome, why do we still have it generations later? Shouldn't the goal be to lift people up, not enable them in their situation?

Welfare isn't to blame for people being trapped in poverty, it's lack of opportunity to get out. The answer isn't less welfare, it's more welfare on a much broader scale, a greatly increased minimum wage, nationalization, and accountability.

But even that just treats the symptoms of capitalism, as the underlying issue is an infection of parasites that will continue to exploit the rest of us for their own financial gain so long as they exist as an economic class.

[Alcala-Cordel]

I feel like Kowani could explain better than I could, but our hyper-punitive system feels like wrecking people’s lives and putting them in jail for needing social services to have their babies is better than actually providing them with the help to have their baby, such as maternal care and financial assistance.

“Socialism, like the ancient ideas from which it springs, confuses the distinction between government and society. As a result of this, every time we object to a thing being done by government, the socialists conclude that we object to its being done at all. We disapprove of state education. Then the socialists say that we are opposed to any education. We object to a state religion. Then the socialists say that we want no religion at all. We object to a state-enforced equality. Then they say that we are against equality. And so on, and so on. It is as if the socialists were to accuse us of not wanting persons to eat because we do not want the state to raise grain.”
― Frederic Bastiat, The Law

Every Christian I know would be thrilled to increase their personal charitable donations to care for the children born because abortion is disallowed. Get rid of public welfare, reduce the tax burden on the productive, and people will take care of their neighbors voluntarily, like Jesus commanded.

Yeah, thanks, but no thanks. Decentralization and mutual aid is the hopeful end goal of communism, but eliminating public assistance in favor of hoping christians help people out is just dumb.

[North Washington Republic]

Welfare programs were created to keep the poor dependent on the government, and it has worked. If public welfare is so awesome, why do we still have it generations later? Shouldn't the goal be to lift people up, not enable them in their situation?

Welfare isn't to blame for people being trapped in poverty, it's lack of opportunity to get out. The answer isn't less welfare, it's more welfare on a much broader scale, a greatly increased minimum wage, nationalization, and accountability.

But even that just treats the symptoms of capitalism, as the underlying issue is an infection of parasites that will continue to exploit the rest of us for their own financial gain so long as they exist as an economic class.

We need a moderately regulated free market economy to have an comprehensive and efficient welfare state. A comprehensive and efficient welfare state cannot be achieved with a planned economy.

[The Reformed American Republic]

Welfare isn't to blame for people being trapped in poverty, it's lack of opportunity to get out. The answer isn't less welfare, it's more welfare on a much broader scale, a greatly increased minimum wage, nationalization, and accountability.

But even that just treats the symptoms of capitalism, as the underlying issue is an infection of parasites that will continue to exploit the rest of us for their own financial gain so long as they exist as an economic class.

We need a moderately regulated free market economy to have an comprehensive and efficient welfare state. A comprehensive and efficient welfare state cannot be achieved with a planned economy.

It cannot be achieved with the status quo either.

[Merrill]

No, I hate the lie that the programs are helping people when they aren’t. Compare the pass through rates of money to the actual person being helped of public vs private. Don’t pee on me and tell me it’s rain.

Ok so increase the funding for social programs then. If your house has a broken roof you fix the roof, not destroy the roof because it’s not working as a roof.

I’m compelled to pay taxes. The State promises to use some of the funds to care for the poor. They don’t.

I agree it should be more. This really isn’t the gotcha you think it is.

So, my moral philosophy is violated twice. Welfare is non voluntary, and ineffective. I want to choose to give, and get results from it.

Im pretty sure that Jesus was very clear that you shouldn’t be giving because you get things from it. Also you still aren’t forbidden from donating however much you want now.

It seems like you are making excuses for things

Seems that you don’t understand what pass though rate means. The issue isn’t that the welfare budget isn’t large enough, it’s that the money isn’t going to the people who supposedly need help. Every layer of government takes a cut. In 2016, the cost of the programs was over $25,000 per person under the poverty line. They most assuredly didn’t get $25,000 worth of benefits. No, don’t increase funding through the government. You don’t reward failure with a budget increase. Cancel all public welfare, and let people voluntarily contribute to charities that actually HELP people instead of being a jobs program for government employees.

[Alcala-Cordel]

Welfare isn't to blame for people being trapped in poverty, it's lack of opportunity to get out. The answer isn't less welfare, it's more welfare on a much broader scale, a greatly increased minimum wage, nationalization, and accountability.

But even that just treats the symptoms of capitalism, as the underlying issue is an infection of parasites that will continue to exploit the rest of us for their own financial gain so long as they exist as an economic class.

We need a moderately regulated free market economy to have an comprehensive and efficient welfare state. A comprehensive and efficient welfare state cannot be achieved with a planned economy.

Welfare states do not eliminate the parasitic nature or unsustainability of capitalism. The goal needs to be less nearsighted and unimaginative than that, we need communal ownership of the means of production under which people will contribute according to their ability and receive according to their need.

Bourgeois-controlled society has proven itself to be inefficient and selfish, it's past time for a change. The wealthy are not a necessary part of society.

[Merrill]

No, I hate the lie that the programs are helping people when they aren’t. Compare the pass through rates of money to the actual person being helped of public vs private. Don’t pee on me and tell me it’s rain.

I’m compelled to pay taxes. The State promises to use some of the funds to care for the poor. They don’t.

So, my moral philosophy is violated twice. Welfare is non voluntary, and ineffective. I want to choose to give, and get results from it.

Wait till you hear about how your employer steals the vast majority of your labor.

My employer doesn’t force my labor. I can get a better job, or start business (wouldn’t it be nice if the government didn’t make that so difficult). Labor is voluntary, taxation and other government edicts are compulsory.

[Alcala-Cordel]

Wait till you hear about how your employer steals the vast majority of your labor.

My employer doesn’t force my labor. I can get a better job, or start business (wouldn’t it be nice if the government didn’t make that so difficult). Labor is voluntary, taxation and other government edicts are compulsory.

"Voluntary" implies there are other options. Under capitalism you have no options besides laboring for the bourgeoisie or becoming petty bourgeois yourself.

I don't want to help billionaires buy more megayachts, but if I don't work and buy things I'll become homeless.

[Kowani]

Wait till you hear about how your employer steals the vast majority of your labor.

My employer doesn’t force my labor. I can get a better job, or start business (wouldn’t it be nice if the government didn’t make that so difficult). Labor is voluntary, taxation and other government edicts are compulsory.

"work or starve"
libertarianism, not even once

[Tarsonis]

My employer doesn’t force my labor. I can get a better job, or start business (wouldn’t it be nice if the government didn’t make that so difficult). Labor is voluntary, taxation and other government edicts are compulsory.

"Voluntary" implies there are other options. Under capitalism you have no options besides laboring for the bourgeoisie or becoming petty bourgeois yourself.

it's the same under communism, just replace bourgeoisie with "The Party"